Ubuntu on Dell Recovery Partition?

Sorry to keep troubling the Linux thread, but I now have Windows back under my thumb, and having used the Recovery Partition, am now ready to remove it and free up 10GB.

Now, I read somewhere that I can use Windows to delete the Recovery Partition, but to use the disk space, I have to use a third-party app like gparted. Now bear with me here. I was thinking of deleting the partition and merging it with the Windows partition, then resizing it so that the 10GB are available for Ubuntu.

Then I realized that I might be able to just spare myself the trouble. Could I boot Ubuntu, and choose to install it in the space left by the removed Recovery Partition? This way I wouldn't be endangering my Windows partition, would I? Has anyone else done this before? PLEASE HELP ME!

 

If you have your Windows discs, then you don't really need the recovery partition. You could install Ubuntu on it, but make a smaller swap (not the default size). If you are serious about Ubuntu, 10GB may be just far too small.

 

What do you mean by "a smaller swap?" I don't know that term.
For now, I think 10GB will suffice. I won't be using it as a main OS for now.

But it will work? That's good. Do I delete the partition in Windows first, or can I do it all with gparted?

Thanks for your reply!

 

https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SwapFaq
http://linux.about.com/od/ptn_howto/a/hwtptn04t04.htm

 

Thanks, John B! I still think 10GB will be fine for the present. I really just need to familiarize myself with Ubuntu. And that way, by the time I need more space, I'll be comfortable with the process of messing with partitions and whatnot.

 

Take a look on this before giving ur final word on going with 10gb
http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=202740
That was on less than 2 monts after i started my Linux journey.

 

Thanks, Enunes, but I am positive I will still be using Windows after installing Linux. This is my learning period with Linux.

 

you will have full access to your Vista partition if you need more space for data.

 

I went thru a learning phase also (well, I've used it years ago, then quit), but this time around it has taken over my life Keep us posted.

 

Alright. I am now staring at a box that is title "Install." Underneath that, it says "Prepare partitions." Under that we have four "Devices." Above them all, it says "/dev/sda." I want to install on the Dell Recovery Partition (10GB). Which one is it? We have:

/dev/sda1 fat16 /media/sda1 82MB 33MB
/dev/sda2 ntfs /media/sda2 10737MB 3200MB
/dev/sda3 ntfs /media/sda3 66520MB 21500MB
/dev/sda5 fat32 /media/sda5 2683MB 1900MB

I think the one I'm after is the second one. Am I right?
Also, why no sda4?

Alright, assuming that it is the second one, do I need to format it to fat32 or something other than ntfs?

Anyway, if I go "Forward," having selected the second one, I get the error "No root file system is defined. Please correct this from the partitioning menu."

I go to edit the partition, and there are three boxes. The first one has the new partition size, which is atm the whole thing. The second one is entitled "Use as:" and is set at ntfs. (Do I need to change this?) And the third is the "Mount point:" which is set at /media/sda2.

Obviously, this configuration is not working, because of the aforementioned error message.
Down below, there is a helpful blurb about a mount point and swap file. Does that mean I need to set that partition in the edit menu to a swap file size, and that will create two partitions: one swap file and one for installing Ubuntu? Again, does this all need to be FAT32, or part of it, or what?

And do I need to change the mount point any?

PLEASE HELP ME!

 

pixelot -

"Alright, assuming that it is the second one, do I need to format it to fat32 or something other than ntfs?"

We can't have any assuming!

There are lots of threads on the Ubuntu forums that talk about Dell partitioning. Also go into disk management or whatever it's called in vista and look at how Windows identifies the partitions. Windows is more likely to identify the recovery partition correctly.

In your last post, what program were you using to look at the partitions? An Ubuntu LiveCD? If so, reboot with the LiveCD and let the desktop come up. Don't click on "Install".

Plug in a thumb drive and watch it come up on the desktop. Go into System, and click on Gnome Partition Tool or Partitioner. I don't remember the name exactly. Let it bring up a picture of your partitions. Go to Applications, Screenshot. Take a screenshot and save the screenshot to the thumb drive. Take the thumbdrive to a Windows PC and post back with the screenshot attached. We should be able to help you with the sda identification at least.
sda4 is always skipped AFAIK. Has to do with the four primary partition limitation.

I'm pretty sure the recovery partition is either sda1 or sda5. That's because of the fat formatting.

