Clevo does not support Linux. This can not be real!

Hi everyone,

Before start to read this thread please read this post where I describe the problem:
http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/clevo-n155rd-gpu-does-not-perform-well.789567/

As I mentioned in my previous thread Clevo has a big problem with running GPU without fancy program called Control Center. In my country (Turkey) there is a reseller who sell Clevo laptops and we had a forum like you have here and I am asking people who use different models of Clevo to test their computer if it is work without this fancy Control Center. Guess what, they can not use GPU without Control Center.

Now we know something is broken in the system. In Windows side, this very fancy program Control Center can solve the problem. But do not forget that we should not be installing this very fancy program to get working GPU. In Linux side. You have nothing to do! It just not working. Your GPU work around %30 of its performance. What kind of a craziness is that? How come your system not compatible with the operating systems? I mean laptop can not work without helper programs!

Here, I am asking to Clevo : Are you for real? It is obvious that it is not for just one model. I think new models also come with these "FEATURE".

I am mad as hell. Please tell me the way I think is wrong. Please tell me that is it a bad dream.

Disclaimer: "These are gaming laptops. So why do you try to work in Linux" is a wrong argument! I am a researcher who uses Ubuntu and Cuda(GPU programming). In any cases, they have to work with Linux too.

 

is this program something you have to use in every Linux machine you have ever built? Becuase I have Linux machines and I'm not using that and my GPUs are working at full speed. Never tried on a Clevo, but it sounds like you need to use that on any platform you use? Or by control center you are talking about the "control panel" of the Nvidia card? Becuase that exist on Linux, at least on the build of Linux that I have it is there.

 

VvHave you checked with the Linux community or NVidia to see if they have a Control Center for Linux? Perhaps one is in the works.

Other than that, would using virtual box or VMware to run Linux be a viable work around? Probably not, since you are programming CUDA and need access to the physical card.

I don't think you're going to like this, but for what it's worth, the Clevo product page for N155RD says the model is only certified for Windows 10 - www.clevo.com.tw/clevo_prodetail.asp?id=833 . There's nothing regarding Linux support.

My guess is you're going to need the NVidia Linux community to help with this problem.

 

Does nvidia-settings give you any power profile options?

 

@victorwol,

I think what @araknafobia is trying to say is they want to use Linux on the Clevo N155RD. It installs and runs, but when they try do do anything with the GPU in Linux, they see a low Frames/Sec rate... From anywhere in the 13 to 20 FPS range.

I think they also say, in Windows, this is the same, unless you install the Clevo Control Center. I don't have this model, so I cannot say what that app does.

To me, it sounds like a driver or driver configuration issue. For WIndows / Linux if it cannot find the correct driver, a SVGA or simple driver would suffice, but you would need the correct driver installed to push the GPU. Since you have the P870DM, what does Control Center do? Is this tied to the nVidia driver?

 

No it is an specific program that only runs on Windows developed by Clevo. We do not have chance to get it work in Linux. As said before they broke something in their system. I have 3 friends who have Clevo's old models and their GPU works perfect in Linux as expected(new ones come broken). I am when I say "GPU works on Linux" it is something like all laptops have to have.

As I said above message you may not certified especially for Linux but it still works right? It is the way it was

 

To me, when Clevo says it is *not* certified, what that means is they've done NO testing on anything else except Windows 10. If you use the machine in any other way, it may work, and it may not work. If it doesn't work, I don't expect them to be much help in trying to figure out the problems. In sum, you are on your own.

So, what is needed is for someone to tell us what Control Center actually does. How does it interact with the nVidia driver or the GPU BIOS? If you had some specifications of what that app does, then you could ask the nVidia / Linux community help write diagnostics or fine tune the driver to figure out what is happening on Windows and try to emulate the same behavior within Linux.

 

The linux equivalent of nvidia control panel is the nvidia-settings program, depending on the card it should offer some clocking options.

