Going with Linux - Need some assistance

ok, so i downloaded and tried out the Ubuntu LiveCD and have decided to partition my HDD and install the OS. can someone give me a relatively simple run down of how i go about all this so i end up with a smooth and functional OS? i'm having a hard time combining all the info i've collected from various threads regarding this subject matter. and i say simple because i don't want to waste anybody's time since i'm sure a lot of you have done this type of thing before with users like me. feel free to be as wordy as you want

i'm not terribly knowledgable about this stuff but i can follow directions. Linux is still a foreign language to me. and i've never partioned my HDD before. also, i would need to know what kind of stuff i need to install with Ubuntu to give me a Vista like experience. i've read about beryl, WINE, KDE, etc but have no idea what that stuff is.

so if somebody could put me in the right direction, you'll have another Linux user out there. and i'll do my best to spread the word, assuming i have a pleasant experience. thanks

 

If have your hard drive in an arrangement similar to this one:
<Windows (NTFS)> <swap (swap)> <Linux (ext3)>

Then you are good to go (I usually do partitioning with a tried-and-true program like Partition Magic before letting Linux do its thing).

Boot from the CD and open the installer found on the desktop; the GUI based installer is VERY straightforward. Choose to manually edit your partition table when asked, set the linux partition as "root" and the swap as "swap" (duh). The rest is pretty simple. Beryl, KDE, and Wine are applications that can be added once you have Ubuntu up and running.

 

hate to be a pest, but could you be a little more specific? are you saying that i don't need to partition yet until i boot from the ubuntu CD? and then from there i do the partitioning through the ubuntu utility?

i've been doing research about partitioning for Linux but it seems everyone has their own way. i just want a simple way that an average user like me can manage. i just need more details is all. and what is the "swap" partition?

 

All you really need to do with Ubuntu is go into the partition manager (should be in System->Preferences). From there, simply drop your Windows partition down to a size you feel is good for you. The rest of the hard drive should be then referred to as unallocated space. When you go to install Ubuntu, it should have an option of "Use largest continuous free space" (if it doesn't let us know here). It will make all the necessary partitions for you and should install rather effortlessly. The Gnome Partition Editor is pretty easy to understand (just remember that 1GB=1024MB) and use.

Ubuntu has pretty good hardware support, and you can usually see if you have some unrecognized hardware through the LiveCD. If you're using Ubuntu 6.10, you will likely need to install network-manager to get wireless working, so that means you'll need to have a wired internet connection. To get network manager, simply open a terminal (Applications>Accessories>Terminal) and type

Code:

sudo apt-get install network-manager-gnome

and then enter your password (it won't show up as you type it, but it's working, trust me). From there, you may or may not want to install graphics drivers; that really depends on how deep you want to get into Linux. In order to help you there, you'll need to tell us what graphics card you have, and we'll be happy to help. Good luck, and let us know if you need help with anything.

 

Hopefully this thread will help you out. I wrote it for dual-booting Vista and XP (back when I was stupid... yeah don't go with Vista), but you should be able to follow the first three steps about the same. You can download the GParted LiveCD if you would like to, but GParted should be included with Ubuntu (it's just not quite as robust as the LiveCD as far as options). GParted is short for Gnome Partition Editor by the way.

 

cool. thanks for your help. i'll tinker some more with it tonight and probably be back tomorrow with some follow up questions. i just want to get this is all setup and functional so i can get into the tweaking stage, like visuals and whatnot. i'm a big fan of having a sexy GUI so hopefully i can achieve that.

 

well, i installed ubuntu edgy and that all went easily enough. however, i then attempted to install beryl and that whole process is turning me off to the Linux thing. i figured i would be able to follow some online directions but that didn't exactly go the way i thought it would. i never realized i'd actually have to work with all this source code stuff. i wonder why this all has to be such a chore. Vista is starting to look pleasant again, lol

but thanks for your help. maybe i'll give it another try. maybe i have to go back to college, lol.

 

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BinaryDriverHowto/Nvidia This is for nVidia drivers, or if you use ATi, go here.

