Tongfang Models 2021

Whelp; back home. Tomorrow I'll go get my new lappie; it's been cooling it's heels since Saturday.

 

It took a while to remember you can't clone an encrypted drive; turning off bitlocker got me moving again. Who knows, might even get a game installed today...

Initial impressions are favorable: The keyboard is good, the pad is well below best in class but it's not horrid, no dead pixels or major bleed, relatively clean windows installation.

Sideways would be that I didn't expect it to be much snappier clicking about windows and it isn't. I know this is largely based on drive speed and windows is much slower than the slowest SSD but I still was hoping to see more. Not logical but there you have it.

Unfavorable would be the speakers: These are right down there with the worst I've heard. I've got an ultra-portable that's half this size and it has significantly better sound. I rate them as failing to meet a minimum bar particularly in a 17" laptop. I use external speakers or headphones so it's not a hard stop for me but for anyone that expected to use them regularly; I'd give this one a pass.

 

OK, I did some extensive testing. My new MAX-15 is way too hot, cpu is 50 degree idle, and it stays at 96 degree while gaming. 96 degree with fan at maximum. GPU idle at 41 degree but stays at 85 degree while gaming. There is no way this is sustainable in long term, the air from vent smells burn as well. I am afraid something might melt if I game too much.

Does anyone else have the same experience?

 

You're throttling across the board with those temps but I imagine you know that; I'd get in contact with them.

 

OK, did some digging, someone in the Italian PCS forum posted a solution. I think the default setting use way too much cpu power. Anyway, if anyone is interested. Here is the guy's solution to control temp. (you will need to Google Translate if you don't speak Italian)

https://www.pcspecialist.it/forums/threads/valeon-17.80707/page-2#post-605676

 

Which performance mode?
Which paste?

Try undervolting.

 

A few other things about the Prometheus that may be of interest for prospective buyers:

The fans have been reported as loud by some, not bad at all by others. I'm going to go with the latter, I've had much louder fans. The Arorus I'm putting out to pasture for example has fans that perceptually are half again louder. A Clevo I had with a desktop CPU and SLI sounded like a vacuum cleaner locked in mortal combat with another vacuum cleaner. Way louder. I had an MSI laptop that wasn't unusually loud but it had a horrid high-pitched screech to it that penetrated headphones and annoyed the crap out of anyone in the room including myself. I actually sold that thing and bought another; the fans won. I don't own what loud is so I'll leave it by saying that there are louder laptops.

Laptops generally had bigger bezels when I purchased the laptop I'm retiring; when I first pulled this thing out of the box I had a brief moment where I wondered if it was a 15" screen. Yeah, I know there is no such Prometheus but next to the old one it it's about 3/4" less from side to side and it threw me off for a second. I've already become accustomed to it but I would guess some folks might have a whoa moment when they first pull it out of the wrapper if they're coming from something a few years older.

On my Aorus they sacrificed a drive and put the SD slot on PCI-e, obviously not drive speeds coming from that but it was significantly faster than what I get from the one on this lappy. The USB-C isn't terrible for file transfer; I'm seeing about 375 to 400ish coming across as I migrate data from my old laptop with a portable SSD. No substitute for lightning though... Not sure anyone cares about transferring from physical media anymore but I still do it.

When I was taking the back off to install the second drive I clipped off part of the LED on the left outboard side. This happened while taking off the small plastic triangle covering the LED lights at the rear which need to come off to get the back off. If you're going to be getting into one of these take them off by using your guitar pick or whatever you use at the center inboard side to avoid damaging them. From there it's just a standard run around the edge with the guitar pick and prying with fingernails and the back comes right off.

 

I was seeing temps in the 50s just installing software and loading backups which had me concerned. It turned out that was unwarranted; the Prometheus is running upper 80s on the CPU and mid 70s on the GPU in cyberpunk. That's at 150 watts, boost disabled, in QHD, with everything high or ultra including DLSS, max fans, beast mode, stock clocks. I didn't set up an overlay yet so I didn't catch the frames but it's quite smooth, I’m guessing 50ish. The fans went up to 100 on their own so max fans were redundant but I had them on anyway as I'm running a custom profile so it would be hard to compare with others. I'd have to reiterate two things here: To my ears the fans are not bothersome and that includes in gaming. The speakers are junk, there is no way to be charitable towards them; utter crap.

