CF-29 SSDs: Is it possible to get around IDE bottleneck?

I've got a CF-29 MK5, and for the last few hours I've been coming up empty trying to find a way to get a high performing SSD into it. With the IDE controller, it seems like the only option is paying way too much for an older SLC IDE SSD with limited disc space. Which doesn't make much sense to me, since the SSD would be 'slow' in comparison to a newer, faster SATA SSD.

I (think) my CF-29 has a PCI-e slot in it where I could put a SATA PCIe SSD, but I don't know if that would work. The SATA PCI SSDs are advertised as 'plug n play', but maybe that's only the case if you've got an SATA controller in the first place? Would getting a PCIe SSD would circumvent the IDE issue?

Basically, how do I get an SATA ssd into my CF-29, and still see the drive's full performance?

Is the 29's IDE mobo a bottleneck that is impossible to get around?

Is it possible to do something like install a PCI SATA card http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6614202&postcount=3?

Do something with a card like this http://www.amazon.com/SD-SATA2-4IR-...LTK/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1286052558&sr=8-4?

 

There is an adapter for ide to sata, its on ebay it works. It just requires a bit of modification.

 

I don't think you will find a pci-e slot on the cf-29 , other than the mark 5 wwan sled

Even if it did, the chances of being able to boot to it are 0

I think there is a couple of members here that choose a pata ssd drive and are happy with the performance

And a few that have used a sata to ide adapter , not really a good fit though

The majority have chosen the 7200rpm hitachi or the 5400rpm Samsung drives


Alex

 

I sometimes question the reasoning behind trying to "super speed" a reasonably fast "intelligent brick" like the Toughbook CF-29.

Want a "gamer" Toughbook? Go for an i7-equipped CF-31.

 

I'm one of those members, and I posted some of my positive experiences with it. It certainly makes for a more responsive system.

Another option is a 1.8" ZIF drive and then get an adapter to convert to 2.5" IDE. I've used the Addonics adapter with success. This can give you a few more choices than just the dwindling 2.5" PATA drives.

You have to watch what you getting, as newer isn't necessarily better. An Mtron SLC SSD in a CF-18 gets a better Primary Hard Disk score in the Windows Experience Index (5.9) than a new mid-range desktop computer a friend built with an SATA MLC SSD (5.1).

I don't know much about them as a company, and I have never used any of their products, but RunCore still includes 2.5" PATA IDE Solid State Drives in its product line. While these MLC drives are currently available in capacities up to 256 GB, the performance is less than that of earlier Mtron models.

 

Mtron is one of the first companies that made ssd drives
They were top of the performance charts when they came out
I have a 16gb slc sata Mtron in my spare cf-19 caddy
Expensive when purchased, as was my Samsung slc ssd drives









Alex

 

I don't play games on the toughbook (though the previous owner had Disney games and Sims 2 installed when I got it). I'm looking at this from a long term investment standpoint. I don't want to buy a PATA ssd because PATA is on the way out I think. I would rather heavily invest in a SATA ssd and get an adaptor for it now so I could remove it from the Toughbook and put on a newer machine years from now and still be happy.

Guess it's not possible to see the full performance out of the SATA ssd but so be it. Question is should the new ssd be SLC or MLC. I saw a post by Les(?) recently around here saying that the newer MLCs don't have as many disadvantages vs SLCs

 

Its a toss up

In a few years the cost will be down, and the capacity up on the sata ssd drives

However if you go with an inexpensive sata ssd and adapt it to work it should be reliable and fast






Alex

 

-Adapter - Amazon.com: Addonics ADSAIDE SATA to IDE-ATAPI Converter: Electronics
-SSD - Amazon.com: ADATA 128 GB S599 Sandforce 2.5-Inch SATA II 3.0Gb/s Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) AS599S-128GM-C (Black): Electronics

Think it'll fit the 29?

