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    Fingerprint Reader Mod on a CF-18?

    Discussion in 'Panasonic' started by rcx, Aug 24, 2009.

  1. rcx

    rcx Notebook Consultant

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    Has anyone successfully modded a CF-18 to add a fingerprint reader? I've seen the page for the CF-19 OEM fingerprint reader install, but of course the CF-18 doesn't have that reader-ready spot in the front like the CF-19.

    I've tried searching for some devices that look like they might have the potential for hacking down
    - http://www.silexamerica.com/products/biometrics/
    - http://www.silexamerica.com/products/biometrics/combo_mini.html
    - http://www.digitalpersona.com/index.php?id=embedded_hardware [a smaller version is available if you order enough units]
    - http://www.google.com/products/cata...nt+reader&cid=12848950824545085531&sa=title#p
    - http://www.google.com/products/cata...nt+reader&cid=11947146169454878558&sa=title#p

    Silex has a PCMCIA fingerprint reader with a retractable sensor, but I think opening and closing the PCMCIA door would get old fast. From an outside view, while there are blank areas on the front (to the right of the power switch), side (OEM GPS antenna location), and rear (where the serial port is located on a touchscreen version), all would require some degree of modification. In looking at the unit from the inside, the only location that looks even close to feasible is the GPS antenna spot.

    Anyway, just wondering if someone has ever attempted this....


    Thank you,
    Matthew
     
  2. ohlip

    ohlip Toughbook Modder

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    Maybe below the lcd area opposite to stylus holder but you need to sealed all the side of it upon installation and to make it moisture free reader. You also need to drill a slot for the sensor. It is only my own suggestion. It is still up to you anyway.


    ohlip
     
  3. Toughbook

    Toughbook Drop and Give Me 20!

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    My Father-In-Law gave me like 10 of the Dell fingerprint readers because I was going to mod them into the CF-28 and tie it in to the internal USB... The PCB was about .25" too long to mount where I wanted to.... I still have all the readers though. If you have specs where you want to mount it and have taken it apart to know where it will be and what space you will have... Let me know and I'll check. I want to say that the PCB was around .75" X 2" or something around there. I'll work you a deal if you want one...
     
  4. rcx

    rcx Notebook Consultant

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    Interesting suggestions...I guess I would need to find out how much space is available in the area below the display on the side opposite the stylus holder. There does seem to be a space of almost .75" x 2" in the back near the audio jacks, but it might be just a shade too small. Both of those areas, though, would appear to be too small for the digitalPersona 4500 High-Durability standard size model.


    Thank you,
    Matthew
     
  5. K1SFD

    K1SFD Notebook Enthusiast

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    Hey all,
    As far as the readers themselves, I found some on eBay for $10 including the top cover off of an HP mini laptop. eBay 270419374979 . I also got 2 Lightscribe DL DVD drives (330341729378) for $20 each. :D He didn't have anymore listed, but he has over 3,900 parts that I went through page by page. Found a LOT of good stuff for $10 and under. Get a look at him. User ID ibuyselllaptops and he's in MA, fairly close to me. If I remember right, the specs I found said they were .7" by 1.5" but don't quote me. He also has the 'Mini' cameras and assemblies.

    Beau
     
  6. mnementh

    mnementh Crusty Ol' TinkerDwagon

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    I guess my question would be... why BOTHER?

    I've had two laptops with built-in fingerprint readers; at best they are poor security, and at worst they are simply infuriating.

    You still have a password associated with that fingerprint profile and you still have the option of using it, so traditional means of password hacking still apply and fingerprint readers are notoriously easy to trick; it has been done with scotch tape and superglue as well as some ingenious photocopier manipulation.

    Add to this the poor implementation of the technology makes it a nuisance rather than a convenience; every time you use the scanner, it's like a crap shoot... Will it read right this time? "Oh noes! Pass too fast, Pass too short, *BLINK-BLINK-BLINK-W.T.F.?!?* Your fingerprint did not include a center region, YOU SUCK!"

    I can type my password just as fast and it always works; this technology really only exists to help sell new laptops to pointy-haired bosses who want "the James Bond thing". It isn't well-implemented at this point; you might say that's because it's an infant technology, but it really isn't true. Retinal-scanning technology has been in use since the '60s, and the photocopier was developed from research originally begun to find a way to mechanically reproduce and cross-reference fingerprints.

