Will it last?

For the past few weeks I have been researching and researching which laptop I should get.

At the end of the day I want something good and powerful, but I really want it to last too. I mean, I won't the laptop with the best chance of working with as little hassle as possible for years to come.

Can, Lenovo provide that as a company post IBM? Specifically, I am only looking at the T410 and the T510. Will they be robust and trouble free for years to come?

 

Others will echo that there is always some luck factor in any purchase but what you really have to consider is the overall support structure as well. Thing can go wrong and that is normal. Having a 2-3 year warranty is a great way to insure against those unlucky issues (though over a few years issues do crop up with some regularity).

What other machines are you looking at? Dell Latitude? And why are you only considering the T410 or T510? No T410s? Or even T400s?

What are you needs that necessitate buying the newest gen? Or do you just want powerful just because? An SSD would be more beneficial than the newest generation CPU (battery life increases are not substantial).

 

It's pretty difficult to say for sure if the new models will last because, well, they're new. Ask again in 3 or 4 years and we can give you better info!

 

The reason for the T410 and T510 is price honestly. I can't really go much higher.

The only real other laptops I am looking at are the ASUS UL series. Specifically, the UL80VT-A2 series. I know they aren't really comparable laptops, but what I give up in Lenovo's power I gain in portability. I hear that ASUS is one of the top brands for reliability and the 2 year warranty is really nice. However, the UL's have some horrible flex in the keyboard (like really bad) and the touchpad is terrible.

 

Maybe a better question is, would one expect laptops to last 3-5 years in this day and age? And, which company / model would you feel (in your gut ) would give you the best chance?

 

theres a few strategies to laptops purchases.

Either buy one expensive one and use for a long period. Or buy cheap ones you replacement more often. Good with each. In the past, I have been the former. I am starting to think the latter is a good way to go also.

 

Thinkpads aren't what they used to be, my T400 broke down 6 months after use, they had to change planar board, the hinges are flimsy, there are small cracks in the chassi, the screen is dreadfull.

It's Lenovo, cheap chinese quality at premium price and the T410 is even nastier of what i've read.

It would be one thing if the Lenovo Thinkpads were cheap, but they aren't, they still charge as much as IBM wanted back in the days when it was quality.

I never had these problems with my older IBMs, after Lenovo took over the brand it has been downhill since.

My next notebook will not be Lenovo but will look for alternative and only alternative now for me is Elitebook 8440w or the Macbook Pro.

 

i'm going to disagree with the old "IBM was amazing, Lenovo sucks now" crowd
the Lenovo machines you'll buy today have the advantages of being built with modern techniques and materials regarding build quality
i believe Lenovo makes excellent machines - better than anything else on the market

the IBM thinkpads were not this unfaulted holy grail of build quality
yes, they were great machines, but many had reliability and quality issues

i am of the persuasion that thinkpad quality continues today

 

Yes, I expect my T500 to last me 3-5 years. My experience is very different from Likvid's: the hinges are very solid (can lift the 6+ pound machine by the screen and the chassis will not change position), the laptop feels very solid in pretty much all areas, and my WSXGA+ CCFL screen is fantastic, although it could be a bit brighter.

Not entirely sure where Likvid gets "the T410 is even nastier of what i've read," seeing as there's so few reviews of it yet, and the vast majority I've read have given it good marks (many improvements over the T400).

As for "cheap chinese quality," I'd also point out that while yes, Thinkpads are made in China, they are designed by the same team that designed the IBM Thinkpads back in the day (most of the same head designers as well). And, realize that Macs are made in China as well

 

You based your comment only on one machine, which is hardly fair. You can't generalize based on one machine.

If an IBM thinkpad broke on the first day, while a HP DV range of laptops did not, can we conclude with 100% certainty that HP's DV range laptop has higher longevity than an IBM thinkpad. If that is the case then there wouldn't be a need for statistics.

When Japan started to export its products after WW2, it was known to be of inferior quality by many Americans. But things change hasn't it? For comparison sake, a 200 year old premium Ceramic Vase from China would certainly be more expensive than the equivalent vase from Europe of that same age.

Regarding price, i can assure you that price have came down significantly in many parts of the world. Maybe just not in Europe and some other areas.