 

Thanks for sharing. There's clearly something wrong with my gpu temps. Cyberpunk really taxes the gpu and I can only force temps below 85°C (!) by

• Lowering wattage to 115 :-(
• Undervolting (although clocks are limited to around 1550mhz anyway)
• Fps cap at 60fps
• Keeping the cpu side cool (which has good temps below 80°C thanks to 4.3ghz all core, undervolt and LM).

For some reason rtss doesn't display my fps so I will do some gaming tests later this week. Dgpu on does make a tangible difference when gaming.

 

Ull need thx audio for better sound most likely.

 

I used the default settings in Cyberpunk; gonna try fiddling with it when I get a chance. Haven't got into afterburner and It's a bummer that you can't undervolt the mobile AMD chips. Need to get some testing and adjustment done but life is getting in my way!

 

My speakers sound great but they have their own DAC and bypass all processing; haven't tried my headphones yet. The laptop speakers sound better with THX disabled which puts them into stereo mode. This jibes with the general consensus on Reddit. By better we're talking terrible instead of really terrible.

All the "pro" reviewers panned the speakers, as do most on Reddit. I used to buy a laptop or two per year; I maintain a gaming rig and an ultra-portable. This changed in the last couple years: Nowadays my lightweight is good enough and when the 20 series came out my 1080 GTX was still pulling great frames in the games I played; couldn't see throwing money at it.

This is not to say I'm an expert but I've been through some laptops and it's been a while since I've heard speakers this bad; in 2021 they are below par. It wasn't hyperbole when I said my phone sounds better, it does, there is no good spin that can be put on the Prometheus speakers.

 

Ok, got riva up: In Cyberpunk I saw a high of 77 on the GPU with the temp usually sitting around 74-75. My frames are a little lower than what I've seen on Reddit but I have more candy turned on than most of them. In any event the average seems to hover around the low to mid fifties with a few excursions down into the upper 40s and up to the lower 60s. Both are unusually consistent compared to my Aorus which had the 1080 desktop and whatever the top of the line cpu was back then; it was more reactive with higher spikes and lower dips. The places I saw the lowest numbers where while driving in a crowded area and inside the car. All that is at QHD, DLSS ultra, high or ultra settings, full screen, and with the lappie muxxed, 150 watts, max fans, no overclock.

 

Very good temps! No Afterburner? Overboost or Performance/Game/Enthusiast mode?

 

I'm beast mode, custom fans, mux, 150 watts boost disabled, those are full time, gaming or not. I haven't changed the clocks in CC or with Afterburner. Not sure I'm going to fiddle with it much, temps are good and performance is excellent; I am tempted to see if Afterburner can net better temps. The way the laptop controls power you really don't need the modes unless you're going to go unplugged because the fans usually don't run anyways when futzing about in windows and it pulls power on demand. I'm 100% plugged in so I can set and forget. I was worried because about getting unlucky and having an issue because there were a fair few on Reddit reporting them. Seemed I dodged the random issue bullet, temps haven't been a problem anyone was reporting with the Prometheus so I was probably ok there.

 

Awesome temps for Beast/Overboost mode!

 

Went a bit over 12 in timespy with a gpu temp average of 68; this with everything set as above, a little push on the core and mem, default in timespy settings. Timespy can be tricky when guessing how far you might go from the first run but I'm guessing I'd possibly end up around mid 12s with some screwing around. I don't think it would go much higher but might top out lower. For now I don't have much incentive; the temps are under control and it chews through games with ease. I would venture that if some brave folks figure out a vbios swap and I could throw 165 at it, I'd try it. I think the chassis might be able to take it.

 

If your games play smoothly already, why risk a vbios swap? I use Timespy for a bench of my system compared to similar systems to know whether I'm doing alright, but I never understood the drive to get the most Timespy points at all costs - especially because 3dmark is not the best gauge for long-term gaming performance.

 

I did say after other brave souls figured it out. You could translate that as braver than I and should probably throw smarter in there as well. In any event so long as I have a known road map flashing a vbios isn't any more worrisome than any other bios flash.

Getting the highest number? Played that game a long time ago when we were using words like "Pentium" but I'm out of it now and don't keep current beyond the basics. If you remember the early days you recall going into the bios to change multipliers and freqs with great result; Intel was having stellar yields and substantial gains were possible with CPUs sometimes being massively under binned. I have the same feeling now as I did then; there is more and it's free pizza, but the bad man has put it just out of reach.