    No, it's poorly implemented for the same reason as dozens of other kinds of computer widgets out there; they needed to get it to market so they could capitalize on it, and these were the cheapest designs that worked just well enough to sell to an unsuspecting public.

    mnem
    Suckage comes in degrees...
     
  7. K1SFD

    K1SFD Notebook Enthusiast

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    hmmmmmm...Retinal sanning Toughbook.....heheeheeh I think I feel a week of obsession coming on :GEEK:

    I could fit it next to the Toughbook logo on the CF-18...Scanner on one side, Camera on the other... hmmmm :radar:

    I actually have a high end fingerprint scanner on my desktop for my encrypted files ONLY. It is a full fingerprint scanner, and reads infrared body heat at the same time it scans. It needs a 5 point match (better than some NCIC matches) at it's lowest setting and goes up to a 10 point match. It takes a minimum of 10 'test' scans to train (15+ reccomended) and will only allow it to be turned on if you have at least 3 seperate fingers on file. The scanner has an override with a password, but it stores it using AES encryption inside the program, if you choose to use it (It warns you some 10 times to use it). BTW - unless you ARE james bond, you DON'T NEED this kind of security. I found this at a HAMfest (Auction for HAMs) for $20 (Over $250 new right now). This is ONLY for my encrypted files on my home computer. The REASON that I have this is because I have a LOT of personal information on that computer. I have helped write SOPs and Town Pre-plans for Fire/Emergency Management. As well as the Database and front-end prorgram for the Phone Numbers to ALL residents in town (Listed or not) as well as any limitations/physical disabilities that would require assistance in an evacuation (we are 10 nautical miles from a nuclear power station). I also have the State Point of Dispensing Protocols, etc... I protect this data at ALL costs. If I can't scan or make it past the password, the files are useless. I have it set so that at 10 mis-attempts it locks for 24 hours. 5 times of this, and the system shreds the files (Electronically). I can't for the life of me remember the name of it right now, but if anyone is interested I can take a look for it. (It may take a few days as I am in the process of re-arranging my workspace and my Desktop is a little buried :swoon: )

    Anyway, just had to add my $0.02... and yes I agree 99% of the scanners are USELESS, but I have a friend who asked if I could mod one into an 18 (Like thier is a TON of room after he wantes me to add GPS, BT2.1+EDR, a HAM TNC, and Fingerprint scanner) hmmm... a CF-18 with all of that you say?? He did say he's willing to loose the PCMCIA, which opens up the USB connection on the PCMCIA connectors, but we'll have to see... Can you say EXPENSIVE mod!?!?!?!?!?

    SO, I do keep meaning to ask, what's the best bit to cut through the Magnesium Alloy case??? I have a few Diamond bits, but they are DAMN expensive. :eek2:

    Beau
     
  8. mnementh

    mnementh Crusty Ol' TinkerDwagon

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    Yeah, but the weak spot is STILL the OS and its related hardware; if you have access to the scanner, you have physical access to the machine. Once that's accomplished it's nearly all over; in 8 minutes a good hacker can have a Forensic quality copy of your HDD to decrypt as his leisure, plus have YOU buggered as all git out...

    mnem
    Failure is NOT an option - it comes BUNDLED IN YOUR SOFTWARE!
     
  9. K1SFD

    K1SFD Notebook Enthusiast

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    :swoon:
    VERY true... Hahahaha Most people only think about electronic access to a computer by a hacker, not physical access. I will say that the reason that I have chosen to use AES is because of the strength of the encryption. It's not impossible to crack, but a brute force attack would see the end of mankind before it would be cracked, even with the top (current) super computers. It's actually one of the encryption algorithms that were designed specifically for this type of security. AGAIN you are right in that there are two weak links.

