NP8662-Cancelled

This might be an useless thread but.....

I decided to cancel my order and I have been contemplating on buying the laptop from XoticPC due to better customer service. However, I am having cold feet plunging 1,500+ on this system without really checking the professional reviews, benchmarks, reliability, etc.

From what I have been reading, MxM 3.0 is not supported in this laptop. So the 260GTX is the only top end card for this system. And Nvidia will unlikely be releasing future cards supporting the current MXM 2.1. So there is no future proof on the GPU side.

Also, the temps in this laptop seems high.... I currently own a gateway fx7811 and the GPU never goes higher than 70C, 45C with the CPU-both under load (running crysis). Compared to the NP8662 that reaches over 80+ Celsius GPU and 55+ CPU. Are those temps normal for a top quality laptop like this one?

Also, I have been reading a bit about Asus and MSI. In particular the asus K series with the 4860 ati and the MSI 628 with the GT160. These two laptops will be released in May. These seem cheaper and the price will be under $1,100 with almost comparable performance (10% less performance than the sager). Should I purchase one of these instead of the more expensive sager?


I just need a little justification on purchasing the NP8662......

 

There is no future-proofing on the GPU for any notebook.

 

The NP8662 is a 15.4 inch performance laptop. You buy it knowing it's a smaller 15" chassis with the highest performance components on the market. The buyer they are targeting is one who wants exactly this, not the coolest running notebook for the money. You must expect it to run a little warm all things considered... so it can't be compared to the gateway. Compare my rig to the gateway though, most games don't even exceed 70C on the GPU and the highest I've seen the CPU is 43~, and the GPU is considerably more powerful than the 9800 gts. So yes, the quality of the Sager's is remarkable, and the performance justifies the price.

I would not worry about MXM 2.1. There won't be a new Nvidia GPU till late this year, and it probably has a chance of making it to MXM 2.1 format, you never know.

 

Agreed. +Reps

 

So, on a related question, when would I start worrying if the temperature gets too hot for me? Are we looking at 80*C or higher, or what's the range where I should start thinking this is running too hot? And what would I do at that point, say, if it's idling at 60*C and hits 90*C on full load?

 

Dude, resale value for the NP8662 is pretty high (judging from recent sale of an NP8660 for $1300). If you're not happy when the newest and greatest comes out, just sell your system. Upgrading the GPU tend to be expensive ($300-500 for the GTX260M, god knows how much for the latest and greatest), not to mention, upgrading the other parts of the system.

It may be easier to plunk $1500 now (like I did last night), then sell for $1300 when the newest and greatest comes out--

You may find that this way is actually cheaper, plus you know everything works, and you won't have to deal with incompatibility woes if the BIOS or driver doesn't support something from the get go--

 

The GT160M is not likely to offer 10% less performance than the 260M, it will be probably be less, considering the 260M is looking to be a higher clocked 9800M GTX and the 160M a 9800M GTS. The 9800M GTX at stock already offers more than 10% increase in performance compared to the 9800M GTS. The ATI4860, if ATI's marketing is accurate, however, promises to be competitive at least.

However, I'm more curious as to where you saw the prices for the the K series and 628.

 

This laptops GPU doesn't get to 80C , at least not on mine. For me the GPU never gets above 71C and the CPU never gets above 50C (due to undervolting).

Those are the best temperatures on the market for a 15.4" gaming laptop. It even does better than most 17" gaming laptops with similar specs.

With the notebook cooler I get even better temperatures and the fan noise is much lower.

 

anyway intel processor can reach 105C without damage (for a short period of time) and correct me if I'm wrong even if the CPU did reach 80C (mine reach 65C after 10 hour of gta IV) the only difference would be that instead of a 10 years lifespan you would have a 3-4 years which is more than enough considering that in 3 years the cpu will be outdated and worth aroung 50$. The only thing slightly worrying me is the HD temp, let's say all of my important file are backed up on external storage.

 

How would this work out for the GPU? Could it reasonably exceed 80*C for an extended period of time? I understand the normal wear-and-tear, but I'm considering an 8662, so the hook-up in info is appreciated.

 

Anywhere below 90C would be safe for both.

 

Where do you guys get that the 9800M GTS is within 10% of the 98GTX?

Also to OP, where'd you get the 80+ GPU temp?

 

Where does anyone get that 64 shaders is close to 112?

 

I second that. My GPU runs in the low (sometimes high) 80's under load. And its been doing that for 1.5 years now.

Duane

 

I've hesitated posting this, but what the heck...