Then once that's all working flashy like, go here for XGL.

Then finally, here are the instructions for Beryl.

Then, you'll have the prettiest looking desktop on your block, simple! You don't have to touch the source with ubuntu!

 

Try to stick to the Ubuntu forms and Wiki for code info, at least until you get more familiar with things. When I started using Ubuntu I must have screwed up my system using Gedit plenty of times. Some bad info will even cause it not to boot up properly.

Since you are using Edgy, stick with this site if you already haven't done so ..... http://ubuntuguide.org/wiki/Ubuntu_Edgy

P.S ..... For Feisty, I have found this site to be the best guide to installing Beryl http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?p=1875515#post1875515

 

I really urge people to wait until April when Ubuntu 7.04 comes out. The changes are drastic, and installing an OS has never been easier. No messing around with source code at all to get things installed. Installing video drivers is as easy as clicking check boxes and typing a few commands, as is Beryl. It's all very easy.

 

i guess i just feel like i'm getting bits and pieces of information from various sources and trying to fit them altogether. and i could have sworn i installed the nvidia drivers correctly but apparently i didn't. using that terminal thing is just not for me. i would cut and paste what they told me but that would only work half of the time. maybe i need a step by step guide for installing drivers/apps for this thing. the great thing about windows is that if you ever have a problem, you just go into 'help and support' and you'll get your answer 99% of the time. i think i'll just wait for the april release. where should i download that at?

btw, why is it even necessary to use source code and that terminal thing? what's the point of all that? what's wrong with a completely graphical interface? i can guarantee 99% of windows users won't have the desire to tolerate such a method of installing apps on their OS.

edit: i think i might have meant "commands" when speaking of source code. either way, it all seems unnecessary to me after being a windows user for so long.

 

Well, once you get used to the command line, you realize it's a LOT more powerful in many ways than the clicky-clicky way.

But anyway, that's part of the learning process. There's not a cohesive "one way to do everything" like with Windows, but that's part of the benefit, too. What distro are you trying to install? How did you go about installing the nvidia drivers? The most I've had to do was just edit my repositories (can be done from the GUI), update and install the nvidia driver (again, GUI only) and then update the xorg.conf file to use nvidia instead of nv (not sure if there's an automatic way to do this). But I would HIGHLY recommend against just pasting lines into a terminal unless you know what they'll do. It's a great way to hose your machine, such as if someone told you to just paste "rm -fr ~/*" in a command window and run it (don't do it).

 

If you want to attempt the hard way to connect to a wireless access point without using network manager you can do the following in the console. Its been a while since I've used this method so I might accidentally leave something out.

Code:

sudo iwconfig <interface> essid <essid>
sudo iwconfig <interface> enc <wep key>
sudo iwconfig <interface> ap <mac of access point> //get using sudo iwlist scannning

and restart the card using the switch or ejecting and re-inserting it. This information may be completely wrong. Like I said, its been a while and network manager has spoiled me.

 

Yup, and even the Beta version is VERY stable imo. Can't wait until the final release and the Wiki Starter Guide to me completed.

 

Because Linux is not Windows.

Power, flexibility, stability, speed. How many times have I seen explorer.exe crash? Too many to count. How many times has my tty crashed on Ubuntu? Not once.

That's why there are wonderful tools like Synaptic and Add/Remove included in Ubuntu.

I'm sure every switcher would have felt this way at some stage (myself included) but after a period of time, the terminal becomes my safety blanket.

 

don't get me wrong, Linux is still worth trying out even for the longest of Windows users. it's just a learning process some of us weren't expecting, whereas growing up with Windows gradually teaches us without really having to think or try all that much. i'll admit though that after trying out Linux for myself, i can see myself now getting a little annoyed by people telling me that i should switch over from Windows because it sucks and 'Linux rules.' it's a totally different experience, and at this point, Linux is not an experience many care to deal with when they're being taken care of by Windows.

