Questions about the T60 ...

Well, I'll be off to University in the fall and I am looking to purchase a laptop, and I am now considering the T60 given that my Dell XPS M1210 configuration is coming in the range of the T60s. Without question in my mind the T60 is the superior laptop. Now I need some advice to help me sort through the myriad of configurations that these IBM/Lenovo computers seem to come in. (Couldn't they just go to build to order?). Anyways, that's another topic for another time.

Firstly, the video card. I'll be attending an Engineering program, if that helps. Given that I am just going to be starting the program, I cannot really anticipate my needs, perhaps one of you can. There is a significant price difference between the configurations with the X1300 and the X1400 video cards. I am somewhat inclined to go towards the X1400 video card for the sake of 'future-proofing' my laptop. What would you all recommend?

Now with the screen, I am leaning towards the 14" screen for the sake of portability as well as battery life. From the reviews that I've read, there is a fair bit of complaints with the 14" screen. I am wondering how limited the viewing angle actually is. I do not plan to site beside the laptop and expect clarity. I just want to be able to look from somewhat of an angle and see a good picture. I would greatly appreciate it if someone with a 14" screen could take some pictures from an angle.

Finally, I am wondering about the necessity of upgrading to the onsite next business day warranty. Given that there is already 3 years of depot repair provided with the system, and the quality of the machines, is it necessary, or is it a personal thing. The premium is about 10%, and I guess it's about peace-of-mind. Is it worth it?

I would like to thank you all in advance for your replies, and I hope that you can make my decision easier and certainly more informed.

 

what's ure budget? if u stretch it a little, you'll be in for a real treat- the t60p. it has a fire 5200 gl card, perfect for engin. programs and a 15inch flexview screen with the best viewing angles

if ure still getting the t60, opt for the x1400. it has twice the video memory and will run programs/games much smoother

warranty is always a good idea for a mobile student

 

I was interested in the T60p, but from what I have gathered speaking to Lenovo Canada representatives, it isn't really available in Canada. Moreover it is way out of my budget (Canadian prices that is). It's unfortunate that we Canadians do not get a Back to School sale on the T60p models like there is on the American website. Those models are certainly within my budget.

With my budget, I can go up to 15" display and X1400 card. The questions is with the 15" display is a) battery life and b) weight. Is it worth the sacrifice in battery life (which I guess I can overcome later by adding a battery in the ultrabay) and more importantly, weight for essentially a wider viewing angle. Or, is the 15" screen that much better. One representative who seemed knowledgeable suggested that for 'normal' viewing the screens' quality is identical. What's different is the angles. Anyone have other opinions?

 

just remember there is a non-flexview 15 inch screen too. if thats the only option, just get the 14 inch for better battery/portability

 

The Flexview screen is within my budget. The question really is, is that are the wider viewing angles worth the sacrifice in weight and battery life. From what I have read, the Flexview is one of the best screens available, does everyday experience confirm that?

 

The FlexView is the best matte screen you will find, but it isn't the most portable machine.

 

I have sat down a couple of times this week with the 15" flexview and 14.1" SXGA's side-by-side at work. The flexview is a far superior viewing experience, especially for pictures. Even sitting straight on, the flexview is brighter (more nits) and smooth/even.

I found that the battery drain wasn't terribly signficant. Maybe half-hour or more difference, obviously depends what you're doing so could be more. I would expect about 3 hours under normal conditions, whereas you should coax 4 hours from the 14". Less if you use the drive a lot. One thing, i found that i turned down the flexview brightness on battery so that may have helped.

The 15" flexview is a no-brainer choice except for one thing... you mentioned weight. Actually, weight is only part of the story, the smaller part since it's only about 3/4 pound difference. What bothered me more was BULK. The 15" is heftier in all dimensions, especially thickness. It's 20% thicker and it's noticeable. When you life the 15" by one hand on the edge, even tho it's only 0.8 pounds heavier, it FEELS heavier because of the LEVERAGE affect caused by the larger dimensions. Understand? It's the concept of leverage. So it's tough to decide... i think you really need to try for yourself to decide. If you dont take your laptop out every day, or if you toss it into a large backpack usually, then maybe the 15" is okay. For me, it's a tough call... because i hate the extra bulk of the 15", but in 14" i dont like either XGA or SXGA+

 

Thank-you everyone for your insights so far.

