Intel-TongFang QC7 (Element/Fusion 15/MAG-15/Vapor 15 Pro)

I forgot to mention this, and everyone needs to pay attention to it. @unclewebb has also mentioned it.

If your laptop vendor releases a new firmware DO NOT FLASH IT if you care about your CPU working correctly. Let some other poor bastards be the crash dummy guinea pigs first before taking a blind leap of faith into the abyss. The latest CPU micro-code is absolutely feces if the information this article is correct. The "security" isn't worth the fallout that might occur, including severe overheating if undervolting no longer works. Personally, I'd much rather be "at risk" than put up with this nonsense. The risk of exploit is extremely low compared to the guarantee of your computer becoming a worthless pile of trash if what this article talks about actually happens.

Protecting your Intel CPU from Plundervolt attacks can ruin your overclock, maybe | PCWorld

@Prema

 

I hope perma releases a bios for this machine. I'll try your suggestions later today mr.fox and get back here with some results

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

 

When you say firmware, do you mean everything including bios updates or just nvidia/Intel drivers?

 

Nope, only bios updates. And even if the Bios don't come with CPU micro-code who will lock out voltage tuning, you risk a lot other screw up. Here is just one example of many http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/xps-15-9570-owners-thread.817008/page-290#post-10975246

And some have to struggle with bios updates pushed by Win Update. Dell is known for doing this through collaboration with Microsoft. This was an ugly attempt to stop increased RMA cost due burning graphics card.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...-owners-lounge.826831/page-1103#post-10911536

 

Just read through everything. I'm a pretty average consumer, and this is the first time that I actually own a laptop that can be reasonably voltage tuned, although I haven't really planned to experiment with any of that. For someone like me, I assume it would be fine to update to bios 58 and then essentially avoid updating ever again?

 

Depends if you care about have latest security patches. Will always come new fixes for security problems. And sometimes with something on top. Aka they screw up other things in the effort add in the fixes. See... Not always the fix you want.

 

@XMG any updates on when laptop will be back in stock ? I've ordered mine beginning of December. Was hoping to get it around Xmas - New Year

 

Everyone reading this thread needs to understand that the latest often ain't the greatest when it comes to drivers and firmware. Drivers are generally a simple fix. You uninstall them and replace them with drivers that aren't messed up. Easy, peasy. However, firmware changes can be permanent. You need to think long and hard about firmware updates and take them very seriously. DO NOT flash anything just because it is recommended by the manufacturer or the vendor/distributor. Never... Ever. Live and die by the rule, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. The cure can be worse than the disease. I'm serious. More and more people are getting their systems effed up by cancer firmware than any time in the history of computers that I can remember.

No, I mean firmware. Used to be BIOS back in the days before EFI/UEFI. Drivers are not firmware, but the sketchy drivers can carry a payload of firmware to sneak filth in behind our backs. But, no... drivers are normally totally harmless most of the time. The drivers you want to trust least are those distributed for automatic distribution to the sheeple by the Redmond Retards for OEMs more than those generic drivers you go looking for manually at Intel/AMD/NVIDIA web sites. Generic drivers with no OEM-specific customizations are usually (not always) less dangerous in terms of firmware changes sneaking in when you're not expecting it. If it is a driver automatically pushed by Micro$lop through Windows Updates, run away, be scared of it, say no and say kiss my butt. Your best interests haven't even crossed their mind, and they never will.

Not sure what BIOS 58 is. If it carries the latest CPU micro-code as part of its payload, I would stay away from it. At least long enough to find out what happens to other people first. Otherwise, you'll possibly find yourself with a laptop that overheats like a volcano, throttles like crazy, and cannot be corrected if the voltage is locked and undervolting is not possible. If you run it with BIOS defaults and cannot undervolt, it's going to be a worthless pile of crap that doesn't work correctly.

 

So funny story, after doing a Windows update last night, turning off my PC and goimg to sleep I woke up to a fault Intel gpu driver that crashes and I am greeted to either a black screen or my desktop showing up but everything looks frozen sounds like fun....

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

 

Hi. Reboot into Safe Mode and use System Restore to roll back. If that doesn't work, try uninstalling the Intel driver. Then disable driver updates from Micro$lop catalog and find an older one from your laptop vendor. Best driver to use is often the first release. They need to put their best foot forward with a new product and stable drivers are an important element in achieving that.

