*HP HDX DRAGON Owners Lounge, Part 1*

hi all. i have just installed windows 7 build 7600. i followed the steps above but the chipset, matrix storage and quick launch update did not install correctly. anyone having the same problem?

 

If the hdd is the bottleneck, would it be better to upgrade the SSD than the cpu (I have the T8100, btw)?
It's also alot easier to replace the hdd than the cpu...
do you know what's the system gain roughly in % if i have the Vertex SSD upgraded (or is this apple vs orange, and all it does to make things start up quicker)?


Thanks in advance,
soda

 

I would definitely recommend getting an SSD over a CPU upgrade unless you do CPU intensive work. If your CPU is not breaking 75% utilization for the apps you use most, a CPU upgrade won't help as much as one might think. The 2.1ghz is a slight bottleneck for the GPU when it comes to certain games though. Mostly for RTS games.

Overall system gain in percent is hard to factor because it depends on the app. But not only do things start up quicker, much quicker, but any app that accesses the HDD to read or write gains a very noticeable boost in performance on the order of 100-400%.

 

but it runs at 667 while the HDX can go 800 right?


soda

 

HDX's memory bus runs @ max 667mhz. Its FSB runs @ 800mhz.

 

o oops, lolz...

could they still be dual channel if I buy them individually instead of kit?


Thanks,
soda

 

Sort of. It would be called Dual Channel Asynchronous or Asymmetric mode with a configuration like that. It wouldn't be as fast as Dual Channel Synchronous or symmetric (2 matching sticks).

BTW, if you are not maxing out your RAM now, you won't have any performance gain by going to 6GB or 8GB.

 

thx for the advice, 2.0


soda

 

2 questions come to mind with the ssd: will the same ssd get cheaper later in the year and/or will there be better ssd's?

and most important, where to i get an extra hard drive caddy that fits the hdx! linky please.

 

You're forgetting BR factor. Much more important than any performance gain.

*BR=Bragging Rights.

 

LOL! Yeah, in some cases that means more than anything.

 

Correct, but memory clock speed is only one factor. Another important factor is Latency. The higher the latency, the more "delay" there is in accessing the memory. Also, the higher the clock speed, the higher the latency. Therefore, 800-speed RAM is typically has a CAS Latency of 6, but 667-speed can be 4 or 5. So, it's basically a tradeoff. Faster speed plus more delay cancels each other out. There is "high-performance" (more expensive) 800-speed RAM out there with a lower than normal Latency, in which case you would gain a bit of performance, but IMHO, 667 speed CAS 5 is fine.

Other inherent advantages of 8GB is the ability to run Windows WITHOUT a pagefile, which increases performance and, especially if you have only one SSD, saves you from excessive writes to the SSD.

Overall, 8GB = Good, regardless of whether you "need" it or not.

 

Yes and yes.

There's a number of places you can get one from. Look for the Caddy for Compaq 6520, 6720, or 6820. That is the exact one used in the HDX. Should be about $20.

 

Doing that with 4GB. But then again, I'm an efficient user. I don't run tons of programs at once. Only what I need up. Especially since having an SSD means super fast program loads. There's only so much room on the taskbar.

While 8GB might be good, it has to be weighed on the scale of cost/benefit.

 

The nice thing about SSD's is that there are no moving parts. Nothing that is vulernable to vibrations, shock, etc.

So, and this is up to you, but you really don't need a caddy for the HDX. The SATA data and power connector is there already. You just need a piece or two of 3M double-sided foam tape to hold the SSD in place. It's a pretty secure fit already, without any tape, but a couple of pieces (very small or else you'll never get it OUT of the HDX!), ensures that it won't work it's way out.

That is the cheap "McGyver" way.

 

Agreed. Depends on the user. For yourself, a couple of windows of Solitare and Mahjongg runs fine with 4GB. For me, using Adobe CS4 and Tunebite, I'll take all the memory I can get. My point was only for those looking to get 8GB at a decent price. I wasn't trying to sell or push the virtues of 8GB...

