It's Official! HD-DVD Tosses in the white flag!

Wow am I glad I sent my dv9500t with the HD-DVD back for the dv9700t with blu-ray.

http://news.moneycentral.msn.com/provider/providerarticle.aspx?feed=OBR&date=20080216&id=8203014

 

I have a HP HDX laptop with a HDDVD drive so i am disappointed, but i was expecting this since new near, so now my drive is obselete and my transformers movie on HDDVD is also useless !!!

But i do hope this is true, it's time now for one format, because then i'll just go and buy a blu-ray drive for my laptop from HP.

 

**** i have two HD DVD players....lol o well they up convert very well so no worries. I have a PS3 anyways.

 

my HD DVD drive is now obsolete too... oh, well wonder how much Blu ray disk drive costs from acer...

I wonder about the HD DVD drive for Xbox 360? I bet it is going to replaced by blu ray... I wonder what people are going to do with the HD DVD drives?

 

So, HD-DVD became the new betamax. I'm glad I stuck with regular DVD's. Players and drives for my computer are still too expensive, I'll just wait for prices to come down.

Maybe we can make a big bonfire out of all those useless HD-DVD drives and discs.

 

Watch Transformers/Batman Begins/Hulk over and over... and over again.

 

LOL. Well, Microsoft can still release games on the HD-DVD format. Otherwise people everywhere need to replace the drive from their X-Box with a new blu-ray discdrive and buy new games. Or suffer never buying a new game.

Maybe they can send their X-Box back and receive a PlayStation 3.

 

I think my standalone Toshiba HD-A3 player was worth the $99 I spent on it. Watching Transformers on it was probably one of the best home theater experiences I have ever had

 

In my opinion the PS3's technology when it first came out was 2-3 years ahead of its time. Xbox lovers who were too blinded to see the PS3's potential are probably biting their nails off and rolling their face across their keyboards.

 

I am really glad when I configured my Toshiba A200 in Nov , I did not include the HD crap.

I some what knew this would happen and avoided it.

And I also did not buy the Xbox stuff , I think when PS3 becomes cheaper here , I will get it but not now , it is way too expensive for just a game machine or movie burner, besides it is not even a portable.

So HDX or Qosmio will be replaced with Blu ray models soon or they will simply be discontinued?

 

an xbox 360 is not too far off price wise from ps3's lowest model.... and you get a blu-ray player hdmi output and other features.

 

Not not be picky but it should read "tosses in the towel" or "raises a white flag"

 

only thing that I am worring about is that Blu ray is still to expensive, HD DVD almost needs to be around longer, just to get sony's price down.

 

So we can start buying blu-ray now or...?

I'm quite happy with DVD's at the moment

 

Well... I have an Xbox 360 and also have the HD-DVD piggyback drive.

I currently only have 2 movies, but I'm still waiting on the 5 free 'promotional' discs to arrive. The way I see it, I paid $150 to save some significant wear on my 360. I use the console not only to play games, but also watch DVD's - so the DVD drive was a good 'safeguard' purchase in my opinion. The other nice thing about the decision about the discontied HD-DVD production is lower costs. If there were any of you 'waiting for a sale' to pick-up a movie on HD format...now you'll be able to get them on close-out very soon.

 

Not to mention it cost more to manufacture BD media and players. I'm convinced that consumers would have been better off with HD DVD. But I expect Sony can't afford to get too greedy with licensing fees etc.. with their BD format. The main reason is that physical media as a delivery system is at jeopardy. Buying movies through cable/satelite and downloads is the future. I just saw one movie advertised today (forget which one) on dish that will be available on pay per view on the same day as DVD release. This is a sign folks. The studios are starting to experiment with quick non physical early distribution of content.

I think what happened in the new year is all the retailers and studios got together to decide which format to back. They allowed 1.5 years for the format wars which could kill the chances for blu ray now. In that 1.5 years, many people have found out the benefits of upconverting standard DVD's through HDMI TV's. Downloading content is starting to now take off. And the economy is starting to really slow down. Energy costs have rising considerably. Yes they knew they needed to unify themselves behind one format before it was too late.. And it may already be too late. Normally, I think Blu ray would have been very expensive. But I think Sony will have no choice to cut costs on its hardware and studios will have to reduce media costs hugely if they have any hope at all for mass adoption.

