Panasonic CF-AX2

There's a new Panasonic ultrabook after all:



ƒRƒ“ƒo[ƒ`ƒuƒ‹ƒ^ƒuƒŒƒbƒg | ƒŒƒbƒcƒm[ƒgAX iCF-AX2j | ƒpƒ\ƒRƒ“iŒÂlŒü‚¯j | Panasonic

It appears to replace the former Panasonic CF-J and CR-R series and is only available in Japan.

Interesting features include: SSD only, two batteries, multi-touch touchscreen, screen folds such that the computer can be used as a tablet, much thinner than earlier Toughbooks while still being robust. The resolution of the screen is the same as earlier models in the J series.

I didn't expect all of these features in the J-series' successor!

 

I don't like it's construction - I think keyboard has to be hidden when in tablet mode.

 

those are some nice hinges - see the video on the site I wonder how are the cables routed in there...

 

Yet another surprise: the CF-AX2 can also be pre-ordered from Expansys in Europe.

Laptops & Netbooks - laptop deals, netbook reviews - Expansys.com UK

it's expensive...
To the best of my knowledge, the CF-J/CF-Rs were never sold this way in Europe and Expansys also doesn't offer other Panasonic laptops. Is this an experiment with new sales channels?

 

Panasonic shows off foldable Windows 8 Ultrabook hybrid, launches October 26 (hands-on) -- Engadget
it's interesting, but I don't like it

 

I just priced the AX2 premium edition - came out to about 270,000 yen ($3400 US). Very disappointing. I'd rather get the SX2 or NX2 for that money. Even the Vaio Duo beats it on price with similar configurations.

 

I posted this about a month ago... this is now a duplicate thread....

 

Please read carefully... this thread is about the Panasonic CF-AX2, which was launched less than 3 weeks ago, and which is very different from the Panasonic CF-SX2 or CF-NX2. A simple Google search shows that this is the only thread about this model on this forum.

 

Ahh yes,

I see that I was mistaken. The AX2 I did have the thread on: http://forum.notebookreview.com/panasonic/689222-new-toughbook-cf-sx2.html

But the AX2 I knew about 4 - 5 weeks, but I see that I failed to post a thread on it. I just thought I had posted something on it. I'm thinking, where did I read about someone complaining that the keyboard should be hidden... then I see this post... I'm sorry. I was wrong

Thanks

 

Are there any real owners of this machine now? I'd like to ask about screen and its quality...

 

As far as I know...no . It would be nice to hear from an owner of one to see what it's like for sure...

 

Strange. It is in sale, starting from October 26. Let's hope someone will appear here.

 

Hmmmm... Very similar dimensions and weight to my long-lost Dell L400; much more powerful of course. Never fear; I'm certain the accessories people (both OEM and aftermarket) will gladly hook you up with some kind of smartcover to protect that keyboard and wristpad from being polluted.

mnem
FLIP!

 

... and still we have no owners in there?

 

I played with it when in Japan back in December. It's well built and it felt high quality, but the keyboard exposed at the bottom IMO is a liability even though you can lock it. I also think the premium version which is only available in Japan - which IMO you would need to get any real power - is WAY overpriced (right now it's just under $3,000 equivalent in the US) for an 8GB/256GB SSD/i7-3687U. I don't care how well built it is - no. The new v2 Vaio Duo with that same processor is a much better deal with an active digitizer you can write on and a 512GB SSD. Clearly they are VERY different form factors and the Duo doesn't work for everyone. I have the v1, and after using the AX2 in Japan, don't regret my purchase. I really like the optical trackpoint in the Sony which is a key difference for me.

I also think the Helix will be a much better option and bargain, but its lack of VGA (unlike the DUo and AX2) makes it less business friendly.

I'd say the AX2 and Duo both have great build quality, but the AX2 is definitely more rugged.

So it all depends on what you are looking for. The AX2, Duo, and Helix all are not cheap machines.

 

I'm an owner now (jet-black, 128GB, i7). I agree, it's an expensive machine to buy, but I'm assuming it will be worth the investment.

My previous machine was a Panasonic CF-R6 (2007), which was also an expensive machine to buy, but which I used daily for 6 years without troubles and turned out to be extremely reliable. I don't know of any other laptop in my neighborhood that's been around for such a long time and is still running (I think most people are on their 3rd laptop by now). The main reason for replacing it is that its limited processor speed was getting increasingly annoying - if not for that, I would have probably continued using it. This is the type of reliability that I value a lot, and that led me to upgrade to another Panasonic.

