Disappointed, what would you do?

I just sent back my HP...and am now using an Asus G75 but still not happy. I thought problem solved...I'll get a Sager!! I wanted the NP9170 with the 7970m but low and behold, now I see the issues with the card and Sager/Clevo.
Does anyone have any suggestions as to where/what I should look at next? I really was hoping that Sager would save the day for me but with the issues I've had with Alienware, HP and quirks with the Asus I'm about to pull out my hair, the last thing I need is issues with a PC that is brand new again.
Would any of you purchase this PC knowing what you know now about the video issues?

 

AMD and sager are both aware of the enduro situation at this point. Drivers will be released soon due to awareness I would hope, here and elsewhere. However, the negative side effects don't affect everyone and only in some games.

Optimus took multiple generations to get mostly working functionality. We should expect same for enduro.

I'd say go for it and get a p170em with 7970m!

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2

 

My experience has been absolutely awesome so far, but I have a 680m. Would I buy this machine again? Yes, but probably not with the 7970m.

Just my two cents.

 

Do consider the Nvidia options like the 670M (equal to the Asus) 675M or 680M. The Sager itself is a great computer its just the 7970M drivers which is causing some disappointment.

 

If you want the best, get the Sager NP9170 with the nVIDIA GeForce GTX 680M 256bit w/4GB GDDR5. Absolutely amazing performance, smooth and with much better tessellation than the AMD, and no significant driver issues.

 

get 680M whole life, AMD isn t worth at all atm. Ull just waste ur money on something that is absolutely immature, unless u can buy an AW or Clevo HM model which will let u disable the useless integrated GPU....

 

I'll say it also, same machine different card. Get the P170 with the Nvidia 680M. Thats what I did. :yes:

 

You should just buy that Clevo with GTX 680M and forget about 7970M and the amateurs that work for AMD who still are unable to make good drivers

 

Yea, get a GTX 680M if you have the extra money to do so. If you don't the 7970M will still perform better than anything else and it will only improve with newer drivers.

 

680GTX all the way. wouldnt touch ati with a barge pole even if it and the drivers were working perfectly.

 

Clevos are excellent computers. By buying Clevo you'll be trading out the slim and light build for a cheaper yet more powerful configuration (and usually very sturdy build).

Clevo in itself has no problems, it's the new Enduro technology with 7970M that is causing trouble when used in some Clevo laptops. Nvidia 675M GTX is an excellent card too for a very similar price, sometimes much cheaper, although it is very power hungry. And as everyone pointed out, if you can afford to pay $300+ extra, you'll get the 680M GTX which is a whole new architecture over 675M and improves both performance and power consumption at the same time. If you're into overclocking, then you'll love the 680M more than you ever would 7970M. A good tactic may be to lower the configuration for some other easily upgradable components like RAM and HDD to lower the price, and then upgrade those by yourself later.

But of course, you can take the 7970M and hope that new drivers will solve the enduro issues someday. It's risky, and it's up to you whether it's worth it to take. And even if it won't be fully fixed, 7970M is a very powerful card even with the enduro issues, so you're not throwing your money to the trash either way if that's what you're worried about.

 

My mind is 1xEM with 680m for avoid any problem enduro. We cant be sure how soon this issue solved and how. We just assume that its linked to software/drivers. If not?

 

I am having the same issues.. I was all set for the 7970 and then I started to look at all the issues with it and all the custom DIY mods people are doing just to get it to cool properly and I got turned off. 680 sounds like its pretty similar to the 7970 but at a much higher premium. I looked at desktop builds and even Alienware and MSI optioons and while Alienware looks like it has a kickass keyboard and build quality it still is a Dell and has bloatware and all sorts of things that hold you back.

If I dont see any changes in the next few days before I order I have to get a 680 for me and a 670-675 for my wife.. heat issues with a laptop are really the worst, but because its from new tech and driver issues it should be easier to fix the issue.. not sure if waiting possible months would be worth it.