but for a guy like me, i still want to give it a go because i think it might be interesting to do all the tweaking. like i've said several times already, i like the eye-candy and Ubuntu supposedly gives me so many options in that department. but since i like the point and click interface of Windows and don't want to adandon that, i hope Linux is heading in that direction (without compromising its many benefits of course). i think using the terminal and typing commands reminds too many people of DOS and that's a scary thought, lol. i grew up driving an automatic so i have no desire to drive a stick on a daily basis. however, i wouldn't mind owning one of those sport autos in a Mazda RX8. with a little more time, maybe we'll have the best of both worlds with Linux. just don't tell me Windows sucks and i'm missing out by not switching over. it's just not a good comparison at this point. it would be better if a user still had the options of using the terminal and typing commands in Linux but the main focus was on a more user friendly graphical interface. right now, Linux is for the hobbyest and Windows is for the mainstream. you'll find more people driving a Lexus with an automatic transmission versus a manual (in fact, they don't even offer a manual gearbox in some of their models).

 

thanks for the link on the nvidia drivers. that's the only guide that worked for me. after that, i had a problem installing beryl but i might have forgot to install xgl first. not sure if that would cause a problem. but i'm on Vista right now and will be switching over to Ubuntu after i get done writing this and will give it another attempt.

this is all probably gonna be practice anyways since i'll either start over fresh when Ubuntu Feisty is released in april and/or i take my comp back to costco. i have the HP dv6000t and started getting the high pitch noise that's been bugging so many people that own newer laptops. good thing Costco has the 180 day return policy. this thing is driving me crazy even though its a subtle sound.

 

if you're using nVidia, you don't need to install XGL, that's only for ATI cards.

check to see if you've successfully installed the 3d drivers, hit Alt+F2 to open the run program dialog, then type glxgears and hit enter. if you see spinning 3d gears in a window, you're golden.

you can use this guide from the Beryl Project to help you install what you want. http://wiki.beryl-project.org/wiki/Install_Beryl_on_Ubuntu_Edgy_with_nVidia#Adding_Beryl_repository

 

it just doesn't want me to install beryl apparantly. everything else seems to work. i get the spinning gears. nvidia splash screen shows up. i can't seem to add the beryl repository. per the guide, i type in the command sudo echo -e "\n## Beryl repository\ndeb http://ubuntu.beryl-project.org/ edgy main" >> /etc/apt/sources.list and i get "Permission denied." is there something else i need to do? is there another way i can do this? i'm pretty sure i'm following these directions correctly.

 

i'm also getting this when i type in this command: sudo apt-get install beryl

Reading package lists... Done
Building dependency tree
Reading state information... Done
E: Couldn't find package beryl

 

yikes! ok i don't know how i did it but i finally got beryl installed. that's what sucks though, i don't know the exact process that ended up working. anyways, i then installed "emerald themes." then, per the guide, i typed in "beryl-manager" and that's when all hell breaks loose. my desktop is a mess and i can't function with anything. i just have to restart. i can see the beryl effects (eg. wobbly windows), but its all a big mess. i've tried twice now. do you know what i might be doing wrong or what i did wrong?

 

Can you give us a screenshot of this "ugly mess" so we can help you?

 

sure. how would i go about doing that?

and btw, i can't really function at all now because beryl starts up automatically so the "ugly mess" is there from startup. is there a "safe mode" i can boot up (in case i need to)?

 

Are you using XGL? If so, on the login screen, you can choose to boot into normal GNOME.

 

i don't think it's gonna be possible. the thing is all screwed up. how do i just wipe it all off and reinstall the OS? i haven't gotten too far with it and would rather just start over now that i have access to some better guides. i'd have more piece of mind starting with a clean slate.

 

Just run the install program again off the LiveCD.

 

ok, thanks. i'll go ahead and try to do that today and start from scratch. is it possible to actually install the video drivers, beryl, etc (everything leading up to and including beryl) without using the terminal? that's probably what screwed me up. i probably typed in way too many commands because of all the error messages i would get on some of them, haha.

 

Most likely this happened if you edited any config file. I try my hardest to avoid any code with "Gedit" in it. That usaully means you have to Add or Replace somthing. Sometimes you can't avoid it, like if you want sensors.

