Intel's Upcoming Huron River platform

I think its time to start a thread on the Intel's upcoming Huron River platform, rumoured to be released in Q1 2011. The platform is developed in the 32nm architecture and uses largely the same architecture as the Sandy Bridge desktop platform . It should further transition to 22nm in Q4 2011 - Q1 2012 (Ivy Bridge).
This is what I have managed to gather so far (I will try to keep this post updated):



The CPUs
The CPUs of the Huron River platform will be based on the Sandy Bridge architecture, in fact they are most often referred to as Mobile Sandy Bridge. Overall, Sandy Bridge should be more power efficient than the current offerings. Intel has stated that it has set itself the goal of making the notebooks of this platform able to play two Blu-ray discs on a single charge. Sandy Bridge will also have a new set of instructions called Advanced Vector Extensions - AVX (a more advanced SSE) which will noticeably boost performance.

Intel reports that the top end dual-core Huron River CPU will be about 20% faster than the current top end Arrandale. The package size of the Mobile Sandy Bridge will be about 22% smaller than that of the current 32nm Westmere generation.

The Turbo boost has also been improved and now can go beyond the designated TDP for short periods of time, it's referred to as "Turbo 2.0". Intel claims Turbo Boost 2.0 will deliver more performance and more energy efficiency than its predecessor. It will incorporate new power averaging algorithms that should enable lower energy consumption and, more importantly, make more thermal headroom for overclocking ( Fud). Moreover, the new Turbo will also include the GPU core in its power sharing algorithm, helping to improve performance and power consumption.

The CPU is also supposed to be better integrated with the GPU. The GPU and CPU alongside the memory controller will be put on the same die, unlike separately as they are now with Arrandale.

As Fudzilla reports,just like Sandy Bridge, the Huron River platform will have 2 and 4 core CPUs (no 6 core CPUs for now), all supporting hyper-threading and integrated graphics. Also the CPUs will have display and some audio features integrated.

One of the downsizes of Sandy Bridge is the lack of overclocking potential. Intel has linked all busses to one Base Clock (100 MHz) which controls both the CPU speed and the speed of the USB ports and SATA connection. For this reason, overclocking the Base Clock will quickly lead to the USB ports and SATA connections to fail. Thus overclocking will only be possible for multiplier unlocked CPUs. For notebooks there is no support for memories with unlocked multipliers, so memory overclocking is also out of the question.

As a last note, the new Sandy Bridge CPUs will all use a slightly different socket than current CPUs.

According to some leaked roadmaps these are the first mobile Sandy Bridge CPUs to make it to the market:

[/TR]

"Sandy Bridge" processor for notebooks
Model	Cores / threads	Clock / Turbo	L3 cache	DDR3	Intel GPU EUs	GPU Frequency Normal / Turbo	TDP
Core i7-2920XM	4 / 8	2,5 / 3,5 GHz	8 MB	1600 MHz ?	12	650 / 1300 MHz	55 W
Core i7-2820QM	4 / 8	2,3 / 3,4 GHz	8 MB	1600 MHz ?	12	650 / 1300 MHz	45 W
Core i7-2720QM	4 / 8	2,2 / 3,3 GHz	6 MB	1600 MHz ?	12	650 / 1300 MHz	45 W
Core i7-2620M	2 / 4	2,7 / 3,4 GHz	4 MB	1600 MHz ?	12	650 / 1300 MHz	35 W
Core i7-2540M	2 / 4	2,6 / 3,3 GHz	3 MB	1333 MHz	12	650 / 1150 MHz	35 W
Core i7-2520M	2 / 4	2,5 / 3,2 GHz	3 MB	1333 MHz	12	650 / 1150 MHz	35 W

</html>

Apparently the main performance gain is for the quads in the high-end sector, for Arrandale CPUs the gain is not really impressive. Also it's interesting that Intel maintains the same naming scheme with Calpella, just adding a "2" in front of the code-name. The 2920XM seems to be the only multiplier unlocked CPU for mobile Sandy Bridge. Also it seems that the high-end mobile Huron River CPUs will support 1600 MHz DDR3. This is not yet confirmed as desktop Sandy Bridge only supports 1333 MHz DDR3 and initial reports claimed that mobile Sandy Bridge will be limited to 1333 MHz.


