New to toughbooks, trying to compare

All,

This is my first post on the forum, which I found during many of my Google searches for toughbook info. I apologize if I ask something that has been beaten to death, but in several hours and going back over the last 30 pages or so I've still got questions.

I am a hot air balloon pilot and one of the newest trends in ballooning competition is to fly with a toughbook using mapping software like CompeGPS as a moving map to assist with getting to targets and avoiding red areas (unwelcoming landowners). On a normal gentle flight, a regular computer would hold up, but occasionally in a flight with some speed the ruggedness comes in handy. I've been flying competition for 2 seasons now and I am interested in getting a toughbook. Previously all navigating has been done by hand-held GPS and paper maps.

The 4 or 5 guys I have been talking to all have CF-73 models from Ebay. Yesterday I was within about 5 seconds of getting one and got outbid! After that, I began to expand the search to other models.

What I have been studying on for a couple of days now is whether or not a CF-29 will be as good, or better, than a 73. It appears to me that most all of them can be upgraded to have a decent amount of hard drive space and memory and a lot of the other details appear to be the same from the Panasonic spec sheets online.

I am not a computer expert by any means and I am leary of Ebay items with no hard drive or operating systems.

What I need:
Would like to have at least 80GB hard drive, 1GB or more memory (1.5 would be nice), battery that holds a good charge, ability to add a media bay battery (I think either model will do this if I read correctly), and a working touchscreen, would like to be in the $300 + or - range.

I was set to buy a CF-29 last night until I found out those other guys all used 73s. That said, I think they all use them because they saw somebody else with one and that may or may not be based on much.

On the flip side, in the 30 pages of this forum I have skimmed over, there are tons and tons of topics on the CF-29, and very few on the 73. Is that because the CF-29 is more readily available, or are there other reasons it is more popular? I also noticed batteries seem to be significantly cheaper for the 29.


All of that said, I am not opposed to a model other than these 2, but that's what I've focused on so far. Any advice appreciated. Thanks,

Drew Egerton
Hendersonville, NC


p.s. - Will trade balloon rides for toughbook

 

That's known as "sniping."

This is supposed to be a decent source for used Toughbooks:

Toughbook Exchange - Toughbook CF-73

And as to the CF-73, you may find this helpful:

Panasonic Soultions Company Home > Support > Mobile Computer Support > FAQs > CF-73

 

The CF-73 is a semi-rugged model. The CF-29 is fully-rugged. Apples to oranges, I'd take the CF-29 any day over a CF-73. It's much easier to get parts for a CF-29. Look for a CF-29 Mk4 or 5 with the 1.6ghz processor, though I'm not sure it'll meet your price range. All, IMHO.

 

Did you look into the cf-18/cf-19? They are relatively small and can be inverted into tablets, which turns them into really big gps devices!
And they are fully rugged. But they have no media bay (although you can connect One through a USB port. It's not handy when you need DVDs on the go, but for incidental installing software it's no problem)

 

Somewhat joking here, but if you are like the rest of us, it doesn't matter which one you buy first. Within 6 months you'll own them both and be shopping for more.
It's an addiction that never stops once you start.

Personally, I strongly suggest getting a CF29 instead of the CF72 or 73.
Hot-cold, wet-dry, gentle-accidental drops,the CF29 will take whatever you give it.
The semi ruggeds are okay. I own a couple CF51's. Perfect for around the house, but my CF29 gets tossed in the back of the truck and takes the heat or cold weather. The rough ride of the truck never bothers it. The hard drives in the semi ruggeds are not heated or cushioned nearly as well.

Your mileage may differ.

 

Thanks for the input guys. You all have me leaning back towards the 29s again, if nothing else because of the wealth of knowledge already posted here about them. Cheaper/more readily available parts are a big plus to me also. I may head over to the BST forum here and post a wanted ad for one.

 

I agree with you, the CF-18 or 19 would be better fit for what you want to use it for. I find they have better battery life too. The smaller size and the handle/strap you could hang it anywhere and not worry about it.

 

I have 5 CF-73's. Originally they were going to be my kids upgrades from a CF-28. They are nice machines but it is a pain to find batteries and hard drive caddys. The battery and caddy will drive the price usually over double for what you paid for the machine. Since I couldn't find all the parts cheap I got a few CF-50's as parts are easier to find but not what you need in your case. The cf73 doesn't have optional built in gps either. It can be done as mod though. For what you want the cf-18,19,29,30,u1 would be more what you need. Tell us besides gps how you plan to use your toughbook. Full size keyboard or not? Cd/DVD drive build into the unit? Price? 10",13",5.6". If you have got your hands on a cf73 before and really liked it also look at the 74 model. But keep in mind that it will have no built in gps (it can have gobi style)(wwan) and some parts are harder to find like the 73. The 74,19,30 are dual core models.