I'm mainly using Ubuntu, so I can't really comment on its functionality under Windows 8.
1) Ubuntu recognizes all the hardware out of the box, except for the SD card reader and the new sensors (ambient light, gravity, ...); the webcam, Wifi, and touchscreen are all recognized. (But multi-touch support under Ubuntu is not good yet.)
2) The best battery life I've had till now is 7 hours.
3) The machine is very quiet, except when it is under stress for a longer time, in which case the fan becomes noisy. Under Windows there is a tool for changing the fan speed.
4) The materials of the case are as sturdy as those of the R6, if not better.
5) Wifi reception is very good. I used a USB/Wifi-adapter with antenna in the past, but this is not necessary with the AX2
6) The SSD is very fast - I am impressed by the boot-time under Windows 8.
7) UEFI can be disabled - very practical when installing another OS than Windows 8.
8) The position of the keyboard in tablet mode doesn't really bother me. It switches off automatically, also under Ubuntu. Actually, Panasonic sells a cover if you really need one.

On a further note, the SSD seems to be in the industry standard mSATA form factor, so I have some hope that it can be replaced with something larger in a few years time. (Judging from pictures on the Internet, as I don't intend to open mine in the near future.)

Some other specifications:
- The SSD is a Samsung MZMPC128-HBFU.
- The touchscreen is a D-WAV Scientific Co., Ltd eGalax TouchScreen

I've also tried a Sony VAIO Duo and a Lenovo Yoga in a shop before going for the AX2. Indeed, the choice is probably personal. To me the keyboard of the AX2 feels easier to use (as it offers a palm rest while on the road). Also the multi-touch touchpad feels more usable to me. I do miss the circular touchpad of the R6 though...

 

I own three Panasonics from Japan: the S9, J9, and J10. I love my J10. It's one of the best machines I've ever owned. One of the reasons I didn't like the AX2 was the lack of Panasonic's signature circular trackpad. I find it incredibly useful. In playing with the AX2 in Japan, I really did miss it. The build quality was up to normal Let's Note standards. The hinges were amazing. That thing won't fall apart. The fold over leaving the keyboard exposed really turned me off. If they had made it more of a proper R/J replacement with a touchscreen, I probably would own one. I'm hoping Panasonic's next major iteration of the SX/NX include a touchscreen.

I do agree about form factor being a personal choice. The optical trackpoint/nub on the Duo to me is absolutely perfect and IMO better than Panasonic's trackad. The joystick/nub thing on my old Vaio U70P was my favorite mouse-type thing thing ever. I usually wear them out, so it being optical is amazing. I could see where having the palm rest vs. what the Duo has (or doesn't as the case may be) would bother some. The keyboard could better, but I didn't love what was on the AX2, either. My J10 has a much better keyboard than either. I also didn't like the fact that the Panasonic was a touchscreen but not a digitizer (N-Trig or Wacom) with pen support.

THe one thing where the Duo is heads and shoulders above the AX2 is screen quality. Panasonic is good. It's probably as good as my J10, but that's not saying it's the best ever. Panasonic tends to have great specs and mediocre screens.

Do you only have the built-in battery or did you buy the additional one as well?

 

It's too late for three of my Toughbooks. They already have dented bases.
Glad that Panasonic have finally figured out that the way to protect the base from damage is to put the keyboard there instead.
Obvious when you think about it... keys are spring-loaded, see?

+ 1 what BaRRmaley said in post #2 but without the epic understatement.

 

I forgot to comment on the screen. The screen quality indeed is not as good as one could hope. In particular the viewing angles are not as good as one would expect for a laptop that can also be used a tablet.

To the best of my understanding, the AX2 always has two batteries: the built-in one, and the removable one. There is no placeholder for the replacable one. I ordered a second removable battery (so I have three batteries in total). The run time of 7 hours was for the built-in battery + one removable battery.

 

Thanks for commenting on the screen. It is indeed bad for the price announced.

There is a placeholder for the battery. A sort of USB charger, optional:

 

This looks like an adequate replacement for my TT

- Is the screen indeed matte as LifestyleAsia reports?

- bad viewing angeles probably mean TN panel!?

- Any chance one could replace the panel with a 11.6" Full HD like the Vaio Duo has?

- Are there disassembly guides / photos of internals / service manuals available?

- is SSD mSATA? replacable?