I think that right now I am leaning more towards the 14", mainly for the fact that it is overall a more portable laptop. I can always purchase a nice widescreen lcd in the future. Does anyone have some pictures of the 14" at some angles, as well as straight on?

Also, I am wondering how the 14" stands in comparison to other 14 inch screens around. Is it in the upper-echelon? I would expect that much when I am paying the premium for a ThinkPad machine.

 

I would say it is average.

 

Interesting, I spent another 3 hours today at IBM comparing/trying the 14.1 and the 15" flexview.

I *really* wanted to like the 14.1 (i have never had larger than 14.1 before), but at the end of my testing, i decided the 15" flexview screen is just soo superior. Frankly, the 14" screen sucks in comparison. The screen looks washed out, its text is harsh & crude, colors are different/wrong, and pictures lack depth & perception. It hurst the eyes compared to the 15" flexview. In other words, the screen won over portability.

Sorry for you that i didn't take any pics. maybe next time... But just imagine, with the 14" on an angle you cant make out the picture and the screen washes out, whereas the 15" flexview looks fine.

I spent almost 2 hours considering the portability. I weighed them on the scale in shipping, they were 0.79 pounds different. The weight isn't as noticeable as the bulk. But get this... i have a thinkpad bag and a leather attache laptop bag, I asked someone to put the 15" in one and the 14" in the other (with AC adapters in both)... and i could not tell which case had which laptop!! In my lap, the 15" is not any less comfortable. The only time the bigger bulk bothers me is when i pick it up by the side and lift it with the laptop held flat.

I have to take my laptop every day, and i am a weak female, nevertheless the 15" flexview is what I choose. My eyes will thank me for it!

 

SkiBunny, where can I go to try out the T60s? I couldn't find anywhere in GTA to go and see a model.

 

I saw one at pacific mall (kennedy steeles) but the price was like $2500 :0
I wonder whether lenovo has a small showroom (call and ask??) like ibm used to.

 

For pics/answers to both those questions, looky at this review
http://www.notebookreview.com/defau...nkPad+T60+1953+-+Core+Duo+T2300+1.66+GHz+-+15

 

Wow, the angles seem quite bad. Seems like it might force me to get the 15" model. I guess functionality outweighs the slight loss in weight and battery life. In any case, I dout there would be that many instances where I have a stretch of about three and a half hours without the ability to plug in somewhere. Moreover, I guess I can get the ultrabay battery if I really feel like I need more battery life.

I am really looking forward to buying my T60, it should be awesome.

 

If you want a fantastic flexview T60p, I can arrange for you to get directly from IBM/Lenovo (EPP) the 200772U model for Cdn$1999, which lists on website for $3239. Or the 20075QU for Cdn$1739. Both havde 2GHz Core Duo and 15" Flexview.

If you want a 14.1" SXGA+ t60 directly from ibm/lenovo (EPP), the 2623DCU for CDN$1499 looks appealing (it costs less than the American site's "sale" price of US$1399 which ends Monday).

-SB

 

In follow up to my post above, someone asked me via pm,...
The T60 model 200762U is Cdn$1899 (search model# on the ibm/lenovo canada site for specs)
This is EPP employee pricing for T60
PM me if seriously interested in this or other T60 model ** canada only **
You buy it online at the ibm/lenovo site, u dont pay me haha (read: not a scam)
But they are not returnable (unless defective) like regular sales, however the full ibm international warranty applies

 

Well, thank you to everyone who posted here and helped me to make my decision. I am finally getting a ThinkPad! I ultimately decided on the T60 model 200772U which has a Hz Core Duo, 100 gig hard drive, dvd burner, and the amazing flexview screen. I am now eagerly anticipating this amazing laptop's arrival.

