Lenovo ThinkPad T14 & T14s Owners Thread

Price/performance does matter, hence the dissatisfaction with many higher-priced machines.

ThinkPad X1 does cost a lot, and you're paying for the form factor (much like the new XPS series). It's why I'm mostly quite happy with the Inspiron 5505 I got - given what I paid for it, it performs fairly well. I'm even happier with my old E7440 Latitude - I bought it used/refurbished for $300 CAD 3 years ago, swapped out the 8GB of RAM for 16GB and it works just fine. A machine that was solidly built. Also why the IdeaPad 5 is so popular - it's good value.

And you're right, you don't need a Ryzen 7 for working on spreadsheets. Nor a Ryzen 5 for that matter. I really just need a CPU that's "fast enough", though I like power-efficient CPUs for better battery life and better noise/cooling. Truth is, a lot of the laptops being sold are far more powerful than they need to be for the average user, which results in worse thermals and battery life.

 

Truth in all what you say.

Remember 2011ish? If you wanted great battery life and thin and light, you got a MacBook Air. It was reasonably priced, had a **** screen, low specs, but it was the "use it all day" Laptop and basically started the whole thinner and lighter things. If you wanted a decent everyday-machine you just got a MacBook and for heavy lifting a MacBook Pro. There was a clear differentiation there and the MacBook Pros around 2011/2012 weren't paperthin yet and had decent ports.

Now looking at the convoluted Lenovo Lineup of machines, it's really hard to get a decently priced machine with "not too much power" as to not overwhelm the chassis ability to cool it down for let's say simple typing a novel or working with spreadsheets. Again I feel like a Ryzen 3 quadcore option is missing across the board. Of course one could also go for the lower specs Intel chips, which at this point is ridiculous because you'd be paying more for less and thermals are actually even worse, the only thing saving the thermals is the fact, that they are just not as fast/there are just not as many cores. I'd gladly go with a thicker chassis, like a P1 or P14s and their dual-fan and quad-heatpipe setup, or even better yet, with a Legion's vapor chamber. I feel like the R7 would really need that kind of cooling and if you'd boost it up to it's full 25W potential, I don't think ANYONE would ever need (until the next die shrink) any other processor for heavy lifting.

The R7 in my T14s get's around 25200 multicore score in Geekbench. While a synthetic test it's still an indicator. The Intel based P1 from last year, a workstation class machine, get's 24000.

Crazy times.

I'll need some more time to make up my mind, but at the moment I'm leaning towards a T14 with R5 in the hopes of better thermals.

Fell in love with the ThinkPad Keyboards, hard to use anything else now...

 

I personally am stuck with Thinkpads because of input devices. Their keyboard is great, and trackpoint is simply unmatched. There are other things to love, but also quite a few things to hate about Thinkpads. Regardless, I feel there is no choice for me, and it's very disappointing.

I considered getting a Surface Laptop 3 AMD and making a custom lower shell for it to accommodate Thinkpad Compact USB keyboard, but it is a terrible waste of my time, effort and money, and I would be stuck with soldered slow 802.11ac wifi adapter which is pretty much a deal-breaker for me. Surface Laptop 4 AMD is not out yet, and will definitely cost an arm and a leg with maxed out RAM, because it's soldered - while other AMD-powered machines are no better than Thinkpads.

Recent Thinkpads would be fantastic... if Lenovo offered WQHD/4K with Ryzen CPUs. FHD displays suck - the resolution is too low, and they are traditionally inferior to most 4K & WQHD displays in other aspects. Intel CPUs suck - they are far less secure by design than AMD, even without the constant stream of new vulnerabilities - but only they are offered with high-res displays in current Thinkpad lineup.

I don't think I can wait another year for next update cycle in hopes Lenovo finally makes an AMD Thinkpad with high-res display, will have to settle for something now...

 

Might be a weird question, but would it be possible to replace the screen in a a T14 (AMD) with the 4k screen from the T14i? Not sure if they use the same connectors, and I wouldn't know where to look that up.

 

No. The motherboards of AMD Thinkpads have 2-lane* EDP, meaning 1920x1280 or something along the lines is max they can handle. They definitely can't do WQHD or 4K.

