Multiple issues with my new T61P (in Australia)

Just wondering if anyone can offer me some advice.....

I bought a new T61P about 3 weeks ago. I've been on holidays since then and have only used it consistently for the past couple of weeks and have noticed the following issues:

1. The system comes with Windows Vista Ultimate preloaded. On the laptop where you would normally rest your left wrist, the sticker says Windows Vista Basic. Why couldn't they put the right sticker on the machine, rather than just get any laptop shell and configure it to a T61 ??? It looks cheap and tacky and something that I would expect to happen if it was a cheap laptop, not a Lenovo.

2. The laptop is operating soooooo slow. It almost seems unable to run two programs at once. Web pages take sooo long to load and it takes an eternity to load two web pages simultaneously. I have another laptop (not IBM/Lenovo) that is over 3 years old and runs on Win XP SP2 and the old laptop operates faster, even with a slower processor and less RAM.

3. The wireless connection consistently drops out and then usually takes a few minutes to reconnect. There are times when it cannot even connect. I have no wireless issues with my other laptop.

4. Lenovo are offering customers the opportunity to purchase Win XP SP2 so that you can downgrade the OS from Win Vista to Win XP SP2. Why should I even have to purchase the CD just so that my new T61P can work better ?

5. I have already spent about 6 hours trying to fix the wireless problem. I also called Lenovo Support. I can't believe I am wasting my time trying to fix something that should already properly work when I take it out of the box.

6. The 90W AC adapter that came with the T61P gets hot after about 2 hours use. Why ????

7. With all these troubles I have experienced, I just want to return everything to Lenovo.

It seems that the Lenovo slogan "Best Engineered PC's" is very misleading. Can so much have changed when it used to be an IBM Thinkpad compared to a Lenovo Thinkpad ?

If anyone else is experiencing similar issues, please let me know.

Thanks.

 

1. Where did you get it from?
2. Install Windows the clean way (there is a very detailed guide here, written by a member called stallen).
3. See 2 + use newest Intel drivers.
4. You don't need to purchase anything as long as you do 2.
5. 2 + 3.
6. It's probably normal. Can't attest to this though. Maybe some other members here will.
7. Try what I've said here before doing so.

 

Thanks Fade To Black. I will let you know how I go with your suggested fixes.

In response to 1., I purchased the laptop through the Lenovo Australia website.

 

I have had my T61p for about 2 months now and nothing but joy. Well I did in fact crack the screen after a very unsettling incident happened in an airport, but I was ab le to buy a new one and reinstall it myself.

I have no issues with XP and have Vista installed on a secondary hdd. No issues there either.

Are you sure that you have the latest drives installed for your box? My wireless works relatively well, but I can't get it to connect at more than 54 with my Linksys WRT300N.

I wish you the best of luck, my only complaint with this machine is the weight. But other than that it has been very very smooth sailing

 

Thanks Bandito. Yes I agree, the T61p is rather heavy. Have you had any issues with the 90W AC adapter feeling really hot after about 2 hours use ?

 

My 3rd palmrest replacement came today and believe it or not, it looked like the thing has been used before, I can see some stains on the inside of the "ThinkPad" logo.

I asked the technicians and he looked as wide-eyed as I was, the palmrest is taken fresh out of a sealed box that just arrived.

And no change, squeaky palmrest -- so no luck on getting rid of the cheap pastic feeling. I guess I'd have to follow the rest of the unfortunate crowd and stick some pads under the palmrest stop the squeaky part.

There's no way I am recommending Lenovo T to anybody else. Damn pissed.

 

Believe it or not Seymores, I may even settle for a dirty palm rest that going through what I have already. Aren't the Lenovos coming out of Malaysia or China now ? I wonder whatthe quality would have been like if they were still IBM.....

 

Anyone know what the Return policy is for Lenovo ??? On their website ( http://www-604.ibm.com/webapp/wcs/s...catalogId=-36&langId=036&subject=faq_delivery) it says that you can return the UNOPENED product within 21 days.

I'm sure they would have a separate policy if the product is faulty, but I can't find it on their website (very convenient...). As my laptop is only 3 weeks old, it would not be appropriate to send it for repairs.

 

Which model did you buy, the cheaper T7500 or the horrendously expensive T7800 model?

 

I bought the cheaper (yet still overpriced compared to other 'quality' brands) T61p T7500 model.

