Max RAM for T60?

The T60 specs say a max of 3GB RAM. But I've never heard of 1.5GB RAM sticks before.

So does that mean the max "paired" DDR2 is 2GB using two 1G sticks? What happens if I installed two 2GB sticks, would it work like having 3GB and still have the benefit of being paired?

I'm on the verge of getting a T60 (clearance at Best Buy). I know there are some great deals at Lenovo right now, so it makes this decision kind of tough, but I would still end up saving a few hundred dollars by getting "last years model".

The T60 I'm looking at has 15.4" WXGA+ enhanced resolution, fingerprint reader, X1400, 120GB HD, but only 1GB RAM (I assume it's using both slots right now). Also, not the latest processor (T5500).

I've played around with it enough now to not like Vista Business very well and would prefer XP. I think this maching needs 2GB desparately. Overall it's pretty sluggish right now.

Compared to the T61, The T60 has PCMCIA slot as opposed to Express slots. And this machine does not have any bluetooth built in. But overall I figure it's a very solid laptop.

If I were buying new from Lenovo, I'd be getting the R61 14.1", with webcam, bluetooth, ......

 

If you wanna get the practical maximum of RAM, get a 2GB and a 1GB stick which will amount to 3GB of addressible memory.
It will work like a charm.
I've used the same configuration in my T60, and now in the T61.
Don't pay attention to terms like "matched" or "dual-channel", which are just marketing gimmicks.
Branding dosn't matter either.

 

The max ram for the T60 is 4GB. The max RAM that you'll be able to see in windows is about 3.25GB. Having "paired", or dual channel RAM is a slight performance gain at best, and a marketing gimmick at worst. The most cost efficient RAM you could get for the T60 would be a 2GB and a 1GB stick, or 2 1GB sticks.

 

You're wrong. Lenovo's implementation of the 945chipset for some reason limits it to 3Gigs being visible no matter what OS or 32 or 64 you're using.

 

Would it be significantly cheaper than this configuration?
The T60 will run hotter and have inferior battery performance.

 

Nice config, who would have thought these prices possible 3 months ago.

Still not sure which is better, because what I'm looking at is still pretty good I think. Here's the specs.


T5500 1.6GHz, 667MHz FSB
120GB 5400rpm HD
1G RAM (I assume 2 DIMMs unfortunately)
15.4" WSXGA+
ATI X1400 GPU
No bluetooth
DVD double layer RW
6-cell battery
Vista Business
PC Card slot (no express slot is my understanding)
Intel PRO/Wireless 3945ABG
Fingerprint reader.
This would be approx $800 before tax and extended warranty

What else would give your config better battery life than the T60, other than screensize and integrated graphcis do you think? Do you know of anything really outdated or negative about the T60?

FYI, I'm not doing any gaming, and for all I know the X3100 integrated graphics may eventually rival the ATI X1400 in performance once it gets fully optimized. But for some reason I still like the idea of having a dedicated GPU.

At first I had my heart set on the 14.1" (R61 or T61). But now I'm starting to like the 15.4" WSXGA+ (though the text is kind of small in native resolution, and I like to run in the native resolution when possible). I don't need ultraportability right now.

I do plan to add either extended warranty or protection plan by the way, have to choose between Best Buy or direct from Lenovo.

Back to the RAM, I'm hearing mixed messages about the importance of paired dual-channel, but I like the answer's I'm getting here best.

 

Clyde, the integrated X3100 is all you'll ever need.
It'd run cooler and significantly improve your batter usage - the most important factors in a non-gaming notebook.

 

If you don't care for the 4:3 format, then definately get a better screen.
The standard aspect ratio is a must for me.
Even though there's nothing particularly wrong with my 14" SXGA+, the newer screens in general are better in every way.

 

Does the WSXGA+ on the T60 fall in the standard aspect ratio category you were talking about? One thing I like about Thinkpads in general is that I prefer matte screens.


Is there a way to tell if a laptop with 1GB RAM has two 512MB sticks vs one 1GB stick?

Earlier I said "No Gaming". That assumes I don't give into my 13year old son who is into half life and .... on our old desktop. If I ever do allow games onto the laptop, I realize that neither the ATI X1400 or the Integrated X3100 are powerhouses, but would the X1400 be a little better?

