New UK user needs to make a tough choice!

Hi there everyone,

Having never owned my own laptop I now need one for work, i have decided on a Lenovo of some description, as I have used some of the older models before and like the idea of making my first laptop purchase something which will be build well and last me.

I dint have a lot of money to spend on it, however i really dont think i will require a very powerfull system. It will be used for creating Access Databases and Web Design, with the usuall MS Office applications and surfing.

So far in my search of these forums I have seen some positive comments about the Thinkpad R400, which i can get for £650 with the following spec:

Lenovo ThinkPad R400 7443 - Core 2 Duo T6670 2.2 GHz - 14.1" TFT
2GB Ram, 250 GB HDD etc.

As the Lenovo website no longer sells this model in the UK, I would purchase it from a reseller. I know the CPU in this is getting on a bit now, but in order for me to get a T410 (i5) it would cost £900.

So my question is, do you think the R400 would be a good starter machine for my purposes? Or do you think I would be better off trying to stretch my money and get the T410? Sorry to add another model into this too but what about the SL410, I can get that for the same amount as the R400, but from what i have read so far the build quality of the R400 is superior to the SL410.

Many thanks in advance everyone.
Jim.

 

In my opinion the R series was a great way to start into ThinkPad ownership. I previously owned an IBM Thinkpad R50e and Lenovo Thinkpad R61e and both been dependable and are great value. You certainly get a lot more performance for the money (comparing to the basic T series at the time) and construction wise it is very sturdy and stronger than the SL series (I don't consider them as true ThinkPads in my personal opinion).

For your requirements the R400 should be able to perform your office tasks and web designing with ease. Take note that some R series come only with a Trackpoint (the red nib in the middle of the keyboard) and no trackpad like most laptops on the market. While myself prefer to use the Trackpoint solely, if you find it difficult to use then consider getting a model with both Trackpoint and Trackpad included (this is called UltraNav).

I don't think you need the T410 as the R400 would be perfectly usable for your requirements and your budget. But if you find £650 a bit pricey then consider a good condition 2nd hand Thinkpad. Thinkpad's are usually durable, I bought my 3 year old Thinkpad T61 a month ago for £250 with a Core 2 Duo T7300, 1GB RAM and 80GB HDD, I upgraded my machine for a extra £100 with a bigger hard drive and more RAM and it is a perfectly usable machine under Windows 7. For you I recommend scouting for a Thinkpad T400 (preferably still with warranty) on auction sites like eBay which you can get for sub £400-500 (half the original RRP), or if you're set on a Thinkpad R400 then you can find a better specced machine for considerably less than the going list price (I saw this on eBay as a starter for you). I hope this helps and good luck on your upcoming purchase!

 

Is the R400 an old(er) machine? I recently (not yet been a week) bought one and it was made in Jan 2010! How come Lenovo UK does not sell it? Of course, I bought my machine in India. So, maybe it is still available in Asian markets but not in the European market.

 

Apparantly the R series is still available in Europe, apart from the UK for whatever reason.

 

How are these things decided...I wonder! I just checked on the Lenovo US site, no sign of the R400 there either!

I am enjoying my R400, it is a nifty piece of machine and as you correctly put it, it is an excellent machine to get into the ThinkPad line! I hope BigJim can find one, it would suit his purposes quite well!

Bigjim...if you want a R400, you can make a quick trip to the Netherlands, Germany, France etc. and buy a machine there...according to the Lenovo site, the R series is available there (as Hearst555 mentioned). If you want more exotic locations, you can go to Thailand, Singapore, Indonesia, Sri Lanka, India etc...!

How strange!

Edit: Err...you won't get a R series machine in Saudi Arabia though!!!

 

Might be a nice excuse for a holiday lol!

Its strange, maybe some stock issues, I think the R400 is the one I will get, I really just want my first laptop to be rugged and last me. I dont have a lot of money (credit crunch) so trying to get something to suit my needs and budget is the most important.

Thanks Everyone.

 

Good luck with your search and enjoy your R400 when you pick it up!

Cheers!

PS: "Credit Crunch"...you, me and I'll bet a million (or more) others too!

 

Get the R400 and don't look back.

 

Not too sure what the rules are here for posting Ebay sales, however someone did earlier in the thread, so ill put one in, mods, please delete it id this is a problem.

