More silent replacement for P150EM

I am a proud owner of a P150EM (NP9150). Great performance, no issues ever, specs in signature. I am mostly looking for a more silent idle laptop. No real rush, mostly asking out of curiosity.

I recommended my flatmate to get the P650sm which has the GTX970x with good overall specs and I noticed that it is completely silent when idle/browsing/non gaming; however, I found that it is a bit larger than mine (both are 15''). I was wondering if there is a good replacement for mine in terms of (1) better GFX card (i.e. GTX 970x) and better silent performance as the fan noise when not under heavy load is starting to get on my nerves. There seems to be a lot of new Clevo models and I am not exactly sure I understand the distinction between them

P150SM-A (Upgrade of mine)
P650SG / SE
P750ZM

Priorities:
4K screen
More silent when idle
Good GPU (GTX 970m)
Same dimensions as current

 

Well, unless you really want another laptop, I would just suggest getting 680M GTX and selling 7970M, cause it will be less hot and more powerful, don't forget about good thermal paste (6w\mk++) and undervolting - that would really make a difference.
I would wait for 990M at least, before changing laptop.
P.S. Just checked and found out for myselt - it really seems like 970M \ 980M going to work in P150EM, so think would be a nice ugrade, although I would still wait for a price drop - i.e. when 990M will be out.))

 

You could upgrade the P150EM to a 970M/980M yourself.

As for the idle fan noise, when was the last time you blew out the dust and repasted using a quality TIM?

 

I always clean the laptop so that's not the issue. The GPU fan is always off when idle, it's mostly the CPU fan that's always running. I have very limited background processes running yet the fan is always on

 

That was one of the reasons I sold my P150HM 1 year after buying it. Too loud in idle, even louder under load.
I bought W370ET after selling it, which had gtx660m (around 40% slower than amd6990m I had), but it was silent in idle and bearable at high loads.
But it still wasnt a perfect solution due to the lack of power on the GPU.

Last year i bought myself a MSI GT70 with gtx880m, which I am using to this day. Silent as hell. No noise coming out of this. None.

For detailed reviews on noise of laptops, use notebookcheckreview.com via google search. Just type the laptop you want to check for and you will compare the various noise levels (all measured in db's), which I find to be accurate.

 

But what are your CPU temps when idle?

 

Average temps of 42C/38C/40C/44C for core 0/1/2/3

 

See the below file for a 5 minute log
http://www38.zippyshare.com/v/zZc5PuGt/file.html

 

Well if you sit in the 40s and your fans are constantly going I can understand then... though it shouldn't particularly be loud. I would suggest a P150SM-A or P157SM-A before they go out of stock, or a P750ZM if you really want some epic (CPU) power and cooling under the hood.

The P650Sx is another alternative, but being integrated with lower vRAM I must give the nod to the SM-A models as you're already accustomed to them.

 

Sorry to pop in like this, but you would recommend a Sager NP8268-S from XoticPC or another reseller right now then? I've been eyeing it since the price drop made it possible to get the 980m for under $1600 (with cash discount), and even moreso if I opt out of the msata 120gb Samsung 850 evo. Though I may keep that in there if I buy it, since it only saves 60 bucks to not get it. Kind of depends on exactly how much that drive costs by itself on a good sale, and I haven't looked that up yet.

 

The product is in its end of life state right now. It's gonna be phased out soon. If you're willing to roll with that, then go right ahead. All other things considered it's a solid machine.

 

On the assumption that it's not likely to leave me with a brick before it's seen at least five years of heavy use whether I'm in warranty or not because the motherboard or something else now irreplaceable is dead (then again, thanks to socketed components I could probably easily salvage the processor and graphics card in addition to hard drives and ram and at LEAST use the latter in a new laptop), then yes. Assuming it is as solid as it seems, a bigger concern is not getting anymore bios or other specialized software updates. Seems like it could be a serious issue. Unless they should be doing bios and other important software updates for a year or two since everyone is still selling it right now and it's been pretty popular.

And how are the fans on it? I got the impression from HTWinguts review that they're pretty smoothly programmed, but everyone seems to talk like only the newest Sagers have excellent automatic fan profiles. Is it possible to easily tweak the fan profiles on the NP8268 as well? That seems like something people on the forums here encountered issues with. Or is it really unnecessary?

 

The fan profiles don't work all that well normally, but fn + 1 will always work, so that's a non-issue. The cooling is pretty decent, but not as good as the ZM series for overclocking the CPU. The GPU you likely won't be able to overheat at all. I don't think software updates will be that bad; my only concern was Windows 10 but Prema said he doesn't think it'd be any kind of issue at all, so I'll go with what he thinks.

