Why I'm returning my HP dv6000z

Hello,

I'm not up for writing a full "review" of my new dv6000z, but I have a couple rants that forum members might find interesting.

I recently received the HP Dv6000z that I ordered from HP.com. I chose it over the 6000t because I wanted to jump on the 64-bit bandwagon, and be somewhat future-proofed for the lifespan of the laptop.

First off, HP has this irksome habit of marketing two laptops otherwise identical except one has an AMD chip (the 6000z) and another has an Intel chip (the 6000t). Invariably, the model with the AMD chip will be slightly crappier, such as having an inferior video card or something. I don't know if there's a legit technical reason for why this is, or if HP is stacking the deck in favor of Intel models. Whatever the reason, it sucks for those of us who prefer AMD.

Second, when I received the laptop with the AMD Turion 64 chip, I noticed that it came with the 32-bit version of Windows Vista installed. Hmm, I thought, what's the point of running a 32-bit OS on a 64-bit processor?

I settled in for a long telephone call and called HP service. I was on the line for 90 minutes, transferred among 6 different people, none of whom understood my problem. One of them said it was my fault for not specifying a 64-bit OS when I ordered it (no such option is presented). Finally, I told them to have someone call me tomorrow, since I couldn't stand to be on the phone anymore.

The case manager who called today said that customers want the 32-bit OS, since lots of drivers and stuff aren't ready for the 64-bit yet. OK, what if I want the 64-bit anyway? Will HP upgrade me to the 64-bit when that stuff does become available? Ummm, he said. What good will a 64-bit processor do for HP's customers with a 32-bit OS?

(If HP had included the actual OS DVD, I could have fixed the whole thing myself since Microsoft includes the 32-bit and 64-bit versions on the same disc, but of course, HP only allows you to get a System Recovery DVD)

The second gripe I have is with the webcam--it works with HP quickplay, but doesn't seem to work with any other program. Maybe someone out there has figured out a way around this, but at this point, I've given up on this laptop and will be returning it.

I ordered a Lenovo T60 last night, which is more than I wanted to spend, but it's better in every way and I've given up on HP.

 

huh? the Intel C2D is 64bit compatible, the old Core Duo wasnt.

probably the reason the AMD version didnt come with a decent graphics card is because it is catered more towards budget buyers. currently the C2D is far better than the X2, and even I who has been with AMD for 6 years has moved to Intel because its a better CPU.

Not sure if Vista has both 32 and 64bit versions cuz I have the DVD and Ive noticed it only has the 32bit versions. The 64bit is a different DVD and is actually larger in size from what I have seen in torrent sites.



The X2 is both a 32bit and 64bit CPU, you will not really see much benefit from running a 64bit OS and Vista already has problems with drivers and software so imagine how the 64bit version would be considering even the old XP64 OS had software and driver issues.

As for the customer service, yeah its crap sometimes.

ive got the dv9000t and the webcam works on msn perfectly fine, never really needed it so didnt try it on something else.

Oh well does the T60 come with the 64bit version?

 

Sounds like this guy doesn't know what he was buying.

How can you complain about a crappy video card AFTER you bought it? You knew which video card you were going to get, if you don't like it, you shouldn't buy it in the first place.

Prefer AMD over Intel? These companies don't deserve loyalty from customers. For you to give AMD your loyalty is just nonsense. Go with whoever offers the best product. At this time, it's Intel.

Want an OS DVD? Getting 32bit version instead of 64bit? Again, just doesn't sound like you know what you were buying. Do more homework.

 

The gap between the C2D and Turion X2, which is overhyped to begin with, narrows in AMD64 mode. There's more to it than just breaking the 4GB RAM limit.

The OEM editions of Vista are either 32-bit or 64-bit. Only the retail discs have both 32-bit and 64-bit.

There has been a disgusting amount of foot-dragging by various OEMs in getting working 64-bit Vista drivers finished. Strange, since 64-bit Linux has been very popular for years. If Microsoft had been smart they'd have made Vista 64-bit-only to force the issue and saved themselves a LOT of testing.

Vista reacts really well to lots of RAM, so 4GB will become the new power user standard sooner rather than later... and 32-bit Vista can only recognize 3.5GB max.

I'm not surprised by HP's 64-bit cluelessness but I'm still disappointed. I thought my "free" Vista upgrade would be 64-bit.

 

PS: Even Microsoft will tell you that Vista 64 isn't ready for public consumption.

 

if theyd made it 64bit only then it would render many computers useless and would cost them alot of money in lost potential sales. It would mean that any computer that doesnt have 64bit support would have to be replaced/upgraded in order to work with Vista, that means extra costs to consumers and businesses, means less incentive and less money to purchase OS upgrades.

 

uhhhh....... the T60 is an Intel

 

LOL true. so what was the point of all this if in the end you go for an intel?

and how much extra did u pay? u cuda purchased a 64bit OEM version of Vista for about $100-200

 

The T60 has a 1.83 CD T2400 which is only mildly quicker than the TL-50 in benchmarks. Depending on what configuration you had I'm not sure if its a better system neccessarily.

 

LOL true. so what was the point of all this if in the end you go for an intel?

There was no point. That what was so frustrating. Get it?