* - while I didn't see the schematics, ODMs design motherboards according to OEMs spec, and since Lenovo didn't plan to put WQHD or 4K displays in AMD Thinkpads, 99.9% the ODM who designed the motherboards didn't put 4-lane EDP instead of 2-lane.

p.s. if it was possible to just put a 4K or WQHD display from X1C to any AMD Thinkpad, I wouldn't complain and praise Lenovo as the best vendor ever. (=

 

I'm also no fan of limited screen selection on AMD machines but to be honest, for MY (yours might differ) usecases I don't see the point of a 4K panel in a 14" frame. Even if it would be a visible difference (which for ME it isn't), I can't think of doing such graphic sensitive work on such a tiny screen for a long enough time the 4K's extra sharpness would benefit my eyes. I use my Laptops on big color accurate monitors for that and only use the built in screen for "quick fixes" when I'm away from home or actual creative writing. 4K panels on anything smaller than a 17" feels like a complete waste of battery life to me. But hey, the option should be there at least.

Personally I find the sweet spot is something "2Kish" like the MacBooks do, or something around 1440p-ish. But I really don't mind a good 1080p screen, just wish they'd be a bit more color accurate with quicker response times, because "blurry text" when scrolling fast through walls of text for hours on end when editing, is a strain on my eyes!

As for the current ThinkPad situation, I figure it's the same like with all computers. There's always something better around the corner, if you wait for it, you'll wait forever. Get a Computer that most closely resembles what you need, live with compromises and try to get rid of it when something better comes around and get that instead. Luckily ThinkPads do hold their value a bit longer than your standard Acer thing. Not as well as MacBooks but hey compared to them they don't cost an arm and a leg, even if they are already on the expensive side.

Tomorrow the TNT guys pick up my returned T14s, as soon as I get my money back I'm getting the T14 with R5 and call it a day. Hope notebookcheck.com will FINALLY upload their ThinkPad AMD reviews... also Lisa Gade's MobileTechReviews Youtube channel should have their reviews up this week.

PS: Also love the Trackpoint!

 

For those interested I've written up my experiences with my ThinkPad T14s in detailled review form here.
Today the fedex dude collected my T14s - I did return it because of heat issues. Once I got my money back, I might investigate the T14 with R5.

 

WQHD at 14" @ 100% scaling is the perfect display for me. 4K can be scaled down to match that, while with 1080p I just don't get enough space - especially vertical - and it's not sharp enough at 14". Also, I strongly prefer 3:2 ratio, but there are very few displays with it.

 

Using almost any other keyboard after using a good ThinkPad keyboard is difficult indeed.

Definitely wish there was more customization options. I want a 15" ThinkPad with the high-quality keyboard, 400 nits display, AMD Ryzen, a non-fingerprint magnet finish (like the silver finish that was available on some prior ThinkPads) and smaller bezels. But I don't need/want to pay the outrageous premium the T-series commands simply due to...I don't know what, exactly. Certainly not worth 2x the price of an IdeaPad.

I'd recommend posting that review either directly in the Lenovo forums, or posting and linking to it - currently people will have to read through this entire thread before seeing your post with the link to the review. By this I mean a new thread in the Lenovo forums titled "T14s review" or something like that to make it easy to find.

 

I've dropped and spilled drinks on my X-series Thinkpads, seen others do the same with their T & X Thinkpads, and repaired both business and consumer machines after some more adventurous escapades way too many times to agree with you. Thinkpads are built like tanks and totally worth the extra price. The fact that Lenovo gimps Thinkpads as if on purpose, by putting poor (compared to many Ideapads) displays in them, and making questionable design choices like m.2 SSD slots that are unable to accomodate double-sided drives, doesn't change that.

Ideapads are in a different league. Just like Macbooks, Microsoft Surface devices, Dell XPS line - and every other consumer & premium consumer laptop or tablet out there, despite whatever great features they may have. For me, laptop is a working tool - not some shiny toy to be pampered with or a gaming device safely sitting at the table - and there is no doubt whether my laptop will be dropped or get liquids spilled on - it definitely will get a fair share of both! Any laptop not designed to withstand such accidents and easily repairable if it does end up damaged, is a a poor choice for me. Same with warranty - if not international & on-site, it's pretty much useless.