 

Alright, thanks a lot for the info. My concern with the P760zm models that I've also been eyeing is that they seem to run the desktop processor pretty high up there temperature wise compared to what Intel probably had in mind. But if desktop processors actually have dangerous temp thresholds a lot closer to the ones mobile processors have (close to 100C) than I though, maybe I'm worrying for nothing.

 

No, the throttle point for desktop CPUs is 95C and the TJMax is 105c. Those machines (on max fans with a decent paste job) don't run very hot, even the 15" models. I would suggest the P750ZM or P770ZM wholeheartedly if you are more of an enthusiast. And no optimus too, so you get stuff like mobile DSR and shadowplay desktop recording etc.

 

They're tempting, but I need some decent battery life, and they are more expensive. Especially the new models with g-sync. Is that really worth a premium, by the way? I think I have a sense of what it does, I just don't think I understand why that's so amazing for gaming. I'd heard that the cooling performance is identical in both sizes of the latest DSR clevos though; the IPS screen is just better in the NP9772 than in the NP9752.

And does Optimus really result in any loss of performance on applications using the dedicated graphics? I assumed shadowplay would work regardless of its presence. I suppose a better question is: what are the real tradeoffs with and without Optimus as I'd probably experience them? I am a little concerned that any monitors plugged into the ports (should I ever decide to try it with all the graphics power the 970m or 980m really provides) will run off of the wrong graphics solution. I've also heard that the switch can break, leaving people trapped with the Intel graphics only. That's definitely not something I want happening in a notebook with a high end dedicated gpu; soldered to the motherboard or no.

I'm also wondering if I'd really notice any differences besides viewing angles if I saw the NP8268, the NP8652, the NP9752, and the 17 inch versions of each of them all right next to each other, with the exact same high quality picture on them, and then the exact same HD video. I'm not used to criticizing panels. I had a Dell Studio 1558 with a glossy 720p TN panel previously, and I never really had any complaints with the screen. If all of those laptops have screens much better than what Dell probably shoved into that poorly designed (it ran hot frequently just doing normal browsing...despite the extended battery essentially being a pretty good sized built in stand) machine, then I'll probably be happy.

 

No tangible loss, it just passes the frame buffer through the Intel GPU which is connected to the all the display outputs.

Shadowplay works fine now with Optimus machines. All ports pass through the Intel GPU. There is no way the switch can "break". It's a software solution not a hardware one.

Only thing you will be limited by is the display output resolution and refresh of the Intel GPU. This is why some Nvidia tech does not work with Optimus. It's at the mercy of whatever max spec the Intel GPU can provide through the external graphics I/O.

If you're used to a 720p TN panel these IPS panels will be orgasmic.

 

Alright, thanks for the info. So...if optimus isn't a hardware solution, can it be turned off and everything port wise be handed over to the nvidia gpu?

And what about the TN panel in the np8268?

 

No, it is part hardware. Internal and external display outputs are all connected to the iGPU. You can't turn off Optimus.

 

Shadowplay has desktop recording on mobile now (without driver hacks), and Optimus does not support it so far.

 

Understood; thanks for the explanation. And how is Optimus not limiting performance at all besides preventing the use of Shadowplay when everything passes through the iGPU (the ones inside the 4710mq and 4720hq are leagues behind the 970m and 980m)? I assumed Optimus worked by giving both graphics solutions access to all ports and the screen, and divvying up which one does what or something like that via software.

 

No. The iGPU is connected to everything (in most cases). Any technologies, resolutions, refresh rates, or whatever that the iGPU cannot support is INSTANTLY rendered impossible for the machine. The dGPU simply does the heavy lifting in place of the iGPU, but it runs through the iGPU to do so. So if you connected a 120Hz panel to the iGPU and it can't support 120Hz it will give you 60Hz as the highest possible connection type. You also have limited access to nVidia control panel when using it, as their display control options cannot work.

What you are thinking of is a switchable graphics solution, used by a MUX chip. This restarts the PC and disconnects the iGPU from all displays and connects the dGPU to all the displays, or vice versa. It MUST restart the PC to do so. Also, the internal laptop screen must be limited to the iGPU's I/O limitations during this method, or windows will kind of confuse itself. Any systems that had 3D models and MUX switches (the older Alienware 17" models are a good example) had the iGPU completely disabled, permanently, when using the 120Hz panels.

 

Okay. Sounds like either way the cost of longer running times is the full power of the dedicated graphics. *sighs* I suppose it shouldn't be a surprise that Optimus is very far from perfect. So...in your rather knowledgeable opinion, in the NP8268 and the NP8652, how severely does Optimus limit a 980m that's mated to Intel HD Graphics 4600? I'm looking around Notebookcheck but not seeing any clear indications about how it will limit the far superior dedicated graphics. They seem to support roughly the same versions of the usual graphics related stuff like DirectX, but of course the Nvidia chip has its own features. For someone who will be doing computer science coursework and playing stuff like Witcher 3, Minecraft, and Skyrim, are there any really good features from NVidia that the integrated GPU will keep me from using?