I have been searchning all day now, and have found this:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/LENOVO-THINKP...tZUK_Computing_Laptops_EH?hash=item335a5e761d

I have never purchased anything of that value on Ebay before, I have put the serial number into the lenovo website and it is legit and covered until the end of the year, only thing is the advert seems a bit weird to me, maybe im just worrying for no reason!
What does everyone think about that? Its £50 less than the one i specced earlier and is new with more ram.

Maybe this might be my first Thinkpad?

Thanks,
Jim

 

@bigjim...in what way does the ad look weird to you?

 

A Thinkpad T400 is a good choice, the T series are generally less bulkier than their R series sibling. Also the fit and finish on the T series have a premium feel to it compared to the R series such as rubberised LCD lid, but the build strength between the two are neglible as both have the roll cages now and stiffer chassis. The T400 features 3G WWAN cards for mobile roaming (though you need to have a network subscription) and some models have the switchable graphics which is omitted from the successor T410 (with exception of T410s). For this, the system must have a dedicated graphics card (ATi 3470 in T400) to have the switchable graphics option.

I purchased alot of Thinkpads (as well as selling) from eBay without a problem, including my current T61 (my 2nd one). Though obviously you have to be careful when dealing with eBay, here's my tips:

- Check seller feedback and history - Obviously the higher the better but read in detail of how many transactions the seller have dealt with and the comments from users. Also be vigilant of when the seller have joined eBay, the longer they have been with eBay the less likely they will do a runner when things do go wrong.
- Pop a question, ask if unsure - If you're unsure of the item and want more details of it most sellers would happily oblige to answer your question. If they don't reply or try to hide away from the subject then it normally arouses suspicion, I typically walk away at this point.
- Start nationally first - If you're new to eBay then its best stick with the sellers that deal within your country (UK). Of course i'm not saying that all international sellers are bad, I dealt with sellers from the USA, HK and Japan without any problems but you have to be aware of potential custom duties that may occur as well as foreign standards such as different power leads, keyboard language etc. when you buy electronic goods abroad.
- Use PayPal or Credit Card - If you thinking of buying a laptop from eBay then it will be an expensive purchase so make sure you're protected when things do go wrong. Use PayPal or Credit Cards when making these payments as they offer a payment protection and makes it easier to get your money back when things go awry. Let me stress that Debit Cards offer you no protection when things do go wrong so avoid paying with them if possible.

Oh just to let you know, the listing you provided seem fine to me. Obviously just ask the seller any questions of the system if you're unsure of anything.

 

I am not too familiar with ebay. But the price seems fair instead of suspicious for the T400.

 

Thanks for the replies, I dont know what it was about the advert, I think it was the way in which all the items were listed, probably me just being paranoid. Anyway, i think ill go for it in the morning, ill post an update on here if the sale is successfull and let you know how i get on with it, thanks to you all.

Jim.

 

@Hearst555...

Re: the rubberized LCD lid. On my (new) R400, I think the lid is rubberized too! At least it feels that way! Also, isn't the T400 a trifle lighter than the R400?

Cheers!

 

If the R400 does have the rubberised lid than i'm surprised, I definitely know that the R61 has a more plasticky feel on the lid compared to the T61 as well as being slightly more angular in design on the palmrest. It was one of the ways to distinguish between the R and T series so it's surprising to see Lenovo is blurring the lines between the two of late.

The T400 should be a tiny bit lighter than the R400 but not by much. You shouldn't be able to feel the difference between the two in that respects.

 

Hi...

I am pretty sure the R400 I have has the rubberized lid 'cause I compared it with a friend's T400. At least I could not spot a difference - but then again, I have an unpracticed eye. As for the weight, there is a difference, but not much as you said.

Oh...and I am sure I have the R400 - its written on the invoice and on the machine.

 

Well, I ordered the T400 from the earlier Ebay link, I am not awaiting delivery, sometime in the middle of next week hopefully.

Thanks again to you all, fingers crossed the machine will be fine!

Jim.

 

The model number should be shown next to the Lenovo logo on the screen where the status indicators are. So don't worry you have the R400 if it says so.

 

@Hearst555...lol! Yeah, that is what I meant when I said it is mentioned on the machine!

