T61 or X61 for daily class travel.. please help!

Starting in August, I'll be walking between classes daily with a laptop. I appreciate the greater screen resolution and size of the T61, not to mention the dedicated graphics capability. However, would it be worth it to sacrifice that bit of performance and resolution in order to have the incredible portability of the X series?

Anyone who carries their laptop with them daily... how much more does a 14.1" impede you than a 12"?

Thanks for any assistance you can provide.

 

I plan to carry a backpack with 20 lbs of books and 6.5 lbs of laptop and laptop equipment with me everyday. Since parking in cities is a major problem, I will walk about 1-2 miles everyday. I think I am making the right decision choosing the 14.1" laptop over the 12.1" laptop. I find it difficult to type on 12.1" laptops and I cannot get used to that tiny screen. Hopefully, I am making the right choice.

 

I'm kind of in your same boat. I'll be traversing the Penn State campus daily, which, is quite large.

I do believe the X61 keyboard is a full-size keyboard, though, you are correct about the screen. I'm just pretty undecided, I guess. I need to decide before long, though.

 

The keyboard size is about the same, but the screen makes everything look so small. If you can stand the 12.1" screen, it is worth it. I prefer the larger 14.1" screen even though it makes the weight and base of the laptop bigger.

 

Yea, I think the dedicated video might just be the dealbreaker for me though here.

If I could get the NVidia card on the X61, I'm pretty sure there'd be no contest.

...man, I can only imagine the kind of FPS that NVidia card would crank out at a max. resolution of 1024 X 768. O_O

 

t61 if class is close.
x61 if class is at least 10 minutes per trip plus books.

 

For me it was the T61... no brainer really. It is cheaper, offers better performance, although the battery life is worse. To me carrying around an extra pound or two is not going to make a big difference at all. Heck I probably wouldnt notice the difference.

 

I canceled my order for a T61 and am now going to get an X60s, I don't need the performance because I have a really decent desktop. The deal breaker for me was the battery life, The insane battery life the X60s is going to be nice for me because I start class at 9 and though I might only have 3 classes that day I will be in and out of the lab all the time so the battery life will be nice.

 

Well, weight isn't the only consideration for me, size is too... smaller would be far more convenient.

Well, as it stands, I'm pretty much still undecided, so, any further insight is welcome!

 

Check out the 12.1" screen on anything in stock at a store in that size.

If this is your ONLY computer, beware tho, using that screen for a half-hour in a store is not a good test. Using it for hours at home or school is more straining on the eyes.

As you know, the X60 is an XGA screen. So it doesn't hold a lot. Plenty for surfing or work processing. Size wise, the pixel/text size on the X60/s is almost identical to that of WXGA (1200x800) 14.1" computer. The pixel density of the X-series is 106ppi and its 107ppi for a 14.1" WXGA widescreen

 

^^

Thanks for the info. My girlfriend has the Dell M710, and I love its portability, but detest the miniature keyboard, which, fortunately, the X61 doesn't have.

But yea, the extra real estate would be missed.

 

You will not be carrying your textbooks most of the time in most of your classes. I guess it will depend on classes, but almost all classes I have taken did not require textbooks in class. 300 and 400 classes required textbooks for me, but by then, we were using smaller paperbacks.

 

I was also thinking about this, but I think I'm gonna go for the T61. The option for WXGA+ with the brighter screen is a plus in my book. The 1024x768, 150 nit screen on the X61 is kind of a disappointment for me.

I personally think the integrated graphics is a plus for school, it'll keep you from playing any games unless your really bored then you can play some old RTS or something. In my case this is good because I'm just going down the street for school and I have a 1500 dollar gaming desktop waiting for me a home.

If it's gonna be your main machine for work and play then I can understand the better video card. But integrated is fine for any UI graphics and older games.

Now all I'm worried about is the battery life... I just hope I can get a seat next to a outlet or something

 

i don't know if this will come into play for you, but i'm probably going to get the x60/x60 tablet because of the battery life, weight and the fact that i CANNOT play games. if i can, i end up wasting my time on campus being unproductive (playing games).
so here's my say:
if you have a gaming rig at home, get the x61.
if this will be your one and only, get the t61.