 

I don't see myself switching to the 680M and most likely will stick with my 7970M, but for those buying brand new go for the 680M. While my 7970M performs just fine for the work I do and games I play, I acknowledge the problems with Enduro does exist. So for me, things can only get better. For everyone else though, who might be into a bigger variety of games, just be on the safe side and go for the 680M.

EDIT: Making some words and phrases bold to help those whose problems extends beyond their 7970M (i.e., vision, reading and comprehension, etc.)

 

I have zero heating issues. Even without my laptop cooler, my laptop runs on the cool side. Honestly. Those with overheating problems have one or more of the following combination and possible others:

-modding and tweaking hardware or software (OC'ing, custom drivers, etc.)
-defective cards (rare, but happens)
-warm surroundings

My CPU and GPU are in the 40s at idle. During gaming and benchmarks (with or without my laptop cooler), I can't get it to go past 86*C. Maybe if I pointed a hair dryer at my laptop I can get it to go to 90+ but who does that? Lol.

 

I do notice you have the second sstep I7 cpu which had me thinking that the 3610 is one of the causes of the really bad performance.

I did start looking at laptop coolers so glad to see that not everyone has issues and I dont plan to dink around in my laptop.. I build my desktops and want a nice "out of the garage" feeling to my laptop so I can play and use it without always tinkering with things.

 

Seriously, STOP downplaying the 7970M problems. They are here and they are real.
We don`t care if YOU picked the longest straw and got lucky, the fact is that people still have heat issues with this card and various other issues. Its like the Xbox 360 owners trying to say that the failure rates of the console was a big hoax just because their console worked just fine. But the fact was that 30%+ of the first Xbox consoles had big hardware issues.

With 7970M it seems like a big gamble. Some work just fine, other does not.

 

Well its not just that. Prospective consumers should get a fair representation of the percentage that work and the percentage that don't. If it is closer to 30-50% that have problems, it isn't fair that all you read about is negative reaction. It is helpful to read that people are having good results as well. Just look at it that way

Usually on the internet it takes little fuel to start fires.

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2

 

I like the fact that people say they are running fine on a 7970 in a thread like this.. as long as its not a flame fest hearing all sides can only be beneficial.

 

People who say they are running fine simply arent aware that they have that issue. This under-utilization problem affects all EM series 7970m cards exactly the same.

 

Comments like this doesn't help anyone who are seeking for advice on purchasing a new laptop.

Why? Because if you statement stands true that means buying a HD7970M is risking his money and what if he gets an unlucky HD7970M?

If you get an "unlucky" HD7970M you can only hope they'll fix it, if you have the money, get a GTX680M and never look back.

 

What? I'm lost here.

Did you read my previous post? Did you notice that post was a direct response to someone's post? That someone is trying to decide which to get and is mislead into thinking that 7970M's have overheating problems. Should I pretend that mine also has overheating problems when in fact I do NOT?

I'm not here to defend the 7970M. If I were buying this laptop all over again, knowing what I know now, I would choose the 680M. Money isn't an issue for me when it comes to buying a laptop. When I say my 7970M is fine, please, please, READ what I wrote in that same sentence and don't take it out of context. Here, I'll repeat myself once again: My 7970M works fine for the work I do and the games I play.

YES, it has problems and yes I am affected by the problem as all 7970M users are.

BUT for the stuff I do with my laptop, the 7970M doesn't cripple me. If it did, I'd do what fenryr did and call up Malibal and get the 680M. $295? I have it, cash in hand.

I'm sorry but for those who want me to trash the 7970M, I just can't. This is the same reason I started that thread thinking my 7970M is just fine. I was in a personal quest to find out if my 7970M and everyone else who has one is affected and the conclusion is we are. Okay, so I'm not exempted. But am I getting frustrated by the issues? No. It's not apparent to me. STOP trying to force your issues with others who use their computers differently from YOU. We don't mirror your tasks or play with the games you do. What do you want me to say? I'm suffering over here and experiencing problems with games that I don't play? If you play a game where the Enduro issues are RIGHT IN YOUR FACE but I don't, that's not my problem is it?

