T61p thermal issues?

NOTE: This thread and the above poll are intended to survey T61p owners who put their CPU and GPU under load for extended periods of time (like gamers are known for doing). Please don't respond to the poll if you don't use your T61p for tasks that load the CPU and GPU for reasonably long periods (at least 5 to 10 minutes).

I'm looking at buying a T61p because it looks like the most DX10-compatible gaming performance you can get in a 15" (or 14") laptop for less than $1400. (Except maybe for the Vostro 1500, but the Vostro doesn't have a decent DVI out option, and I much prefer the Thinkpad haptics anyway). Naturally, I don't want to buy a thermal nightmare/pending class-action lawsuit/laptop that the manufacturer must call a "notebook" due to liability issues with setting people's crotches on fire. It seems like there are many owners having problems with it running quite hot, so I have some questions I hope a T61p owner can answer:

1) Is it easy to underclock the GPU and VRAM? I know ATITool makes it easy to underclock ATI GPU's and memory, but is there anything similar out there for the Quadro FX 570M?

2) Is it easy to underclock the CPU and RAM? Does the BIOS offer any settings for that?

3) Would going to a slower CPU (like the T7250 or the T5270) lower the thermal output significantly? I've looked all over, but haven't found any empirical numbers about how much heat these CPUs put out under load. All I know is that Intel started focusing on power efficiency with Merom. I don't know if that means they should run cooler than the older CPUs, though, because they are also increasing the clock speed.

4) Would getting a 5400rpm HD instead of a 7200rpm drive cut heat down significantly?

5) Can anyone recommend any good cooling options/accessories for the T61p? With the heat vents on the side and back, I wonder how much better a targus-style cooling pad would be over any ordinary flat, non-insulating surface.

Btw, I know I seem a little heat-obsessed, but in my opinion, increasing the performance of a CPU by 20% is not a great gain if it also increases the thermal output by 20%, particularly in the mobile market. At some point you have to draw the line and say "this hot and no hotter", and the manufacturers seem to draw that line a good deal higher than I do.

Thanks for any responses!

 

1) Yes, you can use nTune to underclock and overclock the memory and processor of the GPU

2) You can't underclock the RAM. Besides, there no point in that since clock speed in RAM isn't a factor in generating heat. As for the CPU, windows will automatically throttle it for you, underclocking it when appropriate.

3) A higher clock CPU has the ability to be clocked to a lower state, but it's ALWAYS to buy the best CPU you can afford (or need).

4) No

5) Thinkpads for known for their cooling features, so I seriously doubt if you're ever going to need any kind of extra cooling

 

Thanks for your helpful response hehe!

Ah, I should have said "relax the timings" or something to that effect. Any way to do that? Whatever would be appropriate to reduce the temperature of the RAM. Are you sure about clock speed not affecting heat output?

Theoretically, yes, but if the laptop is generating enough heat so as to become unreliable (as some owners seem to be reporting in another thread), then it would make sense to decrease the CPU clock speed. But if speedstep has temperature based throttling, obviously that would be preferable. Do you know if it throttles the CPU when it reaches high temperature, or only when it's not under significant load?

I have a work-provided T43 right now, and I definitely like it a lot, it's one of the main reasons I want to buy myself a Thinkpad. But then again, it has a lower-power CPU and integrated graphics...it's not really pushing any thermal dissipation limits. I had to troubleshoot my friend's Inspiron 1100 for her, so I know how frustrating it is owning a notebook that frequently shuts down due to heat-related instability. Just want to make sure this T61p beast isn't like that...no use buying a laptop that's going to crap out 10 minutes into a TF2 match!

 

The poll has problems as written. My t61p has no apparent thermal issues but I am also not a gamer, so the "thermal issues" question cannot be answered in the absense of specifying certain kinds of loads.

All I can say is that i own a top tier t61p and I don't have thermal issues as I use my machine. There is something else that is true. The t61p is not sold as gaming machine ever. It is a mobile work station configured for business.

 

Very true, I agree. You're right, business applications, even CAD and some engineering apps, would not tend to put the computer under a sustained heavy load. I had actually thought about including poll options that specified whether or not the owner was a gamer, but that would have made the poll way too complicated. I should have worded the poll differently . I doubt I can edit the wording now, but suffice it to say, hopefully people who check this thread understand the poll is intended for people who push the CPU and GPU for extended periods of time. It's obviously not going to have thermal issues for the average business user.

Note: I've edited my first post, hopefully it helps. :/

 

Just to say one more thing. I'm not a business user either. I'm a software developer. Generally, the loads we present are short spikes of heavy loads.

 

A few years back Toshiba dumbed down their BIOS to cover up the thermal issues but I beleive this was on a desktop processor that was used in a notebook. Resulted in a class action lawsuit in which Toshiba paid out. IMO there were other issues with their mobile processor units in which I was an owner but they were not mainstream notebooks so they got away with the BIOS clockdown. I went through three motherboards on that machine.

 

Agreed..its not meant or designed to be a gaming notebook. Having said that because of its specs it can be a capable gaming notebook for a 15.4" and it seems quite a few use it for that. For someone planning to use the T61p for extended gaming sessions I would highly suggest investing in some sort of cooling pad. Due to the vent design on the T61p, I am of the opinion that a passive cooling solution is more suited for the T61p rather than an active cooling pad plus its quieter and doesn't draw any power.

Personally I use an ixoft pad and it works pretty well. The only area that gets sufficiently hot is the top left and when the pad gets too warm I just do the switcherroo - rotate the pad. And if it gets beyond that I have a backup pad

As for HDD I use the Hitachi 200gb 7k200rpm drive and I'm amazed at how cool that runs.

 

The T61P is one of the best 15" gaming laptops though .

 

I would have to agree...the closest competitor would probably be the C90s or the G1s. Not sure I'm a big fan (pun intended) of the huge rear vent on the C90s and its noise. As for the G1s well lets just say it would look really out of place at the office.

 

Also just an fyi...

What about 14" T61p's...
Are these to be included in the survey? Reading the first post It would seem so....but this is a completely different thermal footprint.

Let me know if this is promising for results:
T61p 14" SXGA+ w/ Quadro 570M 128MB
2GB System ram (2x 1gb dimms)
T7700 (2.4Ghz dual core)
running Unreal Tournament 2007 for 45 minutes (nonstop action) on AC power @ 1024x768 + high details at a steady 60fps (vsync enabled).

 

That's an excellent point, jaxx1. Given how I worded the poll, I think we have to include all T61p's, including the 14" models, even though they may skew the results. You're right, they cetainly would seem to have different thermal characteristics. I know they score significantly lower in 3Dmark06 benchmarks, thanks to that reduced 64-bit graphics bus, and I can only imagine that would help reduce thermal output. But then again, the smaller chassis could increase thermal density. Hmmm.... /shrug