 

Alright so last sunday I ordered a T14 Ryzen 7, which I just received. Shipping estimate was 3 weeks but got it in 2 days, so that's nice.

I bought a Yoga Slim 7 before that, but due to the bad (and defective) display I'm returning that one. I also didn't like the overly bright backlit keyboard, the T14 has way better brightness options. The T14 is 240 euro's more, but the improved display, keyboard, and overall ThinkPad quality is probably worth it. I also could've gone for the Ryzen 5 which would be roughly the same price as the Yoga Slim 7 (tough it has a 4650U, compared to the 4800U in the Yoga Slim 7), but I was just in a generous mood I guess.

Currently I'm just testing how the T14 fares in daily usage, especially how the temps are. If those are okay then I'm going to keep the T14, and if not then I'll have to look at other options (though there are almost no good alternatives in the EU). The trackpad could be better, but I'm spoiled by my old MacBook Pro. Maybe I just have to get used to the trackpoint. The T14 does indeed come with single channel ram, so I'll probably add another stick.

Btw don't forget to use the Lenovo Vantage app to update some Lenovo stuff. I feel like it runs a bit cooler since I've updated it.

 

That's an opinion, not a fact (in terms of whether or not they're worth the price - I agree they're built like tanks).

Most people I know (including myself) never drop their machines, rarely (if ever) spill liquids on them. I've had many, many (many) laptops over the years, and the non-business ones typically last just as long as the business ones.

My experience has been the complete opposite (aka very rarely come across drop/spill damage). Likely different scenario if you work at a company and deal with people who don't care about those work-provided machines.

Mind you, I'm not arguing that ThinkPads (and other business-grade laptops) aren't built better - they are. I have several old Latitudes that are still working, which I bought refurbished many years ago. They had clearly been dropped, yet still worked. A cheap $400 laptop would likely not have survived intact.

For people who are careful (which, based on my observations, is a large portion of laptop owners in my circle) the massive increase is price is likely not worth it. Much like CPU power, GPU power, RAM/SSD requirements etc, whether or not the improved build quality is "totally worth it" is entirely subjective and depends on each individual. In my case, for example, the 2x price premium is "totally" not worth it, though I'd gladly pay $100-$200 more for it.

EDIT: My sister-in-law definitely falls under the category of people for whom a ThinkPad is totally worth it - she's incredibly clumsy and has dropped/broken several laptops (doesn't help she has two young kids who think they're just another toy). I've told them they should buy a good used ThinkPad/Latitude/EliteBook, it'll actually be able to withstand the abuse. I also think used business laptops are pretty good value, which is why I've bought several - they're what my wife and kids use, as I can see them being less careful with them. My own personal laptops are a different story.

 

Sure is, like everything else in my post.

My experience is quite the opposite.

1. Hinge mounts typically go out on consumer stuff, requiring lower case and/or display lid replacement. Worst I saw on a few Thinkpads were metal washers getting out of display lid - was able to fix those with reassembly and a bit of superglue, the result was satisfying although the procedure has to be repeated about once a year afterwards; on consumer stuff, the mounts where the washers go are often completely destroyed after some years.

2. Liquid spills often result in dead motherboard on consumer stuff, while Thinkpads typically survive that, requiring a keyboard replacement at worst, and often get away without that.

3. Drops.

My first laptop was a gaming Acer which I used for 5 or 6 years. Upgraded the hell out of it, was still in great condition by the time I parted it out - due to expensive upgrades, made much more sense than selling it as a whole - which allowed me to buy a much newer Thinkpad. I dare say it's an exception that proves the rule - consumer laptops are not made to last long.

Most people I know drop their personal laptops, spill all sorts of drinks on them, and sometimes do even weirder stuff to damage them. \=

Very true, at least in the US.