 

If this post was aimed at me, please read and reread my post above.

I've noticed quite a few here are willing to get into it with others without even reading first.

 

I know two people personally that are completely happy with their 7970m. Neither has heating problems and they have great FPS in all the games they play. The only thing they've both said they have issues with is that some games run off the HD4000 graphics the first time launching. They said all they have to do is change the setting to make it run off the 7970m and thats it. Some games still report as running off the HD4000 but they actually are running on the 7970m. I should have mine in a week or two hopefully since the order was placed on Monday. I'll give my experience when it comes in. If it's all doom and gloom you'll be the first to know.

The people crying about down playing the issues I think just as equally could be told to stop "up playing" the issues. Or maybe they are just trying to justify to themselves that spending the extra $300 on the 680 was worth it?

 

Exactly. Enduro issues doesn't equate to bad graphic card last I checked. Meaning the card, if in use even with bad drivers (or other exaggerations), is still usable for some games. Some games will expose the problem, some won't. If you're like me and you play the not-so-demanding games, the 7970M will run just fine. Believe me, if it didn't I'd be all over the 680M right now. $295 is a lot of money, but I have it and I won't break a sweat spending it. So if anyone wants to accuse me of defending the 7970M because it's my purchase, you can drop it right now because if I can justify $295 (meaning a game I play NEEDS it), I'll drop $295 like it had cockroaches.

 

I'm in a similar situation to the OP, and I've decided to wait. I'm actually considering going down to the NP6370 instead of the NP9170. The 660m card has similar performance to the 670m and the laptop is much less expensive. I absolutely can't afford the 680m in the NP9170 right now and while the 7970m is better for most games than the other options, I can't see spending that much and worry that it will have the same problems in Guild Wars 2 or whatever the next game is that it has now in BF3.

 

Why not wait for the next GPU's rather than getting old technology?

 

That's quite the wait, the new GPUs just came out.

 

I will probably give Clevo/AMD a couple of months time to fix the issues and if the they aren't solved then, I will seriously consider getting the 680m. On the meantime, for example BF3 plays smooth as butter eventhough the FPS drops to below 25 at times. Weird.

 

You guys are awesome! So much input and support. I do not do a lot of gaming but have always tried to buy a great system, if I want the power I know it is available. I'm still uder a return period for the Asus. I also still have my other PC was plauged with all kinds of issues ALL the time (M17x)
Maybe I'll wait a few weeks and see if things clear with the 7970M I really do not want to spend the extra om the 680's just because what I did want is a gamble, I been down that road with the AW and had mill fill of issues. I'll have another 30 days to think about it but there again....there are free memory upgrades and hard drives upgrades at this time. Oy buying PC's has almost become a full time job doing research, once burned, never again. I hope those of you having issues get them cleared up ASAP.
Thanks again I am learning a lot.

 

Welcome to laptops, sucks doesnt it? I have 3k in the bank waiting for any company to get off their lazy butt and make a decent laptop so far no one has bothered. Pretty pathetic really. It is no wonder people think apple is so great, not that apple is just that the competition is so bad.

 

Whoa that is a pretty extreme opinion.

Sent from my EVO using Tapatalk 2

 

Research ahead of time. So far my NP9150 is the perfect laptop for me. I sprung for the 680m over a faster CPU and am very happy for that. I also will have a CPU upgrade path in the future if desired/needed and likely a 50-75% performance increase GPU upgrade in the future unless they change the MXM slot for the next gen laptop. There are always compromises, but IMHO with the Clevo/Sager laptops the compromises are minor. Worse thing about my laptop is that the keyboard has ghosting issues with certain key combinations in games, that's about it, and nothing a $50 USB keyboard can't fix if really needed. The CPU performs as expected, the GPU performs better than I could have ever expected at stock and with a solid 25% fps improvement with overclock.

 

I am researching ahead of time which is why I still have my money and I am throwing it at the screen trying to get anyone to take it. If I did not research I would be like the OP who has returned multiple laptops.

