Should the T4x0s be called the X4x0?

I am looking at the T400s (which is exactly same externally as the T4x0s) and comparing it to the X61s and X200 that i have, i can't help to wonder why Lenovo did not call the T400s the X400 instead.

Most of my friends asked why T400s cost so much more than the T400 and i told them it is thinner, they say for that money i could get a X200 with ultrabase instead. Then i showed them the T400s side by with the X200, and many people said whoa the T400s is really thin, comparable to the X200. Most of my friends would say, Lenovo did not market the T400s too well, they asked why Lenovo did not call it X400 instead, then people wouldn't have minded so much for paying the premium.

What's in a name, they say.... so how does the general Thinkpadder community think about the naming convention of the T400s -> X400?

Here is a picture to illustrate what i am babbling about.



The T400s (on the right) is actually thinner than the X200 (on the left).

 

It would make logical sense. The T4x0s has always had far more design similarities to the x300/x301 than the T4x0. It also might make the price premium easier to take.

However, I think it's classed as a T for the following reasons:

14.1" screen size (every X series has been 13.3" or smaller, with the vast majority at 12.1")
Dedicated graphics options (every X series has had an Intel integrated GPU since these have been available)
Someone else will have to confirm but I don't believe the CPU in the T400s is soldered either. Conversely, it is soldered for the x200/x300.
Two spindle design; all other X series have been single spindle (granted the x300/x301 was an exception here, but you still couldn't use the Ultrabay as it was only 7mm)

In short, 'T' has traditionally implied more features and fewer compromises than the 'X' series (portability above all else). The T4x0s straddles the line here and Lenovo chose to go with the 'T' moniker.

 

Doesn't really matter does it? You want a T4xxs then you buy one Lenovo doesn't seem to advertise Thinkpads much so the specific names aren't really relevant to the target customers (corporate, education, etc).

Now what I want is a Thinkpad-brand competitor to the Vaio Z. The best screens, fastest dual core processors, Blu-Ray, 13 inches, and 3 pounds. Now that would be a perfect laptop, too bad only Sony seems to have this formula down (and really expensive ingredients at that

 

The pain I have with the T410s is its short battery performance, which is only marginally increased when an Ultrabay 3-cell battery is added. This alone negates the value of being a "mobile" computing device. I end up carrying the X201 with me whenever I am out of the office: 9 hours of battery for a work day (with settings that are comfortable to me) is simply wonderful.

In terms of design, especially in relation to thickness (or, rather, thinness ) and weight, the T410s is a significant achievement. It becomes almost "transparent" when you use it.

However, Lenovo mismarkets the T410s, which looks similar to and is overshadowed by the T410. I never feel that the T410s is a replacement for the X301: the X301 is too special for the T410s to replace it. Because of its battery weakness, I never recommend it to colleagues and friends and, instead, suggest that they consider the T410 with 9-cell battery.

 

@jonlumpkin... the CPU on the T4x0s are soldered like on the other X series. Not every X series had integrated GPU, X31, X32, X2x all had ATI discrete GPU. It is only starting from the X4x machines did X series started to move to Intel integrated GPU option.

Also, traditionally people have associated the X series as super portable laptops and command a premium as such. T series did not did not command the sort of premium that X series had.

What i am trying to say, is that the X400 is a better product descriptor than the T400s moniker.

Just like when Lenovo decided that the p designated T series, should be called W series instead and more people whom weren't familiar to thinkpads, would better understand what the laptops was capable of and why it was more expensive.

As i have said, many people whom don't follow the Thinkpads development, don't know why the T4x0s commanded the premium it did, as to them it was just a slightly thinner T series. But when i showed them the T400s next to the X200, then they understand what the fuss is about and what they paid for.

In my opinion while Lenovo succeeded in the product development and design exercise on the T400s, they did not fully maximize the product marketing and branding potential for this fine machine.

 

They have also x200 and x200S, now should they rename those as well giving x200 new name, lets say T200 ?
Point being, it looks like X has always been their thin, small and light machines and while T400s is light and thin its not exactly small anymore.

 

@veer, if everything was as simple as you make it out to be.

I have been reading that one of the reason why T400s wasn't called a X400, was due to some sort of feud between the X series group team and T series product group team, not sure how true this is.

Right now X series group have X100e, X201, X201s and T series group have T410, T510, T410s....

If rumors were true, neither T or X series would get a 13.3 inch model, since this is a borderline product.