- RAM upgradable?

- how much battery life with the internal battery?

 

It's more matte than glossy. The screen does not act as a mirror and is certainly not as reflective as that of a Macbook, for instance. However, light sources are reflected more than in older matte screens, so it's not completely matte.

Yes, this must be a TN panel. It's a very bright screen, though, and may contribute to the machine's longlevity on battery?

If anybody knows how to do this, I'd be curious. Although the screws that keep together the screen are likely below the rubber cushions, It doesn't like this is going to be easy.

In the Japanese manual it is explained how to open the case to replace the internal battery, if needed. I don't know of instructions to open it further. There are quite some pictures of the internals here:

パナソニック Let'snote CF-AX2発売記念「タッチ＆トライ」イベント - a set on Flickr

Based on the pictures, I think the SSD can be replaced, if you manage to open the case. It's the green chip on this picture:

_DSC9904 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

It looks like it can be unscrewed from the motherboard.

I don't think so.

Around 2 hours.

 

Thanks a lot travelings for your detailed answers!

The resolution of 1366x768 is the major reason I'd like to replace my otherwise still beloved TT. I started a thread in the hardware section to get some opinions whether its possible to replace the panel: http://forum.notebookreview.com/har...er-display-mod-11-6-fhd-panasonic-cf-ax2.html

I couldn't spot the RAM on the picture you linked. Is it hidden under the white sticker? Do you know what the socket below is good for?

Do you have the model with the Gobi 3000 WWAN module? I couldn't spot this either, neither I can seem to find the SIM card slot on the pictures on the web - is it behind the battery?


PS: Hehehe, funny pictures of the guy dancing on the toughbook

 

very nice of them to display a new (Let's Note) model disassembled. That didn't and won't happen with Toughbooks, unfortunately.
The RAM could be soldered on the MB, so no upgrades ever. That's the price of it being an ultrabook convertible tablet.

the guy was dancing on a piece of material used to distribute the load evenly, but anyways, it's a rare feature to display on an ultrabook.

 

Honestly, if the screen is the main reason for replacing your current machine, I think the AX2 is not the right choice - it's screen is not the best. Maybe it's better to wait - who knows that maybe there's an upgrade later this year with a better screen.

I don't know - however, the motherboard is used on both sides. The memory may also be on the other side. I currently can't find a picture of it, but I don't remember seeing anything there that can be replaced.

I don't have the one with a WWAN module... in machines that have it, the slot is behind the battery.

 

Do you know manufacturer & model number of the display, or where to find its data sheet?

I'm asking because current Full HD screens appear to use eDP connection and I'm not quite sure what the CF-AX2 uses.

 

I really don't know... I also don't know of any software solution to find this out.

Others might find this link interesting:

CF-AX2

it shows that indeed switching the SSD is not difficult.

 

it's really straightforward to find the panel P/N:
* in Linux, just search the /var/log/Xorg.0.log file, on the section near EDID info. It should list the panel model number there.
* in Windows, install Hwinfo app: HWiNFO, HWiNFO32 & HWiNFO64 - Hardware Information and Analysis Tools and look there for the Display Section

 

Actually, I had already checked that, as well as /sys/class/drm/ in combination with parse-edid. Although I can retrieve the EDID information for external monitors without issues, it is unavailable for the internal screen.

 

Earlier this week the AX3 was launched:

ƒŒƒbƒcƒm[ƒgAX iCF-AX3j | ƒpƒ\ƒRƒ“iŒÂlŒü‚¯j | Panasonic

It basically "solves" the screen issue discussed above. It comes with a 1080p IPS screen, as well as a Haswell chipset, which gives it an advertised battery life of 12 hours; otherwise it's identical to the AX2 (two batteries, touchscreen, 128/256GB SSD, 4/8GB RAM, i5/i7 processor, HDMI, VGA, USB 3). A very nice machine, also compared to the new Dell XPS 11 or Lenovo Yoga 11s, if you ask me - but I guess the lack of discussion means that it's not of interest to most people. Is there anybody else here with an AX2/3?

 

I just read the news and jumped here just to see you have posted already
That's a sweet update. Where you got the info about 8GB RAM from? All 5 configurations listed show only 4GB!?

After some time of using the AX now, what do you like and what not so much?

 

The Premium version has 8GB:

レッツノートプレミアムエディション(CF-AX3) Core i7 高機能｜マイレッツ倶楽部 | CLUB Panasonic

The worst part of the AX2 is the screen - it limits its usability as a tablet. So it's good that they've corrected this.