It sounds like we use Timespy or other benchmark software in much the same way; for me it's mostly a diagnostic tool to get the best performance versus thermals. Once I'm past initial setup I'm usually done with them unless I feel like the lappy has lost a step and I want to verify I'm still where I was.

 

I've done some testing at lower power settings over the last few days and find that in GPU intense games the Prometheus can gain a nice thermal reduction by leaving the GPU at 150 but taking it down a notch on the CPU. In Cyberpunk this brings GPU temps down to 70ish on average with lows in the upper 60s and peaks in the lower 70s. A nice drop that comes at little loss in frame rate, I'd say maybe 3 or 4 fps gone missing when observing the counter. While a keener eye might discern a difference I don't notice it being any less smooth in game.

I'm thinking there isn't enough of us to have a dedicated model thread, that's why I keep posting observations here. Maybe that will change as the year goes on...

Edit: I decided to run timespy in the lower CPU power setup and I hit at 11,712; a drop of about 500.

 

Running my intel at all-core 4.3ghz at 45w is sufficient to feed the gpu at qhd and reduces temps below 80°C even in demanding games.

 

It's a bummer that I can't undervolt. I've had mixed results with it but it would have been nice to be able to try.

 

I'm going to have to revise my statement about there not being enough traffic to keep a dedicated device thread going: There isn't enough traffic to keep a thread going for all the devices!

 

Some additional info for the control center for tongfang 2021:

It seems control center is not linked to any specific vendor, you can use any control center designed for 2021 tongfang laptops. I have a SlimBook Titan ( GM5ZG7W) and can use either the standar control center or the eluktronics one (I haven't tried XMG). both work perfectly.

Control center versions

I do have the following installers:

3.0.34.0 (standar version that came for my slimbook, no branding)
3.9.31.0 (XMG)
3.9.32.0 (XMG)
3.23.26.0 (Eluktronics)

looking at the application versions it seems the nomenclature is:

MainVersion.Vendor.vendorVersion.VendorSubversion

so:

0 no branding
9 XMG
23 Eluktronics

VendorVersion its not global, standar 34 is older than 32 from XMG (19/05/2021 vs 01/06/2021), so you can't do apples to apples with the version.

Control center functionality

Part of the available options seems to be custom tailored per vendor. Eluktronics do have GPU and memory clock sliders, but XMG does not. On the other hand XMG has NVidia whisper it its last version, not available for Eluktronics at the moment. Standar does not have any of these.
It looks like XMG does not want to give full GPU control to the end user (or pay for it), while Eluktronics does.

Even the language support is different, Standar supports EN,JP,ZH while XMG has EN,DE and Eluktronics EN,ES. as the language support its just a Json file, I'm almost sure you can use files for any version, the file itself is just a dictionary

Maybe additional functionality in the control center must be paid by the vendor, so every vendor decides what they want, this applies to branding of the app as well.

I've been trying to get the control center from PCSpecialist, as they have another clone called IONICO, but I haven't found a way to donwload it. It might be interesting to get it and see what they offer in their control center and compare.

 

Eluktronics will up the TGP to 165W (150W + 15W boost) on the 3080M with a BIOS and Control Center update.

 

So will any reseller btw, xmg included.
Not sure why anyone would want this since pulling max watts already throws warnings into cc regarding temperatures.

 

Not on the Prometheus, I can run Cyberpunk for hours at 150 and I'm sitting just under or over 70. I'm pretty sure it'll take more although I can't prove it until I have it.

 

He

70 what gpu? At full cpu and gpu, full settings? What about cpu?

 

Yeah, the GPU, CPU runs higher, usually the upper single digits as I run it but that depends on where you leave the power. Crank the CPU power up and it can go about 10ish more than the GPU but I don't: In games you can put the CPU at 50 and still flood the GPU at 150. On the other hand if I crank everything in beast it will push the Cyberpunk temps mid to upper 70s (GPU) and that's where you see the larger delta with the CPU but I don't bother; it only produces a couple more frames. It does push the timespy up 500 or so depending on how many sliders you move to the right. I'm pretty sure I can leave the CPU at about 50 and take some of that 165, maybe all of it. I also wouldn't be surprised if I could pull a little more power from the CPU and still keep the GPU fed, it would take some testing I haven't done to determine that but first I'd have to have a reason to bother; like that 165 watts. Right now the thermals are non issues with headroom still remaining and this is all happening while it's sitting directly on a desk with no ventilation in a 75 degree room. If they bring that 165 I'm going to try it, I'm curious myself.