Totemobakadesu123 - i've posted on this topic a couple times and you may be referring to a couple threads I created which brought some great insight and discussion from members here at notebookreview - some of whom posted their views in your thread as well.

In one of those threads, I believe it was Shyster1 who took issue (I'm using a stronger word than warranted but can't think of a better one) with the constant use of the word "upgrading". He prefers "replacement" which I agree with now...because when you read about MXM2.1, 3.0, etc. your mind - at least mind did at least - went to the idea of "upgrading" and "future proofing", but you can't think of it this way...you do need to think of it as "replacement" because the philosophy behind MXM isn't to give us - the consumer - the ability to upgrade. It was created for the manufacturers and OEMs to facilitate and make support cheaper, more efficient, etc (as I understand it).

Now an ancillary benefit to the consumer of manufacturers who design and OEMs / resellers who support MXM based notebooks, is in some cases consumers have been able to buy newer cards to slot into their "older" machines - like owners of np8660 notebooks being able to "replace" their 9800gts' with 260M's. This is all dependent on the manufacturers updating BIOS info and those kinds of things in order for it to work.

The main thing a few of the posters are trying to impress upon people - I believe - is that while you may glean nuggets of information here and there, such as:

- MXM3.0 motherboards arriving at the end of the year in the new CLEVO models D900F, etc. along with the new 40nm 212 based GPU's
- two variants of the 280M, MXM3.0 version with higher clock speeds
- np8662 being max'ed out with the 260M because the thermal budget can't support a 280M

ultimately you can't divine the product roadmap of Clevo - they keep it a secret - the bastids. Some have prognosticated in my thread that it is unlikely Clevo will make MXM2.1 compliant GPU's on the new 40 nm Nvidia architecture, but no one knows for sure. I've inferred that because the two new notebooks clevo has announced are big fat pigs (11 lbs +) that I'd have to wait until Q1/Q2 of 2010 for an MXM3.0 compliant NP5797 or NP8662 (I want a laptop that has great gaming performance, is less than 9lbs, and gives me the greatest "replacement" potential), but who knows if I'm holding out for a unicorn....

I do know that - for me - if I buy a notebook now I'm likely to buy a middle of the road np8662, rather than a loaded 5797, because:

- I will want an MXM3.0 based notebook with the new NVIDIA gpu's when they come out because I believe I'll be able to "replace" the GPU and other components over the following few years
- I want to save a bit of money, and why go whole hog when I'll sell and buy again within 12-15 months


...but I don't know for sure.

 

Nope, "took issue" is perfect; perhaps a little on the you're-too-kind side, if you ask me!

 

Apologies, I forget who it was (kaltmond ???) who had an 9800M GTX placed in his M860TU. You should talk to him about it, because I feel if that it could work replacing (correct phrase here right ) the 280M into this machnie shouldn't be much different. Mind ya, he also claims to have a QX9200 in there too!

I know Kevin_Jack said he may test this out too, if they'll refund the card if it doesn't work.

 

He had to undervolt the card. I'd rather get a GTX 260m and O/C it, besides, I'd think it'd be worth the upgrade since I'm coming from a 9800m GTS. I don't think the performance gain would only be 10%?

 

I also tested a 98M GTX in the M860Tu chassis. It almost impossible to work with. Temps reached 100 C in gaming while also downclocking due to overheating. In everyday use it's fine, it will stay at about 65C.

One of the issues is the heatsink. The heatsink in the M860TU just isn't made for the 9800M GTX and the thermal heatsink doesn't sit tightly on the GPU. I guess it could be made to sit tightly with some strings and wires but this is one of the reasons why I think my card got so hot.

 

Knowing Kaltmond and his customising habits (see the smartbay - Genius) he probably messed with the heatsink too.

 

Well made a little change recently. Reapplied the thermal paste and and a cheap cooler under the NB. Now GPU back to 1.0V and OC 600/1500/950 stable. In games sometimes still go up to 90°C, but never overheated again. VGA is still 9800M GTX with BIOS flash to GTX 280M.

 

WOW! Incredible

 

Hey Kaltmond, just a question to set something straight seeming as this topic wheels wide of topic - you're using the new 8662 motherboard, not the 8660 right?

I think many would like to know where you got the MB without the trouble of just selling the 860 to get an 862...

...or any of the other seperate compenants in for that matter (GPU/CPU).

 

Whoa that's pretty cool Kaltmond, thanks for the post.

 

Would it be too much to request pictures of your new cooler?

 

I like those temperatures a lot, especially after doing something as intensive as 3dmark06