On that note, anyone know if there is any facility to track one's order online in Canada. I see on the American Lenovo website that there is a convenient order status link on the main page. However, no suck luck on the Canadian website. If anyone knows how to accomplish this online, I would greatly appreciate it! Of-course I could always phone in and check.

Anyways, expect a review in a few weeks (hopefully sooner!).

 

Hmm so wasn't that 200772U kinda expensive?

Anyway dont pay for NBD warranty coverage... almost every time they come next day and tell you have to send it in to the depot, there is VERY little on that machine that the tech can/will fix onsite. If you're gonna extra spend money on warranty, better to extend the term or spend it on accident coverage. IMHO

 

I pretty much settled on the 200772U myself right now, but could be convinced to save some money (flexview is a must though) ... The other rig I'm considering is the 2007C7U, but it all depends on what prices I can get through the campus store down here in the US (unfortunately I don't have EPP connections). I kinda like the idea of having the 128Mb of the X1400 although I might never need it

Btw, you totally convinced me of getting the flexview as well. Thanks for sharing your opinions (and links)!

 

I got it through Visaperks . It was about 100 more before taxes from your EPP price. I figured that the 100 was worth it for the ability to return without hassles.

In regards to NBD, thanks for the information. I had ordered it, but I'll reconsider now. What convinced me was that there was about $80 difference between the additional protection and NBD + the protection (all this for three years). So I felt that it would be worth it. Plus, with university I thought I'd appreciate the tech coming to me. We'll see I guess. The warranty also has a return policy .

 

Well i hope y'all enjoy your flexviews... i wish flexview came in the 14" form factor, oh well the 15" is more readable (i find sxga+ is too small in 14" for me)

Nayyer, did you order online or by phone?... Did they give you an estimated delivery timeframe??

Bunny

 

I ordered online, however I have a rep handling my order. According to her, I should expect 'two to three weeks'. This is fine for me as I only need it by September, so hopefully it arrives by then. Good thing I ordered now though!

 

Just got my T60 ... was originally worried about the 14 inch 1400x1050 screen--but I like it. Much better when side by side with my old T43. This Samsung screen is much brighter.

I did have some odd distortion on the windows menu's, but this eems to have been corrected by an updated ATI driiver (from windows update).

 

A big batch of the 200772u just arrived today... so expect yours to arrive soon

 

Was that the 2623D6U ?
Those are very nice, a good compromise between portability and screen (15" is less portable and 12" screen is too small).... I want the 15" flexview screen but i only wanna carry around the 12" ultraportable LOL.
If you find the text too small you can change the DPI settings (actually i believe IBM ships it with some larger fonts installed). Of course the price you pay for setting text larger is that you see less, but i prefer it anyway.

 

Yes, it is a 2623D6U. Likely I will add some ram shortly, but other than that it very much fits my needs. I turned on cleartype and everything is very readable.

 

Wow, you are absolutely correct. I just got a call from shipping company to expect my new laptop to arrive Monday! This is absolutely fantastic. No Lenovo shipping woes for me, although the funny thing is that I called order status department on Thursday and they said to expect it on the 22nd - glad they were wrong. I cannot wait to try out this awesome machine come Monday evening.

 

Dont ask shipping dept, ask ski bunny.... i check inventory online in real-time hehe

Yep i will be interested to hear your impressions of the 200772u... the screen is fantastic, but if you find the laptop too big remember you can exchange it for a smaller one.... the 200762u is the same machine but 14.1" (not flexview, same x1400 graphics tho) and it's in stock now. Or the 2623D6U, as wolff says, is very nice and great value it costs $500 less (but it's 3-weeks in backorder)

 

How do you check prices? I used the Education section (supposedly with 5% discount).

2623d6u $1,519.06 76 in stock
($1,599 in the Buy Today, Ship Today promotion)
200762u $1,663.20 10 days
200772u $1,887.20 10 days

 

you are looking at US prices and inventory...
The 62u is in stock in canada but the d6u is back-ordered 3 weeks.
That's probably because the d6u costs less in canada than in the US (after currency conversion), whereas the 62u is more expensive in canada.

 

Where to find best prices on the Lenovo (US) Web site? It's difficult to navigate.