Integrated GPU
The GPU will be made in 32nm instead of the current 45nm and for now only DirectX 10.1 support has been confirmed but DirectX 11 is still possible. Its turbo capabilities should be significantly improved.
Intel informed some of its partners that these new GPUs will be almost twice as fast as the current integrated GPUs of the Arrandale platform. In consequence these GPUs will be able to easily play 1080p content (current generation can only do 720p).

Some sources report that the high-end mobile quads of this platform will have 2 integrated GPUs. This has not been entirely confirmed and there is no information on why would Intel want to use 2 GPUs. It is possible that by using two GPU cores the chipset may be able to shut down one core and save power (longer battery life). Some pre-release benchmarks indicate that the integrated GPU is a decent performer and is able to challenge the low-end GPUs of Nvidia and ATI.

While there may be some differences between the Sandy Bridge GPU and the Huron River one, overall specifications should be similar:
• Sandy Bridge Graphics Support
• Integrated Displayport with up to 2560x1600 resolution
• Multi-monitor display with up to 4 displays: 2 Int, 2 USB2
• HDMI1.3 support with premium audio



Wireless
In Intel's good old tradition, a new generation of mini-PCIe wireless adapters supporting WiFi and Wimax, code named Rainbow Peak and Taylor Peak, will be released at the same time as the new chipset.
It will be IEEE 802.11a/g/n (2.4GHz/5GHz) compliant and have a 3x3 antenna. What is more interesting is that the wireless module will also have integrated bluetooth capabilities.

Also the platform will be able to stream 1080p content over the wireless to an external TV.

Also now Intel will offer its own Gigabit LAN adapter.

Chipset
The chipset (Intel Mobile Express Series 6) is code named Cougar Point and seems to be the same for the mobile, desktop and server platform with slight variations for each platform. For notebooks the following chipsets will be available: HM65, HM67, QM67 and QS67 - each version is aimed at a different type of PCs, Q chipsets are designed for business orientated machines while H are for consumer gradated laptops.
The mobile platform will support 2x DDR3 800, 1066 and 1333 and possibly 1600 MHz.
It has been confirmed that the new chipset will support SATA 6.0 GB/s but for home users the chipset will only support one SATA 6.0 connector. It appears that the platform will have native USB 3.0 support! Finally, the platform will get updated to version 10 of Intel's Matrix RAID Storage driver.
There is also a new feature called "Zero Power ODD" which should reduce the power consumption of ODDs by putting them in a sort of a sleep mode when needed.
Intel has also reported that Sandy Bridge will have an improved version of Intel Rapid Storage Technology which should improve battery life when playing DVDs or Blu-Rays.
The Huron River platform will support PCIe 3.0 16X or x8 for two cards, this feature like many others will be integrated in the platform's monolithic chip, however there are currently no specific details about SLI or CrossFire. More recent information suggests that the ability to switch between integrated and discrete GPUs will only be available for single GPU solutions. Crossfire and SLI configurations will not be able to use the integrated GPU. It is unclear at this point if this means that the mobile chipsets with dual-GPU support will be different from those that are designed just for one video card (for economic reasons this doesn't really make sense).

 

Shouldn't this perhaps be in the Hardware Components and Aftermarket Upgrades section?

 

It could be moved there, but the previous Calpella thread was also in the Clevo section and it went alright. Generally people who buy Clevo or Alienware will be more interested in the latest tech then the general users.

 

I've updated the post with new information.

I was wondering, if Huron River will support PCIe 3.0, will this require an update to the MXM slot ?

 

I thought about that too and my guess is not right away, since Sandy Bridge will still be able to handle PCIe 2.0, but a new MXM slot will likely be needed in a GPU generation or two.

So if not for the HD6000 series then I'd bet for the HD7000s and mobile Fermi in 2012.

 

This here folks is the post of the night! lol

ROTFLMAO

 

I'm just glad we will get quads in 32 nm finally. My guess is that not releasing a 32 nm clarksfield was to make sure they had a big enough gap to make all the performance hounds upgrade again. Sounds like this microarchitecture is another performance winner though.

