New Lenovo T43 owner - Dissapointed.

Recently a new company I started working for offered me as part of a signing bonus, a laptop of my customized choosing. I was hoping to wait for the Core 2 Duo to come out, however, our IT guy ordered a T43 for me instead.

When browsing various Hot Deal forums, you always see the T43 almost double the price of similar specced laptops from Dell. IBM fans would proclaim that this is due to the superior IBM build quality which is undeniably and absolutely positively the BEST, according to them.

I really had to see for myself what the fuss was all about. I received my T43 just a few days ago. And I have to say I am extremely disappointed. I currently also owned/own a "cheap quality" Dell Inspiron 6000 which I am comparing this to.

Specs
IBM T43 1875DMU
Pentium M 1.7Ghz
512MB Memory
60GB HDD
CDRW/DVD
14.1" XGA
6cell batt
$1300 (purchased at full retail price by idiot IT guy in my company)

My other laptop:
Dell Inspiron 6000
512MB DDR2
40GB HDD
CDRW/DVD
15.4" SXGA+
6cell
$700 (hot forum deal)

Quality - My Impressions

Case / Overall Construction
Inspiron 6000 - feels relatively solid all throughout. Keyboard is of great quality, although no drip proof feature that I know of (which is on the T43).
T43 - after reading all the rave reviews from ALL sorts of websites and IBM thinkpad fanboys, I was expecting something better. Under the keyboard where your palm rests, you can push the T43 inwards with your fingertips. It creaks and bends quite easily. My Inspiron 6000 does not creak here.

The Back of the LCD of the Inspiron 6000 is very strong and solid. It takes quite a bit of effort to produce distortion in the LCD by bending the back panel, however the T43 bends with ease. This is contrary to all of the reviews I've read on the T43 and it shocked me.

Screen
Inspiron 6000 - Beautiful, vibrant, SXGA+ screen. It was my first laptop so I wasn't sure if this was the standard, substandard, or good screen, however when I compared this to my new T43....
T43 - The T43 screen angles are TERRIBLE. LENOVO come on! This laptop costs almost twice as much as my Inspiron! The colors seem washed out, Black looks VERY Gray, and if you ever so slightly have the vertical angle a tiny bit off from the best viewing angle, you will notice Washed out colors RIGHT away. The older IBM T43 laptop review from this website says that the screen is of very good quality, but if you look at the T60 notebookreview.com review, you will see that the newer T60 has the same screen problems I am mentioning. Perhaps Lenovo took a dive and took some cost reducing measures?

Mouse/trackpad
The T43 clearly wins here. The Inspiron 6000 mouse buttons feel like they will break within a year. However the T43 mouse buttons feel solid and robust.

Overall

Overall, I am extremely disappointed with my new T43. It fails in quality in areas where my Inspiron 6000, which is half it's price, shines. The Screen on the T43 is a nightmare for me. As notebookreview.com's review for the T60 screen states (T60 is T43's replacement), the T60's screen has the worst viewing angles of any LCD they've seen on a laptop. The case construction was really just average compared to what I was expecting from a $1200+ laptop. When the original reviews for the T43 from IBM were rolling in, IBM had ownership of the thinkpad line. My one guess is that Lenovo started cutting some corners after they took possession of IBM's thinkpad line. I can't believe that the wonderfully praised T43, and the T43 I am holding in my hands this very moment are one and the same laptop.

 

ThinkPad screens never were a shining point (unless you get a FlexView, then they're great but that costs $$$).

I've used both of these laptops also and would have to disagree on the i6000 being more solid. The keyboard feel, Active Protection System, steel hinges and lack of any flex on the T43 casing (it's a hard plastic with magnesium reinforced lid and base) would make me want to drop it 3-feet before I dropped the i6000 3-feet

Also, with a ThinkPad, the small things and learning features over time brings you to appreciate it more. Especially for within an IT department. It's not really a great consumer notebook to get to be honest -- if the goal is to use it for entertainment purposes as well it's the wrong fit.

 

I tend to agree with your observations about the screen, but not the rest.

Maybe it's a case of high expectations not being met, or maybe yours is a reject (if the casing indeed flexes as easily as you claim).

In any event, having paid full price you can return it.

At $1300 list price for a 1875DMU, you must be in Canada??

For $1300, I can get you one of these T43's for the exact same price (in your name and you order it - if you are in canada - pm me)... maybe both you and your IT guy will be happy with this instead:

Specs
IBM T43
Pentium M 2.0 Ghz
CDRW/DVD MultiBurner
15" SXGA+
IPS + FlexView
Bluetooth + 802.11a/b/g
x300 Graphics Adapter
512MB Memory
80 GB HDD 5400rmp
6cell batt
XPP
Fingerprint Reader + TPM
3-year IBM warranty
266892u... Cdn$1300+tax

 

That's the thing abaxter, I really don't see how my screen can be reinforced with magnesium alloy. It feels like rubbery plastic on the outside, and it bends rather EASILY ( i'll make a video and post it sometime this weekend hopefully). I cannot do this with my Inspiron 6000.

