Toughbook N00b requesting advice

I'm shopping for a used Toughbook. My experience is limited to what I use at work in our squad cars, which are CF-28s and -29s. One is touch screen, one is touchscreen/rubber backlit KB, and one is touchscreen regular KB. I would like to get one with a backlit KB, but I'd like to be water proof. The touch screen is a MUST have. In looking around eBay, I'm finding some OK deals on units with few cosmetic flaws, but no HD, no OS, no battery, etc. Some are a little more and have some accessories like WiFi, GPS, etc.

Basically what I need to know is if it's worth buying a TB that doesn't have an OS and buying that separately, or if I should find a package deal. Also, I want something that will reliably run Windows XP without breaking a sweat and run some ham radio software/programs. I'd like something with more than one USB, a slot for an SD, and whatnot.

Also, which Mhz should I be looking for? This has me a bit lost.

 

Try to get one complete. The OS is no problem because the restore disk will cost you $20.00-$35.00 . Look for a MK4 or mk5...this will give you the sd reader. Prices $350.00 +. If you look at one that has no cd, caddy, battery and hdd it will be cheaper but this stuff will cost you
$100.00 caddy
$50.00 HDD
$80.00 CD/ROM
$50.00 Battery
$100.00+ Emissive Keyboard - the best one
$80.00 Rubber keyboard

 

Thanks a bunch. Mk4 and Mk5. How do I tell this difference? Model number?

 

What about a CF-18? Would these be decent for the same uses?

 

MK1 = 29C, 29D
MK2 = 29E, 29F
MK3 = 29H, 29J
MK4 = 29L, 29M
MK5 = 29N, 29P

If you read the first page of the FAQ you will learn a lot. http://forum.notebookreview.com/panasonic/241106-cf-29-f-q-read-me-before-posting.html

When buying one that you have to add all the extra's you really don't know what you are getting as in....working touch is the big thing. Mine is a MK5 1.6 MHz and it works great. I have about $475.00 into it.

 

Yes it will do all you want it to. Check the size, the CF-18s and 19s are a lot smaller than people think before they have seen one. That said,they are also very nice computers.
CAP

 

I'm not too worried about overall size so long as it's not impossible to type on/see. I checked otu the FAQ on the 29, but I didn't really learn what differences there are between the CF28 and 29.

Are the chicklet keyboards waterproof/resistant, or are just the rubber ones?

My price range is limited to about $300. If I find a CF19 for that price would it be too good to be true?

 

1. The keyboard is a separate unit and isolated to a point (no total submersion for a week) from the innards of the unit. I read where folks cleaned their keyboards in a dishwasher. Just commenting not recommending.
2. From my wife.....she likes the feel of the 29 since she was taught touch typing in high school.
3. CF-29 Mark 4 and 5 are 1.6Ghz. You can add more than enough ram for XP. 512 +1 gig. There are two exceptions that I doubt you will find and 1 (the 256 ram) is non-touch from the factory. Look at the different models in the Panasonic Toughbook Configurator discontinued model section for particulars on a unit you are interested in.
4. CF 18/19 No comment I have never seen one.

Jeff

 

Here's a 1.6GHz Mk5 Touch Screen unit that has had its hard drive uograded:

Panasonic ToughBook CF-29 1.6GHz/new120/CDRW/DVD/WIFI

Get an emissive backlit keyboard from Rob ( JB007Rules) and you're good to go.

 

Good price but the touchscreen not working

 

If you are typing quite a bit, skip the cf-18 as the keyboard is smaller than standard as it's time consuming to type on it
The tablets are great for portability ,the screen on these in my opinion is even brighter that the cf-29's
Don't worry about getting the right keyboard as they are easily replaced (one member here sells nice brand new backlit for 1/2 what panasonic charges)

Many mk4 and mk5 cf-29's have non-working touchscreens , try to find a low hr unit if possible

 

If the touchscreen ends up inop, or if it dies during my ownership, can it be replaced with relatively little kicking and screaming?

 

Yes if you know you way around a laptop. They can be had for about $100.00......give or take

 

Good to know. I doubt it's within my skill set, but my FIL is a retired computer "man" so maybe I can con him into it. I really like the CF-18 the more I look into it. The cost is more than I really want to spend, but I think it would be better suited for my needs. I need mostly portability.

I noticed a break-down of the various production versions of the CF-29 in the sticky, is there a table that shows the breakdown for the CF-18?