One thing that would lead me to ordering a R61 or T61 from Lenovo is the ability to get XP. The T60 I'm looking at has Vista Business. With 1GB RAM, it is looking like a real DOG right now when I test drive it. Drives me crazy, it's like going back in time. I'm concerned that simply going from 1GB to 2GB RAM is going to completely cure that problem.

So if I get the T60, I may take my old legit version of XP I have laying around (bought it the first week XP was released, now the desktop I used it on is dead and buried) and try loading into the T60, after reading through forums about any driver headaches. Then Vista Business will always be waiting there lurking in the recovery partition on the hard drive in case I ever change my mind.

Right now I am just not a fan of Vista at all. Change for change's sake is not progress. It's like having a high performance 500 horse power turbo-charged engine (the Core 2 Duo) sitting in an old truck with the parking brakes on all the time (Windows Vista). The operating system is supposed to be a platform from which to build on, not the end product, and it's not even a good end product. Sorry for ranting, but why isn't software efficiency given any priority.

Sorry for going off topic. Anyway, does the T60 deal look decent?

 

Just FYI Windows XP was a DOG when it first made way onto computers as well. Give it time and vista will mature and perk up. Few years from new everyone will be on vista.

 

I'm sure you're right that, within a few years nearly all will be on Vista.

To me it just seems like the Benefit-to-DOGNESS ratio is just not high enough with Vista. But I'm just now scratching the surface.

If people could experience a truly fast boot-up, shutdown, and non-sluggishness, I don't think they would tolerate Vista.

 

No, you'll be wishing you had not bought that machine before the years out.

 

Do you say that mainly because of the speed of the T60 vs T61 (based on processor and chipset and ...) or for other reasons?

Could you be more specific, because I'm not boxed in yet. I can still order a new T61 or R61 direct from Lenovo.

I'm trying to find some benchmarks that compare the two with Vista.

I'm still not clear on the max RAM for the T60. The specs I've seen say 3GB, but someone else mentioned 4GB.

Some of the things I might regret about the T60 besides more speed are (a) no express slot, and (b) no integrated bluetooth, although I have a bluetooth dongle already.

How critical do people think the express slot will be in the next 4 years?

 

Considering for a few more dollars you could move to the Santa Rosa based chipset, better CPU, faster GPU, etc... The config you have spec'd locks you nicely into WinXP or Linux.

And keep in mind a few of us actually like Windows Vista. So when you start off ranting about it, how much help do you think you're going to get?

Regarding the RAM in the T60, you can place two 2GB SoDIMMs in the machine but x86 systems will only use 3GB. Therefore you'd be wasting money above 3GB. The same is true for a x64 OS with the T60 chipset. The T61 on the other hand will actually allow addressability of close to 8GB when 4GB SoDIMMS are made and affordable, with x64 operating systems.

Regarding the ExpressCard slot, it is available on the T60 series. Since it is a high speed capable interface, the most common use today is a eSATA card in order to attach a high speed disk enclosure.

What would you use all of that memory and disk for (other than porn)? Virtualization, HD recording, etc. For instance, I use a network based HD tuner to record directly to my machine across my Gige network. The expresscard slot is perfect for high I/O needs.

If you want detailed specs on all of the Lenovo machines, search for tabook.pdf.

 

Actually the limitation on the 965chipset can still only see 4Gigs. In the next chipset Intel said they'll go beyond 4Gigs.

 

halobox, sorry for slamming Vista so much, when I really don't know too much about it yet. I appreciate the help, cause I can't really afford a bad decision, needs to last me ~ 4 years.

Based on tebore's comment about max 4GB in the 965chipset, I guess I'd still probaby be ok with the T60. The main thing that's bugging me right now about the T60 that I'm looking at is that it doesn't have the ExpressCard slot. The T60 may have had that as an option, but it doesn't seem to be in this unit. Not sure how much of a weakness having just PCMCIA is versus ExpressSlot, looking forward. Since I like to edit home movies, probably some high speed offloading onto an external HD is something I'd be interested in and sounds like the ExpressCard could do that nicely in the future.

Right now I'm still not able to get down quite as far on price for a 15.4" WSXGA+ (which I'm starting to get hooked on). Wish I wouldn't have missed out on the special on the T61p 14".