I don't see people in this economy buying up expensive BD machines and 25 dollar BD movies. What I do see are the lines getting longer and longer on those Red Box DVD vending machines where people rent a new release for a buck. What I see is Sony maybe getting too greedy and not dropping prices fast enough for this product to catch on.

 

Pretty sure the games are not HD DVD... Then you would not need to buy the HD Drive add on.

 

Regarding the HDX, HP are already fitting a blu-ray drive to the most recent models.

 

Toshiba Announces Discontinuation of HD DVD Businesses

19 February, 2008

Company Remains Focused on Championing Consumer Access to High Definition Content

TOKYO--Toshiba Corporation today announced that it has undertaken a thorough review of its overall strategy for HD DVD and has decided it will no longer develop, manufacture and market HD DVD players and recorders. This decision has been made following recent major changes in the market. Toshiba will continue, however, to provide full product support and after-sales service for all owners of Toshiba HD DVD products.

HD DVD was developed to offer consumers access at an affordable price to high-quality, high definition content and prepare them for the digital convergence of tomorrow where the fusion of consumer electronics and IT will continue to progress.

"We carefully assessed the long-term impact of continuing the so-called 'next-generation format war' and concluded that a swift decision will best help the market develop," said Atsutoshi Nishida, President and CEO of Toshiba Corporation. "While we are disappointed for the company and more importantly, for the consumer, the real mass market opportunity for high definition content remains untapped and Toshiba is both able and determined to use our talent, technology and intellectual property to make digital convergence a reality."

Toshiba will continue to lead innovation, in a wide range of technologies that will drive mass market access to high definition content. These include high capacity NAND flash memory, small form factor hard disk drives, next generation CPUs, visual processing, and wireless and encryption technologies. The company expects to make forthcoming announcements around strategic progress in these convergence technologies.

Toshiba will begin to reduce shipments of HD DVD players and recorders to retail channels, aiming for cessation of these businesses by the end of March 2008. Toshiba also plans to end volume production of HD DVD disk drives for such applications as PCs and games in the same timeframe, yet will continue to make efforts to meet customer requirements. The company will continue to assess the position of notebook PCs with integrated HD DVD drives within the overall PC business relative to future market demand.

This decision will not impact on Toshiba's commitment to standard DVD, and the company will continue to market conventional DVD players and recorders. Toshiba intends to continue to contribute to the development of the DVD industry, as a member of the DVD Forum, an international organization with some 200 member companies, committed to the discussion and defining of optimum optical disc formats for the consumer and the related industries.

Toshiba also intends to maintain collaborative relations with the companies who joined with Toshiba in working to build up the HD DVD market, including Universal Studios, Paramount Pictures, and DreamWorks Animation and major Japanese and European content providers on the entertainment side, as well as leaders in the IT industry, including Microsoft, Intel, and HP. Toshiba will study possible collaboration with these companies for future business opportunities, utilizing the many assets generated through the development of HD DVD.


http://www.toshiba.co.jp/about/press/2008_02/pr1903.htm

 

That sucks. I have a Hp with a HD DVD drive. Bought a few movies to see what they'd look like but I'm not a big DVD buyer anyway. The drive came with a preconfigured laptop I got in Office Depot so no great loss. Does anyone know if Hp sell Blu Ray drives as add ons ? (Not that I'm gonna rush out and buy one, just curious)

 

I'd hold off on Blu...I really think it will also fail. Limited movies, quirky playback on the 1.1 players...which will be obsolete soon (next gen will be very expensive...$1000 or more), $35 for movies, $40 for a recordable disc.