The NP9150 might be perfect for you but I think a gaming laptop should have a 120hz screen, we need that to play against the desktop users who have them and CRTs. With clevo it is fairly baffling that they do not offer the option and no one has a clue why.

They keyboard is also a killer, cant game if you cant press the keys really is it too much to ask for a $2000 laptop to have the features of a $15 keyboard? Maybe the problematic steel series keyboard fixes this, who knows.

 

I bought a P150EM with the 7970m and I am giving Sager / AMD until mid august before I order a 680m...I find it that bad.

 

So you're saying that both the CPU and GPU in these Sagers can be upgraded without having to change motherboards?

 

Likewise... it needs to be fixed soon.

 

Lol. I'm not heavily on one side or the other, but really? If 30-50% of a product is bad, it's not fair to only hear a bad reaction? lol... if "3"% are bad that is a REALLY bad percentage. If half the cards have that problem, they should seriously be considering a full recall/flat out refund.

Truth is, the 7970m isn't that bad, and it will get better (most likely... so far attempts at driver fixes have been mostly failures). That being said, the problems are real, and not JUST real, they are also COMMON. Every time someone comes on to complain about theirs, someone else asks "is it really that bad?" and then the same 5 lucky people with fully working 7970m's come on and say "no no they are fine." They're not fine. People should be warned that chances are good they will have a rough experience with it, especially if they really plan on using it for a wide variety of games.

 

I seriously wonder when utilization/enduro will be fixed, might be many months ahead.

 

haha you do make a good point. I just made up some numbers but those are definitely high enough to warrant recall/refund lol. Anyways, I don't even have the 7970m lol. I just prefer to see a fair representation. People should know the potential issues and due research pays off, but these reviews/complaints make the card sound unsuable - which I highly doubt. Like you, I am on neither side and have no stakes one way or the other. I need to stop responding to random nbr threads.

 

I am a bit disappointed of course, my NP9170 arrives on Monday with the 7970M. However, I was fully aware of the issues that plague some users.

The 7970M simply offers a certain performance at a certain price point that is unbeatable. Had the 675m been only slightly weaker than the 7970M I would have opted for it. Had the 680M been only moderately more expensive than the 7970M ... same story. But as it stands I wouldn't mind doing some DIY and digging to circumvent some of the issues till AMD/Sager solve the issue. If that doesn't happen, It'll just be noted for the next time I stand before an AMD product. Perhaps I'm lighter on AMD than most because most of those games affected are games I don't play. I mostly play WoW, EvE online, some Dota, SC2 ... might give Diablo a try, so short of a report I read about performance issues in Diablo at certain exotic settings, I'm not too worried, but I fully understand and sympathize with those who want the card to perform 100% as it should from the get-go.

By the way, do these issues affect every manufacturer supplying the 7970M in their laptop line-ups, or is it just Sager?

 

You don't need 120fps for anything unless you plan to compete in world championship Quake or Starcraft match. 99% of people probably can't even tell the difference between 60fps and 120fps. Check this thread for example: http://forum.notebookreview.com/gaming-software-graphics-cards/680800-max-settings-vs-60fps.html
3 out of 37 so far prefer 60+ FPS over graphics. And I think I saw one person in the comments even mention 120.

In this case you might want to consider the AMD card depending on what exactly you're doing. 680M's main downside is that it's rather bad at compute tasks, even worse than the older Nvidia GPUs. Nvidia left that job for their $2000+ quadro cards and focused GeForce on gaming. I can't explain what compute is exactly because I don't fully know myself, but I do know that it's involved in 3D rendering (maya, blender) and something that Photoshop CS6 does.

 

Can probably mod the driver and turn it into a Quadro K5000m tho. Both are an underclocked GTX670.

 

Remember fanbois taint the issue, AMD and Nvidia have their fair share of issues respectively, Nvidia went through this with optimus not long ago, but memories are short.