T7500(2.2GHz), 2GB RAM, 160GB 7200rpm HD, 15.4in 1680x1050 LCD, 256MB nVIDIA Quadro FX 570M, CDRW/DVDRW, Intel 802.11agn, Bluetooth, Modem, 1Gb Ethernet, UltraNav, Secure chip, Fingerprint reader, 9c Li-Ion, WinVista Ultimate 32

 

1: I've got the exact same specs as your machine, and I still don't believe they put the wrong sticker on! Although I had to get mine with a CDRW drive instead of a DVDRW drive to get it shipped before December, still awaiting shipment of my DVDRW drive since November! Grrr...

2: The slow down issue, have you checked your default power profiles? I noticed the energy saving profile severely limits the CPU, so much so that it feels really sluggish with Aero running.

3: I can't help you with the wireless problem because so far it's been hassle free, I connect to an Airport Express(G), Airport Extreme(Pre-N) and a Netgear 824M(B) regularly. It'd be more helpful if you included additional information regarding what you are connecting to and what encryption methods you are using for us to troubleshoot. Operation Mode would be handy too.

6: It's normal, my PSU actually gets hot to the touch after about 30 mins of gaming.

 

Hey ecenshu

Hope you don't have to wait too long for the DVDRW.

1. Imagine my disgust when I found out they put the wrong sticker on. When I contact Lenovo, this will be something that I will also be mentioning to them. It appears that they spent too much money creating their 'Best Engineered PC's' advertisements and forgot to allocate money to getting competent people to put together their machines.

2. In relation to the power profiles, I had already changed it to 'Maximum Performance'.

3. I connect the wireless through a router - Netgear WPN824. Encryption method is WEP. What do you mean by Operation Mode ? Sorry I am not a tech-head (no offense intended) nor work in IT.

6. I also use a HP laptop and the AC adaptor does not get hot at all when using continuously.

 

Hence you should have gotten an HP 8510w instead. It has a Vista Premium sticker.
Anyway, the sticker isn't that big of an issue. Just get one off eBay if you must have it.

 

Thanks chrixx.

Unfortunately I have no intention of purchasing a sticker off eBay. I will be demanding that Lenovo send me the correct sticker (at their expense). Why should I fork out money to correct their stuff-up.

I have had 2 HP's laptops before and have found that their performance diminishes rapidly. Acer, HP and Dell are definitely 3 brands that I stay well away from (and now Lenovo)

 

Well, from what I know, Lenovo won't do it, but it's worth a try. Stickers are something done at the factory.

Have you owned a HP business notebook before? They're not like a regular Pavillion. I've had many and they are just as durable as my Thinkpad, but then the newer Thinkpads do have some build issues I'm concerned with.

 

No I have only owned HP Pavilion notebooks before, but I will check them out. Unfortunately the newer Thinkpad models aren't made as well as the old T41/2/3's.

Out of curiosity, what do you think of Sony and ASUS ?

 

That's the problem. HP's Pavillions were prone to problems, but their quality have actually improved recently. The HP business models are completely different in terms of build quality and reliability and are actually assembled with pretty high precision. I think Thinkpads are still very reliable, if you can forgive some slight flaws in assembly precision. Dell's Latitude is another option.

Sony has good quality but it's slightly overpriced, with poor support. Asus is value for money, but has relatively poor construction and materials. If you're after the highest specs at lowest cost, Asus is definitely a good option.

 

By Operation Mode, I meant wether you were connecting at A/B/G/Pre-N speeds. It seems the 824 series is capable of G speeds. I've noticed with my Netgear Access Point that the hardware slows to a crawl after prolonged use (about 3-4 days) and the only solution is to reboot it. I'm pretty sure that is a different problem to yours though as you seem to lose connection instead of just degraded performance.

I'm assuming that when you say the network "drops out" means that you lose the actual wireless connection (Windows reports no network found)...ie: the wireless icon in the task bar shows a cross on it, instead of problems with the network connection (Yellow question mark).

If its a red cross, then it would be isolated to the network card in your laptop and the Access Point. If it's a yellow question mark then there may be other problems, sometimes to do with whatever is assigning you IP addresses (Usually the router/modem) but could be the Access Point as well.

Sorry I can't be of more help, wireless netwoking problems are always tough troubleshooting because it's so local.

 

Thanks ecenshu.

That's correct, the connection drops out. There's nothing wrong with the performance of the router. And yes, there's a red cross. The connection either reconnects after a few minutes, or it is unable to find the connection for a longer period.

As well as the T61p, a HP notebook and HP desktop uses the router, and neither of them have drop out or performance issues.

 

Hi ed_h,

1. Call Lenovo regarding your sticker and see what they can do...I dunno about you but I always get rid of all stickers on my palm rest, in my opinion it gives it a nice clean look.