 

Well, Im giving my opinion on what I see when I look at those machines and their specs and that makes it quite simple to me
Adding another size, bigger one, to the X series would IMO dilute X series, just like when people complained about addition of SL/L series, which isnt exactly the same, but imagine if Lenovo released 15" X series and later on 17". That wouldnt make sense to differentiate them, only based on weight and thickness while remaining pretty much the same machines spec wise, to me that definitely wouldnt make sense.
They would need entirely different machines to make up full X series for 11"-17" to make them different from regular T/W series.
I do think that while 14" isnt quite big its still too big to be deemed ultraportable, which seems is where X series succeed with their size and mobility.
Sure, if you compare regular T series to slim T series by looks they seem like different laptops. But at the end of the day they seem to be targeted at pretty much the same tasks, except for T4xxS poor battery life which sucks to be so low.

 

It is more about brand management, and the perceived value of product in the eye of the consumers. A T400s and X400 would have a different perceived value in the eye of the customer whom are not researching into their potential purchase.

If Lenovo can make a 17 inch laptop under 2 kgs, then they rightly call it a X series laptop.

 

X designates a subnotebook or ultraportable.   a 14"+ notebook could be as thin as paper but has too large of a footprint to fall into what the industry (not lenovo) considers a subnotebook or ultraportable.

eventually everyone will produce thin notebooks.   by only using thinness as a determining factor, every thinkpad would become an X model and nothing would differentiate the lines.

the T400s and T410s have the correct nomenclature in my humble opinion.

 

How does the x200s compare to the x200 and T410s in thickness? They have about 170 x200s's on the outlet for about $800 each.

 

Width, height, thickness, weight, battery life.

A practical reduction of the first 4 parameters while maintaining usefully large value of the fifth (and preserving the traditional greatness of the ThinkPad keyboard) will justify an X ultraportable ThinkPad.

And... perfect display, with wide viewing angle, great contrast, adaptive brightness, and wonderful color reproduction fidelity.

And... fantastic stereo sound.

And... cool and quiet.

Above all, the creation must be affordable to ThinkPad lovers, mod'able by ThinkPad tinkerers and a profitable business for Lenovo!

 

Maybe Lenovo would start a model line called Thinkpad P, lightweight and full sized.

X200s is about the same thickness as the T4x0s. I would only get the X200s at that price if it had the WXGA+ screen.

 

Well it's good to see that Lenovo is still following in IBM's footsteps in some regard: they're keeping the long tradition of making beautifully-designed, well-made machines and letting them hit the market with a resounding thud thanks to dud marketing.

[/mild_sarcasm]

 

It just shows that making a great product is only half the story in winning the market share... without effective marketing, a great product still wouldn't sell itself really well.

 

why wont they keep the 13' imo 13'' is best for both worlds. 12'' is too small and 14'' is slightly bigger. x300 is my dream machine!

@lead: since you have the machines why dont you take more pictures of comparing them? would be really nice and helpful to some of us potential buyer who wants to know how exactly their sizes are. would be cool to throw in a t61(thats the one i have ) many thanks if ya do that!

 

i can do it during the weekend or early next week when i have bit more time.

Which T61 do you have? the only T61 i have right now is a 14.1 inch widescreen model (but i have T60 14.1 inch standard aspect ratio and a T500 which are comparable to the T61 14.1 inch 4:3 or T61 15.4 inch).

 

While the X300/X301 was really thin for its category and time (Macbook Air notwithstanding and the Timeline wasn't available at that time), the T400s/T410s isn't thin or light enough to justify its existence in my opinion. At that footprint, most buyers wouldn't be considering thin and light to be a priority but more about balanced performance and portability. The T400s/T410s fails that with its paltry battery life and limited CPU options.

 

i have the 15'' T61(suppose it should be similar to T5x0's size?) just throw in all your thinkpads and play around with them to compare their sizes. many thanks to you sir !

 

Absolutely. I don't usually like Apple's products, but I'll be damned if they're not one of the best companies in the industry when it comes to marketing.

 

Steve Jobs can sell anything.... but then again he started the company, and he is passionate about it... you won't see the CEO of Lenovo start to appear at various events trying to sell Lenovo's new products.

 

It's not Steve Jobs's doing really. I mean sure, he does the big introductions, but the marketing -- the TV ads, the magazine ads, the magazine articles -- is more the action of Apple itself.

 

i think it's an unfounded rumor.

the T4x0s doesn't belong in the the ultraportable category because it's not just about thinness...it's a bit too big and the poor battery life disqualify it, not to mention the weight.

 

The X400 would make more sense for me and I suspect most people. As it is difficult to demo the machines before bying, and the little s doesn't dignify that it is indeed a completely different machine.
400 is the screen size, so there is no confusion with the smaller X:es.
If I knew about the X400, I might have saved up instead of going the T410 route.

 

And the next logical step would be X400s -- even slimmer!

(With superior battery life, of course.)