 

as of 40 minutes ago, maybe this will fix your firefox woes
http://www.ghacks.net/2009/07/16/firefox-3-5-1-update-available/


also see this
http://mozillalinks.org/wp/2009/07/firefox-3-5-1-due-this-week-to-fix-security-and-slow-startup-bugs/

 

good to know on a pinch if necessary, but i think i might want to be getting the hard drive out at some point for some reason or another, so i don't want to effectively superglue it in there, if that's what you are saying.

 

the whole thing about ram and stuff, if i have 2, 2gb sticks in there now, and get a 4gb stick, having 6gb total (i also do photoshop with super huge files (got a 5d mark ii and shoot raw, and work with hdr images)...then how will performance be given that it is now not dual channel with matching sticks, vs. 4gb of dual channel?

lastly if 2 4gb sticks are ordered, does it need to be the same lot or whatever? that's kind of impossible to do when ordering online from newegg i imagine.

 

http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDetail.jsp?ProductCode=10009849&prodlist=froogle
good price? $124.99 after $20 mail in rebate

i had to pull the quadruplepostfecta.

besides, i find it easier if they are different subject in posts to post separately

EDIT: damn thats only the 30giggy
i guess the 120giggy (with 64mb ram which is what i want and need) is $370. oopps
http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDetail.jsp?ProductCode=10009989&prodlist=froogle

 

LOL. I'll give it to you. That was pretty funny. Solitare and Mahjong...

Not for nothing, that was the best price for 4GB sticks I ever saw.

 

It'll be less performance than the 4GB you have now but can't quantify how much less it would be in percent. You may notice, you may not.

No, just same manufacturer will do. Pretty much they won't be selling old stock and new. So you'll likely be getting the same lot, same revision.

 

thanks. will probably be getting 2 sticks, if i do, and if that's a great price, then maybe i'll go for it, and wait for ssd prices to go down. i doubt that this memory would go down much do you?

 

No reason to badger anyone. Simply asking the poster to clarify his question would have been enough. Some of your comments were uncalled for.

 

Memory prices will drop like the SSD prices will. Memory chips are a commodity.

Though with SSDs, you'll get more speed an more capacity per dollar the longer you wait.

 

now, even the hp quickplay doesn't perform well anymore.... it can't read my blu ray discs.... anyone having the same problems???

 

Well, maybe not. Think about it. DDR2 is becoming a relic. Look at DDR RAM (DDR1, not DDR2). It was cheap, but demand is WAY DOWN, so now DDR RAM is kinda pricey. DDR3 is now the king of the hill, so to speak, so I don't expect DDR2 to be in much demand from here forward. As such, I truly believe that price for 4GB modules is very good. We may see some "blowout" pricing (or, we are seeing that NOW), but in the end, DDR2 prices will start to climb again as DDR3 becomes the norm.

The analogy to SSD is not completely valid as SSD's, as they mature, are still compatible with all current systems, whereas DDR2 RAM has apexed, and is now on the downhill slide, and is not compatible with most new systems. SSD's are still in their infancy and, yes, pricing will drop more and performance will increase as demand increases and production costs decrease.

 

Valid. What's more, with Win 7 coming out and being more efficient in the RAM usage and management department, demand for 8GB DDR2 will likely drop further. Demand for 8GB is low on both DDR2 and DDR3 as it is now. Probably be a year or two before 8GB becomes a "normal" option when buying a new notebook.

 

Demand is low, especially for DDR3, because it really doesn't exist in 4GB modules at anywhere close to an affordable price. 2GB DDR3 is cheap, but there isn't any real alternative. My desktop, a Dell XPS 730X only has 3 slots. That's 6GB TOTAL I can EVER have in my system, until 4GB modules become available. To be honest, I'm not comfortable with having a 6GB limit.

Who knows...while Windows 7 may be more efficient, people don't necessarily plan on buying memory for their OS. I think it's the apps that use the majority of memory, and those haven't really changed (yet).

Just my 2 cents worth!.

 

As a side question to this, would you say it follows that if the chipset is different from one machine to another, the BIOSes will also be different?

I could likely be wrong but my impression from forums where people talk about putting together their own machines that it was common belief that certain components worked better and interacted better with other components they chose to put in their machines.