Other small qualms were No Windows button (Windows Button + E, or +R to bring up My Computer,etc) which helps you work more efficiently. FN Key where the CTRL key normally is..

 

Possibly Lenovo has started cutting corners on their more recent T43's? Did you guys have experience with the older "IBM-owned T43's?

Just a thought...

 

Yes and i see no difference. I had a newly arrived & opened T43 last week in IBM HQ i was playing with (actually i had 2 dozen or so new thinkpads of all the newer series), and this was one of 3 that fell off the end of the table (about 3 feet) as we pushed more stuff onto the other end of the table. Then someone stepped onto it (ouch). Didn't affect it any. But just in case probably we will sell that one as a refurb LOL (j/k).

 

yeah i know... solution is to install & run linux.

 

To stop this Lenovo bashing, I'll chime in and say I have the exact same experience as Shayu on a T42.
The palm rests on my T30 are rock solid, but the T42 not so, and it creaks.
My Inspiron E1505's plam rest feels more solid.
Same thing with the lid.

I dunno why people are still bashing Dell so much tho. Compared to the T30/T42, my precison M90 seems like a tank - I cannot bend/indent the lid with just hand (while lid open), and its a 17". I'm assuming the Inspiron 1705 would be the same as apparently they ahve the same metal casing (the 1505 is plastic)

 

My T42 was very solid. The Z61m I wrote the review for was a tank which leads me to believe they are not cutting corners.

 

Hmmm i just noticed that the T41 2373 that i am currently typing on has a creeky right palm rest.
But this model has been tossed around alot... i treat my laptops rough especially when i travel they take a lot of abuse like any lugguge.
But my T20 and T23 are still rock solid.

 

Are you kidding? To say the i6000's screen casing is even in the same league as the t43's is an insult to the thinkpad. The t43's doesn't ripple when you push on the back, doesn't twist much at all, and the metal hinges hold it 100x better than any inspiron I've ever seen. And yes, I own three dells and one thinkpad, and the dells don't come anywhere close to the thinkpad in terms of quality, period.

 

Anyone who has owned a Dell Notebook/Desktop or anything Dell makes, knows that they are loaded with spam. Every Dell comes with AOL and 4 other ISP services nobody wants. I takes a couple of hours to remove most of the preloaded software.

Let's not forget, to get the lowest Dell prices the original poster is speaking of, one must be educated on notebook pricing. You need coupon codes to get the best. What about those non computer geeks that do not know how to shop. When you see a Dell TV add for a Notebook, they never include a warranty in the television price.

Don't forget about the Thinkpad fingerprint reader and ThinkVantage software included in the T43's. Dell does not offer either of these.

My T43 palm rests squeek as well as my T42 palm rests. Life goes on.

 

I have ripples on my T30, and the T42 when pushing on the screen casing at the back.
No ripples on the Inspiron E1505.


It may very well be that thinkpads take drops better, but for normal user tests, case flex etc, the inspirons seem better. Excep for the keyboard, where I think thinkpads rule.

I am very surprised too at the semmingly good build quality of the inspirons.

 

Dell has blowout sales frequently. The end of every fiscal quarter, they will blow laptops out at fantastic prices. That's the end of every January, April, July, and October.

This past July they had

E1405
14.'1" XGA+ Ultralife
1.83Ghz Core Duo
1GB DDR2
100GB 5400rpm
8X DVD Burner
6cell

For slightly over $600. Awesome.

 

I rather not imply that the Inspiron 6000 I own is of better quality overall than the T43. If I came off that way, I apologize. There are some areas, however, that the 6000 did exceed the T43 as I stated in my brief review.

My point was, rather, that the T43 coming in at almost two and a half times the price of my Inspiron 6000* failed to show me why it costed -that- much more.

 

But it doesn't cost 2.5x as much... you're comparing your "hot deal" price on one to the full list price that your IT idiot paid. The top of the line T43 is offered for Cdn$1300 if you know how to get it (eg. perks or epp), wherease the list price on dell w/o coupon is $2500, so i could say that a crappy dell costs double the price of a loaded T43 which, by the way, contains heaps of features that no dell at any price has.

If you compare best prices available, probably the dell will provide more value. Achieved by volume production and use of the cheapest pieces found on earth. Therein lies the quality issue. I hear that Dells are made of used disposable plastic cutlery for their notebook cases?

 

Many reviews have indicated that the E1705 is made of magnesium alloy casing.