    ONE = Physical access. For me, I am disabled and home 99% of the time, and I have a Smith & Wesson security system. .40 and 9mm actually. MY wife's security system is her 12g Mossberg. (She prefers shotgun sports over handgun, although she is Rangemaster Qualified in Shotgun, Rifle, and Handgun). I pity the poor fool who picks our house, of course he'd have to be an idiot since I am up most of the night, and everyone else if up the rest of the time. I only average about 3-4 hours of sleep during the night and it's NEVER the same time. Anyway,

    TWO = PASSWORD!!! Most people pick waaaaaaaaay to simple passwords and they use common names or terms. (May favorite is 'password' and 'delllaptopD610' I love it when I get these kinds of passwords as I know I get to spend ALL kinds of quality time explaining to my customer why that's almost as bad as having it on a sticky note on the monitor :twitchy: (Don't laugh!! I've seen it soooo often.) Or a small composition book that has 'PASSWORDS' written in the Subject area. :confused2: I always as 'so why bother to have a password? (I have one customer who absolutely refuses to use anything except 'abc123' or '123454321'. It took me an hour to get him to use the second one (It was just 12345) My passwords meet strong encryption guidelines as they are between 12 & 18 char long, uses letters, numbers, & symbols, and is not a dictionary word). It's actually a password that written out a spellchecker would freak-out and just quit over :swoon:

    Most people think of passwords as an annoyance, and should just be avoided. 99% of my customers have their computers boot straight to a desktop by entering their password into the registry file (DOOOOOH!!! :realmad: )

    Please don't misunderstand, I know that my data is not 100% safe, but it's safer than most. Like I mentioned, I have a shredder program set to the sensitive files on my box. Other than that, I keep NO cc number, passwords, on-line accounts, or ANYTHING that I wouldn't want a hacker in Russia to have. I also have dual redundant RAID systems sitting on the network are 100% AES encrypted. These are Linux boxes that house them (more secure and less likely to be infected - but not impossible!) On top of that they are on a different subnet that cannot be seen by coming in through the router, only if you are on the inside LAN can you see them. (I have a 'fake' server sitting out in the DMZ with trash and ghost data on it). I used to do security and penetration testing for fortune 500 companies (Can't use names, but I Guarantee if you look around your office you will see at LEAST 6 of them).

    My experience is one of the reasons that I work to keep it secure. ANY HIGHLY sensitive data is secured in a safe on hard copy only. It DOES NOT stay on the computer. I take ZERO chances with some things. I also have (usually) up to 6-10 months of hard copy DVD back-ups (Full & Incremental). Just remember... Just because your PARANOID, doesn't mean that they AREN'T REALLY OUT TO GET YOU!!! :biggrin:

    Beau
    Remember to HAVE FUN.... otherwise you might as well call it WORK...

    BTW... Dwagon, did I read that you are expecting the click/clack of little claws coming your way again?? Congrats!!! I just saw a 2 week old at the bank today and it reminded me of how small my soon to be 7 year old used to be. She is growing up WAAAAAAY too fast!!! This is going to be her 5th year on School starting 9/8!! (She goes to a Montessori school)... She's already getting in trouble for the boys chasing her! We had to have a talk about her kissing a boy during recess! (He's a good kid; they have been friends since they were three). I still might have to rub him out though..... ;) How old are yours??

    Beau
     
  10. Toughbook

    Toughbook Drop and Give Me 20!

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    I use a carbide Dremel bit and it moves the magnesium very well. I now do this in front of my shop vac system so that there are no little magnesium dust particles floating around to land back in the laptop or in lungs! :eek:

    You also must watch out for sparks... Not from cutting or grinding the magnesium but from other sources landing on the stuff you grind off. If you have a pile of shavings and a spark gets on it... IT WILL burn until it stops... Nothing will stop that. And it burns VERY hot. Be careful when trimming it! ;)
     
  11. mnementh

    mnementh Crusty Ol' TinkerDwagon

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    The true nature of computer security is the same as most other forms of security - it is NOT an attempt to STOP would-be villains (You can't STOP someone if they're motivated enough, just think of every episode of A-Team and MacGyver you ever saw) ;) but rather to slow them down; either to such point that they cannot obtain their objective without being caught, or that they grow frustrated and move on to easier targets.

    As you have noted above... hacking the hardware is usually much harder than hacking the software... which in turn, is usually much harder than hacking the wetware. Now which one do you suppose the TRULY experienced hack is going to attack first?