Wait I thought you said before that benchmarks give a reliable picture of what's going on. What do you mean by "drill down the components"? Are you saying the bottle neck at the same place on all these CPUs?

That would follow I think if I was expecting the 2.8 to run faster..but through remote session I would have though latency and/or lag would make them look the same or make mine look like it functioned faster, but it was the opposite. I'm an animator, that was my major, and I've been an artist all my life, so maybe I see things differently from you having studied frames their speeds and such from when I was a kid, but frankly it just stood out to me. Maybe it was placebo but my expectations were the opposite in that context. I quite was surprised.

I don't know what my problem is but maybe I'm millisecond sensitive I'm not OCD, but maybe my background has a part in why I'm reporting what I observed.

Yea here's where you said it regarding benchmarks that I was referring to above. I don't know, it just sounds incredibly reductionistic. I hear what you're saying with the GPU.

Could you elaborate a bit more for me please?

I see. Is it possible different chipsets shapes similarity or dissimilarity in BIOSes used between two machines? I ask because I thought they used different chips. I also understood/heard that they had different BIOSes.

Hmm.. Valid points of concern. One tech I talked to said there was some switch on the MOBO that allowed some control of certain limits you would want to see in the BIOS when it boots, that come up once the switch is moved. He could be confused which is NOT a stretch regarding techs in general and/or at HP, but do you remember seeing anything like that when you opened it up? Just an idea, not saying it will happen, but if I could find someone with some extra cash and wanted to get you the 3700 to see if it can work do you think you'd be up to trying it? I can't speak for MobileArtist but I know I'm not proficient with hands on stuff relating to actually opening a machine up, at least not a notebook, and doing what you did with the 280M. If its a desktop and its not too complicated I'll do it, but not when you have to be so careful with all the MANY pars of the HDX. I was watching the HP videos and my eyes started to cross Lol. Unless I had all the videos lined up for me like on a DVD or something in order, I MIGHT, but I just don't think I'd have the patience for something like that. I save that kind of concentration for things like drawing, painting, animation, music, and film.

 

I've had that problem consistently while setting up a double/triple boot set up..I found the only way I could get it working was if I took the stupid hard drives out, put them into enclosures, format them FULLY using another PC then setting up the boots that I could get them working in every OS.. I tried EVERYTHING from filters to whatever the normal protocol is to try to fix them. That was the only thing that worked. The way you're supposed to update Quickplay is from WITHIN the player when it asks you to update to 3.7, then 3.7.6112 or something along those numbers without rebooting in between. Nothing more annoying to set up other stuff and then find out QuickPlay doesn't work with Blu Rays. It may possibly also be that you're using a modified Dox GPU driver and it may not have Blu Ray support. Can't think of anything else.

 

You would only get a 10-15% performance increase with a 3700M over a comfortably overclocked (i.e., not overstrained) 8800M GTS with an X9000. According to 2.0, this might not translate into a big improvement in practical terms. The Quadro FSAA can be disabled in NVIDIA Control Panel, either globally (let application decide or lower value, e.g. 4x) or on a per application basis. I wouldn't worry about this issue.

The person selling the 3700M on eBay is actually selling more than one piece. I think he/she might be a factory in Taiwan selling Class B (still OK) parts. So the listing is just renewed every few weeks and it doesn't mean he/she is not selling it (you can easily tell from his feedback profile that he sold at least three 3700Ms over the past few months: http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=note3c&&ftab=FeedbackAsSeller ). However, I think the genuine HP NVIDIA 3700M part is different, both physically and BIOS wise.

 

I'm sorry for my English. But you're wrong. HDX have Bluetooth module under right below the keyboard near USB port on right hand side. Since I took 4965 out I have no problem using Bluetooth function. I wonder why your guy having problem and still keep both 4965 ,5300 together. After I pull 4965 out and place 5300 into next slot, I only use wireless asst button for turn Bluetooth on/off and it still turn blue when only Bluetooth is "on".
It's not only me watching all people here exchange idea in this site. Most are as bad English as me. I wasn't grow up in English speaking area. This's the best I can do. The Intel wifi card are made by people who don't even know English.

 

Thanks for the heads up.