 

Well I know for me I always just carry my backpack, and it has a laptop compartment. So as long as it fits in there I am happy (the thing is huge and I am pretty sure you cant fill it with a laptop)

 

Aside from this, though, it's much easier to whip out a 12.1" laptop as opposed to a 14.1" one..

 

Does anyone else commute daily between classes with a 14.1" notebook? Just wondering.

 

I used to commute to class with a 15.4" laptop everyday. It's never bothered me. I have a laptop pocket in my backpack and most of the time, my books are bigger than my laptop.

I ordered a 14.1" T61, so it should be even easier to take around.

 

I got a Targus XL backpack. It can handle even a 17" laptop and balances the weight out very well with wide padded straps. It might be a good choice for you if you go 15.4". I'd sooner get the 15.4" and that kind of bag than to be frustrated by having to scroll webpages left and right.

 

Yikes, I was trying to decide between a 14.1" and a 12.1"... I don't think I'll go any bigger. Nice to know that something even as big as a 15.4 is workable.

Anyway, I'm really unimpressed by the X61's 1024x768 screen though, so, I dunno. I'm really leaning towards the 14.1" T61.

 

The T61 is a lot bulkier than the T60.

The 15" T60 (which has the world-best flexview screen with IPS) isn't much bulkier than the dam 14.1 widescreen T61, even tho the 15" t60 has a substantially larger display.

"T" used to stand for "thin and light"... no longer true on the T61. That's a reason why so many longtime Thinkpad fans dislike the T61

 

Its a shame that the T60 15" flexview is 400 dollars more expensive (with the same cpu) then the 14.1 T61. I wouldn't mind getting a flexview but that much more money is just to much with college coming up but I guess it depends on budget.

Also correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't flexview originally intended for multimedia viewing? I would think it would be a bit overkill for something intended for schoolwork.

One more thing, how much bulkier is the T61? From what I saw it's a tad thicker then the T60 but I wouldn't think it would be bulkier then the T60 15.4.

 

T61 widescreen with 6 cell = 148 cubic inchesl
T60 14.1 with 6 cell = 122 cubic inches (even tho the screen is physically larger than T61)
T60 15" with 6 cell = 168 cubic inches
X60 with 8 cell = 71 cublic inches

 

Really? That's a damn shame. Anyway, is the T61 unmanagably large for daily travel between class? Also, is it too large to whip out to take a quick note or two in a class?

 

It weighs like 5lbs, its slightly lighter than the old 14". Also, the 15.4" is 5.5lbs as opposed to 5.8 for the old 15". Again, I see lighter. So T still does stand for thin and light, even more so than before.

And 14" notebooks are bearable, but I would much rather have a 12" that weighs like 3lbs. I am currently planning on buying something 13" that weighs 4lbs, so I am downsizing by 1.5lbs. The 14" notebooks are fine if your strong etc, but if you aren't, I would stick to something smaller. And I have never used my computer for gaming primarily because of time constraints, so yea. I would stick to the X61, but thats my view.

 

Oh, Vivek, how you complicate my decision... =P

If you don't mind me asking, which 13" model are you buying? Just curious, as this seems like the absolute IDEAL size for me, it just makes me sad that Lenovo has no such offering.

Either way, I'm probably going to need to order soon in order to have it in time...!

 

I looking at the Asus S37s (its also known as the Z37s). It has an nvidia go8400M (essentially the same as the Quadro M140 in the T61) and Santa Rosa, plus an HP-imprint like finish, rotating webcam, 13.3" WXGA, and 4.3lbs. It seems like an improved version of the W7J, but I can guarantee that it wont match the build quality and solid feel of the ThinkPad, plus probably won't have as good of a keyboard (though I felt the keyboard on the X60 was slightly cramped, it had excellent feel).
Another laptop I am looking forward to is the 12" Dell XPS M1210/1220 (Santa Rosa/DX10 redesign); however, the fact that its a Dell is unappealing to me.
By the way, both of those have not been officially released for sale, and the Dell is kind of an assumed rumor. The Asus, however, is essentially confirmed by the resellers who have pics and stuff in the Asus forum.

