Did i make a mistake going with 1080 instead of 1440 or even 4k?

Hey everyone,

So here's the question in regards to my next laptop lol, i went ahead with my purchase of a EVOC P870DM3 17.3
From HIDevolution thats going to replace my 6 year old AW M17x R3.

Top of the line everything in regards to spec except for the screen.

Will i regret the screen size i chose over the next couple years?

Just like the AW i plan on taking extra good care of the Evoc and will use it for as long as i can.

 

J00 did the right thing. Read this please: http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...his-right-mind-buy-a-4k-screen-laptop.776830/

I would never buy anything more than a FHD screen on a 17.3 inch laptop even if you gave it to me for free.

If I had an 18.4" laptop then Maybe I might consider 1440p although Not excited about the tiny text. 4K? Heck not unless it was a 34" inch screen so forget laptops. This is coming from a guy who has good eye sight.

And no I will not deal with the garbage scaling methods of Windows

 

Wow that got me convinced pretty quick, thanks a lot @Phoenix for the help/crazy fast reply.

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I tend to agree with Phoenix. Those higher resolutions on sub 18" screens tend to make for nice image quality, but scaling can be fickle and text can be difficult to see. I sometimes dread installing Win 10 on a 4K screen.

 

Thing is I tried a couple of 1440 and 4k screens but they were external ones and have no idea how it affects small sizes like 17-18".

But with that picture cleared up I doubt I'd need it to be the main screen on the laptop + I can always use an external big screen when I'm at home if/whenever needed.

I was surprised that the FHD screen option cancels out the single 1080 gfx card and was thinking shouldn't the higher res panels need the extra umph of SLI compared to FHD in regards to gaming and Fps?

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I've got a 27" 1440p screen at home, and it's absolutely fine at that size. 4K on a notebook is definitely not necessary, unless you're doing high precision visual work I guess, and even then, I'd probably say get something with a FHD screen and then push your workspace to a bigger external monitor with higher resolution.

 

Exactly what im gonna do, FHD is a go on the laptop.

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You made the best decision going with an FHD screen on your taptop! Good job!

 

I would also stay on 1080p on a laptop. My desktop is a 25" 1440p display, and it is nice, sharp and crisp. Cramming that many pixels into a 15-17" monitor is unnecessary.

Not to mention that you're then asking a mobile GPU to push up to 4x the pixels of a 1080p panel. And despite recent advances, even the best mobile display panel is subpar compared to a good desktop monitor. A desktop monitor is probably the same size/weight as an entire laptop.

And scaling issues.

I know there are people who swear by 4k on their laptops. I'd rather see them start to make better panels, rather than cram more pixels into them.

 

Nice topic. I was thinking of getting a 4k 15inch laptop and realized it's not necessary

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Hilarious meme... but, yeah... 4K on a laptop is (in my opinion) is absolutely miserable unless you set 200% scaling and doing that sucks as bad as text being too small to read at 100% scaling. I've tried and tried for many hours on multiple laptops to tweak things enough to make 4K good and I have never been satisfied with the outcome. I wouldn't want 4K on a laptop screen even if it were offered as a free upgrade.

I do like 2560 x 1440 though. On a 15-inch screen it's almost too much (borderline, yet still acceptable) but on 17- or 18-inch screens it's very nice at 100% scaling.

I can just about guarantee you would hate it, especially on a 15-inch screen. I had an XPS 15 with a truly gorgeous 15-inch 4K screen for a few months and I cannot express how horrible the experience of using that screen was. If you set 200% scaling (default setting for 4K) you have the exactly same usable screen real estate as a 1080p screen and nothing will scale correctly. Text on menus and inside of Windows dialogue boxes will be truncated and some applications won't function correctly at all. The scaling problem can even include incorrect mouse cursor placement in some older applications.

 

You are the legendary Fox. Thanks for this.



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Sure thing, bro. I like my friends to be happy with their choices. Glad to share my experience.

 

Agreed 100% with @Phoenix, 1080p is the way to go on laptops. I have no need for any higher resolution than that. 1440p is nice but I still prefer 1080p on laptops.

 

Short answer: No
Long answer: No, no you did not.

 

I rather you spend more money for IPS or even GSync rather than higher resolution.