As an example, I found a back door (Education discount) that gave
a better price for the 2623d6u than the well-advertised current promotion. If I talked to the CSR, could she or he find an even better price for me?

 

Sometimes the CSR can wiggle a bit....
About the D6U, tell them it was $1399 in july for back to school (it was) and if they dont give that to you, you'll buy a XXXXXXX.

 

I was hoping for something more dramatic, like a $200 rebate.

How often are rebates offered? I hope the arrival of the T61 will drive prices down.

 

I have not seen rebates on thinkpads. Many of the high end T60's dropped in price lately (because the high end core duos dropped a lot). I am sure the prices of the T60's will drop later, and then so will the T61's. you can play that game forever. So if you dont need anything, wait... but if you do then you must buy.

The cheapest i have ever seen the D6U public price was $1399 from lenovo USA last month.
(employee price is $1279, so not that much difference, and bear in mind the employee purchase is Final Sale no returns)

 

You can actually get a slightly better machine for $1399 on the lenovo US website right now (it's the 2007C4U). Go to the education part (here), and go to students, select students & alumni (box on bottom left). Once you're in, there is still a back to school sale running until september 18th. And the prices are pretty good ...

 

Curious how much is the 200768u and 200762u on there, or the 200772u?
I have seen some educational posts for t60p at incredible prices!

 

I just ordered the 200772U, so don't tell me ...

 

Actually on the education page, the back-to-school sale and the little box in the upper right corner gave the same prices. That is, the BTS prices and the "everyday" prices (with more choices) are the same.

200762u $1,663.20
200768u $1,703.20
200772u $1,887.20

 

200776u? ... sweet!
(it's like the 200772u but it has 7200rpm, bigger cache, and can take more RAM)

 

If you're a student, check your campus computer store. It depends on what deals they have, but some of the prices I've seen around beat the lenovo site by a couple of hundred bucks. Some of the deals I found must be close to the EPP price if not lower. My 200772U was actually cheaper than the canadian EPP quote skibunny posted a while ago.

 

The 20072u is available to anyone in canada on visaperks for Cdn$2099, which is $100 more than the Cdn employee price. The US employee price is US$1651, but none are in stock in the US. They ARE in stock in canada.

But employee prices are final sale. Visaperks purchases are 100% refundable for 30 days, even for used items.

Yes those campus/educations discounts I've seen posted in some cases (eg. t60p) are unbeatable.

Are campus computer store sales returnable or final sale?

 

Ad returnable: I haven't really probed that, which was probably a mistake. But after all the time I spent researching this computer, I might as well go with it. The price was just too tempting ... (I got it slightly below the US EPP).
I yet have to see the laptop - it's about to be shipped - and they had it in stock at the store whenever I asked.

BTW: you mentioned the atheros wifi at some point. I guess this is not the one that is on the specs for the 200772U (Intel). Any reasons?

 

right the 200772u uses intel 3945 instead of the ibm thinkpad/atheros wifi... probably so the model can use the "centrino" moniker, but the thinkpad a/b/g is reportedly better/stronger. A few rares issues reported with the intel. I wouldn't worry about it tho. I mean, you'd have to custom order to get it exactly the way you want, and then it'd be very expensive and probably take forever to get it. I mean, ideally i'd take the thinkpad a/b/g and the 7200rpm... but then we'd be talking t60p prices and is it worth it? not for me.

you have a nice machine anyway. envy you.

 

You're right about the t60p prices ... good thing though is that you can change the hd and afaik even the wifi (unlike a lot of the other stuff)

 

Engineering? definitely need a dedicated vid card because some engineering programs wont run with out it. and ram, the more the merry =)

 

How come when you try to customize a T60 to include flexview, it requires you to pick the T2700 duo core processor (add additional $550 from the base processor T2400). Only then can you choose the flexview screen with ati
x1400 for an additional $300. I want a flexview screen, but do not require the fastest core duo processor available. Is this a scheme to get rid of their inventory of core duos in preparation for the merom chips?

 

Try this link: You can get as low as a T2400 with a flexview and an x1400.

 

Nevermind, link works fine now.