Yes, I went for an Intel in the end, despite my preference for AMD. This is because after my frustration at trying to get an AMD with a 64-bit OS, I gave up, and convenience of buying a standard configuration from another large retailer outweighed the perceived value of the AMD configuration. How is this stupid or irrational? Had HP got it right, none of this would have happened.

Regarding the video card, this is true, I knew it wasn't the best when I bought it, but that was not the primary beef of my post. I was willing to accept a lower grade video card in exchange for getting an AMD processor. That option now being impractical, I might as well cash in for a better video card.

 

If that's correct, I hope that the OP knows the T2400 isn't 64-bit capable............

 

What model video card came with the amd config?

 

I am guessing a 6150 came with it.

The solution wouldve been to simply purchase the 64bit version and not spend more on a laptop you dont want. In the end as had been stated right now Vista64 really isnt all that great and i wonder just how useful it wouldve been for you.

also if the T60 doesnt have a 64bit CPU then isnt this ultimately futile? you are practically back to where you started....

 

Maybe his T60 config included something like the T5600 processor, which is a 64-bit CPU, or am I missing something?

Regardless, I'm quite satisfied with my dv6000t.

Bill

 

I fail to understand why some people feel that they absolutely have to run a 64 bit operating system. This poster seems to think that simply because it's got more bits it means its better? I mean honestly, comon here..... realistically there are NOT that many people that need a 64 bit operating system yet. I realize there's the 3.5 gig limit on 32 bit but I bet there aren't many people that can honestly say they actually use that much RAM. I love photography and run Adobe Photoshop with 16 bit TIFF images all the time. I'm also a Computer Engineer and work on simulating large ASIC's on Cadence and ModelSim simulators and our Sims do just fine with the 3.5 gig of ram linux box's that we run them on. I realize that soon enough we will be pushing that boundary and 64 bit will be necessary, but it's not there yet and this dying need of some people to have it is something I simply don't understand........ ESPECIALLY in a laptop. I also love how people think 64 bit OS's should be faster. I've seen so many threads complaining about how people upgraded to 64 bit windows and their performance is down. We have 64 bit simulators here and we avoid them at all cost. Why? 64 bits is twice as much data to move around. Yes, complicated math with very large integers will definitely make use of this bit depth. If your software was written to make use of 64 bits for whatever reason then yes, it will run better. Not that many applications however are written for this, or even have need of this yet. I can go run a large complicated simulation right now on a 64 bit AMD Athlon that's faster then any of the other Intel machines we currently have and guess what...... it'll take 15 percent LONGER to complete! People need to start being smart of this rather then just blindly buying into what's new. Why do you think Intel and AMD stopped using Ghz to sell their chips. More is not always better.

 

The architectural updates that AMD made when designing AMD64 make a huge difference on certain apps. The Java VM, codecs, and crypto react very well to the doubling of general registers (x86 is a register-starved architecture) and what not. Admittedly things will work a bit better if you're running Linux than Windows since Linux has been 64-bit-capable for other architectures prior to AMD64 and thus has much more mature 64-bit support, but the market is going to go 64-bit whether the lazy OEMs like it or not and it'd be nice not to have to do a full reinstall (or have to buy a new license) when that happens.

 

Yeah, the market definitely will move in that direction. I just don't think people need to make such a big deal out of it yet. It's not a mature solution and isn't worth returning your laptop to buy a more expensive one for by any means. If you buy a 32 bit OS today, I'd be willing to wager that in 2 more years you'll still be in fairly good shape. To his credit however I don't know why he feels that he needs 64 bit Windows right now, but obviously he does, or maybe he simply wants it for having it. I don't want to bash what he wants at all. I know that for my hobbies I've certainly spent more money then I should have many a time.

 

Wow, I wish I knew things were better before I even used them. It would save me a lot of grief.

You sound like you just don't know what you were doing and blamed HP for it.

If you had a 64 bit OS you'd be, well, running 64 bit and probably complaining about how bad it is and how there's no drivers or programs for anything you want to do. You seem to have some belief that you'd be missing out on something by running 32 bit, but you wouldn't be. It'd be the other way around.

As far as graphics cards go, would you prefer the intel 950? Because that's what you'd probably be getting.

And HP's "irksome habit" of marking the same model with two different letters based on cpu? Maybe I"m a nutcase, but I LIKE knowing that essentially it's the same PC other than the CPU. 6000z or 6000t tells me that one is AMD, one is Intel, but for the most part they're the exact same PC, which is true.

 

Seems like you made a rushed decision and turned the tables around by blaming HP.

 

i agree... do your research before buying a laptop... 32bit or 64bit, intel or amd, hey! it's your preference, don't blame HP!

 

I think this is a bit unfair. I spoke to a Voodoo rep at GDC who pretty much echoed my concerns.

The OEM isn't lazy; 64-bit Vista is NOT READY. It sucks like x64 XP did, and it also sucks in some new ways. They don't want to be fielding questions on why peoples' legacy apps aren't running, or why other newer apps are inexplicably not working. Vista by itself causes enough problems, what happens when you throw WoW into the mix?

This is why OEMs aren't switching to 64-bit Vista: 32-bit has enough problems and they don't want to get stuck doing Microshaft's tech support. The one OEM that sells 64-bit Vista is going to look like a jerk when some software is running on their competitor's machines but not theirs.

 

Agreed.

Read the details, get the info, and think long and hard before you feel you know all about computers and buying a notebook.

Don't blame the manufacturers.