 

well i don't even have a clue what the source.list thing (or whatever it's called) is all about or how to even use it. assuming i'm given the correct commands and in the right order (if that matters), i can manage that in the terminal. all you have to do really is cut and paste. the only problem with that, however, is that i'm not sure what's really going on. a guy like me can get confused in a hurry when something doesn't go perfectly. i certainly don't want to be reinstalling Ubuntu every other day because i screwed up a command or something else of that nature.

 

Thats what I've been doing... I've got some weird problem where I'll start beryl and it will hang a few short times(blinking the screen), then everything will go well for a while, then it will hang again and I get kicked off the wireless and can't get it back without a restart. If I don't restart I'll get another hang after a short while and then everything locks, no other tty's are accessible or anything. Mouse still works though..

Was thinking of installing one of my other distro's like mepis to see if it is any better.

I don't really see the correlation between my wireless and beryl, but thats how it is

 

I think alot of people's problem with Beryl is they don't know how to use it or set it up.

Did you CRTL+ALT and move your mouse for cube effect? Did you play with Beryl settings which has tons of options? Also If you can't turn Beryl off even after you exit Beryl, simply Log-out and back in. Takes 2 secs, no need to reset.

On Feisty just after I quit Beryl, to quit it for good I just go to desktop effects Press Enable and Press in again ....and off goes Beryl.


I'm just assuming because I got confused myself at first when I installed Beryl.

 

Not sure if you were talking to me, but yes I know all about the options. I was using composite effects before quinnstorm split. I reinstall because something about installing and / or configuring screws with my wireless (which I already said) and even removing beryl doesn't fix it.

 

Was actually referring more towards weiser701. I would have no idea why it would mess with your wireless. Did you try to reinstall wireless driver? If that is easily possible... I'm no expert.

 

It's actually not a big deal because I've been bouncing a few distro's for the last few months just for fun. I still live in XP because the hassle of dual booting to do daily things isn't acceptable for me. Of course at the rate I'm losing interest in games who knows how much longer till I have no reason left for windows.

 

well, i went ahead and reinstalled Ubuntu. i installed the nvidia drivers and i think that all went fine. i can never tell but i do get the nvidia splash screen on startup. my problem is with the repositories it seems. using this guide, i can't get past "adding the appropiate gpg key" in the terminal. i added the third party repositories that were listed in this guide. my problem is:

after typing in the first command, i get: "Cannot write to `[email protected]' (Broken pipe)."

when typing in the second command, i get: "Cannot write to `quinn.key.asc' (Broken pipe)."

this is where i get stuck. honestly, i don't know what else to do. i don't want to do any special editing or anything like that. that's just not to my abilities. i'm pretty sure i'm following the directions exactly. and they don't seem that complicated.

 

Did you add the extra repository from inside the synaptic package manager? You should add the line

Code:

deb http://ubuntu.beryl-project.org/ edgy main 

as a third party repo. Only then will attempting to get the gpg key work.

See here for help with repos.

 

Don't use that guide, it's fairly old...

use this instead..
http://wiki.beryl-project.org/wiki/Install_Beryl_on_Ubuntu

 

btw, i'm also getting these messages when adding the repositories listed:

W: GPG error: http://www.beerorkid.com edgy Release: The following signatures couldn't be verified because the public key is not available: NO_PUBKEY 31A5F97FED8A569E

W: GPG error: http://ubuntu.beryl-project.org edgy Release: The following signatures couldn't be verified because the public key is not available: NO_PUBKEY 3FF0DB166A7476EA

then when i run apt-get update (after inputting "wget -q http://ubuntu.beryl-project.org/[email protected] -O- | sudo apt-key add" for the gpg key") i get these error messages at the end:

W: GPG error: http://ubuntu.beryl-project.org edgy Release: The following signatures couldn't be verified because the public key is not available: NO_PUBKEY 3FF0DB166A7476EA
W: GPG error: http://www.beerorkid.com edgy Release: The following signatures couldn't be verified because the public key is not available: NO_PUBKEY 31A5F97FED8A569E
W: You may want to run apt-get update to correct these problems


i wasn't sure if that could be preventing me from going any further. all i'm doing is cutting and pasting. it can't be something wrong on my end. i wouldn't think anyways.