 

I can tell you straight that some games *HATE* optimus. Optimus is a lot of headache for a little benefit... sometimes people find that the little benefit is the huge selling point of a laptop... and I agree. It can be a huge selling point. But its place in the highest end systems is a diminishing returns kind of deal. You lose out on custom resolutions, DSR, Gsync, overclocking your monitor refresh rate, nVidia's display and resolution options, etc.

The real question you need to ask yourself is: "do I need more than 2 hours of battery life"? Note I said "need" and not "want". If your answer to that question is "yes, I need 3-4 hours of battery life", then you're better off with an Optimus-using machine. If your response is "no, I can live with 2 hours", then your best bet is a P750ZM or P770ZM

 

By taking out the small msata drive and adding a 980m, I can set up an order for an NP8268-S for the same price as the NP8652 base model, that latter being without and ICD thermal compound upgrade or anyting. If I went for a P750ZM, then I'd be either getting the base model, or downgrading to the i5 4690k to actually save some money. So it kind of comes down to one of the 980m notebooks with Optimus, or the desktop replacement with a 970m. Even pairing a 980m with the i5 would be a serious strain to my budget, since I wanted to stay below 1600 USD, not nearly break 1800. If I stay below 1600 USD I won't even blink about upgrading the warranty to 3 years, assuming I absolutely love the laptop I get from XoticPC or LPC Digital. Unless I get an incredible internship or something in the next couple years, it's unlikely that I'll upgrade whatever I get even if I could (besides maybe 8 gb more ram and adding an SSD). But of course socketed parts do still allow me to keep it in mind...as long as processors and GPU's using those sockets can be found at reasonable prices for their age.

So, I'm wondering what you think given your knowledge about all this: which of those three would you probably go with given my budget? I am leaning towards the NP8268-S, since I don't even have to buy an external optical drive to use it, and I should presumably be able to get an enclosure for the drive for cheap and salvage it's own optical drive once I move onto a different laptop in 5 years at the minimum...hopefully.

 

@Mattchion are you talking about this NP8268-S that's currently $240 off at Xotic PC? Yeah for <$1600 with those specs it's by far the best deal on a non-BGA 980M notebook right now.

 

Yeah man, I'd go with what Octiceps said. The 980M and some sockets, even for an EOL machine... that's something you aren't gonna beat for the money. Good luck! Hopefully it lasts very long

 

Exactly; thin and light it won't necessarily be, but if the TN panel is gonna impress someone used to 720p tn panels or whatever the heck is in this really old Inspiron 1501, I think I'm out of reasons not to take the deal. What do you think about the msata though? Would it be better to opt out of it and save 60 bucks? Or is it probably a better idea to keep it and install Windows 7 pro or 8.1 pro on it, then get another msata later for the other slot to store more games? And would you go with XoticPC, or LPC Digital, or another Sager reseller altogether? I want the absolute best deal and experience possible for the price they're all selling it at now. I assume with any of them I have 90 days to decide if I want to triple the warranty period for 150 or so extra, right? Because I'll probably do that to be safe once I'm absolutely sure I love the laptop as much I get the feeling I will.

 

Same questions I asked in my reply to Opticeps apply here, if you don't mind. And I thought it was a good deal. TN panel, but optical drive comes with it, and the mxm card has max vram. Also, I've heard the mq processors are more flexible as far as tweaking it for a little more performance when I want it, given that the cooling system seems adequate for a little overclocking.

 

You'll want an SSD for your OS, it makes every day to day task fly by, OS drives mostly read data so it will stay relevant for some time and as you say you have a second free space for future expansion.

 

The screen is fine, I think you'll be really satisfied with it coming from what you're used to.

I would keep the default SSD. Removing it only saves you $60. A 120GB 850 EVO mSATA purchased separately is about $80 so no reason not to keep it. Install your OS to it and put your other stuff on the 1TB HDD and SSD in the other mSATA slot. Just don't get the 2nd mSATA SSD from Xotic, they're charging a lot more than what you'd pay retail for.

Xotic PC has the best deal on this config right now so I'd get it from them.

Yeah you have 90 days from the time the laptop ships to extend the warranty. A longer warranty is definitely good if you can afford it.

 

Yes the MQ are far more flexible but you aren't gonna get say 4GHz out of that without liquid ultra, etc. But you will definitely have good control especially with Prema's BIOS for it.