The "quality" of a screen is not depicted by its resolution only

 

Or heck, if you really want 1440P onwards, just use HDMI out to a much bigger display that can actually support those resolutions properly!

 

Me too on the monitor front. I am eyeing up the super wide 144hz monitors for my next screen.

 

Laptop: 1080p tops
Monitor: 27" 1440p tops lol

 

Ditto

 

is it possible to upgrade the 1080p panel yourself at a later date, with a 1440p 120hz gysnc? or would we be stuck with the 1080p for the life of the laptop

 

If you can find a compatible panel, then sure. You might want to inquire with your reseller on warranty risk.

 

ok thanks i ll find out!

 

why is there people who say they love their 4k igzo xps tho? scaling cant be different for everyone if they have the same panel and OS.
i had a 28 inch 4k monitor and even then i had the text problem, but thats all software dependant. the actual desktop scaling was much better than my 1440p monitor

 

Because the people that like it have a different opinion. People should buy whatever makes them happy. I just don't want anyone to make a terrible mistake buying something because it is a popular fad and end up hating it. That has happened to a lot of people as well. Many have posted their regrets about buying a 4K laptop. That's why I share my hate for 4K... to make people stop and think before spending money.

 

im trying to get help finding out what i need and im getting both opinion for/against. im looking for a gaming/cad/editing laptop and the alienware 15 with a 4k igzo screen is pretty well priced (good storage/good color gamut/good enough gpu for medium settings at 4k) but i cant get any proper help because only people who hate 4k are replying instead of the people who actually own the system. and one of them sent me to read this thread, but its nothing new scaling well never be perfect until all the programs are fixed. windows desktop already scales great to 4k at 28 and 32' its just the indiviual programs that dont

 

4K screens = the biggest curse that happened to laptops and is marketed as the best thing made ever since sliced bread

Example: Lenovo Yoga 15 inch Flip screen laptop with a 4K screen! *** oh but it requires 250% DPI scaling to see anything sir, sorry, enter the world of misalignment **

 

Displays are a bit like laptops as there is no perfect machine for everyone nor display.

 

My Yoga 2 Pro has a 3K screen (3200x1800) on a 13-inch computer, and I absolutely hate it, so I pretty much just gave it to my wife. I have a 28-inch 4K monitor now, which is the absolute minimum size I would consider acceptable for such resolution. Scaling has improved with every major Windows 10 update, making productivity tasks quite good. Playing older games (2008-14 era) in 4K on the GTX 1070 is a phenomenal experience, but 1440p really is the sweet spot for a 27-28-inch monitor, especially if you want to avoid scaling. I would never consider anything higher than 1080p on a built-in notebook display. My old MacBook Pro 15's 1680x1050 screen was just about perfect from a resolution standpoint.

 

Let me throw in my 2 cents -

4K screens BGA Craptops = the biggest curse that happened to laptops and is marketed as the best thing made ever since sliced bread.

 

Without the thinner gaming machines the bottom would have dropped out of the market and it would be a lot smaller than it is as a whole.

 

Windows manages high DPI screens like cr#p...period.

You want correct dpi scaling ? Go for a mac but forget about demanding games once you do that.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure people who bought LGA/Maxwell laptops are pretty happy with their non-upgradeable maxwell card. How can you be sure that volta will be upgrade-friendly for pascal mxm laptops ?

 

Maxwell non-upgradable? P870DM - 1070 is already out there. 1080 may be around the corner. What's non-upgradable about that? LGA non-upgradable? If Kaby Lake support is added after release, then what's the beef?

 

Can you install a 1070 MXM GPU in a P870DM from the 980M/980 era ? I don't see any upgrade from 980 to a 1080...for the P870DM2 yes you have pascal GPU but what's the point in having an MXM card if in the end you'll have to change the whole barebone in order to upgrade the GPU ?

I don't know 100% for P870DM upgrade from 980 to 1080 @Phoenix @HTWingNut might know better, but we cannot upgrade the MXM cards of the msi GT80 that's for sure, MSI had to put in place an exchange program for that...

regarding the CPU lga is super cool, I have nothing to say about it, but in general CPU upgrades are way less important than a GPU upgrade for gamers/workstation.

 

Where did you see that?