Turns out you are right, you don't need the 4965 installed to get bluetooth to work. But...

If you had bluetooth off, like I did, the only way to get it to work again after installing the 5300 is to install the 4965, use wireless assistant to turn it on, then take the 4965 out.

I don't use bluetooth, but I prefer the wifi light in the top panel to be blue instead of orange.

Anyway, thanks for posting that. Now I only have the 5300 installed.

 

You don't have 4965 anymore. My wireless asst is use for turn bluetooth on/off. My Bluetooth still on and wireless button still blue only popup MSG said wifi is off because there is no 4965. But your new wifi (5300) stay on always and unable to control or turn it off by same button.

 

Intel wifi 5300. For my experience I borrow sp42617 from HDX18 install and get latest driver from intel install on top sp42617, then I got it stay 300Mbps all the time ( previously 250 or 275 up and down ). So how 2.0 and other people have XXX Mbps.

 

Exactly what I have and how I have it too.

Stays at 300Mbps pretty much all the time. The router is downstairs (1st floor) and the HDX(s) are on the 2nd floor. 5300 does a much better job than the 4965 did. does even better than the 5100 in my DV5(s).

 

Does wireless assistant work in Windows 7? (If you have tried, and know, of course!)

 

Yes, it does.

 

Concur, it works fine.

Also, I'll let you know about the sound issue this weekend. Was busy all week.

 

Yes and no. What's important is who makes the BIOS. For instance, I have a TX2500 and a DV5. 2 radically different platforms but that use the same BIOS... Insyde. Therefore as a general rule, what trick you find that works on one machine with the same BIOS will work on the other. Like BIOS recovery tricks, etc.

It's true to some extent only with desktops for good reason. But when it comes to CPUs, it's not.

What I'm saying is, if you take 3Dmark06 and compare the overall score, you would think that there's a big boost between the X9000 and T9300/T9500. But when you look at the SM2.0 and SM3.0, the raw graphics components, there's far less of a difference. And that corresponds to the same results you will find in games. X9000 won't make your games run any faster since you're past the CPU /GPU bottleneck. Games are predominately GPU dependent. There are exceptions like Crysis and Far Cry which will gain 1-2 FPS. Also some RTS games will see a small boost in certain scenarios.

Again, you will only see the difference of up to 13% when you are doing something that requires 100% CPU utilization. Ordinary programs don't stress the CPU to that degree so you won't see a difference with the Penryns with 6MB cache. Encoding, redndering, etc, things that use 100% of the CPU will see the difference. But 13% means you have to get your stopwatch out to notice the difference. "Snappier' is a valid observation but there are other more viable ways to get your computer snappier. SSD for one will give a significantly better boost to system performance than upgrading from a T9300 to X9000 and is much more cost effective.

Penryn CPUs have 6 steps or frequency levels. In balanced mode, it will step through 4 of them when plugged in. In high perf mode, it only runs two of them. 6x and it's max. So with a 200Mhz FSB (800/4), @ 6x the cpu speed will be 6x200=1200Mhz. @max it will be 14 x 200 or 2800Mhz on the X9000, 13 x 200 = 2600Mhz on the T9500, and 12.5 x 200 = 2500Mhz on the T9300. But not for both cores all the time. It switches back and forth between 6x and max multiplier as demand begs for it.

Not sure what you are asking here, but they share the same BIOS as far as code. Rare that an ODM switches from Award to say Phoenix or Insyde. They tend to stick with one BISO for long periods of time. They sometimes swicth for a custom job or for a better deal/fit for a new chipset. But not often.

LOL, you have to stop talking to these HP techs. They seem to be full of disinformation. Unfortunately, there is no switch on the board or jumpers for that matter like how you might find on a desktop's mobo.

Sure, I'm game. Don't think it'll work. But I'd be willing to give it the old college try if someone really wanted to do that. I've taken the HDx apart so many times now, it only takes me 2hrs round trip.

Don't sell yourself short. It's not as hard as it might look. Think of it as model building. Just a bunch of plastic parts and screws. Label things as you go along and it goes like clockwork.