HD VOD, online downloads will kill Blu....it's just a matter of time IMHO. Also, 1% of the market share is not what I consider "winning the war". There are better, cheaper alternatives for watching movies or backing up data:

16 GB flash drives, removable HD's, etc.

I would not shell out $350-$400 for a Blu player for my computer....how long would it take to write 30 GB to a disc? 3-5 hours? let alone the cost.....oh, get one little scratch on that precious BD and you just messed up 2 GB's of information. No thanks!!!

 

Good point. Whats the story with downloadable HD content. I presume your notebook has to have all the neccessary graphics capabilities etc, or are they to be played through special programs to get the full HD experience.

 

I don't know too much about that, but IPTV and HD VOD look very promising. Verizon plans on having close to 1000 HD Titles in their HD VOD menu by the end of the year. Why spend $800 on a player and $35 on a disc when alot of the HD VOD content will be free. Movies will be $2.99-$3.99....so why oh why would Blu be able to survive?

It's like digital music....compression technology will become better and the need for optical discs will no longer be needed.

 

You can't really look at the current prices for the Blu-Ray players, because its the same as when DVD first came out, very expensive. It will take a little bit of time for prices to come to a reasonable amount. At the same time though, you have the PS3 which can be used for Blu-Ray movies and playing games. I'm excited that Blu-Ray is the winner in the battle, because it has a ton of potential.

 

Yeah but HD was just starting to get more affordable. Can't imagine Blu Ray having much incentive to drop prices seeing as they didn't even do it when they had competition.

 

The problem is that Blu is running out of time. Believe me, I'd love to see Blu in every house because I am heavily invested in HD. But I can guarantee that the "avg Joe" is content with $5-$12 DVd's and HD VOD. Unless Blu drop prices on players to $199 (version 2.0) and discs to the same price as DVD (SOON) there is no hope for Blu to survive....it needs to be done in the next 6-9 months or sadly Blu will bite the dust as well. Like I said, 1% of the market share is not "winning" a war....

If it was not for the PS3, Blu would be in "dire straights" as well.

 

You could see this was going to happen, it was just movie studio after movie studio signing up with Sony to produce BR DVDs. Sony executives are probably getting trashed at the bar right now.

First a Government Stimulus check in June, and you know everyone who doesnt have a flatscreen HDTV, will get one with that check.

Now HD DVD dies...

Proves Sony is still atop the consumer electronics industry, just not notebooks yet... ha.

 

For me, I love Sony as far as the entertainment industry goes. They've done a great job on TVs as well as game consoles, so I was excited about Blu-Ray as soon as I heard about it because of what it can do and what it will mean in the HD world and especially in the gaming community.

 

So I guess they will also kill rewritable HD-DVD discs as well? I would like HD DVD-RAM discs to come out, love the current DVD-RAM discs and how convenient they are, write to them just like a hard drive.

 

It's a SHAME that HD DVD lost. Arguably the better of the two technologies, and the one that would likely gain mass marketability (due to it being complete spec, and cheaper).

I don't understand why any competing movie studio (warner) would put their movie production in the hands of another competing movie studio (SONY).

Seems dumb to me, now Sony can control the market and raise prices.

BR Live (java) is a mess as well. Plus BR can't do the dual/combo disks. So you have to end up buying the dvd and hd versions if you are like me you take your movies out.

It seems like downloads are the promising feature for the future, because you can not only watch it in high def, but you can also take it anywhere you go (in the car, camping, etc...)

 

So Valleybacker, why do you say that HD-DVD is the better of the two technologies? Please state your reasons, I'm interested in hearing them.

 

Sony does not own Blu-Ray, just like no one company owned DVD and so had a monopoly and raised prices. Your not going to see that with Blu-Ray now.

 

It's true about the VOD. Think about how CDs are being replaced with iPods. I haven't bought a CD in years - I download all of my music. It's easier, cheaper and more convenient. Eventually, we'll all have hard drives attached to our LCD and Plasma tvs. And they'll probably be more portable so we can just hook up our library to any tv. Pretty soon you won't have to leave the couch at all ... no more running out to Blockbuster or some video store. All of it right there on demand. Isn't that sort of what Apple TV is all about? It definitely beats putting in a disk everytime you want to watch something. Just download it - click the title on a list of movies and you're there.