 

Small PSA for everyone who owns this notebook DO NOT let windows update install the intel gpu driver that's
after
26.20.100.6952
and before
26.20.100.7463
just install the latest 26.20.100.7463 and you should be fine.

I didn't even need to boot into safe mode, if you connect the laptop through HDMI or display port you can access everything fine since it loads up the nvidia driver. From there I used Display Driver Uninstaller to get rid of the cancer intel gpu driver that was killing everything and installed the updated one above. After that everything is good now I have to start testing League of legends and see if the latest windows update fixed the studdering, if not ill have to start doing that DEEP analysis.

 

It's the newest bios version that came out on Friday.

The changelog:
• Fixed SSD device information
• Fixed by EC of Battery Power Performance
• Adding BIOS Setup HDD Security.
• Implement AMI PSIRT issue patch.
• Fixed Accidental Wake-up Event from Sleep/Standby (S3)
• Improved compatibility with USB-C/DP Adapters during Reboot and Cold Boot
• Improved compatibility with Thunderbolt Docking stations (new Thunderbolt Firmware and Driver will be supplied shortly)

Is it possible to somehow check if the update contains the cpu microcode? I believe the update came out a few days after the date that the article about plundervolt was written

 

Awesome. Thanks for sharing this great info.

There is a way to check. I am not sure how. Possibly with an AMI/Phoenix BIOS tool that can open the capsule and view all of the contents. I do not know what BIOS the MAG-15 has, but I vaguely remember hearing it is different than other Tongfang models since Intel was involved with the development. I am confident someone like @Prema could look at it and answer if he has time. The vendor (i.e. XMG, Eluktronics, etc.) might be able to answer that as well if it is not clearly disclosed in the release notes. I am not sure that I would have confidence in all vendors to know the answer, but the better ones should be able to answer that question because they really know their stuff.

---

From The ThrottleStop Guide thread...

 

HI all. I consider myself a power-user and pretty savvy when it comes to tweaking, but I think I'm missing some points.

On the first post, Bob has the following:

CPU UV -.125 Core/Cache PL limits to 35w

I can set the undervolt just fine but don't know what "PL limits to 35w" means and where that is entered? I see several places to enter power limits.

Also, Bob makes it a point to not copy and paste the settings he settled on, which I totally get. But, Mr. Fox seems to be saying to apply a blanket setting along with the undervolt, but to be sure to start Throttlestop as soon as you get to the desktop. I'm confused on 2 things here:

1. Should I be applying these values Mr. Fox suggests and
2. Is it not enough to tell Throttlestop to start automagically

Sorry if I'm way out in left field here but again, feel like I'm missing some details. I searched the thread and didn't see anyone posts that seemed to contain the details I'm looking for. But, to be honest, I didn't look through all 132 pages.

Thanks in advance if anyone is willing to educate me!

 

In all honesty, I think I'm going to do a solid for this community and make a wiki page with all this information because I agree 132 pages is a LOT to go through. I believe setting throttlestop at start up using task manager is enough in my experience. As for the power limit you can edit those values through throttlestop in the tpl menu but I believe it's much more of a hassle than it's worth and you are better setting the max boost to 3.4 GHz - 3.7 GHz because in real world senarios the CPU won't pull a lot of wattage if it doesn't need it.

I'm also in the process of going through this laptop's performance with a fine tooth comb as I suspect the new drivers, window update or SOMETHING is lowering the performance and I'm currently in a very heavy duty investigation.

League of legends isn't a demanding title, even on max it can be played on the integrated Intel gpu @ 80 fps easy BUT I still get studdering and inconsistent frame times despite me limiting it with riva statistics tuner. Currently I'm rotating through all the gpu driver versions and seeing what's causing it or maybe it's the bios I just updated to for all I know. I will fill you in when I find out because to me it's SUPER disappointing that my wife's new EVOO 15.6" with 1660 ti is getting 144 fps in league of legends with absolutely no studdering and consistent frame times with stock drivers and Riva statistics server running showing me the frame times.

@XMG there's a way to flash old bios versions right?

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

 

Does the update need to be installed then to check?