 

What Blair said and fifteen minutes the third time you do it.

 

What kind of hours do these things reach when they start to "burn out"? In the BIOS I saw on on auction, it was in the 5800 range.

 

I'm running a Mark 4 +12,500. Generally you will only see the hours on the Mark 4 and 5 (1.6Ghz).

 

Sure

CF-18B MK1 (900MHz)
CF-18D/E MK2 (1.1MHz
CF-18F/G/H MK3 (1.1MHz)
CF-18K/L MK4 (1.2MHz)
CF-18N/P MK5 (1.2MHz)
I think I got the speeds right.....but not sure

 

Don't worry about the hours for backlite failure I have them with 15,000 hrs and they are still like new,but its seems that the well used models have touchscreen failures

As others have stated the complete lids are an easy changeout

If you are just buying a laptop for use on a desktop, the larger are fine

For portability the cf-18 is really great , I use my smaller screen laptops far more than the larger

 

Actually, it read "The touchscreen does not work right and has been disabled in bios."

Could be simple (dirt/crud around edges) or could be major (panel going "belly up").

In any case, I missed it when I scanned over the description (good catch there, TAN ).

 

Thats a good point....it just might be. For someone not needing a touch I would grab it because it is a very good price and if it was dirt/crud they got a steal of a deal

 

The more and more I look over an '18 the more I like it. For a hundred or so more, I think it might be a better deal. Does the serial number configuration tell the date it was built like on the CF-29s or is it different on these?

 

No it's the same

What type of cf-18 do you want ,you have 2 types, touchscreen and digitizer,
Btw I have one for sale

 

Yeah if you plan on resting your hand on the screen while writing I would go for digi.

As for burned out there are members here still proudly using CF-28's and my CF-72 still feels "like new" for what it is.

 

Hear, hear!

My CF-28 Mk1 is STILL the bomb for car diags and network diagnostics & router programming!

mnem
Burned out on all the NEW stuff!

 

I guess I don't know the difference between the TS and a Digitizer. I want to be able to use it in "tablet" format if I want,so I guess touchscreen.

 

No, both are touch screens and can be used as tablets. The "touchscreen" we speak of here can be manipulated with your finger or any blunt object. The "digitizer" uses a Wacom touch panel which will not respond to any input other than that from a special magnetic pen or stylus, you cannot use your finger. Both approaches have their pluses and minuses, and both have their advocates on this forum. I suggest you do some more reading or better, try to find some examples to try. Your local computer store might have a Wacom graphics slate you can try, the digitizer, and a iPad is one example of a "touch screen", but don't expect a CF-18 or 19 screen to behave as slick as a iPad.
CAP

 

Well I have an I-phone, which won't respond to anything but my touch (annoying). The CF-28 in my squad car I take home on occasion has touchscreen where I can use the stylus or my finger. I much prefer that thus far. I'll check out the Ipad when I get a chance, but if it's anything like the phone, meh.

I think I'll be able to get by with the standard touchscreen.

BTW, I put my squad car's computer in BIOS and tried to find the hours on it, but to no avail. I found the serial number and all that, but is there no hour meter on the '28s?

 

Correct
It's a feature added around five years ago
The cf-29s mk4 and 5 have it

There is a way to find hours on the model , that is if the hard drive is original
An application called HD tune pro has run hour's listed in the health status (S.M.A.R.T.) tab , line 9

 

Ok. This thing is a 2003 model so it's probably a bit old.

 

I didn't mention iPhone/pad cause it's a weird situation and almost opposite of the digi/touch screen. It refuses touch of fingernails and any stylus. With this new OS it sometimes doesn't even react to fingertips. I was gonna go for tom tom vs something else but ADHD kicked in and I was off to another forum. I had a digi tablet 3 months ago I was working on for a coworker. Next time he brings it in I will do a touch vs digi comparison vid placing my hand on screen while trying to write with a respectful stylus.

For cold weather, the slip on mechanix gloves work on the iPhone/pad screen but the traditional Velcro ended ones don't get you past unlock slide. Alternative to those EXPENSIVE 180s gloves.

I wasn't saying the 28 was burned out, I was saying they are still going strong. Still envy the 2 WiFi cards option. I have a working touch in a SBC unit and I barely use it since I got it working in W7

 

Ah I see. It would be nice to rest your palm on the screen so you can write properly, so I guess that's a great benefit. Just yesterday I was using the notepad feature to write addresses and plate numbers with and it was sort of awkward.