I would suggest the SSD. Trust me.

 

I do, and everything considered I believe the first Sager (the NP8268-S) to catch my eye is probably ultimately the best choice for a purchase. I'll likely place an order within the next couple days and let you know how it goes. I've got my fingers crossed that the heatsinks will be properly assembled and in perfect condition on the Clevo 150 SM-A I get though, knock on wood. I saw a thread on here full of people with P150 and P170 based laptops (even from the pricier places that should've been good, like Malibal); looking for solutions to messed up heatsinks and doing all manner of little tricks to make the heating solutions work as well as they should have to start with.

And I don't expect to hit 4 Ghz. I think hitting 3.5 or maybe a teeny bit higher at quad core max boost speed would be enough to ensure good performance all the way up to the day I retire it as my notebook (hopefully resigning it to a cozy position as my dependable backup should whatever laptop I get in ideally 5 years at the earliest fall apart on me).

 

Malibal is not good. They were extremely shady and threatened users and removed themselves from this forum ages ago. Mythlogic is the only place that has impeccable pre-sale QA testing, unfortunately. Not that it's bad that they do it, but that others do NOT do it properly. If they find your machine overheating or throttling etc, they'll fix it. They do pretty good jobs with the thermal paste for the most part as well.

 

Good to know. I'll still probably buy through XoticPC or maybe LPC Digital. The latter looks like they put in a somewhat better spindle hard drive in the NP8268-S (or at least name what it is, and it's Sata III versus what sounds like a Sata II drive in XoticPC's version according to Xotic's own site), but there's far more reviews out there for Xotic (and between 90 and 95% are positive, even if the ones there for LPC seem to be 100% positive).

 

The HDDs are identical. The HGST 7K1000 is the only 1TB 7200 RPM laptop drive on the market.

With the NP8268-S at LPC you have the option of a 128GB M600 mSATA for the standard SSD instead of the 120GB 850 EVO, but otherwise it's identical to the NP8268-S at Xotic.

 

It would be the same HDD regardless since its Sager that is actually installing it. We list SATA II since that is what Sager's site directly has it listed as. With a HDD you wouldn't see a difference because they are not able to saturate SATA II max transfer speeds.

 

it is in fact SATA III though, just for reference. (As an owner of said drive)

 

Thanks for the confirmation it will be III

 

I assume they're comparable performance wise, and it's only 10 bucks for the same at Xotic. Considering it'll just hold Windows and maybe a game or two while I hold off a couple months on getting another msata, I dunno if 8 GB is really anything to worry about. And I suspected the data drives were the same, just wasn't absolutely certain. Also, not sure how LPC Digital does things, but I can get at best a 2% cash discount plus free shipping at XoticPC. I assumed the prices down to the discounts will actually end up being the same there (a bump down from 3 to 2%), even if I didn't check for sure at LPC Digital.

 

I wondered, but hadn't dug around to check for certain.

Thanks for the confirmation.

 

The 850 evo handles using a portion as slc nand better than the m600, so I would say the 850 evo is a better choice.

 

Alright, thanks for the info. What would you recommend for an msata to store games once I've gotten settled with the NP8268 and I'm sure I want to keep it for the long haul?

 

What's your budget and desired capacity?

 

The 850 evo again, it's suitable for most users. It's only those writing a LOT of different data that need to worry about more professional grade drives.

 

Got it. And are there any sort of hardware adapters I could use to recycle my msata drives for at least a desktop if not a laptop later? I know M.2 drives are replacing them, but for all I know there will be M.3 drives instead anyways by the time I'm building a desktop and/or looking to buy a new laptop again.

 

I'll have to see on budget, but I'd rather not pay more than maybe $150. From what I've seem, there's some nice 256 gb drives for less than that. I'd go for 500, but I'm not sure I can afford it, at least not before this fall anyways.

 

If you're wary of Samsung's TLC drives (don't blame ya) get the Crucial MX200

 

Also, I wanted to ask you something. I noticed the PowerNotebooks stuff on your signature, and looking at them they still have an impeccable resellerratings average rating at 10/10. I feel like someone was claiming they had problems with PowerNotebooks on some forum, but overall I just haven't heard much about them. How are they as a reseller? It looks like I could get it cheaper through them, but is the customer service and so on as good as XoticPC? Kind of curious, since it'd be nice to get this laptop at the absolute cheapest price possible, assuming that PowerNotebooks is as good as Xotic or better in pretty much every way that counts for a reseller from the customer perspective. Looking around online it feels like a lot resellers are comparable, there's just more people who have used certain ones for whatever reason.

 

You can see more feedback for us in the reseller feedback section on here. We have certainly been around for some time