I would love a wiki being made for this!

In regards to the stuttering problem, someone on reddit also had it. XMG gave some advice that seemed to have fixed it for them, although it isn't anything too complicated so you may have already done it. Linking it here just in case you want to double check though.

https://www.reddit.com/r/XMG_gg/comments/e9eepd/after_3_days_of_use_with_the_new_xmg_fusion_15

 

Thanks to you Tom and buffalofloyd for the replies and information. After doing some testing it seems to only be happening when I connect it to my 144hz external monitor and 60hz monitor. I'm not sure why it seems to only occur 50% of the time, but it does seems to be similar to what buffalofloyd is experiencing. If it makes any difference, I don't close my lid on my MAG 15 (the screen gets pretty warm when closed) and just have it set to extend to my two monitors with the laptop screen turned off.

 

Let me elaborate a bit so it makes more sense.

First Question:
Every CPU is different, so overclocking limits and voltage requirements will vary. Sometimes you can use the same voltage and get the same results, but it is not uncommon to find a lot of variance between them based on bin quality. That is why copying the settings others use might not produce ideal results. Settings that might be perfectly stable on some CPU samples could be totally unstable and cause problems on others that are inferior bin quality. If you have an extraordinary sample, you might also be leaving performance and thermal headroom on the table by running more voltage than your CPU needs to run optimally. This is why Brother @B0B said what he said, and he is 100% accurate.

Power limits are a different matter. Voltage values are applied. Power limits are just that... limits. The values are not applied like voltage, they merely represent a capped maximum value. You can think of power limits like a governor on an engine. Removing limits (raising them to a value that is greater than the CPU is capable of utilizing) eliminates power cap impediments that hinder performance. I advocate maxing them out rather than trying to figure out how much the CPU is capable of pulling. Doing so is a complete waste of time. Just max out the power limits and focus on voltage optimization. I personally find it stupid that power limits exist, but that's just my opinion. If you are trying to limit power use for maximum battery run time and don't care about performance, or your computer has such a horrible thermal management solution that is has to be crippled to avoid overheating problems, then maybe they have a place. This is why my recommendations are not in conflict with what Brother @B0B said. We are talking about two different types of settings (voltage versus power limits).

Second Question:
For those that do not have cancer firmware that imposes performance hindering power limits, setting ThrottleStop to run as a task at Windows startup is all you need to do. Unfortunately, many laptops are engineered by people that place minimal value or importance on performance. Laptop firmware engineers seem to have a fetish for capping performance and acting like Nazi control freaks. On some systems, ThrottleStop isn't enough to fix their blunders. I advocate immediately launching ThrottleStop (within 1 to 2 seconds of accessing the desktop) based on my experience with the MECH-15. I have a unique unlocked BIOS that Brother @Prema provided to me. I have the power limits set to 2000W in the BIOS. HWiNFO64 confirms the settings and so does ThrottleStop after launching it for the first time and the ThrottleStop.ini adopts the BIOS settings as its own power limit defaults. Something in the firmware overrides the unlocked BIOS power limits and forces PL1 to 70W and PL2 to 85W. These limits are too low for the CPU to avoid power limit throttling under sustained 100% load. However, if I immediately launch ThrottleStop (rather than waiting for the task scheduler to launch it) then ThrottleStop takes control of the registers in the firmware and the EC (my assumption it is the EC... usually is) is unable to impose the 70W/85W power limits once it shakes hands with the OS. It's too late because ThrottleStop has taken control and blocked firmware intervention. This is consistent on the MECH-15. The success may not be the same on the MAG-15 or other systems if the firmware is more aggressive. This success could also be destroyed on the MECH-15 if there is a Nazi firmware update released that kills that capability. That is why I strongly discourage flashing new firmware on a system that is operating to your satisfaction. Your laptop's behavior may no longer be acceptable after flashing, and some of the laptop makers are going full-retard on blocking firmware downgrades. If that happens you're just screwed unless you made a chip dump prior to flashing and can write the old code back to the chip using an SPI programmer.

Hope that makes more sense now. My previous comments were very brief and did not explain the basis for my recommendations.