 

Nice work Blacky enjoyed reading that, sounds very interesting indeed. Bit gutted myself that this wont be supported on the chipset in my 8690, but nothing lasts for ever in computer world. Might make this one a dektop project

I have one off/on topic question. By reading a post above im guessing desktop and mobile Fermi dont come hand in hand ? As desktop is scheduled for release around 26th of March.

 

Blacky's at it again.lol
Great post man will be looking for future updates but man 2011 is so far away.

 

I don't think it should require a new MXM slot, but we will definitely see one.
We need this badly in order to entertain our strong sense of tech "progress".
MXM 4.0c anyone?

 

I've been reading last night a little bit about PCIe 3.0 and it is designed to be backwards compatible with PCIe 2.0 cards and the changes overall are not that radical.

This is just a wild guess: If this is the case, then the MXM 3.0 might just be upgraded instead of being completely redesigned like it did from 2.1 to 3.0. In other words, current laptops would just get a motherboard revision where the MXM slot is just replaced in the laptops chassis but the overall motherboard design remains the same. In such case, you should still be able to just upgrade the motherboard, which some might do anyway in order to get Huron River support. I know that for my laptop a motherboard is around 200$ - 250 $ if bought from Clevo's service centre.

And thanx for the support guys, I will try to keep the post updated with new information.

 

That is if Clevo doesn't do a new system by then.

I mean, you are talking about 2011

 

Well, that is for desktops.

While you still have compatibility between the PCIe 1.0 devices and the PCIe 2.0 bus and the PCIe 2.0 devices and the PCIe 1.0 bus in the desktop space, we saw the "mighty" MXM 3.0b coming just to kill the upgrade-ability of all the previous high-end laptops when PCIe 2.0 has arrived into the laptops in 2009.

They even made 2 versions of 260M GTX and 280M GTX where the previous MXM 2.1 spec version did not have the SLI connector. They have spent money from their pocket to ablate the SLI connector in the MXM 2.1 versions just for the business as usual.

Therefore, I will not hold my breath that MXM 3.0b is the last iteration of the MXM series

 

Enjoy:
Intel briefly demos next-gen Sandy Bridge laptop platform at Computex -- Engadget

(Mobile Sandy Bridge)

 

To be honest I really don't find Huron River, or Sandy Bridge that exciting. For me personally I can buy mobile Core i7 or desktop Core i7 now with comfort, knowing that there isn't too much of a big deal with the new platform. A new instruction or two with a 20% performance boost and a bit more battery life just doesn't scream to me to buy it. When it makes the move to 22nm in Q4 2011, that's when it'll start getting good.

 

You should know then that the 22nm Ivy Bridge of 2011 is basically a die-shrink of Sandy Bridge. (at least that's what I know until now)

 

Yes I know that. That's why I said that's when it'll get good/be worth it.

 

Personally I'm more interested in what Llano will offer more than Sandy Bridge.

AMD should be showcasing one of their Fusion APU at Computex right about now and I look forward to reading about it in the morning.

 

Looks like PCIE 3.0 is about to go official but I wouldn't bet on it: PCI Express 3.0 to Be Announced on June 23 - Actual products slated for 2011 - Softpedia

 

Enjoy: Intel's Sandy Bridge CPUs to tape out ahead of schedule, could be with us this year -- Engadget

Looks like Sandy Bridge may come out earlier than expected.

 

Just in time for Santa perhaps?

 

That would be nice.

Any details on how they will handle the integrated GPU and the dedicated cards? I'm curious if the dedicated cards would power down and let the Intel gpu take over on the fly (like when idle or simply reading text).

 

We should get a better idea of when PCs using Sandy Bridge might be available at the Intel Developer Forum in San Francisco this September.