 

My 4965 runs either 130Mbps or 270Mbps. I am using a Linksys WRT600N. So I am considering getting the 5300 half mini, but they seem to be hard to find in stock and for a good price. Any suggestions on finding a good deal?

 

Got my 2 from this guy in china off ebay. Took a week and a half to arrive.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&item=320389092659

 

Yo, could someone point me to a list that shows the processors compatible with the HDX Dragon. I'm going on a power craze and want to get my Dragon in peak condition. I looked into the t9300 as a replacement for my current t8100. I read its supposed to give something like a 20% performance increase over my current CPU, although that may have been about the t9500(the clock is the only difference I could see and its only like .3 gig hertz difference). Also, I'm starting to shop around for 8 gigs but they are still pretty expensive. The cheapest 4gig I have found is about 140 bucks.

Thanks for your help.

And I did try search, just fyi.

I also read that, ages ago, there was a quad core that was compatible with the Dragon. True/False? If there is, should I get that over the t9300?

 

Long time no see. How's things?

List:

T9300 2.5ghz
T9500 2.6ghz
X9000 2.8ghz

Note for each of these you will find engineering samples (ES) on ebay. The only ones worth considering are the ones with C0 stepping. That's the same stepping as non-ES and they also report core temps.

As for quad core, nope because the FSB for the QX9300 and Q9100 is 1066mhz.

Good hunting.

 

Hmmm...you'd obviously be very good on the game show "What's my line"!

Since he has only 1 post, he's obviously someone we know by another name...

Any clues?

 

Hello, I just joined Notebook review because I was thinking about buying a HDX18T laptop and this forum popped up in my Google searches. I was thinking of buying my HDX18T in August when I predict it will be on huge sales. My current specs for the laptop are....

*Genuine Windows Vista Home Premium with Service Pack 1 (64-bit)
*Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo Processor T9900 (3.06 GHz, 6 MB L2 Cache, 1066MHz FSB)
*4GB DDR3 System Memory (2 Dimm) - For 1GB Nvidia GeForce GT 130M
*1TB 7200RPM SATA Dual Hard Drive (500GB x 2) with HP ProtectSmart Hard Drive Protection
*1GB Nvidia GeForce GT 130M - For DDR3 Memory
*18.4" diagonal High Definition HP Ultra BrightView Infinity Display (1920x1080p)
*Lightscribe Blu-Ray ROM with SuperMulti DVD+/-R/RW Double Layer
*Webcam + Fingerprint Reader with HP Imprint Finish (Fluid)
*Intel Next-Gen Wireless-N Mini-card
*No TV Tuner w/remote control
*Full Size Backlit Keyboard
*8 Cell Lithium Ion Battery
*No Productivity Software
*HP Home & Home Office Store in-box envelope

I was also thinking of getting the HP 20" Roller Case for Notebook PCs from the accessory side of the HDX18T for $59 after rebates.
( http://www.shopping.hp.com/store/product/product_detail/KD853PA)
I was wondering if you guys could check up on my config just in case somehow something is wrong. Also, I was reading the posts in this thread and I've read about someone who wanted to buy a different Wireless card for their HDX18T? Would buying a different Wireless card then the included one (Intel Next-Gen Wireless-N Mini-card) get better performance and if, could you provide the name and link of one that does amazing? I'm looking for a wireless card that will provide the best performance for my "to-be" laptop; however, I'm sorry to say I don't really know much about wireless cards because I have never had my own laptop before. Also, my router that I use is from Verizon Fios and is pictured here ( http://www.actiontec.com/products/product.php?pid=189). The final price for my HDX18T laptop and 20" bag W/ tax/shipping & handling is $1,910.98 at the moment; however, I hope to get that price down in August. Thank you all for your help again.

-Jason

 

Jason,

I think you mistook this forum (DRAGON being the now-discontinued HP HDX 20" portable) for the HDX18t Owners Lounge.

You're probably better off reposting your question over there.

Good luck.

 

Sorry about that, I just saw a lot of HDX18T questions on the posts here and somehow never read the title fully. Can you link me to there? Oh, how did you reply back to me so fast by the way?

 

*OFFICIAL: HP HDX18 Owners Lounge*

Lots of FAST computers!