Also, depending on how you treat your laptop, the quality would also differ. The hinge on the Lenovo Thinkpads are better than the old IBM Thinkpad hinges. Also there is the internal magnesium rollcage, which were lacking in the T4x thinkpads, which is prone to the detaching gpu syndrome.

You are just prejudiced against certain company due to their country of origin, and your good judgement on certain things are clouded by your prejudice.

 

You've done a decent job elaborating your desire for a powerful, enduring laptop but you haven't specified what it is that you actually need. Value, like power, is relative. Perhaps if you outline your needs folks will be help you navigate the hype to find something of maximum value to you.

The G series is more computer then most people will use. Provided you don't take it in to a mosh pit it will wear well enough to keep many people happy. The fringe benefit is that you aren't married to old tech simply because you spent more then you should have.

Btw, the ul80 is pretty flimsy in my experience, but the smaller models seem sturdy. The switchable graphics models straddle the line between work and play arguably more effectively then any thinkpad will, and they do so for a lot less cash. On a personal note, I'm strongly biased against Asus for their poor qc.

In my case, I like my gear "seasoned" and always try to avoid the "sucker tax".

Best of luck!

 

i inducted a friend to t400 and she's happy with it.
if you'd like to pay a few hundred more, t410s is better than t410.

 

There will always be ignorant and extremely biaised trollers like this.

Most TP owners I know are pretty satisfied with their laptops.

 

from my observation, mac users and thinkpad users have the highest brand loyalty.

 

I know some friends who will buy every mac product there is (except maybe the ipad this time).

I enjoy that thinkpad owners are more critical of their machines and will question lenovo repeatedly.

Of course I am generalizing and it is mostly a different market segment.

 

Well, basically something mildly powerful that I can travel with and has good battery life within $800 USD. But, the problem I am having isn't that they're aren't computers like that, it's that there are far far too many. So, instead I end up focusing on longevity, build quality and customer service. Where do you guys think Lenovo ranks among the other laptop makers? Or instead, which one's should I avoid at all costs?

From my own research, I have found ASUS has sub par build quality, but the best warranty and a good failure rate and in general their laptops run cool and quiet. HP runs hot and loud, has an average build and average failure rate. HP and Dell are about even as I can tell. Acer and Gateway seem like bargain laptops, cheap both in price and make. I don't know much about Lenovo or Toshiba. Apple is just, well... Apple.

 

Yeah...nevertheless, they end up buying Thinkpads regularly... You are absolutely right about the brand loyalty thing for ThinkPad owners. I have met (in flesh and blood) quite a few recently after I bought mine and they swear by their ThinkPad and you know what, having bought one myself after a long haitus, I swear by mine too - though I am the first one to admit that I know next to nothing about it aside from my very limited experience with my machine....

 

Business warranties will always be better for any brand. I always opt for business laptops because the support service is so much better when you need it.

 

ThinkPad's are good in all those parts you mentioned, can i suggest getting a used ThinkPad off eBay in good condition? I picked my fairly well specced T61p off eBay for a lucky $511 USD, in pretty good condition despite the known GPU problem, what do you do on your laptop that you need the most modern power for?

 

Web Development mostly, I know I don't need a ton of power but, I just want to get the best bang for my buck.

 

http://outlet.lenovo.com/ <--- then try this cheap and good.

 

Question. Do you guys feel the extra warranties are worth it? I really like the idea ASUS 2 year warranty.

ThinkPlus 2 Year EasyServ Total for 1 Year EasyServ ThinkPad (+129)

or

ThinkPlus 2 Year Onsite 9x5 Next Business Day Warranty and Maintenance Option (+200)

I really do want it to last AT LEAST 2 years.

 

Yes, I recommend getting 2 years+. Amex and some Visa will add warranty for an additional year (read your cards rewards/info).

I have 3 years on my current x200 + 1 year with amex on top.

 

For the sake for $71, I'd probably go for the on-site. The turnaround time should be much quicker than having to ship it off to a depot for repair. The other benefit is you can wach what the technician is doing. I sprung for the on-site. I would have gone 2 or 3 years but for some reason, only the basic 1 year depot or the 4 year on-site options were available at the time I placed my order, so I went with the 4-year. Probably overkill.