Intel Sandy Bridge Comes Out Ahead of Schedule - May debut this year instead of 2011 - Softpedia

 

Part of the Sandy Bridge/ Huron River CPU roadmap has been leaked:
Neue Roadmap: ?Sandy Bridge? entschlüsselt (Update) - 11.08.2010 - ComputerBase

Core i7-2920XM 4 / 8 2,5 / 3,5 GHz 8 MB 55 W
Core i7-2820QM 4 / 8 2,3 / 3,4 GHz 8 MB 45 W
Core i7-2720QM 4 / 8 2,2 / 3,3 GHz 6 MB 45 W
Core i7-2620M 2 / 4 2,7 / 3,4 GHz 4 MB 35 W
Core i5-2540M 2 / 4 2,6 / 3,3 GHz 3 MB 35 W
Core i5-2520M 2 / 4 2,5 / 3,2 GHz 3 MB 35 W

Looks like the new CPUs carry the same naming as the old ones with a "2" added in front.
The Arrandale CPUs don't seem to gain any speed except in Turbo boost. In fact the i7-(2)620 is slightly lower clocked then the upcoming i7-640 which runs at 2.80 GHz. The big improvement is for quad cores which all gain 400 Mhz over current offerings. The i7-2920XM looks good and I am 90% sure that they will later release (Q3 2011?) an i7-2940XM clocked at 2.66 Ghz.

 

Thanks for the update! I see 20% improvement in OP with a slightly lower clocked high-end dual core option. If that applies to quads as well, with the core clock increases on top, they will be beasts comparatively.

We also have to remember that all of these cores have an IGP (at least, that's what I was under the impression of), so the TDP of the 4 cores actually went down with speed going up. Interesting power scaling when you only have to drop 4 cores a few hundred MHz to be only 10W more in TDP than the dual-core cousins.

 

I like the new clocks! But these things are going to be power guzzlers, just like their older cousins. The refresh on these processors will be a lot like the current generation, one bin bumps.

Sure would like to see Intel work more on improving the power draw versus processing power, these beasts already have more than enough capability for most people’s use. Maybe the die shrink to 22nm will help.

 

Look at my post. They increased the core clocks by several hundred MHz, added an IGP and still stayed in the 45W TDP for quads. What else were you expecting?

45W is acceptable for TDP I think, especially when any notebook with an nvidia card now has the potential for Optimus.

 

Don't forget that with SB Intel has tied the speed of every bus to a single internal clock generator and OC'ing is practically crippled (at least for non-extreme CPU's).
With ThrottleStop and setfsb 940XM can be a tough contestant

 

Maybe you should read my post. Let me further elaborate, I stated that processors already have more processing power than most people need. Thus you could stand to lower the clocks to match the present generation and thus have lower power draw. Perhaps you could get the 55W down to 45W and the 45’s down to 35 and so on. With AMD not having anything terribly competitive right now, it’s not like Intel could afford a tock generation being more about power than performance.

From reading the posts around here it seems like the biggest gripe or argument against the quads is power consumption. Yes I do like the clocks that are reportedly being released, but I wouldn’t mind seeing lower power either.

If it is in fact true that these new CPU’s have the IGP included then those numbers for power use are pretty reasonable. However I have stated before in another post the TDP spec is only good as a marketing tool, there is no value in it from the standpoint of engineering a cooling solution. There is no way of telling what conditions the silicon is being driven to for the said power dissipation.

Personally I run my laptop on the AC line all the time so I am not stressing over that fact.

If you could get the high end notebook manufactures to implement optimus with their high end graphic cards and have a quad running at 35W you would have a real winner of a laptop on your hand.

As far as what do I expect, Nothing that can’t be done.

 

What you're saying makes no sense because the CPU line is already tiered to allow for differing grades of TDP and performance all the way from around 15W (ULV) to 55W. Are you saying they should just not offer the performance that is possible with 55W anymore? There's no reason to cut back on the focus on performance/power and focus only on power when they already do this with lower wattage offerings in addition to Atom processors. If you feel the higher TDP parts are too powerful for you, you just get a cheaper netbook or an ultrathin if you're a big spender.

And the fact that they all have IGP matters because Nvidia could potentially offer battery and heat-saving Optimus on any notebook that they have a discrete product in.

 

CPUs are already hosting GPUs and now we are hearing about Audio too.
Can we see a day when all like GPU, audio, wifi, etc ... everything will be in a single chip

I wish these new processors should come early so that the current processor prices will come down

 

Or you could just buy a lower model CPU.

 

Thank you for the executive summary

 

On my other thread on Calpella I've wrote that there are 2 CPUs with lower clocks and 25W TDP, the Intel® Core™ i7-6x0LM series.