The second disappointment is the quality of the black paint on the black model. On some of the corners it's already disappearing, revealing the magnesium underneath. I would have expected a better finishing. Probably the silver model will look good for longer.

 

Thanks for the link to the premium model

Do you mean the fact that it is HD only / TN / matte coating?
Have you used touch nonetheless? Is it difficult to clean fingerprints? Is there much wear on the coating?
When using as a tablet were you protecting the keyboard? If not does the keyboard get a lot of dust. Is there wear on the keys and key symbols?

I didn't know there even was a black model. I can't stand silver devices, but that makes me thinking. Or where you dancing on it like the dude in the conference

Where did you get your model from btw? Are you thinking of udgrading to the AX-3?

 

Agree that the IPS on the AX3 will make it a better machine. The old panel just was not that great IMO. I wish it was truly a J replacement and you could have 16GB in there. That would be great. Another thing I wish they had done was make it a true tablet with pen. That would be a Duo killer IMO.

 

Am I missing some info or does neither the AX2 or AX3 come with backlit keyboard?

 

Nope, neither do as far as I know. Not really needed since they're pretty high contrast (white with black letters). I've used 3 different Panasonics without backlit keyboards - come to think of it no Panasonic has it I've seen - at night with no issues.

 

You haven't been looking at the right models, they put them in the big boy models, have been long before almost everyone else. I think it's been almost 20 years now
CAP

 

I was referring to the TN panel type, which reduces viewing angles. The coating is ok. I also don't mind the resolution.

I have been using touch. Fingerprints are easily removed. I guess I have not used it enough to already have wear on the coating.

I have not protected the keyboard - but I did not use it in extreme circumstances either.

Yes, actually, there is, to my disappointment. My hands are apparently oily (or I did not clean them enough) and some keys are starting to shine. I never noticed this on my earlier gray/white model.

Till now I don't believe I've abused my machine in any way, which makes it a little sad that the paint is still disappearing in some places.

I bought mine at Conics (Japan). I'm not upgrading - I choose Panasonic as it increases chances that I can use the same machine for a long time.

 

I have the CF-AX2 and I am a bit disappointed with it. The finish and form look nice but not as usable as the CF-NX2 or CF-SX2 line IMO. I have had 10 lets note laptops before this. Somehow the laptop being lighter is more dense which makes it harder to use in bed on your chest.

The keys are spaced apart which is a big pain in the butt to type at very fast speeds I think this was done intentionally to stop people from buying convertibles in place of laptops.

The screen is a bit dim in my opinion I wonder how the HD one will be. I personally like the smaller resolution because the screen isnt that big to accommodate the larger resolution.

 

I have been considering purchasing the new AX3 now that a proper display has been incorporated. While looking over some of the specs of the system and perusing reviews on Japanese sites I came across an image of the MOTHERBOARD. If you look on the left side you will see a space that appears to be reserved for mPCIe/mSATA. I have owned a notebook that had a similar space that was left incomplete whereas the LTE model utilized the section for the necessary WWAN card. What annoys me about the AX3 is that there is already hardware allotted for an SSD as well as a dual WWAN/WLAN card. It seems as though Panasonic has designed the board with the potential for expansion though couldn't be bothered to solder on a 10 cent connector so that customers would be able to add a secondary drive et cetera.

I don't see Panasonic using this as a means to offer an expanded version down the road; I believe they simply abandoned offering expansion options. I wouldn't mind their not shipping with said options but disallowing the user to add functionality is unacceptable in my book.

I used to have a colleague who performed hardware hacks on motherboards that weren't generally considered feasible. I'd like to pretend that soldering an mPCIe connector on those solder points was doable. Then again, you'd almost certainly run into issues with the BIOS even if you could miraculously pull of the soldering.

 

Actually, WWAN is an option (at least in Japan) and there are models where a connector is present:

ËÉÏÂTOUGHBOOK CF-AX2²ð»ú - Panasonic(ËÉÏÂ)±Ê¼Ç±¾µçÄÔרÇø - ÆäËüÆ·ÅƱʼDZ¾ - רÃÅÍøÂÛ̳--רҵµÄ±Ê¼Ç±¾µçÄÔ¼¼Êõ½»Á÷ÉçÇø

I've been wondering about the possibilities to put an additional SSD there as well. Just like I wonder whether an AX3 screen assembly would fit in an AX2...