 

You can always upgrade later on the phone.

 

I believe with Apple you can buy the extra AppleCare warranty any time during that first year warranty period, is this true for Lenovo as well?

I am asking this because they have a sale and their warranty price doesn't count against the discount.

 

Yes. However you won't get a sale price on the warranty you will just the "normal" upgrade price. You can do the warranty within the first year.

Accidental protection needs to be upgraded within 30 days.

 

One more question for you guys. I am going to be traveling a lot with this laptop.

Should I get the T410 integrated (less weight, more battery life) or the T510 discrete (more weight, less battery life)?

 

Those two options you list are kind of opposite ends of the spectrum. There's two questions you need to answer:
1) Do you need discrete graphics or can you get by with integrated?
2) do you want 14" 16:10 or 15.6" 16:9 screen?

I'd personally suggest a compromise of the T510 integrated, since you seem to be open to integrated graphics. The T510's extra space and different layout seem to give it better cooling, plus you might enjoy the extra screen real-estate (provided you're okay with the aspect). It would be a bit heavier than the T410 integrated but a bit lighter than the T510 discrete, plus you'd get the smaller lighter cooler-running 65w power brick instead of the 90 (discrete units).

 

Bear in mind too that the discrete graphics options is considered to be fairly lack-luster (compared to other discrete cards on the market), and in most cases not much better than the integrated. Also, the extra screen res of the 15.6" screens (get either HD+ or FHD) would give you more room to work with in web development than the 14.1" screen. Some people complain about the lack of height with the 16:9 screen, but I don't think it's an issue for web development--it's nice having the extra width for your toolbox on the left and solution explorer/properties window on the right while still being able to see entire lines of code/markkup without horizontal scrolling.

 

Thank for the input Mutnat. I see you got the 9 cell battery, my god it is tempting to get at such a small cost, but it protrudes sooooo much.

Do you find it was worth it? Does it still fit into notebook cases/backpacks etc.?

 

I think it's worth it...it really doesn't protrude that much. When I measured, I think it was just over half an inch, around maybe 6/10" that it sticks out. I personally think it's worth it, but if you're likely to be near a power jack the vast majority of the time, then it might not be worth it to you. In terns of fit, I left some measurements and some some info on what would fit at this post on the T510 owner's thread, but in a nutshell: most 15.6" cases won't fit (i think even with the 6-cell battery), but most/all 16" or 17" cases should fit just fine.

 

One thing which may be worth mentioning regarding to 16:9 screen for web development is that due to its "unusual" resolution ratio for computer monitors, your web pages sometimes may not fit very well in others' screens.

Although it looks perfectly fine in your screen, it may need extra scrolling for others...

Just possibilies... I just ordered T510 though.

 

Thank you all for you wonderful responses. I am about to pull the trigger

I just want to make sure everything is all in order. So, what do you guys think of my order? Does everything look ok?

ThinkPad T510 - 1 Year Depot Topseller Warranty
Processor: Intel Core i5-540M Processor (2.53GHz 3MBL3 1066MHz)
Operating system: Genuine Windows 7 Professional 64
Operating system Language: Genuine Windows 7 Professional 64 - English
Display type: 15.6" HD+ AG LED
System graphics: Intel GMA5700MHD, AMT
Total memory: 4 GB PC3-8500 DDR3 (2 DIMM)
Keyboard: US English Keyboard
Pointing device: UltraNavN-FPR for Color Sensor
Camera: Integrated Camera Module 2.0MP
Hard drive: 320GB Hard Disk Drive, 5400rpm
Optical device: DVD Recordable, Ultrabay Enhanced
System expansion slots: Express Card Slot & 5-in-1 CR
Battery: 9cell, LI Battery TWSL
Power cord: 65W AC Adapter; NA, LA, (2pin)
WiFi wireless LAN adapters: Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6200
Language pack: English US Publication

Thanks guys

 

Yep, you're gonna love it!

 

Ok, I pulled the trigger, thanks everyone

Only thing I changed was the harddrive to a 7200rpm one.

I guess I'll have to hang out here more often now

 

YES it will, PERIOD