Strange about the rubberized lid though..ain't it. Also, I posted a question about the ThinkVantage System Update...perhaps you could take a look at it and let me know what you think?

Cheers!

 

my first laptop is R51 an absolutely awesome laptop which made me only consider Thinkpad as my laptop choice since then.I am using T61 now and from my experience i think the main different between the R series and T series is that T series looks more slick and edgy business looking while R series tend to be soft 'friendly' home-user feeling.and i recall R series usually has a 1yr warranty while T series has 3 yrs .

 

My R400 comes with a 3-year onsite (International) warranty - at no extra cost.

 

Granted this goes back a number of generations, but my introduction to the ThinkPad line was the R31. Although it doesn't see much use these days, it has held up very well and still runs fine. The R series units I have seen since then have appeared to be fine to me as well.

The only time I saw an SL series ThinkPad in person was in a Best Buy store, and I wasn't very impressed. It looked and felt like it wasn't as well made as the other ThinkPad models. It might be fine, though.

 

Hey Everyone,

Thought id update all who helped me. I received a Brand New T400 yesterday, purchased from Ebay.

Initial impressions were brilliant, loved the size (didnt realist it would be that thin) and shape. Then a few things became apparent that spoiled things for me. Im not too sure why but there is a plastic cover on the right hand edge, that was not clicked in properly, causing the right palm rest to buckle slightly, once i snapped it back into place that was fine though.

Main problem is.... wait for it..... Keyboard.
My god, i had read some posts from people who had experienced flexing issues with their keyboards and I even warched some Video's on youtube. These reviews really cannot do my machine justice. The whole left hand side of the keyboard flexes so badly, even with slight pressure on the w, q, tab,`, 1, 2, a, s, d, keys all of the those keys and some of the fuction keys move downwards into the case. Its so poor in fact that I am amazed that they let it out of the factory. The only keys that seem to be flex free are b, n, m, and a couple of others. When I press those the only thing that moves is that key!

I called lenovo, as my machine is in Warranty until Nov this year and they said that I would have to pay to send it back to their repair centre. I just couldnt believe that, its the first time I have had to pay to send a product that I would say was faulty back in my life. And to top ot off they say I cant use my original box as they cant send that back, so now I have to buy bubble wrap, a box etc and ship it recorded.

Does anyone else have any experience of the chances of them fixing the problem are? Have you had your keyboards replaced and been trouble free after?

Thanks in advance, sorry its a long one, but we are a low income family, and its taken me a long time to save for my first laptop, and so far I wish I had got the Acer one from PC World that I saw, the frame and keyboard were rock solid and it had an i3 processor!

 

Some people who brought up the flexing issues on the T400 keyboard were able to get a new stiffer keyboard for free from Lenovo, but it is a bit of a lottery of who's dealing with your enquiry. You shouldn't need to send the whole unit back if it's just the keyboard that is flexing, especially if its going to cost you on the postage which in my opinion is unfair.

You can try and contact Lenovo again saying that the keyboard is below par of what you expect from the ThinkPad experience and hopefully they can be more reasonable and send you a replacement. Otherwise I suggest purchasing a T61 keyboard for your T400. While they are compatible to each other, the T61 has virtually no flex thanks to the stiffer backplate, why Lenovo decided to fiddle with one of ThinkPad's trademarks is puzzling to me (if it ain't broke, don't fix). For you look for part number "42T3167", this is the UK English version of the NMB T61 keyboard which many tend to prefer. I'm a bit odd and prefer the clickier Chicony (42T3297) though rather unfortunately I got the NMB in mine!

 

Thanks for that m8, ill phone them back in the morning, my dad's an elecronic test engineer, so ill get him to fit it for me if i have any luck on the phone, if he can put a radar system for a Tornado together, he can fit a keyboard.

 

Removing the keyboard in the T400 is straight forward:

- First take out the battery to prevent the laptop switching on by accident.

- Remove the screws marked with the keyboard symbol then take out the palmrest (watch for the cable) - Fig 1

- Lift the keyboard towards you and gently disconnect the cable underneath - Fig 2

Reverse the steps with the replacment keyboard and all should be well. It may take a bit to snap the palmrest back into place.