 

I like your ssd choice
It uses the Sandforce controller ,which is highly rated

Not sure on the Adapter
Here's another listing for it
SATA laptop adapter 2.5" IDE Panasonic TOUGHBOOK CF-29 - eBay (item 260666946111 end time Oct-19-10 20:23:49 PDT)






Alex

 

I love AmazonPrime but if the ebay one is what works I'll go with it

 

They might be the same

That seller looks like he knows Toughbooks , and his prices are not out of line , unlike some others on ebay







Alex

 

I am glad you like my pricing Tomcat, yeah I have worked on a "few" toughbooks in my time I am "techtough" on eBay,

frustration at trying to find toughbook parts at a reasonable price led me to start the eBay business since I figured I was not alone.

Later boys

 

well techstuff I will give it a shot hopefully it works with my 500GB sata

 

Are you talking about using this adapter with a ssd ? or did I miss something here. Why I asked is someone on here about 2-3 months did this......well tried to but would not boot, would not show up in the BIOS at all.

 

@ toughasnails

Could you find the post
Sata hard drive and SSD should have the same pinouts so if thats the case, its issues in the bios




Alex

 

I will try but having a problem with the search, it always worked great for me but nothing now. Been this way since they did the changes.

Oops! This link appears broken.
DNS error occurred. Server cannot be found.

 

Slightly OT but does anyone know if I can I (or should) replace the HDD (HITACHI TRAVELSTAR 5K250 HTS542525K9SA00 250GB 5400RPM 8MB SATA-150 2.5" HARD DRIVE) on my CF-W7 with a SSD & if so which would be a good choice? TIA.

 

For now use the search tool in my signature
Just click on it, and type a space after the .com, then your search query and it will limit the search to NBR

The normal NBR search is currently disabled for normal members
( Moderators still have it though )

If you are using the default vBulletin style ,the google tool bar is shown, unfortunately it does not work

I added the search tool to my resource thread sticky as it works better than the old search tools



Alex

 

Keep this in mind:

Parallel ATA [PATA] Personal Computer cable Bus: used for Hard drives, Floppy and CD drives. Top bus speed is 133MBytes/sec over an 18 inch Parallel cable.

PC Card isn't any better at data transfer rate of 132MBps [synchronous burst-transfer orientation].

Seems like a lot of work, considering the only slightly better 150MBps transfer rate for the Serial ATA Bus.

 

Found it ....This was one of the post I was talking out http://forum.notebookreview.com/panasonic/503103-problem-ssd-cooldrive-ide-sata-adapter.html

 

That's an oxymoron. Normal Toughbook addicts

 

@ deere245

Oops....I messed that up
I typed out too many words and did make it clear

The NBR search is currently disabled for unusual members





Alex

 

I was thinking about installing PCLinuxOS on the SSD, that or W7. I'm hoping the other OP was having trouble because he had an MK3 model, older SSD, and used XP.

Has anyone on these forums successfully installed an SATA SSD on a CF-29 before?

 

Aye, I have... then moved it to a CF-19...
It ran pretty well on my Corsair P128.

 

am wondering if anyone has tried this with like a couple 32 gig cf cards for a solid state HD
eBay - New & used electronics, cars, apparel, collectibles, sporting goods & more at low prices
Extreme CF Compact Flash Card 32GB 60MB/s - eBay (item 220676438102 end time Oct-29-10 16:30:36 PDT)

 

@ bladerunner12345
The first link adapter is for a desktop interface

Things might be different now but

I looked before at adapting a CF card and use it like a hard drive but found that the cf cards transfer speed to be too slow


Alex

 

I believe fastest optimal transfer rates for CF now are around 90mb/s / UDMA 6 (Sandisk Extreme Pro & the like http://www.electronista.com/articles/10/09/28/kingston.outs.ultimate.600x.with.90mbps.speeds.

 

@ cyrilng

Its been a couple of years since I looked at this idea , and I see things have changed

However the best bang for the buck is a Samsung hard drive
http://forum.notebookreview.com/har...worlds-fastest-ata-ide-mobile-hard-drive.html
If a you have money to burn an ide interface SSD will work great but the cost of that flash card @ $270.00 is a bit much



Alex

 

Alex,

Agree & thanks for the link but the HDD on my CF-W7 is SATA I think.