 

Sony controls the blu ray processing plants.

 

I don't understand why people even liked HD-DVD, besides the fact that it might come with a regular DVD version for watching in on a regular DVD player as well (as you guys stated before). Blu-Ray is the better technology and it is still expanding (they are currently testing 200GB dual layer Blu-Ray discs). It does everything that HD-DVD does, and more. So for the people that love HD-DVD that much, please explain to me why it is the better technology, because I can't see how it is.

 

I have never owned or even used either, but as far as i'm concerned blu-ray is better simply because the discs can hold more data, which will be useful when/if we ever start using them to burn on to.

 

It's a...ummm, was a completed and polished technology, also it is/was future proof because of F/W updates and online options.Complete and stable F/W and S/w. Backwards compatible and same thickness of regular Dvd's so one side of the disc is HD and the other could be played on a regular Dvd player then later you can use it in your HD DVD player when you upgrade....BR can not. BR is not complete. They are at version 1.1 and these machines are having many problems. Also, the 2.0 players (not even out yet) are estimated to be $1000 and more complete or "stable" but still not fully complete. the PS3 is the only BR player that would be worth buying due to the fact that it can be upgraded regularly to be "future proof"...the stand alones, as of now, can not.

 

I hate to say this....but how long do you think it will take to burn to a BR disc?
Flash drives are where it's at.....16 GB flash drives or 320 GB mini HD are faster, better and more reliable.

I'd guess writing 20-30 Gb to a BR disc would take hours. HD....5-10 minutes?
Flash drive even less.

 

Whats sad is consumers were not allowed to choose which format. If all the studios would have backed both formats and allowed the public to choose, I think HD DVD may have won. The reason I think HD DVD would have eventually won is that the cost of the media and hardware cost less. Price is everything and I believe HD DVD would have hit the magic sweet spot in price before BD. Forget about PS3. The console market is more niche. I'm talking about prices of HD DVD falling to a point were mass market would have started to react in a big way in places like walmart etc.. But Sony and the big studios did not allow for a even playing field on the content end. The way it ended up HD DVD never had a chance. And like Mikeslets456 says, BD is going to cost the consumer alot more in hardward. Its not polished and still does not have bonus features like HD DVD did.. At least that is what I have read. The consumer would have been better off with HD DVD since those players would have hit economies of scales much quicker. And now we have a company like Sony, controlling the licensing fees etc... To me, Sony is like Disney or comcast etc.. Its never a good idea to give companies like this too much power.

I fully expect that this technology will cost more in media and hardware going forward now that Sony is at the wheel.

 

Well I'm glad that BR won, because I wasn't about to be buying HD-DVDs for one movie and then have to buy BR for another because the movie wasn't created on both. I look at the whole picture, and there isn't too much expandability for HD-DVD, but there is for BR. I look at where technology is now and where it can go in the future, and BR has a lot more future than HD-DVD.

 

Actually, the more "user friendly" and compatible format was HD-DVD. Also, HD DVD was able to match BD disc capacity in the next generation.

A huge disadvantage of BR was the thickness of the disc and incomplete format.....it's thicker and therefore you can not "stamp" an SD version on one side to play in a regular DVD player like HD DVD did. I really believe the consumer lost on this one. High prices of Blu, incomplete format (now at version 1.1 and waiting for 2.0....who knows how long) and pricing will kill the HDM (optical) industry.

I'm a HD junkie, but I'll wait for either Blu players to drop to $150 and have the same amount of titles as SD DVD or simply use HD-VOD or MPEG4 Downloads. I'll continue to back up on my external HD and SLOW DL Dvd's...

Have to hand it to Sony, they learned from Betamax and marketed this correctly. The superior product lost because of marketing strategy....or lack thereof...

 

I have totally selfish reasons for wanting BluRay to win. A. I have a PS3 for gaming. B. I have a PS3 for watching HD movies. C. I love the color blue.

On the unselfish side, everything yall say is totally correct. It's not good for the format to be in one company's hands so to speak. That's why other companies need to step up to the plate and take on the format to bring prices down.