    The bugger with all that encryption is the software; M$ OSes notoriously manage their memory poorly and with ZERO SECURITY (and your LINUX derivatives DO have their own weaknesses there TOO, so don't cackle too loudly); I can almost GUARANTEE that somewhere on your HDD reside non-encrypted cache files (which may not even be currently connected to an active FAT, but can still be read from as a binary) which contain or have contained EVERY PASSWORD you ever used on it.

    This of course means the same thing; by hacking that weakness in the software, one is actually hacking the wetware - taking advantage of the laziness/incompetence/poor organization/etc of the FALLIBLE HUMAN BEINGS who wrote the OS to begin with.

    As for the clickety-tickety of little clawed feet - yeah. It's wonderful and infuriating all at the same time... Marcus turns 2 in October, so it's all still brand new to me. I'm still hoping for a widdle gurl dwagon to have daddy wrapped around her little finger; but mommy has informed me that "the baby factory is now CLOSED" so wish me luck. :D

    mnem
    Even paranoids have enemies.
     
  12. Toughbook

    Toughbook Drop and Give Me 20!

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    So are you saying that drugs and a paperclip should make just about anyone happy?

    If that's the case... We need to find out which is the best security...

    Do you use the drugs and try to figure out a way to make your laptop more secure with the paperclip?

    -OR-

    Do you just leave the drugs and the paperclip on the table beside the laptop as a lure? Then the would-be perpetrator uses the drugs and then sits there agog thinking about why you left the paperclip there...

    Anyone?
     
  13. mnementh

    mnementh Crusty Ol' TinkerDwagon

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    Huh?

    Where did drugs come into the picture? I get the paper clip/McGyver thing... but drugs?

    mnem
    My reality check just bounced...
     
  14. Toughbook

    Toughbook Drop and Give Me 20!

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    Come on.... Mr. T had to be drugged every episode to get him on the airplane.
     
  15. mnementh

    mnementh Crusty Ol' TinkerDwagon

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    Ahhh, yes...

    Well, in T's defense - you'd have to drug MY happy arse to get me in any aircraft piloted by 'DAT FOO'...

    mnem
    Nope... not gonna say it... ye cain't make me...
     
  16. rcx

    rcx Notebook Consultant

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    When out and about, I prefer to use the convertible CF-18/19's (digitizer) it slate mode. Usage is not necessarily constant. When logging in and/or unlocking it, I'm not always in a situation where I can readily pop the latch, lift the screen, rotate the Toughbook to a manageable typing position, free both hands to type the strong password, and then reverse that whole process to get back to my prior slate mode setup. :)


    Matthew
     
  17. mnementh

    mnementh Crusty Ol' TinkerDwagon

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    I still maintain that it's just as much hassle to play the "Fingerprint Scanner Crapshoot" game as it is to use the soft keyboard to enter one lousy password... I have tablet PCs TOO; I LOVE my SLATE ONLY PCs. I think they're the BOMB. Fingerprint scanners... bleaaaaghh. Wasted time every time you use them; just like booting Winblows.

    mnem
    If we could only send MicroSuck a BILL for ALL the man-hours WASTED waiting for Windoze to REBOOT...
     
  18. rcx

    rcx Notebook Consultant

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    It's supposedly been tried, though I haven't heard any more since the initial round of news....

    Employees Sue for Unpaid Windows Vista Overtime - "A series of lawsuits have been brought against major US companies by staff claiming unpaid overtime based on the time it takes Windows Vista to start up and shut down.
    ...
    The crux of the issue is the fact that some companies have connected time-keeping systems to their PCs.

    These systems are not activated until the user logs in, which is taking up to 15 minutes after the machine running Windows Vista has been turned on thanks to the long boot cycle. This means staff are in the office or shop but not officially working until they've logged in"​

    Follow the link for the complete hoot. ;)
     
  19. mnementh

    mnementh Crusty Ol' TinkerDwagon

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    Yeah... Gotta LOVE the Register; if for no other reason than that they host the adventures of the BOFH.

    But what I specifically meant was the time TRULY WASTED waiting for Windows... in ALL its VARIED INCARNATIONS... to REBOOT Because it CRASHED. If only 1% of those man-hours were actually recoverable... I'd be happy with the Toaster Leavins from that gig...

    mnem
    In OTHER news... Bill Gates has retired from MicroSoft... NO...REALLY...