Edit... I just went over to reddit and saw the post there, I had thought what was mentioned above was a guess, evidently not. Yep, I'm going to be all over that 165.

 

Are you able to post copies of your standard one for posterity?

I have a copy of ControlCenter_3.1.22.0_STD (Infinity) (31/03/2021) - https://mega.nz/file/WAoAUIYR#Ym-un2HBHW-uqUSpvSo3Ej5t-aH-F5t6OWOZOdDhI9o
This has:

• GPU and Memory clock sliders
• Unlocked TGP/Dynamic boost disable
• Whispermode
• Battery capacity limiting (note, I've been hesitant to actually test it since I saw previously people had issues permanently locking batteries to lower capacities)

Cons:

• No project aurora support
• Somewhat buggy tgp selection when > 125w and changing modes (also shows 150w for a 3070. Doesnt actually do anything > 140w though)
  
• Keyboard colour selection in user mode occasionally doesn't re-init correctly after being asleep, meaning a few keys may be the wrong colour/unlit

So from a feature perspective, this seems the most complete, despite being the oldest.

I extracted the installers, and unfortunately the feature sets provided appear to be baked into the code itself, no config files I can see appear to define what features are/are not available (based on diffing this version and an eluktronics version).
I've also attempted a decompile of GamingCenter3_Cross.dll which appears to contain the majority of functionality (it's the biggest thing), however no luck, it doesn't work with standard c# inspection tools, and that's all I really have experience with.

What I really want is a TGP increase on the 3070, since both 3070 and 3080 are GA104 but I don't think Nvidia would be too fond of that (Also per ALU the 3070 wattage is higher at 140w than the 3080 at 165 so maybe not even possible)

 

I thought project aurora support came from their own software, not in the control center

https://github.com/antonpup/Aurora/releases/tag/v0.8.1

TGP selection in Eluktronics version is shown correctly at 140W max when dynamic boost is disabled, corrected bug?

It would be great if we can found the "official" standar repository from tongfang, probably they keep there the latest version of unbranded control center with fixes and functionality.

I'll post the standar version once @ home

 

Standar control center

https://mega.nz/file/RJQXSSaT#UIc7JIl48KTtVQN0PrBRcz20ZUmc_Auwyvr7wb-lszU

 

After playing a little bit with the control center I have a configuration thaty makes the laptop to fly in games

Basically I cut the power on the CPU (5900HX) 20w SPL, 25w SPPt and 30w fPPT and gave full power to the GPU (140w) + some overclock (+100 core + 350 RAM).



Doing an Assasins creed valhalla benchmark (ultra + 1080p) I get 73-78 fps consistently, CPU never goes over 82º and GPU under 80º. I'd say the CPU its the main factor for the cooling of the laptop, if it is controlled with the SPL/sPPT/fPPT it allows the GPU to reach higher clocks keeping the temperature.



GPU-Z sensors indicate GPU clock is between 1920 and 2030 all the time with power cuts when it reaches 140w.



Looking into results in some online bechmarks, these values are quite close to a desktop 3070, what is quite surprising.



A quick TFLOP calculation gives me back almost 20 TFLOPS (1950 * 2 * 5120), what seems to be insane for a laptop 3070... Am I missing something or this is a beast for gaming if tweaked?

 

I been saying it; cut back the CPU and you lose a lot of heat and can still feed the graphics with QHD gaming. Looking forward to upgrading mine but I'm already a couple weeks wait time as they're doing it with Team Viewer. This to try and prevent people using it elsewhere, they could have just published the new BIOS.

 

Keep in mind Ampere TFLOPS are inflated and not comparable to previous gens since Nvidia is factoring in the hybrid FP32/INT8 cores in their calculation, which doubles the TFLOPS on paper.

 

Dont you get throttled at 75 target temp (gpu)?

 

Never mind Found my answer on my own, thanks.

 

Yea, notebook review seems kinda dead these days.