 

I certainly hope you're wrong. I have been assured by Lenovo that the T61p will address about 7.5GB of RAM when the 4GB SoDIMMs come out.

Do you see that in writing on the Intel website somewhere?

 

What are you talking about? All the T60(p)s have Expresscard 54 slots.

 

As for memory
ftp://download.intel.com/design/mobile/datashts/31627303.pdf

Check 1.1.2 you'll see max supported at 4gigs.

 

Thanks for the reference, good to know that the 965chipset has the 4GB limitation.

I need to be more thorough next time I start a thread, and take what a sales clerk at the local store says with a grain of salt. He said the T60 doesn't have an Expresscard slot. I just looked at the specs more closely after reading tebore's remarks, and it does have it in the top slot (PC card on the bottom). When I looked in Device Manager, I only say a PCMCIA description, but I guess that covers both.

Also, regarding RAM, I just looked at that more carefully as well on lenovo's support website, and it looks like when the T60 is running XP it only supports 3GB, but with Vista it does support 4GB.

I did purchase the T60 by the way, because they're about ready to take this last one off the shelf, even if it's not sold. Now that I have it, I have a few days to decide whether to keep it or not (decide before the Lenovo Labor Day sale ends). This unit had been opened, so I get to play with it without worrying about a restocking fee.

So far so good.

I realize the T60 has an outdated and slower chipset. But I have a cash limit(well, it's a matter of how deep in the doghouse I really want to go), which is why originally I was not looking above $600. But now, what I really want has evolved over the last two weeks. For me the 15.4" WSXGA+ has become a real plus, since I don't need ultraportability right now and I just love the screen.

Comparing to a new T61, with a feature set that's similar to this T60 (15.4" WSXGA+, 120GB, fingerprint reader, and DVD RW, X3100, 1GB 1DIMM, add 1G later), then I'm coming out around $1120 before tax & extended warranty. That's about $300 more than what I can get this last T60 for (but I think the T60 s two 512MB DIMMS, so I lose another $50 essentially when expanding to 2GB). For most people I think it would be a no brainer to step up to the Santa Rosa chipset, to help future proof this big investment for a little longer and getting a faster processor. But it still may not be worth it for me right now.

So far the idea of keeping the T60 is sitting well with my gut, after having played with it for a while, especially considering some of the other weaker systems I was originally considering. We'll see what tomorrow holds. I need to figure out how to create restore CD's (or can I create restore DVD's instead?).

If I do keep it, next I have to decide on a service plan, and whether to go direct through Lenovo for a plan, or use Best Buy's plan. Best Buy offers a battery replacement with their extended plan, but you'd think Lenovo repair houses would have better Thinkpad knowledge?

On a different topic, later on I'm going to ask for feedback on a laptop config I'm recommending to my father-in-law who is in the market for a laptop.

 

By the way, I can't say I haven't been warned by you folks (to go with the T61 instead of T60). You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink. But don't think don't appreciate the advice, I really do, this forum is great. I'm even warming up to vista.

The biggest problem I'm having now is web browsing, because the CA Security Suite I'm using (which is Vista compatible) is driving me crazy. Can't find the sweet spot for the Firewall security. Since I'm on a router, maybe I don't need the CA Firewall, but it is denying practically 10 items everywhere I go (many of them cookies I think) and many of the sites won't load with the CA Firewall on. Finding the balance between usability versus vulnerability is always a mystery to me.

 

I've been told be three different OEM's their Santa Rosa based laptops will go to 8GB. I have asked for written proof. If I manage to get something, I'll post it here. I agree, the Intel doc looks pretty solid, but I've seen docs get "revised" after "market conditions" change.

 

I'm fairly certain that that 4gig max is because DIMMs bigger than 2GB don't exist. I.E. it's a practical limit, not a theoretical one.

 

Yea, that's exactly what I was told. However, the Intel specs should be accurate, and they SHOULD say 8GB if thats the real number. Scary...

 

All the reviews of the SR platform at preview and at release say 4Gigs. Intel shown a road map awhile ago saying SR will be 4gigs only and the next chipset for Penryn and better support Centrino Pro will be able to use 8Gigs.

Intel doesn't usually like to use a practical limit it usually writes what it's max capabilities are. But then again there was the BX chipset and the site also stated the ICH7 not having SATA2 support.