 

those messages you're getting are just warnings saying that there is no GPG key associated with the repository. You still get the same software, it's just not authenticated. I would remove the beerorkid.com repository.

If you want a GUI way of adding repositories, System>Administration>Software Sources and then the "Third Party" tab will allow you to add custom servers.

Once you've added the repository, you'll need to open the terminal, and paste the following, including the dash at the very end of the line, then hit enter. It'll seem to hang, but it's just waiting for your password, so just type that in and hit enter again. It should finish by saying "OK".

Code:

wget http://ubuntu.beryl-project.org/[email protected] -O- | sudo apt-key add -

Then follow this guide from the point "Updating System", then sections "Installation", "Executing Beryl" "Users of GNOME" and "Restart X11" http://wiki.beryl-project.org/wiki/Install_Beryl_on_Ubuntu_Edgy_with_nVidia#Updating_System

 

ok, the same thing happened again. my desktop is a big mess. i guess ubuntu just doesn't like my computer, haha. i just don't know what to do differently and i'm running out of patience. once i input "beryl-manager" in the terminal, the chaos begins. it's so bad i can't get anything to function so i probably couldn't take a snap shot of it. there must be one step that's not going correctly but i wouldn't know how to diagnose it. could it be the nvidia drivers? since beryl is installing but the graphics are what seem to be screwed up. should i unistall all of the drivers and try reinstalling them? the correct ones, assuming that's the problem.

and fyi, this is the list of drivers i get in synaptic manager ("nvidia-restricted-modules" used as search, per guide):

linux-restricted modules-2.6.1 [non-free linux 2.6.17 modules on 386]
linux-restricted modules-2.6.1;2.6.17.7-10.1 [non-free linux 2.6.17 modules on x86_64 generic]
linux-restricted modules-2.6.1;2.6.17.7-11.2 [non-free linux 2.6.17 modules on 386]
linux-restricted modules-2.6.1;2.6.17.7-11.2 [non-free linux 2.6.17 modules on x86_64 generic]
linux-restricted modules-386 2.6.17.11 [restricted linux modules on 386]
linux-restricted modules-386 2.6.17.11 [obsoleted by: restricted-linux-modules-generic]
linux-restricted modules-comb 2.6.17-11.2 [non-free linux 2.6.17 modules helper script]
linux-restricted modules-gener 2.6.17.11 [restricted linux modules for generic kernels]
linux-restricted modules-k7 [obsoleted by: restricted-linux-modules-generic]

the ones in bold appear to be installed. i can't remember which of those i had to install myself. a few were already installed. are there any others on that list that need to be installed or uninstalled? any NOT on the list? i have an nvidia GeForce Go 7400 card with a T5200 Intel processor inside an HP dv6000t.

 

I would uninstall everything except the helper script and the one for generic kernels.

 

sorry, that didn't work. maybe i need a more complete guide for installing the video drivers. the beryl installation seems to be the most straight forward. every time i reference a guide that i used, someone here tells me it's old or might not be complete. you would think this stuff would be more straight forward and not so sporadic by now.

btw, is there any way to recover ubuntu back to its original installation without actually reinstalling the entire thing?

 

Here's what I would do, since there seems to have been a bunch of changes that are conflicting. Unfortunately, there's no restore type function, so it would be best to reinstall the whole thing so that you have a clean slate.

I would then make sure you have all of the updates by running the update manager from System>Administration>Update Manager.

Next, make sure all of the software repositories are enabled, System>Administration>Software Sources. On the "Ubuntu 6.10" tab, make sure that universe, main, multiverse, and restricted are all checked for use.

Next, install a program called "Gdebi" which makes installing individually downloaded software packages easier, and is important for the next step. Open Synaptic (System>Administration>Synaptic Package Manager) and use the search function to search for gdebi. Mark it for installation and hit the apply button. Exit synaptic.