 

Could somebody with a GM5ZG7Y or GM5ZG7W let me know what their DPC latency is.

 

Echo... Echo... Echo...

 

Anyone knows if we have a non XMG laptop (similar tongfang model) can we use the bios update they have just released?

https://old.reddit.com/r/XMG_gg/comments/oadli2/release_bios_update_for_xmg_neo_early_2021_with/

It seems XMG gets more updates than other resellers from Tongfang.

Looking into the base of my laptop, the model states GM5ZG7W, based on https://laptops.miraheze.org/wiki/Tongfang

G Category : Gaming
M generation: M
5 display size, 5 for 15" and 7 for 17"
Z CPU Ce Zanne
G GPU type: RTX 3xxx
7 GPU model , 3070
W chassis ( https://blog.lovemadoka.xyz:444/26.html)


I have donwloaded the NEO 15 ones and they look quite generic:

EC file names include GMxZG , that seems to mean any display (5 for 15" or 7 for 17") + any GPU (7 for 3070 or 8 for 3080) buty for ryzen 5xxx only

BIOS file name GM5ZGx , that seems to be for ryzen 5xxx + display 15" + any GPU

oemsevtool files are specific per model: GM5ZG7W, GM5ZG8W, GM7ZG7S, GM7ZG8S

ti "looks" like the bios,EC and oemsevtools might be valid for any compatible model following the nomenclatures, the only thing might be some branding in the oemsevtools. These files contains the specific XMG model in the name, so logos, etc might be there.

 

@albertopm I have the Eluktronics max 15 5900 3080 but I’m out right now when I get back I’ll look up my chassis model and then check out the firmware update. Hope it’s compatible… interested in a full bore 3080…

~Koog

 

@albertopm I just checked and by my calculation the Eluktronics MAX-15 5900HX 3080 has a Tong Fang model number of GM5ZG8Y although this isn't mentioned on the base or in the bios screens.

So I think I cannot try this firmware because the chassis is different but I would love the same for this chassis.

Sorry.

 

Maybe you can conact Eluktronics, I see someone have 165W on their MAX-15.

From reddit - "Just today, I opened and started using my Max-15, which was ordered and mid-May and shipped and delivered over a week ago. In the control center, however, not only does the tgp bar go past 135 with dynamic boost off, but it goes past 150, all the way up to 165. Does this mean that the update has already been installed on my device? or a mistaken mech-15 version has? or something else?
Is it safe to use at those levels?"

https://www.reddit.com/r/eluktronics/comments/nqws1d/eluktronics_rtx_3080_more_power/

 

hi guys, does anyone know how the nvidia rtx card is managed through the typec / thinderbolt / dport port to an external dport monitor? ? on my old laptop I had the rtx enabled immediately on the typec and I saw it from the active nvidia control panel, while on my new tongfang by connecting the monitor on the type c, I do not see all the active nvidia control panel

 

I confirm that the intel 11th does not allow the direct use of the dgpu towards the external monitor through the combo typec / tb4 port, as the tb4 is managed by the intel chip so the graphics part passes all the way out from the intel igpu. no gsync on external monitor, the only graphic output direct from the dgpu to an external monitor remains the hdmi port

 

anyone got any know anything about the new intel 11th gen tracer v.

https://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/Tracer-V-Edge-I17E-550

looks exactly the same as the max17. will it be able to use the control center?

 

@Kevin (and others with the MAX-15 5900HX 3080 or GM5ZG8Y)....

You're a star... mine apparently already shipped with that feature enabled... 165W here we go...I've the liquid metal paste and the AMD 7nm so I'm probabluy optimal on the hw side will be largely based on the title now... CPU vs GPU use, world density etc...

The trick was to turn off dynamic boost, then the Configurable TGP Tagret slider widens up to 165W...




Control center is v 3.23.26.0
BIOS: N.1.18ELU05


~Happy Koog

 

很高興聽見！享受您強大的筆記本電腦！

 

Hello, can you please help me.
I need the current EC and BIOS for the model GM7ZG7P.

The reason is that I took the update from xmg and there is the model GM7ZG7M. Although they are the same in terms of structure, I also checked. The keyboard layout is different and I haven't compared that.

Otherwise the notebook runs without any problems and there were slight errors beforehand. Which was also the reason why I looked for an update.

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