Edit: Here are two screen shots that I believe will be self-explanatory. This is with my MECH-15G2Rx. Don't know if it will be equally successful in circumventing power caps on the MAG-15 or on other laptops. Each person will have to test it to find out. YMMV.

What would we do without @unclewebb and his masterpiece, ThrottleStop? I shudder to think.

I wouldn't do that unless you can use an SPI programmer to take a chip dump and save it as a BIN file before flashing. If the BIOS update is crap, then you can use the SPI programmer to erase the chip and then force the old firmware back on the chip.

 

So here is the funny thing. I have 2 nvme ssds on my machine with 2 versions of windows 10. The tldr is that I used the other STOCK windows 10 with no updates and there is no studdering! I'm 100% sure that it's related to windows 10 updates. I already am past the freezing issues mentioned by that post. I had the latest version of control center installed along with latest and oldest Nvidia drivers but nothing fixes the issues. Now it seems like it's for SURE NOT THE BIOS and this studder is indeed tied to window update.

Current working version with no studdering
Windows 10 version 1903 build 18362.239
Keep in mind I also had the following running
Throttlestop
Riva statistics tuner

GPU drivers tested
Intel
26.20.100.6952

Nvidia
436.48
441.20

Command center
Version 2.1.0.19

Only updates installed
1. Update for Microsoft Windows (KB4507452)
2. Update for Microsoft Windows (KB4506991)
3. Update for Microsoft Windows (KB4506472)
4. Security Update for Microsoft Windows (KB4509096)

On my wife's EVO 15.6" the current updates are installed with no studdering
1. Update for Microsoft Windows (KB4514359)
2. Update for Microsoft Windows (KB4524147)
3. Security Update for Microsoft Windows (KB4515383)
4. Security Update for Microsoft Windows (KB4497727)

Windows 10 update on 1st SSD with studdering

GPU drivers tested
Intel
26.20.100.6952
26.20.100.7463

Nvidia drivers tested
431.36
436.48
441.20

Updates installed
1. Feature Update to Windows 10 version 1909 via Enablement Package (KB4517245)
2. Update for Microsoft Windows (KB4530684)
3. Update for Microsoft Windows (KB4533002)
4. Security update for Microsoft Windows (KB4524569)
5. Security update for Microsoft Windows (KB4521863)
6. Security update for Microsoft Windows (KB4509096)
7. Security Update for Adobe flash player
8. Update for Microsoft Windows (KB4506472)

I'm going to try rollback the updates on my studdering windows and let you know which is the update that's the culprit.

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

 

Whoa, that's some pretty amazing detective work. Looking forward to reading your conclusions.

 

Newer (and better) answer from @unclewebb in The ThrottleStop Guide thread.

 

So it appears I have reached a roadblock. So after uninstalling all the updates starting with KB453 and most of the KB452 I have more performance with the latest nvidia driver BUT I still get the occasional studder. Now I have 1 more KB4524570 update to uninstall BUT when I try to uninstall I get an error message saying "An error has occured. Not all of the updates were successfully uninstalled." and I have a hunch that THIS is the update that gave me the studdering. If anyone has any experience with uninstalling windows updates let me know what I can do to get rid of this particular update. I know for a fact that I FOR SURE have more performance on my nvidia card now than I did before.

My testing for league of legends is as follows
1. Make a custom game with 2 full teams of bots
2. Start the game (I usually get 144 fps here no problem)
3. Go to lane and wait for minions to show up in lane (since lane minions adds load to either GPU and the effects too)

when I went to lane, my FPS would tank to 120 FPS before rolling back and now I get 144 FPS no problem with riva statistics tuner running and showing me consistent frame times BUT I still get an occasional hiccup of studder that I wasn't getting on my stock windows install on my other NVME drive. I don't know if the updates only hurt direct X 9 games or all games in general but I know at least for league of legends case, there for sure IS a difference.

I'm going to keep trying to rollback a little further as I feel like this is the last update I need to get rid of before I don't have the studdering issue anymore.

Edit: The update that I want to uninstall in question is KB4524570

 

What is your system memory utilization when the stuttering occurs? If you use HWiNFO64 to output important data to your screen instead of MSI Afterburner, you can see more useful information, including how much system memory is being used. Perhaps you are running out of system memory and the system is using virtual memory to an excessive degree?