 

Notebookchexk review of ThinkPad T14s in German. I used translate in Opera to read it. Great rating of 91%.

https://www.notebookcheck.com/Test-...iness-Laptop-ist-mit-AMD-besser.481481.0.html

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I'm native in german. Yes it does read impressive, unfortunately they're not too specific on the thermals,

but from what I could get from their screenshots, it runs at least 15°C cooler than mine did! :/

 

Congrats! I'm also thinking about a T14 now!
If you could get the chance, can you download and install League of Legends and check the temperatures when opening the launcher? Just by loading the launcher, not the game itself, my T14s immediately climbed to 94°C. Playing only a few minutes smashed it straight into it's thermal limit of 105°C.

 

On the durability of tech, the product cycles all just become so much faster because we're tumbling around the drain of our hyperconsumerist world. Most things are just not made to last past 2 or max 3 years. I've always had a great time with Apple stuff (in the past, up to 2012/2013-ish) and tend to use the crap out of my tech. I don't like upgrading if not necessary. Still rocking my OG iPhone SE and see no need to upgrade anytime soon, maybe swap the battery.

Back on topic I do feel that ThinkPads ARE more robust and I'm willing to pay a premium for that, also for the added security features. I don't mind their price when I look at what a specced out XPS or MacBook costs. Still, for this price I expect a somewhat competent thermal solution. I wouldn't even mind a fancy docking-solution with a built-in-vacuum for better thermals when running docked!
One can dream.

Haha.

 

Opening the launcher does prompt the fan to start spinning (on the first level only, it's barely audible in an entirely quiet room), and does increase my temps to 50°C. Temps were at 46°C before opening the launcher, so that barely changed. I was working on a small Visual Studio project and installing some other stuff in the meantime. I did play a 25 minute game of ARAM earlier today where I left the machine unplugged and on 'better battery' on purpose. All settings maxed and running at 1080p. I forgot what the temps/fps where (I watched those the whole day, so the numbers are all scrambled in my head atm), but it was perfectly playable. The laptop did get quite hot, but not unreasonably hot. It also wasn't that loud, but I am used to my MacBook turbines so that might give some perspective. I can try again tomorrow where I change all power settings to max performance and with the power plugged in.

All in all I think that your T14s probably was faulty in some way. The folks over at notebookcheck also didn't seem to have too many issues with the heat.

When I started looking for a new laptop I also started by testing the XPS in stores. I quite liked it, but wasn't too pleased with the lack of ports and the price premium. After a while I found out about the new Ryzen 4000 processors and at that point I knew I had to have one of those. I usually don't get the most expensive option, but this T14 still cost quite a bit less than what my initial budget was.

 

Well, T14s runs hot when faulty, while XPS & Macbooks run hot by design. (= Jokes aside, many if not most recent Intel-based Thinkpads also run crazy hot. Lenovo tends to cheap out on cooling just like everybody else. Sometimes it's possible to just install better designed cooling system from a sister Thinkpad model... other times it requires modding not for the faint of heart.

 

Hmmm that indeed does sound much better than my machine. Did you use it "stock" or apply new thermal paste? Over on medium.com someone responded to my article, also had a "very hot" T14s with R7 and the T14 with R5 he tried wasn't any better. Bad batches maybe due to corona-disturbance in production? Rushing to market? I don't know. I'm hesitant what to get next now. I clearly want a ThinkPad but I'd like to keep my house from burning down!

 

I do have one small problem with my T14 though. Whenever a sound is played for the first time I hear a small crackling/plop noise (similar to when you plug your headphones in). After that it doesn't happen again until the speakers are quiet for about a minute. Weird.
So when the speakers have been quiet for a minute and a sound starts playing there is a small crackling noise, and all is fine after that.
I've tried updating/resetting the realtek driver, but that doesn't solve the problem. I also haven't tested this on Linux. Does this problem sound familiar to anyone?

E: Alright so after clicking random buttons in device manager the problem seems to be resolved. I'm now on driver version 10.0.19041.264 and date 09/05/2020. This isn't the latest version, but it seems to work better for me.

E2: When playing League of Legends ARAM on highest settings 1440p I get about 45 FPS in the 5v5 fights, and 70 in spawn (when nothing happens). For normal gameplay you'd probably want to drop the settings to get a better framerate, but for science I used the highest settings. This is with the AC plugged in and on an external monitor (hence the 1440p). CPU temp (ctl/die) is usually 80°C but jumps 90°C for about ten seconds every minute, not sure why. This is with one single channel 16GB RAM stick.