Would you mind putting a link to the website that contains the picture you mentioned? The direct link did not work.

 

That looks like the board of the AX2 (compare with the flickr shots of the link travelings provided earlier). Check also the date in the URL of the picture: "20130328" - there was no AX3 at that time.

Assuming it is indeed a WiFi/WiMax combo card, I guess the empty space is used for a dedicated WCDMA card on some European models. While WiFi/WiMax Cards are quite common WiFi/WCDMA cards hardly ever existed. Only Huawei & Option produced one, but those never made it in laptops afaik.

 

Travelings,

Ironically, the linked images you provided are not working either. Could you provide another source that shows the connector in question being utilized? Do you have any images for the AX3 board? I would like to see how much the design has changed.

Also, I believe I've fixed the link in my original post but here it is again: http://media.tumblr.com/2edf07f4c07a4f7d90fbf3f842b263b8/tumblr_inline_mj0t7mrT8E1qz4rgp.jpg

oled,

I was aware that the image I included was of the AX2. I assumed the two were not entirely different. Naturally, I would prefer an image of the AX3's motherboard. Have you one?

Also, I was under the impression that Let's Note systems were not sold in Europe save for the SX2.

 

It is and hopefully the AX3 will follow.
No, I couldn't find a picture of the AX3. But as it is based on the Haswell platform I also expect layout changes and wouldn't be surprised if expansion cards even come as M.2 devices rather than Mini Cards.

 

I'm interested in a black model. Unfortunately, that isn't sold in Europe. The downside to black, aside from potential wear showing more readily on the magnesium body, is that, unlike the grey keys, the black keys aren't laser cut. There is another benefit exclusive to the silver model that I can't recall at the moment.

I'm not familiar with "M.2" cards. Please provide a link.

 

I tried to start a discussion here, http://forum.notebookreview.com/har...ket-upgrades/722154-lets-talk-ngff-m-2-a.html

 

Travelings,

I was aware of the WWAN option but I have only seen images like those in my link in which the mPCIe card on the right side of the board is a dual Intel WWAN/WLAN model. Perhaps an LTE model requires the use of the missing slot. Is there a Japanese AX LTE model? I have only seen LTE options in the SX line.

 

If you open the image in the linked website individually, you will be able to see them.

This is an overview of the motherboard:

http://i5.3conline.com/images/piclib/201306/25/batch/1/180856/1372147464770cicm3fqtvm.jpg

As you see, the slot on the right hand side in the picture is present & used. This is a close-up of the card there:

http://i4.3conline.com/images/piclib/201306/25/batch/1/180856/1372147464770eiil7sxxuz.jpg

I don't know which type this is or where this particular model was sold - I found this picture myself through Google. In Japan there was a model with LTE.

 

Hi travelings, thanks for replying.

I did originally open the links individually but tried again to no avail. I then considered that you were likely accessing the server from the U.S. so I VPN'd through a server I have there and that remedied it. I suppose they don't like traffic from the country I am currently in.

I see the slot is used. It is a mystery to me as the board that is lacking the slot uses a dual WiMAX/WLAN Intel card negating the need for the secondary card. the only remaining option (given that Panasonic does not offer a secondary SSD setup) would be a separate WiMAX and WLAN card. I still don't see any option for LTE in Japan (reference: プレミアムエディション　価格スペック比較表 | マイレッツ倶楽部 | CLUB Panasonic) for AX3 - was it offered in the AX2? That would be strange for them to revert.

Is it possible that the image you provided is of the European model? I would imagine the European market would necessitate LTE.

I also need an LTE model. I was considering purchasing a WiMAX model from Japan and attempting to convert it to LTE. Assuming I even got a version with the available secondary slot and was able install the required hardware, there is no promise of the BIOS playing nicely.

Unfortunately, I'd like a black model with LTE - not to mention, 16GB of memory. Ignoring the memory, I don't see any way to accomplish black with LTE.

 

I looked over the images closely and that board has one Intel 6205 (WLAN) and one Ericsson F5521gw (HSPA+) in the slot in question on the left side. That answers my previous query where I wondered why they would offer LTE in the previous generation but not now. On the contrary, they offered "3G" in the AX2 and now only offer WiMAX in the AX3 (as far as I can gather).

This makes me all the more interested in seeing the AX3 board. Unfortunately, I would assume that it uses a dual WiMAX/WLAN card in the right slot and a void minus a connector to the left.