I could not find much by Google-searching, but noticed this post that might be relevant to KB4524570.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Windows10/comments/dyedsq/anyone_else_have_a_memory_leak_issue_with/

 

Memory usage looks fine. Problem is I know there are a lot of bugs in this build of windows and I'm having a hard time finding out what I am missing to install in order to uninstall the update. I have the CBS.log file and I've been trying to track down what's missing but it claims whatever it is, is already installed. Need to find a way to maybe repair or reinstall the updates. Worst comes to worse I'll have to nuke my drive a re-install windows from scratch (hope I don't lose the pro license I paid for through windows store) because I really can't stand that annoying studder, it gives me a headache just playing league.

 

Thanks for the clarifications, Mr. Fox. I *think* I have everything set up correctly and it appears to be working. However, I don't have the PL1 and PL2 Power Limits displayed on my HWInfo sensors tab. I even tried the same version you're using in the screenshot and those 2 entries are missing. I do, however, see a PL4 that has the 1023 setting. Not sure, maybe it's a coincidence?

EDIT: I do see CPU Power Limit 1 & 2 that say Power=unlimited. Is that showing that my configuration is working. That the CPU has

 

Definitely do that and these forums are the right place for details like that.

I never had plans to go into great detail on software like this. Too many people making mistakes.

 

Cool. It looks like you do have that set up right. Nice job.

The PL1 and PL2 sensors in HWiNFO64 comes and goes. As best I can tell, if HWiNFO64 loads before ThrottleStop the sensors will appear. If ThrottleStop loads first, they disappear. Try making a shortcut to HWiNFO64 on your task bar. As soon as you get to the desktop upon login, click that first. Wait about one second, then immediately launch ThrottleStop. Then look for the PL1 and PL2 sensors.

Yeah, Windoze OS X is the buggiest pile of crap OS since Windows ME, LOL. No doubt, 1903 and 1909 are the worst ever, and Lord knows how messed up the next version is going to be. I have absolutely no hope or expectation that Micro$loth is ever going to do Windows 10 the right way and expect it to continue on the path of worsening with every major version update.

You may end up having to nuke it and start over. Look at your activation status. If you have signed in with a Micro$lop account and it shows that you are activated with a digital license you should not even need to enter a product key. When you sign it using your M$ creds it should activate automatically. I would still enter the W10 Pro product key during setup if you have it.

 

Ladies and gentlemen I have finally resolved the studdering issue. The solution is to literally NOT update windows.

the latest update I have is KB4507453.
windows 10 version 1903 (Build 18362.239)

I'm gonna disable windows update and never update again! XD

In all seriousness, I'm going to make a recovery of this image as it is as I have gained some performance vs the updated windows 10 and I no longer have that annoying studder! Maybe when I get brave again I'll try to update and report back here if the update breaks anything.

@XMG you guys should look into how the window updates are affecting performance on these machines and maybe setup a bulletin on reddit possibly. I mean it might have just been me and maybe this studder might only have been noticeable in league of legends. I might start testing cod another day and see if I gained any performance.

Yup, I nuked it and I had my microsoft account linked to my W10 pro so I'm good and setup. This has been a great learning experience for me and it's the reason I bought my 2nd nvme drive to install linux next when the official linux support comes out next month. I only plan to use windows for games and linux for everything else!

So now I'm noticing another issue. Not sure if this is windows update again, a driver or what but while I use my touch pad it occasionally stops working. It's like if I draw a circle on the touchpad it'll follow the circle half the time and the other half the cursor just stops working. Any ideas what could be causing this? @XMG

So checking Throttlestop I see PowerCut option is greyed out and says "locked out" I assume that means the latest bios has locked me out of something? Not sure if this is important and I'm not sure if I can rollback the bios. Although rollback might mean theoretically worse battery life too...

 

Yup, that has been my solution starting around 2010. After Windows 7 SP1 I very seldom installed updates and I only allow those I want. If stability and performance are the most important things, it's the only way to fly. Most of the added "features" they roll out on Windoze OS X are utterly worthless garbage that is only appealing to people that would be better served sticking to an Android phone or a Chromebook rather than a PC.