I mean, it was just killing me to only pay $10-$18 for a Dvd. WAY TOO CHEAP. (sarcasm - if you missed it)

On the other hand, I only buy my BluRays when they're on sale at Amazon.com for $25 - $30. I've never really seen them for more than $40 - if you're paying that much or more, you're getting ripped off.

 

What is the current maximum size of HD-DVDs? What was the next generation size of HD-DVD? I thought that 30GB was the current max of HD-DVD.

 

" but then you couldn’t have the nice stickers of the film on the front"

+ how on earth would you tell which is which, and could so easily get scratched!

 

My thoughts exactly...trying to read inside that little ring isn't easy. Its annoying as well, I have to leave the lights on in my media room just so I can make sure it says HD-DVD on the right side. Annoying

 

Envision:

HP's HDX offers an HD DVD-R optical drive. But the BR drive it offers does not write HD. Writing HD is of primary importance in our case.

1) For the aforementioned reason, does one still purchase a notebook with an HD DVD-R writer or "NO WAY" and wait for a Blu-Ray-R or -RE to become available?

2) Do you feel that HD DVD-R and HD-DVD-RW media will become unavailable?

3) You indicated that BR has a greater potential going into the future. Please elaborate.

 

Here's an excellent source of optical media.

http://www.verbatim.com/index.cfm

Click through their catalog to get an idea of their Hi-def optical media offerings. Then perhaps give them a call and ask if they plan on continuing to offer HD DVD media. I read conflicting reports that say that they have discontinued manufacture of HD DVD media. If Verbatim stops, the rest of the manufacturers are sure to follow.

 

2.0
I contacted Verbatim at 1-800-538-8589. A lady explained that Verbatim has started to phase out HD DVD. She gave me the following information:

BDR-R 25GB 2x $18
BDR-R 25GB 4x $28
BDR-RE Re-writable 25GB 2x $28

HD DVD-R 15GB 1x $18
HD DVD-R Dual Layer 30GB 1x $30

The Rep told me to go to Verbatim Newsroom tab on the bottom of their page to obtain additional information. Although the Rep told me Verbatim will phase out HD DVD, the following link takes us to a January 6, 2008 article that indicates: “Verbatim Adds World’s First 2X-Speed HD DVD Recordable Media to Industry’s Broadest HD DVD Media Product Line
LAS VEGAS, NV (January 6, 2008) – Verbatim® Americas, LLC announced today that it will begin shipping the world’s first 2x-speed HD DVD-R (recordable) and HD DVD-RW (rewriteable) discs this quarter.”
http://www.verbatim.com/news/news_detail.cfm?news_id=53221673-1143-3415-5F73E184E49B4D1B

 

Though, that press release was dated before Toshiba's official capitulation on Feb 16th. Best to go on what Verbatim says currently. The phase out is inevitable as a drop in demand is inevitable. The only somewhat viable market for HD DVD left is in Japan because of the numerous HD DVD set top recorders.

The major manufacturers of the media do not even express any long term commitment but rather express a "wait and see" approach to future production of blank media.

http://www.cdrinfo.com/Sections/News/Details.aspx?NewsId=22552

If one were to buy HD DVD media now, one would be advised to buy in bulk quantities. Not only would one obtain a favorable volume discount, but one wouldn't have to worry about its inevitable obsolescence. Plus figure, one only holds a computer system for 3 years or so, so one should buy enough blank HD DVD media to meet the anticipated demand for the media during the length of ownership of the system.

 

Systems may come and go every few years but media backups last forever.. they do for me. I would not recommend this. If you were to bulk up on a bunch of HD DVD media and one day your optical drive fails.. then what? The sad truth is the most logical thing for HD DVD users to do is take their losses today. Any additional money spent on this dead format will only make the eventual write off greater. But if someone did want to buy up HD DVD media they better hurry. I don't think there were very many HD DVD optical drives produced. Not enough market for any manufacturer to support. I expect all forms of HD DVD media will be completely gone in a few months time.