 

There is an other "love song"... I know how to use Ubuntu. I know how to update Nvidia driver etc. When my monitor is plugged in and install the Nvidia driver that works on my old laptop and my friend's laptop (what I am trying to say that driver is just fine, I think) I can not see any think.Voila!. It gets black screen.If I plugged out the monitor it works.But useless.But I am not sure what it shows in nvidia-setting I will check it out.

Thank you, perfect explanation.
I do not know what Control Center does. I do not think there is someone who knows what it does.

I do not think so. But, I will try it now. Of course without monitor cause it does not work with monitor...

 

@araknafobia - FWIW, here's the English version of the man page for nvidia-settings on Ubuntu - http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/precise/man1/alt-nvidia-current-settings.1.html

I found another man page for nvidia-xconfig - http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/hardy/man1/nvidia-xconfig.1.html, but note, that may have been deprecated and replaced with nvidia-settings.

 

As you can see my clock speed is 1/4 of it. Do you think this can be solved in Ubuntu itself?
https://i.imgur.com/ZOE6Dxs.png

 

Try running glxgears in another window and see if your clock rate increases.

 

Already tried with another benchmark program. It goes max 300 MHz...

 

@araknafobia it may be time to start fiddling with your coolbits settings in an /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/03-nvidia.conf file or whatever you want to name it under xorg.conf.d

Here's the relevant section of the README for your current driver version:

http://us.download.nvidia.com/XFree86/Linux-x86/352.63/README/xconfigoptions.html

Also check out: http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?px=MTY1OTM&page=news_item

and

https://devtalk.nvidia.com/default/topic/820497/-solved-coolbits-without-xorg-conf-/

@jclausius nvidia-xconfig is a utility for automagically generating an xorg.conf file

 

I dont think, the control center is needed for the GPU to work, i have been using CentOS and Ubuntu for CUDA work for a week now and things have been working great. Even better than Windows.
I mainly use them for Vray RT and VFX Physics Simulations using CUDA.
The Control Center app is only for tweaking things and taking control of the lighting. All the other features offered my the CC can be changed in Windows directly, its just a "shortcut" application for most common laptop settings on might use.

EDIT: The apps im using are Maya and 3DS Max.
3DS Max is running using Wine.

 

Given that it's an Optimus laptop, have you actually selected the NV GPU to render and restarted X? You can select that now in the newer drivers under the "PRIME profiles" section. If you're seeing super low framerates, it may not even be rendering with the NV GPU at all. Keep in mind, EVERYTHING gets rendered to the Intel framebuffer in an Optimus laptop.

Optimus generates a LOT of problems in Linux, especially when it comes to actually using the dGPU properly. Now is really a bad time to get into it unless you're really prepared to get your hands dirty and figure it out.

I'd also suggest updating to the 361 series driver. A HUGE amount of work has been going into PRIME support (including reverse-prime! yay!). Better yet, jump on the latest 364.12 version as it changed dramatically in implementation.

 

Optimus, seriously!? That should have been mentioned in line 1. Thanks Stooj, that's a game changer for this problem.

 

wait, are you talking about Hotkeys? Command Center? under Windows you are not obliged to have it installed for proper GPU work. any model i have tried.

 

It's a N155RD according to the other post

But I guess it's easier to get mad than work the problem. Optimus was an absolute $#!+fight on my old W230SS but I did get it working with Bumblee eventually under Linux Mint. Even then, I never did any real gaming on it, just did it more out of curiosity. It's still a LONG way away from what I'd consider stable or consumer ready.

 

Blargh. My bad for not looking up the specs, I did read the other thread

 

I believe that control center is a program that taps into the power settings of the computer, it has a game mode, a power mode, etc... I do not use it. There is no need for it. All that can be managed from the power settings of the machine, and the GPU works perfectly one without it. on my other Laptops, this is the 5th Cleve I get, I always installed the OS myself and skipped all that bloatware

 

I think the control center does control some things that ONLY it can control. An example is the keyboard backlight brightnesses/colors. However, I find it very annoying and don't use it myself.