 

my two quick cents:

When I first looked at Toughbooks, it was a tossup between the CF18/19 and the CF29.
They are both outstanding units, and are totally capabe of doing what you want.

The 18 or 19 would be good because it converts to tablet mode, which is more convenient. The screens are about 10" and you can count on the touch working well (loosely speaking). They are generally in the same ballpark price wise, but parts are a tad more expensive.

The 29 (what I have) has a bigger 13.3 screen and are more easily modded for internal gps and bluetooth, IMHO. The only drawback that I can see is that the touch screens tend to be more worn out/fail than the 18's/19's, depending on what model, mark, and what duty it saw in it's previous life. The TS can be fixed for about $100, if you are so inclined (I was, and love my new screen).


Overall, I see an 18 or 19 being the optimal choice for you, but I do love my 29, too! In your application, I would definitely recommend a dock, be it OEM custom fit locking dock with I/O ports, or just a piece of plywood with tie downs.

Good Luck!

 

I believe I'm going to try a 29 to start with and see how that goes. For $299 I found one with 1280MB Ram and the 1.3GHz processor, 80GB hard drive, XP, DVD/CDRW, and supposedly good touchscreen. For our large maps I think the 13" screen will be nice.

I plan to hook up my Garmin Geko via USB cable to use with Compe so I'm not too concerned with an internal gps

I'm not too sure what to expect from the battery life while running Compe. This will be the main purpose of this computer for me so I don't plan to have a lot of other programs installed and running at the same time. In a typical competition setting, we have a briefing that can last 30 min or so and then a flight can go anywhere from 45 min. to over 2 hrs.

My understanding is that I can swap out a media bay battery while everything is running, is that right? Assuming everything checks out with this one when it arrives I'll be in the market for one or two of those.

For mounting...attached to a piece of plywood seems to be the typical route I've seen. Some guys just use Velcro so they can rip it out of the basket and put it in quickly. Will definitely need to investigate this further. Competitive flying season starts for me at the end of May, so I've got lots of time before that to tinker!

Thanks again,

Drew

 

I like the fully tough models like the cf-29. Plenty of mods can be done and the one you picked up may have a more durable TS if it is so equipped. I prefer the 1.6 models that are non TS that I switch out and put a TS in it one with the 256mb onboard ram like a cf-29L3L(not a T in the second slot) will take a 2gb ram and may give a little more computing power. Love the western mountains of NC, esp near Boone area.....Driller

 

Good for you!

Yes, you can swap the media bay battery out *as long as the main battery or external power is good/on*
Your biggest battery killer is the backlight of the screen. USB GPS puck cannot suck out more than 2.5watts (5v X 0.5 amp)(USB 1) or 5watts (USB 2.0).
And as much as I love it, the touch screens tend to be hit an miss. Mine worked for a well enough for 6 months and then died. But, for $100 I replaced the glass with a brand new TS, and now should be good for another 100,000 touches, AFAIK. Also, not beating on the screen like a high shcool drop out cashier at Taco Bell, will extend the life of any touch screen.

Alternately, you may want to look into a 12v gel cell battery or similar and a LIND power supply. I would like to now point out that I have a tenancy to over-complicate things.

Keep us posted.

 

IMO, for the longest run time, the best solution would be 2 main batteries and a media bay battery. The reason is the media bay battery is used first and then the main battery. That always seemed backwards to me. So, use only 1 main battery. As it draws down to a predetermined charge, say 30 minutes left, insert the media bay battery. The computer will now start using the media bay battery. When it gets down to 30 minutes, swap the main batteries and pull the media bay battery. Seems overly complicated but, you can get a long run time this way. With 3 fully charged good batteries I'd expect over 10 hours of use.

If you decide to use only 1 main battery and 1 media bay battery you should still get 6+ hrs of run time.

 

I still like what the others are saying about the cf-19. I have one and love it! dimming the screen down, and not surfing the web, i can get almost 7 hours of battery life. Plus, for what you want to do with it, I think it would be much better to have a screen that you can flip around and close, protecting the keyboard. I have the digitizer model, but you can also get touchscreens on these. They also weigh a lot less than the 29's do, and can also come with a shoulder strap and/or hand strap. They are fully rugged as well, and should be within your price range as well. Worth checking out.... IMO