Lenovos closest offering in terms of size is the V200, but the only benefit to buying that over the X61 is the price since the V doesn't have dedicated graphics.

 

Ewww. So has Lenovo gone the Dell way with T61?

 

Haha maybe if we're lucky, we can get some HUGE white bumpers put on the sides!

 

No, Dells have pretty much always been pretty crappy.

The IBM purists are just complaining about this new-fangled widescreen format thing. Its lighter, and lower, and offers more screen real estate on the 15.4" and just about the same amount on the 14". I don't see what they are *****ing about. The widescreen form factor is pretty much better overall, especially as sizes increase. I will admit that I see no reason for the X series to be widescreen, other than for a higher resolution screen, but there is no logical reason that the larger models shouldn't be widescreen.

 

That's comparing the 4-cell T61 with a 6-cell T60 (which has larger more powerful cells).

In fact, the 6-cell T61 is 20% larger than the 6-cell T60.

Even tho the T61 screen is significantly smaller
and the T61 lasts half as long on battery power.

T60 14.1" 6 cell = 122 cubic inches
T61 14.1" 6 cell = 148 cubic inches.... ouch

They fattened the T61 and made it power-hungry

You're right that thinkpad purists (i've been one since the early 90's) are indeed dismayed by the T61 dog.

We just got the X61s in this week at ibm. Ruff ruff.

 

So, is the general consensus then pretty much the X61?

Man, I wish it had SXGA though. Would anyone recommend getting the X6 Advanced dock?

 

I had used a X31 for about three years, I purchased it because my prior A31p was just too big and heavy to carry around all the time and the battery life was horrible.

Personally, if they had a X61 with a 13" screen, that would have been my first choice. The 12" screen is just a bit too small for me as I'd use my PC to remotely connect to servers for remote support, too much scrolling. Otherwise, the X series is the perfect laptop. Great keyboard, perfect size and weight, the battery (I used the extended battery) lasted as long as I needed it during the day, really, it is a terrific machine. The only downside is the screen is just a bit too small for me. If it was higher resolution, I could have lived with it.

So, I ordered a T61 and I'm going to try it for a month. If I find it to be too big and heavy, or battery life isn't what I need, back it goes for an X61. If I needed it for school, I'd go with the X Series as the screen size won't be a big issue and the trade off with size, weight and battery life strongly favor the X series. No optical drive on the X is something you might want to consider, it was never a problem for me. As for the dock, I didn't have one but I probably should have had it with a larger screen attached. I use a desktop at my desk most of the time, rarely my notebook.

Regards-Michael G.

 

AGREED. This is really what the whole issue is coming down to, I'm really having a hard time deciding.

If I did order a T61, and found it to be too large, how can I exchange it, and how much can I expect this to cost me?

Thanks.

 

depends where you buy.

the dock depends on your needs for extra ports. Bear in mind that the dock has an ultrabay, but it doesn't come with the optical drive, which is extra. A lot extra. It's cheaper to buy a USB optical drive instead.

My X6 dock sits and collects dust.

 

What if I buy direct from Lenovo?

 

I'm in the same boat - headed back to school and want to get something a bit lighter and more durable than my current laptop.

To me the attraction of the larger laptop is the increased screen resolution. I don't need an optical drive nor do I need the extra performance.

I don't mind a fairly small (physically) screen, but hate low resolution. My current laptop is 1600x1200 (15") and I love the resolution. It looks like the best available for the 14" T series is the SXGA+ (1400x1050 right?) on the T60 (optional equipment)?

Also, I haven't got a great feel for the difference in physical bulk, weight and battery life for the 14.1" T60 as compared to the 15" T60 and the 14" T61.

The best I found for the T61 (in 14") was the 1400x900 which seems like a terribly short screen, but tolerable I suppose.