The previous generation of CPUs (Montevina) kinda of did what othonda is asking for and Intel had a lot of lower clocked, lower power CPUs. Now there are just a few which suggests that few people opted for 25W CPUs over 35W ones.

 

Blacky – I remember the processors you are talking about. If I recall they were always a bit more expensive than the higher powered models. I also remember when people asked if the added cost was worth it most would say “no” unless you needed the extra battery life. I would imagine between the manufacturers trying to keep costs under control and consumers not wanting to pay more for the same performance that these CPU’s didn’t do as well as the higher powered counterparts.

The rest of you:

So what is there not to get, I want a quad core that has about the same or more processing power as my current 920XM and yet get power consumption of a dual core. Why so argumentive about that? It make me laugh when the big argument against quads around here is the power consumption, then you try and argue a point of getting a lower power quad you get chastised about it and told to get a dual. I do know what I am talking about.

 

So you want a quad-core that only outperforms dual cores with which they share a TDP in highly threaded applications and heavy multi-tasking environments?

 

I've updated the initial post with all the latest information on Huron River/Mobile Sandy Bridge. If there is anything I've missed, please let me know.

 

Looks complete to me. What source has the 620M as having different GPU and DDR3 freqs than the other dual cores?

 

Anandtech: Intel's Core 2011 Mobile Roadmap Revealed: Sandy Bridge Part II - AnandTech :: Your Source for Hardware Analysis and News

But to be fair I would take their roadmap with grain of salt.

 

Anand's Sandy Bridge preview raised some flags for me on this situation.

For the desktops only the P67 chipset will support dual-GPUs and memory multiplier overclocking....at the cost of IGP support. Without any word of a P M67 chipset for the mobile market I'm wondering what features the HM67 chipset will support.

On the other hand if Intel dropped dual-GPU support for notebooks I may get to see how a Llano works with Crossfire Blackcombs.

 

Actually I don't understand what YOU don't get. Buy a 2720 and get a chip that is faster than a 920 and consumes less power. You're getting chastized because most people want more power in these forums. However the fact that the lowest quad consumes less power but runs faster than the fastest 920 now is quite an achievement.

 

I guess people just don't get the idea of a 35TDP quad core CPU, its that freaking simple. If you guys don't understand that, It's not my problem. Maybe AMD will be able to come up with one, then Intel will take the Initiative to respond.

 

I see, so no memory multiplier for notebooks.

As for dual cards, that's yet to be seen. As far as I know the difference between desktop and notebook chipsets is small. Now this "small" may include dual card support but until we have some definite proof I will leave things as they are.

You mean this (35W AMD quad):
http://products.amd.com/en-us/NotebookCPUDetail.aspx?id=663

In terms of performance it's pretty much on par with the Q9000, so it would have been a great CPU.... last year. This year is more like the i5-540M / 450M in this regard.

and this (25W AMD quad):
http://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-Phenom-II-X4-P920-Notebook-Processor.30326.0.html

Similar to the P8600 in terms of performance, again a great CPU if it was released last year. This is year a 25W 620LM will outperform it by 20-25%.
Here if you want to buy: http://shop.amd.com/US/_layouts/sho...ory:Notebook&filter=notebook_cpumodelnum:P920

 

The only reason i would be gettin something like this is to get one of the quads, because it has integrated GPU, vs present quads that dont have gpu, and optimus is possible with a quad core gpu.
Should help with battery life.
Not to mention the whole other improvement.

As of now, i have a dillema.
I am scheduled to buy a laptop at the begining of november.
Question is, will i be able to get this new platform ? If i come to think about it, no point in gettin a laptop now, with the "old tech" when the "new tech" is couple of weeks away, am i ?

Imagine one of the new quads, with 470m or 480m with optimus. That would be something i would very much like to have.

Speaking of cpus, how would a mobile 740qm compare to a desktop core ii7 950, compared to a 2740qm in terms of performance ?
That is what i would like to know, esspecialy since intel slashed the price on the 950, and this cpu is now best choice for a x7200. Is it even better than a 940qm ?

 

This my friends, is the human nature. Always wanting more, doomed to be forever insatisfied. Always wanting what he/she doesnt have, and when he gets it, it gets bored with it, takes it for granted, and end up wanting more.