 

It is

And you will have a lot of great SSD choices in that format , at fair prices
I used a Samsung 64GB slc SSD in my F-8 , and use Samsung slc SSD's in my cf-19 and cf-30


Alex

 

Tomcat,
I was thinking more along the lines of reliability and low power consumption than speed for the cf card setup, but what is the transfer speed of a stock HD for a toughbook? I cannot find a side by side comparison, or the terminology is different somehow.
You also stated that the connection would be different, anyone know if an IDE cable plugs into the motherboard? or is it also a special plug there too?

 

@ bladerunner12345

The CF-29 cable terminates to a IDE standard 44-pin Female
The link you provided was for a 40 pin desktop connector



Alex

 

I had used a cf adapter in a fujitsu point 1600 tablet. worked really well (well it increased performance, but it was a p166 mmx with 192mb ram). I was using a sandisk III 2gb cf card. i dunno how it would compare in a toughbook, but I'm interested in it as well. I'm waiting for 32 and 64gb cf cards to drop a bit more first...

 

So Core Team,
How did the adapter/ssd set up work for you? how did you go about connecting it to your cf-29? Did you try to fit it into your stock cf-29 caddy? I tried to put a regular 5400rpm sata in the caddy with an adapter and it was extreme tight even after removing the foam off the back of the caddy and the metal angle bractet off the front. I had to put some plastic tape to insulate the adapter from shorting out on the caddy frame. with all that done.. I installed it into the cf-29 and fired up the machine and for some reason it would not reconize the hard drive. So I'm back to the 160gb samsung IDE/Pata hhd. I would like to put a 128gb samsung ssd but will settle for a 64gb ssd if need be. I to don't want to pay a boat load of money for the old school Pata SSD when I could get twice the size gb in a SATA SSD. It seams that most of the SSD's are quite small if you remove them from there casing. At least from the pics that I have seen. The other idea that I was thinking was to for-go the caddy and remove the back of the computer to install the HHD using the stock ribbon connector with an adapter in the same compartment and make some type of foam mount to hold the hhd in place. I understand that by doing it this way, I will not be able to easly remove the HHD like the stock caddy set up.
All imput is welcome

 

Reason being it was not done right. I had the same problem as you but about an hour or 2 later I finally got it. I ended up taking it out and put a Samsung 160GB in it. It runs just as fast as a 7200 rpm drive and if I drop it I know its still going to work. I bumped my 29 once when I had the adapter in it and bang......blue screen. Next day I pulled it.

Panasonic spent a lot of time and money testing these caddys for a reason, if it was dropped or what ever it would still work . There was a fleabay seller doing this a couple years ago but he is not around any more

Yes you could say that...about 14-18 screws, hope you get it right the first time

 

Thanks for your reply...
have you tried your cf-29 with a SSD. I'm really courious to find out how they do with a SSD. I have been holding back on purchasing one becouse of the cost of the Pata/IDE units. It kills me that they are twice the price of Sata units. I currently have 2 cf-29's in use and really would like to speed up the boot time. I'm one that doesn't like to keep my computer on 24/7.

 

Myself I never tried it but was looking into them but the price was very high. I ended up putting a SSD into my CF-30 instead...28 second boot time . I know there is a few members that have upgraded there 29's to SSD but not sure who and what kind of boot time they got. Your best bet would be to start a new topic/thread on this and hope a few members will join in.

 

Would you have to use the heater with an SSD and also would you have to defrag it as a HHD

 

If you need to know anything about SSD's check out the link in my sig. Great bunch of guys that know ssd's inside and out.

 

Worth noting there's a Renice E7 Series 2.5" PATA SSD Solid State Drive using Eastwho EWS720 controller now available:

Can refer to http://forum.notebookreview.com/sol...e-ews720-zif-ssd-user-review.html#post6952134 for performance data. The ZIF unit is architecturally the same as the IDE unit but presented in a different form factor.

The 2.5" PATA form factor avoids any need for additional ZIF-to-PATA or SATA-to-PATA adapters. Renice also apply conformal coating to the SSD's onboard ICs to give extra protection against environmental factors. These features making it a good SSD to consider for 2.5" PATA equipped Toughbooks.

 

I wish I had found this post sooner. It would have been easier than what I just did. I made a SATA SS HDD fit in a caddy. It works, and very well but it would have been nice to just plug and play for about the same price.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/pan...cooldrive-ide-sata-adapter-3.html#post7618173