My disappointed first impression of T60

Ordered on 19th this month, and got my T60 today. Overall a somewhat disappointing purchase so far. Here is WHY.

1.downgraded return policy. Now the policy is a 21 day return period, there 'may' be a 15% restocking fee, and the package has to be UNOPENED! see discussions here http://www.gripe2ed.com/scoop/story/2006/11/13/102412/15

2. A bright dead pixel on top right area of LCD screen. Very bright and like a star in blue sky, in a very annoying way! I hate it very much. Another annoying thing is that two more dead pixels are coming out and disappearing randomly as I keep using this T60, like a growing problem. I googled online and found somebody else also complained the dead pixels of thinkpad keep growing. Gee!!!

3. Fn key is taking the place of left Ctrl key, extremely inconvenient to use. Ctrl-C and Ctrl-V become a pain. Stupid design to me.

4. there is a big gap between battery and body. Though no functional harm, but surely indicating low build quality.

5. Strange clang noise under my righ palm sometimes. It might come from the harddrive, not a good sign too.

6. Model number 2613-CTO is unrecognized by thinkpad.com. Lenovo now refuse to admit they produced this?

7. The keyboard light has fixed angle. It will not illuminate the full keyboard if you open LCD >90 degree.

I include some good things below also:

1. light and thin. feel good when using on laps, though a little bit warm on left bottom

2. order and shipment is fast, 10 days total.

3. typing is mostly enjoyable

4. the 14.1 LCD SXGA+ is bright! This was the thing I worried most before after reading some reviews.

Just hope the information above will help somebody who are considering buying a T60.

 

Thanks for the info. Sorry to hear that the return policy sux now. About the dead pixels, what is lenovo's policy to return the screen or laptop because of that?

 

I was also wondering

 

Lenovo's policy regarding dead/stuck pixels is available here. According to that page, a SXGA+ screen must have either 11 stuck pixels, 13 dead pixels or a combination of 16 stuck and dead pixels to be eligible for a replacement. However, it's probably worth calling them up to discuss it--I've found the IBM folks very interested in solving customer problems.

 

Yes it has been changed. My understanding is if the company is generous to the customers, the customers will reciprocate by 'spreading the words'. Strict return policy will only hurt the comany more since there is only a very very small proportion of people who want to buy a laptop just to return it (the husstle of makeing phone calls and shipment).

It is this noise from hard drive that dreaded me. Hope this is only a individual case.

 

By the way, what is the specification of your hard drive?

 

a combo of 16? that is waaaaaay too high of a number. I think anything above 2 should warrant an exchange, but thats just my .02

 

A few things.
1 - the return policy - reported experiences indicate this is mainly to give them an out for repeat offenders. They handle each person on a case by case basis.
2 - Call them about dead pixels. the official policy has little to do with reality. Also, there are ways that you can fix dead pixels sometimes. do a google search
3 - the Fn Ctrl thing is only inconvenient when you aren't used to it. As you use it you'll get used to it and find that it's actually better this way
4 - low build quality? T60's are among the few laptops that can reliably withstand a significant fall. The only other one I can think of is the X60.
5 - when you hear the clang noise is it after a bump to the laptop or a sudden movement? Some HDD's click when they resume from the active protection hard drive stoppage
6 - don't know...was it a custom build?
7 - that's odd...when it's dark (like outside on a moonless night), I find that my thinklight sufficiently lights the entire keyboard on my 15" version.

 

Are you sure that it's a dead pixel? I thought I had one, until I discovered that it was actually a bug with a process called "Syn Visual Window". If it persists in the same spot when you reboot your machine, then it probably is dead. But if you've noticed a dead pixel that seems to come and go, try bringing up the task manager when it is on the screen. If there is a process called "Syn Visual Window" running, kill it, and the stuck pixel will disappear.

The transient stuck pixel was driving me batty until I found this out. Apparently, it's a bug in the Synaptics touchpad driver. If you google for it, you'll find an article on the thinkwiki.org site.

 

How do you figure this sux? It was 30 days and they changed it to 21 days. I haven't checked, but I'll bet that's as good or better than Dell, Gateway, Apple, etc.

And "ihateregister"...how many places did you cut & paste this post? I just read it on Fatwallet as well. Btw, I've worked in the dark with my screen open well beyond 90 degrees and the light did a good job of lighting the keys.