E3: I didn't change anything hardware wise, so it's still on stock thermal paste.

 

Again thank you for your investigation. About that crackling noise thing. I had it with my Ideapad, exactly the same thing and also fixed it the same way you did - by fiddling around. Eventually it went away.
Your experience with League of Legends sounds reasonable to me. I was hitting thermal limit of 105°C very often, very quickly. Again, this is not a gaming machine, still the temps should behave. Also I've seen a youtube video about the memory. Single channel really hurts the performance of Ryzen CPUs and the best thing to do is going symmetric, meaning going for a 16 GB RAM stick in that slot. Even if you'd put more in there, just by not being the same amount as the soldered RAM, you lose on performance. Not much though, but still.

After reading plenty of forums and threads it really seems to be a wider spread problem. The machine either runs perfectly fine, or like a hot mess. I'm discussing with people on notebookcheck.com and it seems like the reviewers themselves have a T14 with R5 and said (in comments) it's also very hot but the T14s with R7 is perfectly fine. Seems like a proper lottery.

R7 machines are sold out where I live anyways, so I might just wait until they are in stock again and then try my luck at the draw again.

Another question to the more tech savy people in here: Do you think it's possible, with reasonable effort, to switch the T14 trackpad out for he T14s one?

 

Another T14s review. His unit's cooling seems OK.



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Thanks for posting this, I just saw it. Yes, his max temperature during load and benchmarking is about 78°C. That's what I got when opening the mail app...

 

Well... Just as Josh pointed out...
That single fan in T14s system, can be a culprit in poor heat management.
However, he did also pointed out, INTEL system is not cool either.

 

Lon's review comparing Intel and AMD versions of T14s.



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Not a gamer but some games on T14 Ryzen 5 4650.



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Does anyone know if it's possible to replace the trackpad on a T14 with an X1 one (glass trackpad)? I've read that it's possible on a lot of the earlier T-models.

 

That Mash IT dude with the gaming benchmark also has an indepth R5 T14 review up. Very interesting, low temps and extremely high scores in Geekbench (5500ish) and Cinebench 20 (2500ish) which isn't TOO far off the R7 version. Tempting.

 

LON's reviewed units, i5-10310u vs Ryzen 7 4750u
kinda.........

 

I have the X13 (same trackpad as T14s) and I tried the replace with the X1 glass trackpad but it didn't work (the colour is also a little different). Investigated a little and I noticed the original trackpad has a blue PCB (Elan?) whereas the X1 trackpad is Synaptics. I think if you manage to find an Elan version of the X1 trackpad, it should work.

 

Not a T14 review but very detailed on Ryzen 5 pro 4650 performance.



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Finally got my T14 with R5. 15-20 degrees cooler than my T14s with R7 which I returned. Very happy so far. AOU panel, which is fine for me. If you think the T14 is "fat" - it's not. Not even compared to the T14s. It's... "substantial". Really lovely coating. Perfect keyboard, trackpad actually is smooth despite what some reviewers have pointed out.

Very happy. R5 performance WAY enough for me. Roughly 15-20% less than R7 but with much better temps.

Will soon do a repaste and see if I can further reduce temps.
Finally. This T14 will stay with me.

 

One minor complaint. My T14 came with a smartcard reader. I don't need that one. Now with that open hole prone to dust and dirt and also a structural weakness to the chassis when putting too much pressure on the topcase I'd want to have the plastic dummy they build into the ThinkPads when ordering without Smart Card Reader. Any idea where to get that part? I looked through AliExpress and eBay already but to no avail. Part number would be interesting to have, or anyone got a spare one?

Edit:
Ok... I got the parts number!

DummySmartCardReader 02HK918

But now where to get it, I can't order it from Lenovo's parts page.

Edit2:
Found a solution: https://flexcommunityesales.force.com/
Get your parts there, for those that are interested. Quick shipping for Europe.

 

that’s a bit odd, did you buy a preconfigured t14 or custom?
My T14 custom didn’t have one as per my review but the P1 I just reviewed did.

regards
David

 

My t440p still takes care of my mobile needs but dang I'd love one these. Could play some phantasy star online 2 easily enough especially if you guys are playing league of legends.