No matter what, I'm getting me one of these machines, be it an old school '28 or a newer school '18. I can't wait.

 

I'd go for a Digi 18 with stylus. Just watch the configuration, price, what the seller considers refurbished/used show model in the listings, and drivers to find and in what order to install if it doesn't come with recovery disks or you decide W7 later. On ebay you are lucky to get a Power Supply and a Hard Drive in the same auction.

 

Great info, thanks. I would imagine I'd start out using XP but would like the option to go to Windows 7 if I can.

 

Does the model/serial number indicate the digitizer? Not seeing much in the descriptions on these.

 

D,C,E are digitizer F is tablet according to Panasonic Configurator.

EDIT: THAT WOULD BE THE SECOND LETTER. AS IN CF-18ND_______

Sorry for any confusion.

Jeff muttering to himself

 

It's ok, I appreciate the great advice so far.

 

Home ownership gets in the way of even the smallest projects/wants so I'm still hunting for a good, cheap (ya right) computer. I've wrote of the CF-18 after I got the chance to fiddle with one. It's really too small for my liking. I am back to just kicking around a -28 or -29.

The ebay offerings are sparse. Not many have any guts left in them and IMO, are overpriced as of late.

 

kadet....Check PM

 

I would go with the CF-29, you could pick up a 28 cheaper $100.00 - $150.00 but most will need a new battery ($50.00+) but they are a lot slower. I have three 29's and they work great.

 

How does the CF-29 stack up against the Motorola ML900? This was suggested to me also.

 

I know zip-all about ML 900 but that hasn't stopped me yet. Below from a brief glance at pictures on the bay.

1. Someone says "hey, nice computer" you say "it's my ml 900" or IT"S MY TOUGHBOOK".
2. Looked at pictures and it didn't seem to have doors on USB and etc.
3. It's 1.7Ghz Mark 4,5 CF-29 for almost the same $$ is 1.6Ghz.
4. You would have to find a new forum.

Jeff

 

LOL thanks. Like I said, someone suggested it. I don't think it's as ruggedized as the TB.

 

Just looking at the ones on fleabay they don't deserve to be called Tough, these have been replaced by the ML910 Rugged Notebook.

Rugged PC Review.com - Rugged Notebooks: Motorola ML 900

 

I've been playing with a Motorola ML900 for a couple of weeks. The guy wants $250 for it with a busted left clicker, fingerprint reader, and no working wireless. I like the machine for one stupid reason....it has a red backlit keyboard.

Is there a mod available to turn the backlit keyboard on a toughbook red? Sounds dumb, but I dig it.

 

It is probably doable but you would have to look at the lights on a stripped board and see about a red filter or changing the lights out for red ones.

 

Just about anything is possible, if you are willing to throw enough time and money at it.
And that's not stupid..... a bit dangerous though.
I recently replaced my rubber kb on my 29. I had planned on a photographed necropsy of the old one, but have other things going on.

The back light on my current rubber one is green. I will assume they are LED back lights, but they could just as easily be electroluminescent (hence the green tint). But I believe my old rubber KB was a white back light. Led's are cheaper, more efficient, and easier to implement, so I'm going to stick with the guess of LED's.

ANyway, it should just be a matter of cracking it open, and replacing the LED's. Be carefull, they are probably tiny SMD type, and of a specific rating which you will need to match.

When I go to perform the necropsy, I will take pics and report back.

 

I'm curious as to if maybe different models/series of ToughBooks have different backlighting. For instance, the old 2003 CF-28 I used to use for work had a rubber keyboard with a nice green glow, the one I use in the squad car now (two-year old CF-29) has a chicklet keyboard with white glow (ANNOYING!). I wonder what the CF-18 would have, and while we are on the subject of the CF-18, can anyone tell me if it was available with a rubber keyboard and not chicklet?

 

The CF-18 was only available with a standard kb or a rubber backlit kb. The emissive backlit kb didn't come out until the CF-19 Mk3 or Mk4 was released. It will fit a CF-18 and has a white glow. All keyboards are interchangeable between CF-18's and CF-19's.

 

I prefer the rubber keyboard anyway, for what I will be using the machine for. Thanks. Any idea on the color glow on the rubber KB?