 

100 G SATA sth.

 

I post my review where I often benefited from. Is it a bad habit?

 

I am pretty sure for the brightest dead pixel. I am using 4 LCD screens for desktops and 3 laptops so I know what dead pixel is.

There are also some transient dead pixels showing up and disappearing as I mentioned.

 

Their pixel policy is complete BS IMO. I probably wouldn't even be able to stand one dead pixel!

Question.. is it possible to create more dead pixels?

 

If not and I am unhappy. I think that I'll buy the protection warranty and break the laptop screen to get a new one lol!

 

Sounds like a stuck blue sub-pixel. Same problem I have with my R60. Except mine does strange things, if I leave the laptop off for say 12 hours the stuck pixel turns into a dead pixel. Then if I use it for a few hours it becomes a stuck pixel again. Something to do with the sub-pixel holding a capacitance charge I think. Very annoying initially, but you'll only notice it when you're booting up or if you're watching movies. It'll annoy you less and less over time.

That sounds like the problem with the touchpad driver. I also get random white pixels appearing. Try moving the mouse pointer over them to see if it changes shape. If it does, then it's probably a software problem and not actually a real stuck pixel.

Argh! Yea, I hate that. I've had it for a month now and it still drives me barmy. I'm always pressing Fn+C by mistake. So when I try to paste, nothing happens. (I'm even doing it right now while I'm trying to edit this post!)

Yea, mine rattles a bit as well, nothing to worry about though.

 

If your still in the return-policy date, can you not return it hassle free? Stuck/dead/magic pixels would justify such a return the way I see it.

 

I would personally figure out a way to make more dead pixels
or Id get the protection warranty and smash the screen

 

Before doing anything, if you are dissatisfied with some aspect call them. The nice thing about dealing with IBM/Lenovo is they treat people as individuals, beyond what the official warranty formulas are.

 

What you said might be true for others. But I called them today and they turned me down

The conversation was quite simple. After I complained all kinds of troubles I had, the reps asked: Did you open the box? I responsed yes. Then he immediately transferred me to the warranty department, where I was asked to fax my invoice since they did not have my records! It ended up with a wrong fax number and I gave it up for now.

By the way, my call for returning was hold forever, even longer than the notorious Dell service number. Not sure what was going on.

 

Just trying to help you with your problems there, sport. Nobody's questioning your vast knowledge of LCDs.

 

We all appreciate you sharing your experience with us. However, IBM/Lenovo has a good track record of customer service, and however disappointing it may be, you have perhaps fallen through the cracks. I'd give them another call and ask nicely. The return policy did change, and if you were so concerned about the policy, you should have carefully considered it before buying.

Please keep the discussions civil--there is a difference between argument and insult.

 

I understand how bad it must be to get a dead pixel on your 1-2k laptop. But, it happens, most companies don't have very flexible dead pixel policies.

You could have found out about the Fn-Ctrl Key and the battery issue pretty easily if you did a little research or read a few reviews.

Even my X23 from waaay back has the Fn and Ctrl keys "switched" and the slightly loose battery. There are fixes for the rattling battery thing, it isn't really a build quality issue. It's just how they're made.

I was wondering what was wrong since this is the first time I've read that someone was actually unhappy with their T60.

 

Sorry if my previous post was impolite. English is not my native language so sometime I still can not get the right meaning expressed and even lead to misunderstanding.

Thanks for your help so far.

 

I guess 21 days is still not bad, but

If they are not accepting returns on opened products, then that is not a true return policy at all. Does any one else on this forum have experience returning an opened lenovo laptop?

I hope that is not the case with canadian returns, I will phone them up tommorrow to confirm. Here is is the terms and conditions on the canadian website, LINK(went to US site, couldn't find the return policy)

Lenovo Canada Inc. Return Policy

If acquiring about Lenovo Canada Inc. Personal Computer Products from a Lenovo Canada Inc. website or Lenovo Canada Inc. telesales, you may return any of these Products to Lenovo Canada Inc. for any reason within 30 days of delivery and obtain a refund or credit (excluding Installation, configuration and shipping and handling charges). There are no returns on designated Lenovo Canada Inc. Offerings (such as Lenovo Canada Inc. Employee Purchase Plans and Special Promotions). See Terms and Conditions of the individual offering for the associated return policy. There are no returns on warranty packages or opened software. Lenovo Canada Inc. does not provide refunds for portions of a packaged offering provided at a single price. You may, of course, return the complete package for a refund. To qualify for this credit or refund (as applicable), you must call Lenovo Canada Inc. within 30 days after the date Lenovo Canada Inc. delivers the Product to you to obtain a return-authorization form. You must return the Product, including all documentation and accessories, intact and in its original packaging, to an Lenovo Canada Inc. designated location by the date Lenovo Canada Inc. specifies. The return-authorization form and the shipping label must accompany the return. Installation, configuration and shipping and handling charges will not be refunded.