To install the nVidia driver, I would suggest using Alberto Milone's "Envy" program, which will automate the whole process. You can get it here: http://albertomilone.com/ubuntu/nvidia/scripts/envy_0.9.1-0ubuntu3_all.deb it should download to the desktop, where you can right click and install it (Open with GDebi Package Installer). It should show up in Applications>System Tools (to be honest, that menu item might be hidden by default, if so, right click on the main menu area, and select Edit Menus, and in the window that pops up, the center list [to the left of the buttons] should have System Tools near the bottom of it, make sure it has a check mark.) Run Envy, and tell it to install the nVidia driver. You might need to reboot after this.

Now you can start on Beryl. I think I have covered it pretty well in previous posts, but if you get stuck or aren't sure, STOP, and post a question. It may be frustrating to wait, but it's better than having to start over.

 

thanks BigV. that looks the most promising. i still can't get a grasp on installing the correct video drivers. the guides all seemed so vague for a novice like me. i'm gonna get on that tomorrow. it'll probably be my last effort (if it doesn't work) until Feisty is released next month.

 

ok, i reinstalled ubuntu and followed your guides, BigV. everything seemed to install perfectly. i didn't get any errors with either the nvidia package installer you had me download or the beryl installation. Emerald Theme Manager is showing up in System>Preferences (although it has always showed in previous attempts), but i'm not seeing the "red gem" in the system tray, per the beryl install guide. at least my desktop isn't screwing up anymore when i input "beryl-manager" in the terminal. however, all it does is restart ubuntu (not a complete reboot but like when you do ctrl+alt+backspace). beryl never loads. at least it's something new. you have any suggestions?

EDIT: nevermind, i got the red gem now. i rebooted again and now there it is. i'm gonna go ahead and tinker with it for a little bit and see if i can get it working. however, i'm still not getting anything when i input "beryl-manager" in the terminal

 

yeah....i just can't seem to get beryl running. i can access the beryl settings manager and theme manager but that's about it. is there a guide somewhere that explains what to do after beryl is installed?

 

is the red gem in the notification tray? if so, that's the beryl-manager program. that "restart" you're seeing is probably the window manager switching, it's sort of like when explorer.exe crashes in Windows and the task bar and stuff goes away and comes back, only this time it's intentional.

right click on the gem and point to the "Select Window Manager" entry. It should have Beryl checked off. Also, go to "Select Window Decorator" and make sure emerald is selected.

 

same thing.....right-clicking on the red gem and selecting beryl (as opposed to Gnome) in "select window manager" restarts back to the login screen. i can only get the red gem when i input "beryl-manager" but now that always restarts back to the login screen so i can't even get the red gem anymore. i guess making this thread turned out to be really appropriate for me, haha.

 

Sounds like your drivers may not be installed correctly if beryl crashes Gnome. Or beryl isn't set up right. I've seen some errors on install before, some that took down my X server a while back. I take it that it goes to a black screen, flickers a bit, then starts the login screen? That's what it looks like when X crashes. Check your graphics driver install (AIGLX and the fglrx driver, or nvidia-glx, whatever is necessary for your machine)

 

I'm not quite so familiar with ubuntu as I run Gentoo, but it looks like you need to make sure that you have your Nvidia drivers properly loaded. You can either run 'glxgears' and look at the framerate (should be in the thousands), or try something like:

Code:

$ xdpyinfo | grep -i nv
    NV-CONTROL
    NV-GLX

That's what I get when I run it. Once you get your nvidia drivers installed correctly, just open a shell and run beryl-manager from there. Then you'll at least get an error message about what went wrong; redirect the process' output to a file if necessary, e.g.:

Code:

$ beryl-manager >/tmp/beryl_output.log

Finally, you may want to check Gentoo's Wiki Page. The link is to a non-Gentoo specific part of it about the xorg.conf file. I'm not sure if the debian packages (which *Ubuntu uses) modify your xorg.conf file for you or not - or maybe the *Ubuntu howto answers those types of questions.

p.s. "nano", mentioned on the wiki site, is just a text editor - use whatever you prefer in its place.