Mount points are confusing at first and almost impossible to explain in this context. I'd need an overhead projector

It sounds like you went into "manual install". I'd suggest identifying beyond all doubt the recovery partition, unformatting it, re-formatting it as ext3, then try installing Ubuntu in the Guided mode. I'm not sure right off the top of my head if it'll recognize the small partition as the "largest free space" or not.
For formatting you can use the Gnome Partitioner on the Ubuntu LiveCD but the GParted LiveCD is more reliable.

 

In the first place, thanks!

But I know that the Recovery Partition is ntfs, and that it is 10.00GB. That's why I think it's the second one. (The other ntfs partition is bigger).

And when I tried the guided install, the partition I wanted was not an option.

Outside of the installer, Ubuntu recognizes the partitions perfectly, with their size and name. (I named the desired partition "UBUNTU" when I formatted it in Windows, to remove the Dell recovery stuff).

You say reformat it as ext3. Does that mean it's name, or format? If just its name, then what format?

 

pixelot -
If you're going to install manually, and you're not going to delete any of the other three partitions, you're going to have to:
1) delete the recovery partition
2) create an extended partition out of the blank space. You'll just have to trust me on this. With three primaries it's simpler to just make an extended partition because you can build several logical partitions inside the extended.
3) the minimal Ubuntu install needs (well, some people don't build a swap but let's not go there) one partition for the entire Linux OS and one swap partition. So you create a small (1GB or less) logical partition inside the extended partition, and format it as linuxswap. The linuxswap option will be in the menu when you go to format it.
4) then, with the remaining space you make another logical partition, and format it as ext3.
5) make a note of how these partitions are labeled - sda6 or sda7 or whatever.

Then you get out of GParted, pop in the LiveCD, and when you get into the partitioner you'll have to mount / to the larger partition and make sure swap goes to the little partition. If you set up the extended partition first Ubuntu may recognize it and let you auto-install to it. You could try creating the extended partition, format the whole thing as ext3, then see if Ubuntu will auto-install. I think it will. I know I've done something very similar at least once.

This is not easy or self-explanatory the first couple of times

I'm writing this from memory, so it won't be perfect. If you have access to broadband go to YouTube and look at some of the GParted shows.

We went hiking in Eagle Cap late last summer. You live in a nice area. It must be snowing like crazy there!

If I get the time in the next couple of days I'll partition a spare drive and take a screenshot so you can at least see what it should look like when done.

Just found this thread
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=685073&highlight=vostro+1400
which indicates that you already have an extended partition. Need to find a couple of threads which specifically discuss how to set up your Vostro 1400.

 

Actually, it's not snowing like crazy. All around us it is.

Thanks. This is very helpful. I'll definitely work with it. Thanks again for all your help.

 

I haven't had time to build a HDD, or look thru my screenshot album. I've taken lots of partitioning screenshots and might be able to find a few that'll help you out. Meanwhile, it'd probly be helpful to search for threads regarding your lappy on the Ubuntu forums - something like "vostro 1400 partition" or similar.

Oh, I forgot - there's also a Linux section on the Dell Forum. That might be a really good place to go and research.
http://www.dellcommunity.com/supportforums/board?board.id=sw_linux

For general Linux partitioning, the GParted website has some partitioning guides but they're not very comprehensive.

 

Ok, I'm close to getting it, I think, but I have one question. How do you create an extended partition?

That's not one of the options for formatting as far as I can see?

 

IIRC, extended partition is part of a logical one - so you probably need to create a big logical partition and have extended ones inside it.

I could be wrong though, someone correct me if I am (=

 

Ok. You guys are going to laugh so hard, but here it goes. I deleted the partition I had formatted as ext3, and so I had my nice 10.00GB chunk of unallocated space.

I then tried to create a new extended partition within it, but the option was grayed out. I read somewhere that this may be a result of the MediaDirect partition being extended, and not being able to have two at the same time.

At any rate, when I couldn't get it to work, I tried to boot back into Windows, but I got two beeps from the comptuter and an error message that no bootable device was found. OH SNAP!!!
I was beyond furious. ARRRGGGHHHH!!!!

So I booted back into Ubuntu on the CD, and opened up GParted, where I changed the label on the Windows partition to 'Boot'. IT WORKED!!!! I'm a genius, I thought.

So I think what happened is the first time when I formatted my partition as ext3 for Ubuntu, it was a primary partition by default, which somehow disabled Windows partition from boot....or something. Who knows? At least it's working now (Windows is, not Ubuntu ).