I own only AMD video cards, in fact every friend or person who buys on my advice have switched, and I hear nothing but accolades for dropping Nvidia. But Nvidia makes great hardware, and nothing wrong with buying it. I just do not.

Also you can get bad chips from either company, and both have had a history of ignoring customers for some time on such issues. So please do not think one is any better then the other, at any given time one can be better then the other, but it is not a constant.

Remember, those who love what they own will downplay issues, I had a VW owning friend who you'd think from him that VW saved the world. "Best care he ever owned", yet door handles fell off, windows couldnt roll down, electrical failed uncoutnable times, trunk could not be opened, i mean it went on. owned on GM and it had one problem and it sucked!!! yet VW was the best, go figure (no I am not a GM fanboi, honest Ford Fanboi).

AMD vs Nvidia vs Intel brings out the same stuff, I am self admitted AMD fanboi, but I own a Intel CPU right now, fact is Bulldozer is not a good CPU for my needs, though Intel chipsets frankly are terrible.

AMD vs Nvidia boils down to this: we need them both, to keep each other honest and working hard to continue to bring us awesome technology. Plain and simple, one goes away, the other stagnates, and we will pay for it.

Buy what YOU feel is the best, but be wary of fanboi-ism, 7970m has Enduro teething issues, no one can deny it, same issues Nvidia had recently, and like Nvidia they will get solved. Nvidia has the upper hand, as they all ready fought and wont this battle, AMD is hip deep in theirs.

 

+rep good post.

 

For the most part I agree with this post, but there is one glaring flaw. People aren't "overlooking" the fact that Nvidia had problems with optimus when it first came out, or the fact that it took a long time to fix. It's not "overlooking" it, because it doesn't actually matter NOW. Right now, optimus works, and enduro doesn't. Right now, Nvidia provides smooth, fairly hassle free experience that doesn't require too much DIY unless you want to tweak stuff. Right now, a good number of 7970 + clevo owners are having heating issues because the heatsink connection between the two isn't great.

If anything, the Nvidia troubles with optimus back then lend evidence (not proof, just implication) that the enduro issues may be around for quite some time, and may not have a quick, easy fix.

 

most lightbulbs we have are 60 hertz. so when you turn on a light and cannot see any flashes, i dont see why you would need anything over that when playing games

 

by that logic, most films are 24fps, they look smooth, so why bother with more fps? lets just cap it at 24

 

Unless you're doing some crazy drugs, you shouldn't have any sort of moving images in your lightbulb. In the same respect, if you plan on using your monitor as a light, and just leave the screen white all the time, then lower hz refresh rates are fine.

Truth is, 60 hz is generally acceptable. Anyone who says that's all the human eye can handle, though, is mistaken. There is a noticeable difference when using higher hz for something aside from watching videos. I've never really understood why a movie looks fine at 24 fps, but games look awful that way.That being said, apparently movies look really weird when filmed at 60fps (or so I've heard... it was an issue with the new Hobbit movie).

One of the major advantages to increased hz when gaming is the ability to get maximum framerate without tearing or artifacts. The conscience mind may not be able to pick out one specific frame from another, but the brain can tell the difference and it appreciates the smoothness, as it more closely resembles what it's used to in real life. For that matter, if someone suddenly came out with a 1200hz monitor and a gpu that could readily put out 1200fps, your brain would look at the screen and say, "ahhhh.... this is how it should be". Even if you can't specifically see any difference, it will put less stress on your eyes and brain.

 

Agreed whole heartedly, +rep to that post.

Whatever problems users want to discuss on NBR, this is the one thing I know. There isn't a single game I've tried with full on max settings that the 7970M doesn't play with smooth framerate. Yeah it's not 60 FPS constant, but I play games for fun, I'm not competitive. I don't need a monster machine doing 120FPS. If I set a game to max settings with 2x AA and I get smooth gameplay, I think that's marvelous considering this is a 15" notebook.

So hopefully, you won't be disappointed and you will be stunned and amazed when you can play Crysis 2 full on Ultra with smooth framerate.