2.I'm not sure why your programs run slow, but have you tried connecting to the modem/router via ethernet to check if the internet runs faster?

3.Could it be your wireless card?

4.Welcome to Lenovo.

5.I would send the sucker back pronto, I think theres a cooling off period where you can send it back?....I think the Yanks have something like that I'm not sure what we get here in Oz.

6.I have a R60e which is plugged 90% of the time for over a couple of hours and mine gets hot but not ridiculously hot.

7. Absolutely, in your shoes I'd be all over them to take it back....I know how much we pay for our thinkpads here so that entitles you to a computer that works straight out of the box.

All the best mate.

 

Thanks Palmag.

1. It would have been better if they stuck the stickers on the right hand side of the palmrest. It would avoid the stickers being rubbed off through wear and tear.

2. Yeah I have often plugged in the ethernet cable direct to the router. Works like a dream and achieves very good speeds.

5. I will check if there is a cooling off period on the Oz website.

6. It really shouldnt get that hot at all regardless of length of use. El cheapo AC adapters. Even the HP ones are better.

7. The Thinkpads in Oz aren't cheap. Also, there arent many suppliers that stock them so as to allow you to walk into a shop and test one out. Most of them have to order one in.

 

"4. Lenovo are offering customers the opportunity to purchase Win XP SP2 so that you can downgrade the OS from Win Vista to Win XP SP2. Why should I even have to purchase the CD just so that my new T61P can work better ?"

I have a new T61P running Vista Ultimate. Its build quality is excellent and so is performance. Your problems are not Vista.

 

I got the exact same Australian T61P as you ed_h, had it for about 5 weeks now and I really can't complain. Luck would have it that I got a stuck pixel but i didn't even notice till I'd had it for 4 weeks, still it's an awesome laptop .

1. I was a bit scared too when i first saw the Basic sticker but flipped it over and was relieved to see the Vista Premium licence. I imagine they're probably just left over palm rests from the T60.

2. Don't know what this could be, Lenovo were nice enough to include some PC Doctor thingy hidden in Thinkvantage somewhere I think. Try running this (If you want to return anything they'll ask you to do this first anyway), it takes about an hour (sounds like it might take longer on yours ) but seems to be quite thorough, and it should check out the Wifi card too.

Also could you be a bit more specific, is it CPU, RAM or GPU intensive tasks which are slowing it down, or is it always slow ? Did you change the Power settings in both the Thinkvantage power utility and in Windows one ? (this should happen automatically anyway)

3. Have you tried any other wireless connections or just your router at home ? It could just be compatibility issues with the router, I think I saw a post about this somewhere.

4. As was said before I think the issue is your hardware here and not Vista (definitely not implying that Vista doesn't have issues )

5. What sort of warranty did you get with your laptop ? If you opted for one of the thinkpad protection plans my understanding is they will be quite accommadating with your demands. Also you could always try restoring your laptop to factory settings using the hidden partition, just to see if it solves any problmes.

6. It gets hot basically because it is a lump of iron that transfers large amounts of energy somewhat inneficiently. Unless it's melting through the floor it's probably normal. Mine gets quite hot too, oh and it also makes a buzzing sounds, beat that

7. Hang in there for a while longer, if you can get these few things sorted it's a great machine. I'd be more concerned about the slowness than anything else at the moment though.

IMO nothing really changed when thinkpad went to Lenovo, to the best of my knowledge the factories were already in China and Lenovo still has a research centre in the U.S. As far as I'm concerned everyone is just jumping on the bash-China bandwagon. Doesn't really make sense to me as they make all the worlds laptops anyway, what alternative do you have ?

Anyway I don't think were far away enough from IBM's influence to see where they really want to go with Thinkpads. All I know is that the T61P has a magnesium roll cage, something that no IBM thinkpad ever had. (Sorry this is a general rant and not directe at you at all ed_h )

Lastly I know how much you wanted the Vista premium sticker so i'm almost scared to tell you that if your laptop is identical to mine (which it should be) you'll only have a Core Duo sticker, not a Core 2 Duo. Still I don't need mine so I'm happy to give it to you, then you can have 2 Core Duo stickers (which is almost the same )

Good Luck !

 

Heya Asleep.....

Thanks dude. I used to have a t42 for work and it was awesome, so I have always wanted a Thinkpad ever since.

So you also have the dodgy 'Windows Vista Basic' sticker huh ? My god, I didn't even pick up on the 'Core Dup' sticker !!! Unfortunately I had to send my T61p for service (after having it for less than 1 month) to see if they can fix the wireless issues.