 

You probably haven't seen the posts regarding the Eurocom 1070 GTX upgrade. No sweat... Here you go:
Video regarding the Sky X9 and the 1070 - (note, the Eurocom Sky X9 is based on the P870DM (original) @Mr. Fox did a review on that model) -

In regards to the 1080? Nothing substantial, just a murmur - http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...-the-gtx-1070-mxm.795116/page-2#post-10377613

Regardless, getting back to the original meaning of the post (non-upgradeable BGA vs. @wickette's post), I think the 'non-upgradeable' tag applied to a Maxwell/LGA laptop (in at least the case of the P870DM) is now defunct.

 

I completely agree with you on this one. You either go FHD 120Hz or go home on the DM3.

The 1440p display disappoints me.

 

This is a valid point, as there are no guarantees.

But my revulsion about BGA is not about upgradeable components. No. My gripe with BGA is that all your eggs are in one basket. If one component goes, they all go. I swear I even recently ran across a post where someone mentioned the memory is soldered to the mobo as well? This consumer will gladly scream, "ARE YOU INSANE! NO THANKS!!"

 

Yes that's sadly true, but as long as you're under warranty, if THEY have to pay for a whole new motherboard each time something happens it's their problem.

Regarding the P870DM GPU upgrades I did state that I do not know for sure, but some MXM laptops (MSI...) aren't upgradeable, my point is that it's not sure that an MXM laptop can upgrade to the next generation of GPUs, it always depend on Nvidia's mood, tbh I would prefer that they keep both : MXM and soldered so we can have slim gaming laptop, and more bulky dtr powerhouse.

 

And when the warranty ends? (Hint: take a look at my sig / 6+yr old lappy)

Anyway, we're taking this thread way OT. We can get back to LCD choices of FHD vs. QHD.

 

I'm curious as to why you feel that way. I'm rather happy with it.

Just to add . 1440p is borderline for me on a 17" screen. I found 1080p to be more comfortable all in all but I have no regrets. It's a nice happy medium if you're looking for a little more fidelity and 1080p is still great on a 17".

 

I was thinking of spending for the 4k on a 15in i'm specing out but I was curious if it was worth it... sounds like it would be underwhelming and maybe even an issue with scaling in windows, for the price you have to pay. Thanks!

 

Laptop screens are in the pit of the uncanny valley when it comes to ultra-high resolutions. They work fine on smaller phones and larger monitors/TVs but not so much on the 13-17 inches of a notebook.

Scaling has been improved in Windows 10 since the creator's update, but it's still far from the level of perfection achieved by Mac OS. I love having 4K on my external monitor, but hate it on the built-in display of my Yoga 2 Pro.

 

I think that's the main reason to be honest, we should be able to just it as extra fidelity rather than making the virtual real estate bigger.

 

Agree completely. I don't know exactly the reason, but 4K on a 15" screen just never seems to work exactly right, and even on 17" it's a little weird. I don't see myself getting 4K on anything smaller than 30" unless there's no other option or it's the cheapest thing that meets my other reqs. (1440p on a 27" is working great for me)

 

Microsoft should really fix upscale issues. in a 15" 4K@200% zoom it's the same has having FullHD but with extra crisp detail
Unfortunately, upscaling in windows is horrible. Even for developers it's a nightmare. There is a reason not even Steam works properly.

 

I predict that scaling issues will be addressed according to adoption rate, lower res is still on top of the numbers game.

 

Considering a company the size of Microsoft, not having something like the Device Manager display properly on Windows 10 is a disgrace.
Not having a clear and proper way to support upscale on a XAML, C#, .NET windows application is a disgrace.
The adoption rate excuse doesn't cut it for me, since they sell they own brand of computers with high-dpi displays (Surface line).

Microsoft is the main culprit for low adption of high-dpi displays.

 

I didn't mean for it to sound like an excuse. I meant for it to sound like they are not known for caring about a market segment until it accounts for a significant amount of units moved. It sucks, and it's going to continue to suck until everything moves to 4K and they are forced to do something about it. And all they have to do to look like they're perfectly competent in the eyes of consumers and shareholders is preempt that tipping point by a tiny bit so they can say they're ready for the shift to higher res. Once again, not saying it's a good thing, it was a prediction based on how they've operated in the past.