Must... Resist... Temptation! Lol

Would make running Linux easier, I still can't get the track pad to work in Linux at the moment since I installed the t450 track pad.

 

Oh Hello! We keep running into each other, just came from your vid!

Yes it was a preconfig because everything else was on 5-6 weeks delivery at the time I ordered!

It's a bit of a pain exchanging that thing myself, but oh my! So far loving my T14!

 

Hahaha trackpad?
It's a ThinkPad, use the "NUB"

 

Haha I get every where

glad to hear you are enjoying it, it is such an amazing laptop.
Seems you can’t buy any at all on the U.K. store at the moment, wonder if they just can’t keep up with demand

 

Also doesnt work lol

 

As they are really the only high quality AMD Pro 4000 series chips anywhere I could imagine companies that have a competent IT department eat them up. I've been peskering a Lenovo representative a while ago when there will be new stock. Answer was about end of September, first week of October.

I'm really madly in love with the T14 and actually like the "heft" it brings to the table compared to the T14s quite a lot. The T14s really is so thin it's almost "flimsy" (but stiff af).

Leaked AMD roadmap shows that even the next gen APUs will be based on 7nm and have Vega integrated graphics, but starting 2022 they plan to bring 5nm mobile chips sporting Navi integrated graphics. I guess then I'll upgrade again from my now fresh ThinkPad and hopefully the integrated Navi cards will be somewhat around current Nvidia 1060 area of performance. Anyways, By 2022 I hope ThinkPads across the lineup can be had with AMD, also of course the lovely P series!

 

Now that's a shame!

 

Now that I think on it, doesnt work in Windows either. Might be disabled in BIOS, gonna check that out in a bit lol

 

One does not simply NOT check the bios!
Good luck!

 

Thanks to your post, as well as other info, I have also order the Ryzen 5 pro T14. Will upgrade ssd. Is it necessary to use thermal pad with the ssd?

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I'd say that depends on the SSD. I've tested several and decided to not go for hardcore-performance but rather for low power consumption to further increase battery life and decrease thermal load. I found the WD SN550 Blue 1TB is a viable option. No thermal pad. It doesn't have a DRAM cache but that is no problem in real day-to-day use for me. If you don't shovel around several gigabyte huge files all day long, you will not slow down the SSD (and even then it never drops below 480 MB/s which is good SSD speed, but I never topped it out yet). It's a one-sided, blue PCB, very flat and easy to install too. Only one chip, thus reducing sruface area that gets hot. If you want to, you could easily use a thermal pad on this single chip I fugure. I really like it. Price is fabulous too. Speeds are about 2200/1900 read/write which in all honesty is plenty fast for me. You won't notice any difference to the Samsung 970 Evo Plus 3500/3200 (which is a power hog while under load) when starting programs and working common stuff. Another option, that has DRAM-cache and is slightly faster is the Kingston A2000. Also nice.

If you're upgrading the RAM you should go for the same size that you have onboard, for best dual channel. Performance boost single channel RAM vs. dual channel RAM is significant. About 20%. If you buy 1.2 volt RAM you can further save on power consumption, thus heat and battery life. I went with the crucial 16 GB sodimm.

Hope that helped.

I can only again reiterate that the R5 is PLENTY fast and I feel like for everything you need even more performance, an ultrabook probably isn't the right hoice anyways!
I'm very very happy!

 

Thanks much. I really need 2tb on that drive. Would the Intel 660p be good enough in power saving in this case?

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When researching I found a website (sorry didn't bookmark) comparing NVMe drives for low power consumption and I remember seeing the 660p always in the top 20%, so I'd say yes! I really grew fond of "optimizing for efficiency" rather than raw power. To impress whom?

 

Is it really that bad with a Ryzen 7 processor in a T14 (without an "s")? I thought it was a much better choice than the Ryzen 5. However, I read here that the R7 has major temperature problems and due to the "throttling" caused by high temperatures has the same performance as the R5. I thought the R7 would be much cooler and more powerful in the T14 than in the T14s. I am very disappointed ...

 

I use a 2tb 660 as a boot drive and to be fair I don’t notice any difference in speed to my Samsung 970 evo