 

Again, thanks for the reply m8. Ill call Lenovo in the morning and see if any of those two part numbers are available. Just to confirm, both those are the Keyboards with the full non perforated backplate which should eliminate all of the issues I have?

Your right about the not really needing to return it, as its gonna cost me about £15 to send and package it, which in my opinion is totally wrong.

Thanks again.
Jim.

 

Yes, the T61 keyboards have a full solid backing, no perforated designs that was introduced in the T400 onwards. The flexing issues were more predominant on the earlier T400, though it was changed on later models to solve the flex problem (though not entirely). I'm typing on a T61 keyboard right at this moment and it is rock solid so you shouldn't have a problem with yours should you get one.

 

Success!!!!!!
I called a minute ago and spoke with the woman in technical support. I told her I wanted one of the old style keyboards (t61) and gave her the part numbers. She didn't have that one in stock, but did have one that was a
42T32** I cant remember the rest of the numbers, she said it was completely different to the one I have in my T400 at the moment, and was one of the old style one with a solid metal back, so fingers crossed its a lot better than the one I have which i have named "Mushy".

Even better was the fact that she said I would receive it tommorow and that if it was the wrong one or still suffered flexing she would order me in one of the above mentioned part numbers.

Nice!

 

Glad things are working out for you, as I said before it is a bit of a lottery on who's dealing with your enquiry but at least you don't need to send the whole unit back now!

Most likely you going to get the clickier Chicony keyboard, but it's still a solid keyboard in my opinion. Normally people swapping for the T61 keyboards have their flexing problems solved so fingers crossed it will be the same for you!

 

Fitted the keyboard last night, much much better. I think it is the clickier keyboarf which i like to be honest. Hardly any flexing now anywhere, only problem is that the buttons above the trackpad (for the red rubber pointer) are very rattly, but i dont use those anyway so not a big deal.

I did notice that the memory module is 2gb, so im gonna get another 2gb module to put in, strange I thought it would have has 2 x 1gb, so as to run in duel channel, glad it didnt though cos i can now upgrade cheaper.

Very happy with the machine overall.

Thanks all for your help.
Jim

 

BTW, when you got the keyboard, did you see if it was the perforated one or the one with the solid plate?

Edit: Sorry, if I am not mistaken, I think you did say it was the solid plate one in post #29. But can you share with us the FRU number please? Thanks.

 

As bigjim1979 mentioned he had the "clickier" keyboard I believe he may have the Chicony T61 keyboard (UK English) which is FRU number: 42T3297. All T61 keyboards have a solid back plate regardless of manufacturer and language.

You can find out the list of T61 keyboards, make and language by accessing this site - link.

 

OK. Thanks. I am assuming that the T61 keyboards will also fit on the R400 since it worked on bigjim1979's T400?

 

Sorry for the late reply, the Nimber for the replacement keyboard is 42T3233. It has very tiny holes on the underside, but not fully perdorated like the one that was in before. Altogether its like typing on a completely different computer. Very solid!

Edit, Just googled this and it seems to be the keyboard from the R61, Its very nice, however the buttons for the Red Rubber trackpoint are a bit rattly.

 

Thanks. I just requested the following KB: FRU 42T3143. This is reputed to be the NMB KB and apparently, Lenovo/ThinkPad Center (India) has them sitting around shrinkwrapped and in brand new conditions. Maybe there are a lot of R61 users in India...who knows...!

 

This thread has inspired me - I've just bought a T400 off ebay as well - so will also post my impressions when I receive it - which should hopefully be in a couple of days.

 

You gave up on the X200? That's a shame. It's a great notebook.

 

@Zaz, The T400 was cheaper and brand new in box. The x200 was just the machine and a charger... so I choose the "safer" option - we'll see. I did quite fancy the 14" screen over the 12" too .... but I suspect there will be an X series in my future as well

 

Just got my brand new T400 today via ebay - sealed box - absolutely brand new so very pleased .... however having a bit of buyers remorse/indecision and wondering about selling it on for a X200 instead ...... Hmmmmmmm

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=472195

 

@Scottie P: Why the remorse?

 

Thinking of going for a lighter "sexier" model instead - as you can see in my new thread.....

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=472195

I suspect common sense (T400) will most likely prevail.