Not sure why it runs slow....I have read that I should turn off the Indexing feature.

Well Vista certainly does have issues. Can't wait until Vista SP1 gets released. There's really nothing that special with Vista except for the graphics. Certainly takes up more space though.

Also, as a matter of interest, did you get a carry case for your T61p ? I got one but it's dodgy as. It's as padded and protective as a Coles environmentally friendly green bag. I highly recommend not getting any of the Lenovo carry cases. They are cheap and not very protective.

 

All T61p's with that configuration come with the Vista Basic sticker afaik. It's just how they were configured, since they're preconfigured anyway.
There isn't any Core 2 Duo sticker for Centrino laptops. You'll most likely see a Centrino Pro or Centrino Duo sticker as these models carry the Intel 4965 card, not the Thinkpad Atheros card.

 

I have had my T61p laptop for less than 2 months, and already in that time, it will be sent for repairs twice and Lenovo, in a poor attempt to provide customer service, have made 9 service errors to date. Basically, the T61p is faulty but Lenovo have declined to refund the product.

The 9 service errors that have been made by Lenovo (Australia) in less than 2 months of owning the laptop are outlined below:

1. From the time that I purchased the laptop (by ringing Lenovo Sales) to when the laptop was delivered, Lenovo failed to provide me with a Tax Invoice. It was only until I contacted them on 9 Jan 2008 that I received a soft-copy of the Tax Invoice on 10 Jan 2008.

2. The laptop is a T61p model 6459A12 with Windows Vista Ultimate 32-bit and Intel® Core™ 2 Duo. On the palm rest of the laptop, Lenovo have stuck the incorrect stickers – “Windows Vista Basic” and “Intel Core Duo”. I would have expected this fundamental error from a low-end PC maker, not Lenovo, supposedly the “Best Engineered …….”

3. The Wireless connection constantly drops out. Also, wireless speeds are very slow if and when connected. I have already spent nearly 15 hours trying to fix the wireless problem. This includes downloading the latest drivers, changing wireless channels and restoring the laptop to factory settings. The problem is not with the wireless router (or access point) as 3 other computers (2 running win XP SP2 and 1 running Win Vista Ultimate) use the router and their wireless connection is error-free.

4. According to Lenovo, a refund may only be “considered” if returned within 10 business days of the date noted on the Tax Invoice. This refund policy is misleading as the date on my Tax Invoice is 27 Dec 2007, but I did not receive delivery of the laptop until 9 Jan 2008 (delivery consignment note available on request). Therefore, 8 business days (after taking into account Christmas holidays) had already elapsed before I even took possession of the laptop.

5. On 4 Feb 2008, after speaking to an IBM CSAT representative, I was advised that a refund would be declined but the laptop would be sent for repairs, and it would be picked up by the courier company on 5 Feb 2008. I provided the CSAT representative with my pick-up address. The courier company contacted me on 5 Feb 2008 to confirm pick-up but quoted my incorrect pick-up address. Lenovo had provided the courier company with my wrong pickup address, which was not the address I provided the CSAT representative with. As a result of Lenovo’s error, I had to wait an extra day for the laptop to be picked up. I contacted the CSAT representative to advise of the error and arranged for the laptop to be picked up tomorrow from the correct address.

6. After the laptop had been repaired, Lenovo failed to contact me to confirm this and also failed to provide me with the date when the laptop would be delivered back to me. No follow up was made by the CSAT representative regarding this matter. When the laptop was delivered on the 8 Feb 2008 by the courier company, no one was home to accept delivery of the laptop (because I was not aware that it would be delivered on that day). As a result, I had to take it upon myself to make arrangements with the courier company to deliver it again on 11 Feb 2008.

7. The repairs report noted that the wireless card had been replaced. After using the laptop for about 30 minutes to an hour, the wireless connection continues to drop out constantly. This is also evidenced by the event logs recorded on the laptop.

8. On 13 Feb 2008, I logged another complaint request. The Lenovo Customer Care complaints policy state that “…within 24 hours of making a complaint, you will be contacted by the resolution owner to establish criteria under which you will consider the issue resolved and a timeframe for implementing a 'fix'…” I was not contacted by Lenovo after 3 business days.