 

Lolololol.

Linux got owned.

 

How does your hard drive look like? With partition tables and all? Maybe if you posted a screenshot or something we could be able to help you better .

 

I'll try, but I might not get around to it for a while....

 

If you ever got around to burning a GParted LiveCD here's a guide to taking a screenshot -

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=325775

 

I just got a screenshot...Ubuntu makes it so easy!

Here we are:

 

I'd recommend using a Gparted Live CD to make the Ubuntu partition as its faster.

 

But the problem is making the Ubuntu partition.....I still don't know how to do it. When I go to create an extended partition in the unallocated space, it is not an option.

 

Okay, let's get some stuff out of the way first:

IIRC, you cannot make an extended partition before a primary one - in your case, you have the unallocated space block before the primary ~65GB NTFS partition (I'm guessing that's where you have Windows)

What is the stuff inside the extended partition towards the right of your NTFS partition? If you don't need it, you could probably delete that. Hopefully then it will club all the unallocated space together, and move it to the right of the NTFS partition. Once that happens, you can create your extended partition there.

Hope I didn't confuse you with that post (=

 

That's Dell Media Direct, which I would be happy to delete. I'll give it a try, after backing up all my stuff again....

 

Oooh, <noparse>Dell</noparse> Media Direct, eh.

Well tell us how it goes after you delete that. Especially if it clubs stuff together. If not you'll have to shrink your NTFS partiton or something (If that works you can make an NTFS partition with the unallocated space and merge it).

 

So you think I can delete it easily enough?

 

You do know that you can buy laptops with Ubuntu preinstalled from dell and avoid the Microsoft tax, right?

 

Well, its not likely that he knew he wanted to try linux before this, is it?

 

Well, I'd heard that, but never seen the option on the website.....

......but I already have this one, and I want the experience of doing it myself.

 

I don't see why not.

1) Click partition
2) Delete partition
3) ???????
4) Profit!

.

 

I was just wondering if it's harder to delete the MD partition because it's HPA or something like that.....or so I've heard.

 

I don't think so. It shouldn't be =\

I've never used a Dull so I could be wrong

 

K, I got it to work, but I had to delete the logical partition inside the extended first.

Anyway, here's a new screenshot.



So what should I do now?

 

pixelot -
Good job supplying screenshots. That helps a lot!

1) If this all crashes, do you at least have the discs so you can recover a working Windows installation?
2) On the last page, Thomas recommended downloading/burning a GPLCD disc and I agree 100%. It just works better than using the partitioner on a Linux install CD. Use the install CD for taking screenshots if you wish because it's easier, but use GPLCD for actual partitioning. If you're comfortable using the install CD partitioner, go ahead but it may not work for some tasks.
3) Do you know what sda1 does?
4) If not, then maybe leave it alone. If it's unnecessary, I'd get it out of there. If you delete it, GPLCD will either automatically combine with the existing unallocated space or you can do it.
5) What was that extended partition sda4 for?
6) AFAIK the most dangerous task with a GPLCD is moving a Windows partition, so this is "Use at Your Own Risk" time.
If you have recovery discs and can reinstall, you could try the "Resize" command and drag sda3 all the way to the left. GPLCD will try to move the data over so that it populates the left side of the partition.
This may wreck the Windows install. Or Windows may just run scandisk next time you boot and figure things out for itself. I moved vista on my Acer once and it was unbootable. Next time I resized the partition and it worked after running scandisk.
7) If you do step 6 and Windows becomes unbootable, use GPLCD to wipe the entire drive, then create a primary partition at the size you want for vista. Format that partition to NTFS. Put in the #1 vista recovery disc and start the process. vista "may" install to that NTFS partition and leave the rest of the disk alone. Then you could go back in with GPLCD and create an extended partition in the free space, format it as ext3, and install Ubuntu, or just toss the Ubuntu CD in and let it auto-install to the largest free space.

The part I'm nervous about is moving the Windows partition and data. I don't want to talk you into something that ends up being a train wreck. Maybe someone else who has successfully (or unsuccessfully!) moved a Windows partition can join in and say "it worked" or "don't do it!"

That would drive me nuts to leave 10GB unused.

Here are some links. I just googled "can you move windows data with gparted". Better to take a look before doing any of the above...

http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/windows-vista/using-gparted-to-resize-your-windows-vista-partition/
http://blogcritics.org/archives/2007/04/01/095755.php

 

1. I do have the Vista install disks.
2. sda1 is some sort of Windows related partition.
3. I'll leave it alone.
4. How big is the .iso for this GPLCD?
5. Dell MediaDirect. I deleted it.
6-7. Thanks for the info....I'll work on it a little later!