Looks like Lenovo canada still has a 30 days return policy,

but this line "You must return the Product, including all documentation and accessories, intact and in its original packaging, to an Lenovo Canada Inc." concerns me, I am not too sure what it means. I will phone them up tommorrow to confirm, I hope it does not mean that I can't return a opened case.

 

100% you can return an opened box in canada so long as you call within 30 days.
They even pay for the courier to come get it.
But price is higher to start with.

 

A Real Dead Pixel can not appear or disappear easily or at Random....
I think it is not a real dead pixel generally speeking....

 

I checked... Dell's return policy (U.S.A.) is pretty much identical.

It sucks.. but if US consumer law does not protect the consumer to this extent, then... oh well.

 

I have a T60 on order. If I have a dead pixil and it bothers me I will return the laptop.

I bought one of the Z60M with the Titanium lid from the Lenovo outlet last July and it had a defective LCD. I returned it within 3 days of receiving it. Total out of pocket for me was less than $6. I shipped it by ground using Federal Express. Within one week of shipping the Z60M back to Lenovo my credit card had been restored of the purchase cost of the laptop. I was stressed out by this but it was far better than having to go through the waranty to have it fixed. Lenovo's customer service was fast, polite, helpful, and respectful. That is why I just ordered another Lenovo.

On another note, I have to wonder about the quality control at Lenovo. The problem that I had with the Z60M should have been caught before the laptop was shipped. I think that the problem was not in the LCD but in the ribbon cable that connects the LCD to the motherboard and that it could have been fixed at almost no expense before shipping. The nature of the problem was that there was a verticle red line in the middle of the LCD. The longer I used the LAPtop the wider the line got. The line widened more at the top than at the bottom. The line would disapear if I flexed the case in a twisting motion or proped the front left of the notebook. I also was getting a lot of weird sparkly effects that made me wonder if someone had slipped some LSD in my Weaties. The bad affects worsened as the Laptop got warmer. If I played a game it really got bad. Rebooting helped but letting the laptop cool down gave the best results. I did do bios and video driver updates but none of this helped. Anyway, I was really thankfull for the return policy.

 

What he described is a stuck pixel (he said it was like a bright star)

Stuck pixels can come and go.

 

Just want to let your nice guys know:

I mentioned some strange clang sound in my T60 harddrive. I found that it only happens when I move or tilt the laptop on my lap. No clang noise for stable desktop usage.

And it will disappear if I purposely turn off the active protection, which I prefer not to do now.

So my T60's problems boil down to single one: a stuck pixel.

Return policy does not apply to me since I OPENED the box. The warranty people agreed to change my LCD yesterday after several calls, emails, and faxes.(It seems that they don't share information between sales and warranty departments and I had to prove my purchase)

Hope it will be a happy ending and I will keep you posted.

 

Then it's probably the sound of the drive heads being parked by the anti-shock software.

Good luck with the LCD replacement. Of course, there's no way they'll guarantee the replacement won't have dead/stuck pixels, and they're really doing you a favour by replacing it.

Laptop manufacturers would go out of business if they had to throw out every LCD that had a stuck/dead pixel!

 

I mentioned that: if LCD replacement is not possible, I would definitely return it even with the penalty of restocking fee, which will be reimbursed by my credit card.

 

the "clang" sound is the drive heads being parked. That's how the active protection works, it senses movement and shuts the drive down if it detects too much, or fast movement.

 

Sounds like that feature is quite sensitive. I was under the impression only free-fall would activate the protection feature.

 

You can change how sensitive it is. I have it at the default setting and it seems to work well. If I'm just moving the laptop it doesn't shut it down, but if it move it too fast it does.

 

You can also have it notify you when the active protection goes into action. This will let you tweak the settings to your preferences.

 

Vespoli, you seem pretty knowledgable about all this. How would you rate your 14.1" screen. Im getting my T60 in the mail next week and im a bit worried.