Processor power and video card doesn't matter much to me, I'll mostly be doing word processing, web/e-mail type stuff and the like. Battery life matters, the longer the better.

I may still end up getting an X series as I'll probably be commuting to school via bicycle with the computer in a bookbag, but not sure yet. Kinda depends on how housing arrangements work out and what screen resolutions are available. I guess what I'd really like would be an X series with a 13" SXGA screen, any chance one will exist in the near future? I could put off buying a laptop for a while...


Last question, Lenovo seems to charge insane prices for ram or HDD upgrades. Its it possible to buy one without any ram, HDD or OS at all? Otherwise I'll end up just getting the cheapest they've got and putting in my own stuff.

Any suggestions etc would be great. I've read this whole thread and learned a lot already.

 

I don't think you can order them without ANYTHING, but, yea, get the cheapest they've got.

And I'm glad my thread can help other people too, that's what message boards are for.

 

If you buy direct from Lenovo, there is a 15% restocking charge for returning an item within 21 days. However, if you get a different model I've read that they typically waive the restocking fee.

As for hard drives and memory, typically, I do the same; buy the lowest cost items available and add your own. If you go that route with the hard drive, be careful on the height of the replacement drive you order. The T series, from what I've read, use a smaller height drive than you usually find in 2.5" drives.

Regards-Michael G.

 

The X60t is available in 1400x1050 res.
I'd hate that on a 12" screen, but souunds like it's what you want.
Tablet format is very useful for college students.

 

Well, I just pulled the trigger on a T61. We'll see how things go. =)

 

I think its a bit unfair to compare the widescreen T61 to the standard screen T60. The T60 can house the larger battery because of the taller screen giving it more vertical room inside.

If you compared it to a 14.1 standard screen T61 then I would understand but its kinda like apples and oranges with wide vs. standard. A fair comparison would be the Z61t since it was Lenovo's first 14.1 widescreen notebook.

From what I understand is that screen size determines the size and placement of batteries in notebooks. The flat screen gives less room in the back for the different battery sizes. It would also explain why only the 4 cell is flush while both the 6 and 7 cell are extended batteries.

Makes me wish Lenovo would copy Dell's Latitude line and put them in the front instead of the back.

 

congrats

what's your ship date

 

Congrats!

Ew. That would kill me, because that is so much uglier....

 

Thanks for the congrats, estimated ship date is 06/21/07.

If prices change between now and then, can I ask for a renewed price?

 

Hmm.... theres two things I don't think that go together.. "Thinkpad and uglier"

In my view I think it makes more sense, more wrist resting room.

 

that doesn't make sense...i'm still showing 9/3 as mine...

and yes, you can..you can get a price adjustment as long as it's before the notebook is shipped.

 

It's very fair to compare the T61 and T60 because it's a choice that currently exists for the consumer. As for batteries, those can and are manufactured in different shapes, so the dimensions of the laptop is no excuse to have the 6-cell sticking out the back of the T61, particularly when the battery is a newly redesigned and different battery from the one in the T60.

The T61 features an enormous frame to the left and the top of the screen. It looks as bad as my thinkpads from the early 1990s.

Fact: The T61 is bigger, and yet the physical size of the screen is smaller. What is lenovo thinking? It's a disgrace in design. This is why legions of longtime thinkpad fans are dismayed at the T61. Just head over to thinkpads.com and see.

 

can i get adjustment if i "borrow'" the spp id?

 

Cool, I didn't know that! I've never liked tablets, but a 1400x1050 12" screen would be great for me I think. I'll go look them up now

I was assigned a tablet once (don't remember the make for sure, but I think it was a thinkpad of some sort) at work and it had a terribly low res screen and was super slow. I turned it back in almost immediately and got a (fairly new and decent) dell (12" notebook of some sort) as a replacement. Anyway, my one experience with a tablet wasn't great, but I suspect it had more to do with the specific tablet I was given than tablets in genera.....


Anyway, what if anything do you give up when going from an X60s to the X60T?