Do you have any USB devices connected? I avoid using touchpads and almost never use them on my laptops. I have noticed on my MECH-15 that having a powered USB hub connected with numerous USB devices plugged in causes similar behavior with my wired mouse. It is like there is something polling the USB ports and the cursor hangs at regular intervals, and the lighting on the mouse turns on and off momentarily. If I connect the mouse directly to a USB port and not the hub that behavior goes away.

 

I have my mouse's wireless dongle connected along with a cooling pad connected through usb.... Might be the cause because I have never noticed that behavior before when I was using my laptop on battery power. Might not be an issue for me then since I always usually use a wireless mouse when I'm connected to power and the cooling pad. I only use the touchpad when I'm coding on the go or watching some youtube videos.

I'm super interested in making a heatsink mod for this laptop. I feel like the heatsink design chosen for this chassis isn't really up to snuff. I don't think the pipes actually have any liquid in them or anything otherwise I'd imagine the heat would be moving much faster to the fans. I hate the fact they decided to share the GPU heat pipes with the CPU.

 

Would there be any reason to leave windows update on? Wouldn't a computer eventually be vulnerable to various security problems without the updates?

 

I mean I believe you can technically manually look up security updates and avoid feature updates entirely (because those are honestly the ones that breaks stuff).

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

 

Oh, I assumed that if you applied one update all the previous stuff (including features) would come along as well. Any idea how often one should check for/install those updates?

And when you fixed your stuttering issue, you mentioned that you nuked windows or something along those lines. Did you mean that you just did factory reset or reinstall windows? Or something else?

 

Re installed Windows from the USB iso with stock windows. Factory reset didn't work for me because I had some missing system files but it might work for others. Sometimes it's just better to start fresh and get everything right the first time.

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

 

Unified heat sink design is super stupid and inferior, but it is status quo for the industry. In fact, inadequate thermal management is status quo for the industry. Nobody make a truly great laptop any more. The concept of excellence has gone the way of the dodo bird. The only laptop that had a cooling system that was worth a damn in recent history is the mighty Clevo P870 with the massive vapor chamber, and now it is an EOL product. The people that design and manufacture laptops are idiots and they are overly influenced by the idiots that demand the thinnest and lightest garbage they can get their hands on.

Yes. But, if you ride a bicycle, drive a car, ride on trains, fly on planes, cross the street at a busy intersection, shave using a razor blade or run with scissors you're going to eventually have some kind of mishap, and you're vulnerable every time you do any of those things. We will never be safe until we die and move on to eternal life in paradise, behind the Pearly Gates.

 

XMG/Schenker/Bestware aftersales is bad. It took these guys literally three weeks to just create a simple service order for a set of screws. I called bestware three weeks ago over the phone and the guy told me he made the service order and it would arrive in 2-3 weeks. Hmm no no no, it took him 3 weeks to even make the order.

I feel kinda dumb paying 150 Eur extra for PREMIUM warranty. I hope that my laptop isn't going to fail on me. I like their claim, we guarantee a repair within 48 hours of receipt, yet they fail to ship out a set of screws.

 

If you want good screws at a good price, go to http://laptopscrews.com/ and order stainless steel panhead screws. Their silver color clashes with some people's aesthetic preference, but you can always dob a bit of matte black paint on the head of them with a small paint brush if it bothers you. The original screws used in laptops are rubbish (all brands) that unavoidably sustain damage to their heads because they are made of metal that is too soft to be durable. The original screws aren't worth the cost of the postage to ship them to you. With the stainless steel panhead screws you can feel the difference in quality and hardness of the metal from the very instant you insert the tip of the philips screwdriver onto the head of the screw. I liken it to the difference in feel to grasping a metal or glass flask versus a disposable plastic cup.

 

Where can I find the screw? I don't know what type they are

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

 

Are there any markings next to the holes where they go? Sometimes you can find the size stamped or embossed on surfaces adjacent to the screw holes. There are most commonly two diameters used and the length and diameter can be measured with a metric ruler or caliper. Most are M2 or M2.5 diameter. The smaller screws like used for WiFi and M.2 cards are M2 (2mm) and the larger diameter like used in chassis screws are generally M2.5 (2.5mm). You can find useful info here: https://www.laptopscrews.com/FAQ.htm

Just don't buy the crappy OEM wafer head screws. Those are the same rubbish you need to replace.