Thanks!

 

It's about 50MBs.

 

Dang there's unallocated space to the left and right. Best bet would be to merge it all together with your Windows drive and shrink it back so that you have space to the right. But like Telkwa said, there's a chance of risking your system. I used Partitionmagic 8 for all my partitioning needs.

 

Oh, so (after backing up my personal stuff), I resize the Windows partition to encompass the unallocated space, and then when I shrink it back, it will group it all to the bottom? Is that right?

 

You first will need to merge that 10GB into your windows partition. After that, you go about resizing it.

 

OK. I just booted the LiveCD, and as I speak (I'm on my mom's computer) the Windows partition is being "grown" to encompass the unallocated space. So if I've got this right, I wait for that to finish, and then shrink it to exclude the amount I want for Ubuntu? Which will then be unallocated space in one chunk, and in the right place? Hopefully?

\\edit

This is taking bloody forever!!

 

Yeah, it should work. Make sure you have unallocated space towards teh end of your disk.

Sorry for all the trouble you have to go through =[

 

It's taking a long time because GPLCD is actually moving the Windows data to the left. When you're just formating or resizing free space GParted is pretty quick. Just for comparison, I'm attaching two screenshots - one of my Acer 5920 with the confusing mess of OEM partitions, then the finished product with vista on the left and Ubuntu on the right.

Reader's digest version - I used GPLCD to resize the original vista partitions and it wouldn't boot. Wiped the drive with a Seagate HDD utility CD. Tried to run the recovery discs; got "type mismatch" error. Used GPLCD to format entire HDD to NTFS. Recovery discs worked. vista reinstalled and working but created one huge partition instead of many like before. Shoved vista to the left with GPLCD. (Coulda done this with vista's own partitioner and probably would try that next time.) Re-booted, vista ran scandisk then worked fine. Back in with GPLCD, created one extended partition and three logical drives for Ubuntu /, /home, and swap. These were formatted to ext3, ext3, and linuxswap. Manual installed Ubuntu.

You could just auto-install Ubuntu once you have free space and format it to ext3. Having a /home partition is just so darn handy it was worth the extra effort to me.

 

Thanks for the help, guys, but my little brother hit something that tried to cancel the operation; a window came up warning that doing so would result in SEVERE filesystem damage. My mom saw that he was messing with the computer, so she shut the lid, which seems to have locked it up. The only way I could get out of it was power off. When I booted back into it, all the unallocated space was lumped together, so I made the Ubuntu partitions. When I tried to boot into Windows with the OS disk and repair the installation, it tried, but after about 10 minutes of trying to boot into a supposedly repaired Windows, I just reinstalled. I just now got my wireless working (I hate Dells driver CD) and am in the process of downloading all the other drivers I need for stuff to work properly.

But after I get all this Windows stuff straightened out, I'll install Ubuntu on those partitions!

 

Glad to know that you're making progress here, pix

 

Second install of Windows. This time wiped partitions. Been having trouble with drivers. I just installed the touchpad driver, and I'm not sure Windows will restart correctly. If you're religious, pray now.

 

Are you selling your brother on eBay?

Man, I'd be furious after all the work you've put into this. Did you wipe the entire drive and make one big NTFS partition, or make a partition for Windows at the left hand side and try to install Windows to just that partition?

If you kept some partitions, make sure that there are enough primary partitions available for Windows. You can't have more than four. That's why I always suggest making an extended partition as a "box" for the Linux partitions.

 

Ok. I got Windows working to the point where it boots up without a BSOD, but I'm going to work on installing those updates.

I also installed Ubuntu! I figured it out. Now I know what that small partition at the top is, it's a Dell Utility partition. I think maybe I'll leave it installed, since I don't know what it does....

But I wish it wouldn't mount to my Ubuntu desktop.

\\edit

So what should I do now that Ubuntu is installed? Any recommendations?

Btw, I tried to turn on the advanced graphics, but it said I needed to enable a driver for my nVidia card, but then said it could not enable it for some reason....has this happened to anyone else? Is it a package I need to install, or do I just need to be connected to the Internet? (I'll try to get a screenshot of it sometime).

Oh, and can I connect to ad-hoc networks with a Windows computer?