I made a post about how much I hate it a while back here: http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/sagers-proprietary-control-center.785695/#post-10163976

 

Before the start, I want to make sure that we are in the same understanding. You may think I am stupid and I do not understand the real problem but I do not think it is a drive or Optimus or Linux problem. The thing is broken from the inside. I mean hardware level. Anyway, I want to thank you all for help, I will try every suggestion that may help to solve my problem.

It was a late night I did try some little things but did not work out. I will goo deeper tonight. I think that I may use overclocking feature to solve my problem. But still some interesting things going on with my monitor etc. Anyway, firstly, I should focus first MHz thing, I guess.

Checking the options that maximize power was the first thing I did when I open the Nvidia-settings and I did changes accordingly. Ha ha I like this expression in English "get your hands dirty". I am ready for it! Also, I am sure I am rendering with GPU.I can see the utilization using command tool that Cuda provides. This update thing may work but I need to install another ubuntu to try on it. It will probably crash my system...

EDIT: Nvidia official site gives me this drive:
Version: 361.28
Release Date: 2016.2.9
Operating System: Linux 64-bit
Language: English (US)
File Size: 83.28 MB

But Ubuntu users say that never install that you download from Nvidia.I read this several times. Also, I checked Ubuntu repository latest drive is 352. (I may have missing repository)

EDIT 2: My mistake. This ppa:graphics-drivers/ppa provides various drivers.

That is how it should be. My hypothesis is that If you needed Control Center to get GPU working this thing is broken. It is not Linux's or any other 3th party's fault.

 

I don't think anybody is suggesting you're stupid or anything like that. But for the most part we are lacking information to help you and to make matters worse you are jumping to a HUGE conclusion that it's a hardware problem when, even in Windows in your other thread, it is demonstrably a software problem by installing Clevo CC. All Clevo CC does is some basic P-State controlling. This is no more advanced than most other GPU overclocking tools or something like NVidia Inspector is capable of doing.

The GPU clocking is completely controlled in the software realm. Whether that be by a user-land program or deep into the vBIOS. Fact is, that's software. The only time I've ever seen a hardware trigger a GPU clock change is from thermal throttling or power constraints. The power controller is the only bit of hardware that can even attempt to enforce a GPU clock change.

To be honest, it could just be the Nouveau driver doing it, if it wasn't correctly blacklisted. The Nouveau driver currently doesn't support the higher P-States of the Maxwell GPUs (outside or bleeding edge builds that is).

I was not referring to the maximize power setting. In Optimus laptops there is "PRIME Profiles" section where you can select the GPU. It's a crude switching mechanism (have to reboot) but it does work and you get "most" of your performance out of it.

My suggestion is to have a solid read here (and the related bumblebee/PRIME pages):
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/NVIDIA_Optimus

So far, Bumblebee+Primus is the closest implementation of a "True" hybrid graphics mode (ie off-loading rendering of a window to the dGPU and copying the framebuffer into X transparently without having to restart and rendering the desktop itself with the Intel iGPU).

What you really need to understand, is no matter what you do, the Intel GPU is what is REALLY throwing graphics up to your screen in an Optimus system. The big downside to this, is short of the Nvidia PRIME included with the proprietary driver, the other methods will suffer in performance (Bumblee and Nouveau/PRIME)/

This PPA provides the 364.12 beta driver now which is worth trying. I'm using on my desktop and laptop currently (neither are Optimus though).

No matter how you slice it, GPU clocking is a software problem.

On a related note, the Displayport on the N155RD is directly wired to the Nvidia GPU. This will remain black under Linux no matter what you do, because you have to run a separate X server directly on the NV GPU to use it. I have no idea if it's even possible to run both simultaneously AND share screens in the traditional fashion as that would require Reverse-Prime to work as well.
HDMI is split off the Intel iGPU so that should work in a dual-monitor situation as normal.