Myself right now, have as a main pc a netbook with 1.6ghz atom.
We all know how this cpu compares to your 920xm. If i had a laptop with 920xm, i wouldn't want anything else regarding cpu for MANY MANY years to come.

Yet here you are, having one of the very high end cpus, very few people afford to get, and wanting something that is slighlty better. In what way are you dissatisfied by your current 920xm, is truly beyond my understanding.

The ownership of such a cpu should ban you for desiring something else.

 

Bytales

So please explain what give you the right to come in here and make such assumptions about me being doomed forever to be unsatisfied, wanting more, wanting what I don’t have and being bored with what I do have and taking it for granted and ending up wanting more? You have no idea where I am coming from; you have no clue about me. If you can’t come in here and contribute to constructive dialog, please keep your diatribes to yourself.

While you explain what type of system you have, DO NOT belittle me for what I have. I am able to afford my machine by educating myself, and working my tail end off in a very competitive and brutal industry to become the best there is at what I do for more years than probably most of the people in this forum are old.

And as for your final statements, about me being dissatisfied with what I have. Nowhere in my posts do I even remotely insinuate that I am dissatisfied with what I have. I have stated in posts that go back a long ways that I will most likely keep this laptop for a long time as its more than adequate for what I do with it. Maybe you need to stop and read what is going on in these forums before attacking people for stuff you know nothing about.

Maybe ownership of a Nokia should ban you from posting such nonsense.

 

They should really ditch the 740 and make the price of 820 lower.

 

@Bytales
Let's not get into philosophical debates here. This topic is mainly designed to inform users/consumers about upcoming products so that they can make an informed decision. Imagine how much it would have sucked if in December 2009 you bought a laptop with a T6600 CPU just to find out 3 months later that for the same price you can get a CPU which is 50% faster.

However, this year things are different. In the notebook sector the only major increase in performance is for the mobile quad core CPUs which will transition from 32nm to 45nm. So unless you are planning to get a quad, you won't regret buying an Arrandale CPU now.

That being said, I can see you are eyeing the x7200. Now you should know that SB is going to come out for desktops at the beginning of 2011. The SB desktop CPUs will mark the transition from 45nm CPUs (like the current i7-950) to 32nm CPUs. Thus you should expect a significant increase in performance from the new SB desktop quads. Only the 6-core 980 and 990 will remain unchanged as they are 32nm already. If you are planning to upgrade in November it would be better to wait another 3 months and get the next generation.

@othonda

I don't think he was referring to you specifically, he was just talking in general terms. You can relax now .

In what industry do you work? I'm just curious.

 

My post was in no way meant to attack you or insult you in any way what so ever. If i have given you such a thought, i apologize. Of course you are entitled to buy yourself what you want and what you can afford from the money you earned.
What i meant to say is that if i were to have such a cpu in my laptop i wouldn't probably worry about what's new for maybe 3 years or so, when the even the extrem model cpu would be slower than an entry model cpu.
Gettin such small increases of speed every time something new appears is very expensive and for many is not worth it.

The strategy is to get at some point in time, something above the average, but not the highest end, and use it until one notices it can't do the job youre doing like it used to. At that point it may have been couple years since you bought it. And that's when it's worth gettin something else.

We, pc users are doomed to spend lots of cash on our pcs. Look at console users. They buy the console when it appears and enjoy 5 to 6 years of high end 60 fps games with the same hardware. We have to spend in those 6 years maybe 100 times more cash in an effort to enjoy the same level of performance, which actualy is an effort in futility. An example is the game metro 2033. Even with the latest hardware you can't run it in a constant 60 fps in 1080p with all the detailes set to their maximum.

My main concern is to get something now that is gonna give me the most usage time before i go buy something to replace it.
Having said that i don't know who will last longer, a core i7 950 in a x7200 with 460/470 sli, or a new sandy bridge cpu, like 2720qm or 2820qm with a multi GPU (we don't even know if there's gonna be such a thing) or single gpu.

 

I understand most of what you're saying, with the exception being this:

The majority of blockbuster games, on the current consoles, are barely 720p and can't maintain a consistent framerate above 30fps.