Edit... here's what I recently ordered for the MECH-15. Same as what I always ordered to replace the crappy stock screws on my Clevo laptops.

 

I didn't see any markings on the bottom plate. Not sure if @XMG can answer

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

 

Just go to a hardware store, Harbor Freight, or even Walmart and grab a good metal metric ruler and measure them. The markings on the ruler should be in mm. Or, if you have a precision caliper that will work even better. Harbor Freight has precision metric rulers and calipers pretty cheap. So does Amazon. Digital calipers will let you switch between SAE and metric with the push of a button.

Your laptop probably has only M2 and M2.5 in the areas you would normally service for cleaning or thermal paste/pads. The extra tiny screws Clevo used for years on their GPU heat sinks that stripped out the first time you tried to remove them are M1.5 if memory serves me correctly. Most OEMs only use that small M1.5 size to attach things like power button switches. You'll be able to easily determine what size you need if you measure them. If fact, if you measure the largest diameter and see that it's M2.5 you can probably tell the M2 and M1.5 just by looking at them at that point. The length is measured from the underside of the head that makes contact with the part you are putting the screw into to the tip of the screw.

 

This a great site, thank you for the recommendation. So, panhead for the Mag-15 huh? Done... thank you!

 

@eddi3x3x3 Sorry if you've said this, but I was finding it a bit hard to follow what you had done exactly.

The Windows "image" that you are reporting as working, was that an original windows image that came with the laptop? Or was that a fresh install of Win10 1903?

I've had issues with Windows 10 before, resulting in random freezing and crashing (not with these laptops) and the ONLY fix was to do a clean install of Win10 1903 with a vanilla image made from Microsoft's media creation tool and then manualling install drivers. Is this what you did?

Just asking as that's what my plan was when/if I order one of these laptops. Also on that note, does anyone know if somewhere in Brisbane, Australia which sells these? I know aftershock have a building in Melbourne, but I won't be going there any time soon. Wouldn't mind some in person hands on before pulling the trigger.

 

Yup that is exactly what I did, used an image straight from Microsoft

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

 

When you buy one, see if they will sell it to you for less with no OS. Then you can get Windoze (product key) super cheap from Kinguin.net or eBay.

Maybe if you call or email Aftershock they can tell you if there is someone in Brisbane that sells them. Or, maybe they have a customer that bought one who is in Brisbane that would be willing to show theirs off for you.

 

Have been playing a few games and have encountered sudden stuttering when the action gets heavy - I assume this is because I hit the thermal limits and the system was getting throttled to not exceed the temperature limitation, so I understand the earlier posts hoping new BIOSes raise the thermal limits now (game stuttering when the action is heavy is exactly how you lose games...).

Am messing about with ThrottleStop to see if lowering the voltage can reduce temps a bit - can I check with you guys, what sort of undervolting have you been able to achieve? I find that I can go about -100mV for CPU and cache with no problems, but I definitely cannot do -125mV (system will freeze/crash/spontaneously reboot).

 

I cap the CPU frequency at 3.4 GHz to 3.8 GHz and set speedshift to 64 or 128 depending on the game. I'm working on doing some research on a heatsink mod to further reduce temps.

It's like this machine has all the performance we want but it's locked behind thermal constraints

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

 

Anyone happen to know why I would be getting significantly slower wifi speeds with this computer compared to all my other deices? I'm getting about half the speeds that I usually do.

Edit: Spotify seemed to be the problem, listening to music from it seems to absolutely destroy my wifi speeds for some reason. Any ideas if that's fixable?

 

Does anyone have a skin alternative to dbrand? I have concerns of the laptop scratching.

Also, for anyone interested in buying the MAG 15 dbrand skins, their palmrest skin has the logo cutout at the top left hand corner of the keyboard. They don't offer any no logo cut out options. It's deceptive that their images don't show the full palmrest skin, so I'm returning mine.

 

If it makes any difference, I don't use a skin and I'm pretty ruthless with my laptop. I've had it for almost 3 months now and so far it's completely scratch-free. The magnesium alloy seems like it scratches easily but whenever I see a scratch, it's very easily wiped off. No actual scratches in the material so far.