 

My recent purchase was a Dell D820 . . . this is supposed to be a step up from the inspiron line (which anyone who has used anything else knows insprion sux) and it was junk compared to the hundreds of IBM T43s that have passed through my hands (we are a construction company with a large sales force). We also have some T60p's, x, and r models. Nothing seemed solid on the dell. It felt cheap. The IBMs feel solid like a rock. The dell went back and a T60 is on order. Dell makes money off stupid people who buy them because they don't know better. Go sing your dell praises in the Dell forum (with the other fools). Nobody wants to hear them here.

 

True and not true. The Inspiron I paid $600 for in November can be had for $500 now. I was thinking in terms of present value dollars. $500 x 2.5 is around $1250. Not really fair to compare $600 paid in November to $1300 paid today for a T43.

And Dell's list price for the E1405 I mentioned in the recent deal is not $2500 by even the farthest stretch of the imagination. More close to $800.

 

I'm just trying to facilitate discussion and seeing what you, the IBM fans, think of the laptops. I've learned alot through the various responses posted here.

Rather than say Dell's are Junk, IBM's are solid, and "Get out of our IBM forums." Why not tell me, What, about the IBM felt solid? What parts of the Dell seemed to be of inferior quality? "Dell makes money off stupid people?" Hmm .. kay. Let's try to have a thoughtful discussion here.

I don't care too much for the area under the keyboard bending. But one factor that really bothers me is the terrible viewing angle of the screen. It's one of the major components of the laptop ( I mean, you're staring at it ALL day!) and I feel that Lenovo really skimped in terms of quality here. (Check out Notebookreview.com's review of the T60. He agrees with me and says that "The screen is my biggest complaint" . http://www.notebookreview.com/default.asp?newsID=3002&review=ThinkPad+T60+(Think+Express+Model)

Not to mention the speakers too. Sound muffled compared to the clear ones on my cheap Dell.

 

I'm all for people having their own opinions and I have no problem if you found some things better on the dell, but we must have used completely different computers here. I'm not trying to argue with you, but I'm baffled by these comments. Compared to the three dell laptops in the house, I believe the ibm to be better built throughout, but the screen casing is one area where the ibm trounces the dells. My inspiron 5150's screen is like a trampoline it flexes so much when you grab it, and the e1505's that I've handled have been exactly the same way. In fact, I was hoping that the new dells had improved in this area, but was very disappointed that they handn't. They also bent very easily, and the hinges looked weak (hinges have broken on two of the dells I have). I think these are the normal user tests.

The palmrest does flex a bit on my t43, but the t60s actually don't do this because of the new magnesium frame or whatever it is. Ironically, the dell b130, the cheapest dell you can get, seems to have better build quality than any other dell I've used. However, it is still no thinkpad.

 

:O you work for dell undercover!

this thread has gotten so much attention lol

 

lol yiji..

When I first received the T43, I had some bias as I was used to my Dell. I've tried to be more open minded about my new T43 and I admit it's starting to grow on me.

Thanks for all the comments and insights everyone, I appreciate them.

More comments also welcome.

 

Sell it on the eBay while it is new! and buy one with an SXGA screen, then and only then you can compare it to a WSXGA on dell.

PS: 15" SXGA that is.

 

Being on my second T43 at the mo, after a T42, I know that the palm rest can be a let down (my 2nd one doesn't squeak but the first one did). But other than that, nothing is as solidly built as a ThinkPad (out of NEC, Toshiba, Dell at least). The ergonomics are the ThinkPad's strongest point and nothing comes close. The 4 Dell D505's in the office were bought basically as a result of cost (BTW the Latitude is the so-called T-series equivalent) and within 3-4 months, hinges started to break and chassis to squeak oh and even the paint under the palm rests in those Dells have already worn out, not to mention an LCD replacement just last month. The T43 IS a business laptop and unless you regard it as such you will miss "cheap" thrills you get on lesser machines. And I do stare all day at my 14.1" SXGA+ screen and I absolutley love it if the viewing angle is narrow - extra privacy for sure - although it is admittedly not that bright!

JP

 

After about two weeks of use, the T43 has grown on me for sure.. There's an unspoken feeling of quality that exudes from the T43 that I do not get from my Dell.

The screen really bugs me that it is not SXGA. I told the IT guy it really brings my producitivity down and I got him to agree with me to return the T43. We ordered a Z60M - 2531MTU with 3 year warranty.

Pentium M 760 2GHz, 1GB, 100GB, 15.4" WSXGA+
* DVD Burner, Wireless 802.11a/b/g + Bluetooth, XP Pro, 3 year warranty
* 9 Cell Battery, IEEE 1394 + S-video, 3-1 (SD/MMC/MS) media reader
* ATI Mobility RADEON x600 128MB Graphics

I'll be able to compare apples and oranges with my Inspiron and will update you guys when it comes in.

 

that 2513mtu is in the lenovo outlet for $1000 (discontinued model).