9. On 19 Feb 2008, I went out of my own way to ring Lenovo regarding my complaint and the CSAT representative responded along the lines of “…I have only taken on this new responsibility…” and “…been busy….” Once again, a refund was declined but the laptop would be sent for repairs again. Arrangements were made for the laptop to be picked up by the courier tomorrow 20 Feb 2008. Imagine my anger when the courier turned up at the pick-up address within hours of me speaking to the CSAT representative. The courier was turned away as the laptop was not ready for pick up. I contacted the CSAT representative to advice of his error, and he commented along the lines of “…I didn’t think they would be so efficient”. The CSAT representative had failed to record the date of pick-up.

I have lost all confidence in Lenovo and do not want to have anything further to do with Lenovo ever.

This situation is ridiculous and I would not have expected that a reputable global company like Lenovo to treat customers this way.

The resolution that I have sought is for a FULL refund from Lenovo (T61p laptop, Lenovo laptop carry case and 3-year Thinkpad warranty).

 

You should ask them to replace the laptop if they can't fix or offer a refund. Chances are your replacement should be fine and if you don't like it, just sell it off since it'll be new.
And next time, try a different brand.

 

Don't get me wrong, I think Thinkpads are great machines, but considering the stress and issues I have had to contend with, I don't want anymore to do with Lenovo. Also, I don't want to sell it off and end up possibly making a loss.

In terms of a different brand, Lenovo was my #1 choice and there was no other brand I really wanted. I have used HP's before and know what they are like, but the only other brands I would even consider are Macs. I don't know enough about the reliability and performance of Toshiba, Sony, Acer, and Asus.

 

Your experience suggests that you no longer want another Lenovo product, yet you insist that Thinkpads are the best. It's contradictory. If I'm not satisfied with the product quality, I'll definitely consider another vendor.
The HPs you used are Pavillions, hence it would be inconclusive to judge the entire brand by 1 product model. Similarly, you wouldn't judge Lenovo from the Y series alone. Macs don't have the superior quality you're looking for. They are just another PC that runs a different operating system with some novel features.

Regarding your wireless issues, I'm curious as to whether your other laptops carry the Intel 4965 card or do they have the last generation 3945 cards. Have you tried your laptop with a different router?

The stickers are just a minor issue. I don't think they are that important (they have no value, except sentimental ones maybe).

 

Thinkpads are the best but the T61p I received was a "lemon". Other Thinkpads may not have this problem, but I am disappointed with the way Lenovo has dealt with the situation.

One laptop has the old Intel card and another has the new one.

With the premium price we pay for a Thinkpad, they should get it right the first time. It's no surprise that reports suggest that Acer are near to overpassing Lenovo in Australia.

 

Well my brother got a T61p loaded with Vista; it was slow as heck until he put XP on there and now it's quite smooth.

As to the AC adapter being hot, it all depends on a) your system, and b) what you're doing at the time.

if a) you run a high end machine like the T61p, the A/C adapter will most certainly get hotter than if you're running an integrated GPU/slow CPU consumer laptop, such as the HP pavilion line. This is true of all laptops.

b) if you're charging the battery and running in high performance mode, playing games, doing graphics intensive work, etc., the machine will be drawing much much more power than usual. Thus the adapter will get quite hot.

If you're sitting in power saver mode (which I always recommend unless doing intensive stuff, because it saves power, is quieter, etc), with the battery out of the machine, the A/C shouldn't get extremely hot. Even on a laptop like the T61p.

When my brother is using his T61p, battery out, just browsing, I can pick up his adapter and it's not hot at all.

Anyway that sucks with your machine's problems though. The problem with lemons is that no company can get rid of them, and they all suck at dealing with them. Lenovo, HP's business line, Dell's business line...it won't make a difference who you're dealing with. If you get a lemon, it's the same 3-4 repair grind until you get a replacement. I've been through it before, so I know

 

So, did you ask for a replacement product? If it cannot be repaired without significantly impacting your productivity, you should be entitled to a replacement. The failing wireless connectivity, if truly a fault, should be grounds for replacement. Miscommunication and what seem like poor customer service unfortunately cannot be fixed easily.

 

It's now in repairs for the 2nd time. Regardless of whether they are able to fix it or not, I do not want a replacement. I want a refund.

Yes, there are times when you buy goods, there may be a fault or something's wrong with it. Nothing is always 100% perfect. However, it is how the company goes about resolving it that makes the difference. I have spent nearly $2,500 on a ThinkPad and in the under 2 months I have possessed it, 95% of the time has been spent in a laptop bag or in repairs. They have handled the situation atrociously and have stuffed me around on 9 separate occasions in less than 2 months whilst 'attempting' to resolve the situation.

What if it breaks down again down the track ? I do not want to go through the same rigmoral.....

I want nothing more to do with Lenovo now or in the future.