New Clevos with Max-Q?

I think that the 1080MQ is the real con - an Aorus X5 (1070) can outperform it and it costs more than the X5. The 1070MQ is less of a con - it represents a performance jump over the 1060N but the pricing is pretty exorbitant. Personally, I think the Max-Q thing will succeed, but it will affect those of us who want DT performance in a laptop negatively.

@Papusan @hmscott @Mr. Fox

I'd be interested to see what bro @iunlock thinks about Max-Q, since he is an expert at pushing laptops to their limit.

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk

 

+1

The benchmarks are no surprise really, as it stands you will sacrifice performance for portability. It looks as though I would save around 3 to 4 pounds carrying weight, I would still carry around the same peripherals so the bulk would still be there and three pounds is not worth the drop in performance plus my enjoyment for overclocking would be gone. Maybe the next generation of GPUs will be better.

Some of those Youtube reviews/commercials are just funny.

 

Homie, you know if it's not happening this gen, it's definitely not happening next gen. They'll just make it thinner, lighter, more disposable and more expensive.

 

Depends on what is limiting performance and what drivers have been used. If the CPU is a bottleneck then the GPU will not be working as hard anyway.

 

Yep that's definitely one way they can fudge it.

 

Exactly, using the right mix of benchmarks - showing overall score instead of Graphics, running games at settings and resolutions that generate similar FPS masking power / thermal limits.

That's why it's now buyer beware, the reviews and performance results may not give an accurate view of your use. YMMV.

 

Sager Notebooks also has it: NP8952. Maybe @Meaker@Sager knows something about it.

On a sidenote, it would be nice if the NP8952 "Product Highlights" and customization page specified the GPU is Max Q. At the moment, it's only mentioned (buried, to many) in the technical specifications.

 

That's going to turn into my biggest problem with it. It doesn't show up often in the promo materials from manufacturers and sometimes not even on spec sheets. I don't think they're deliberately hiding it, but it can create confusion with end users.

 

I would imagine a little more than an hour under load....2.5 hours with very light use, like browsing and such, probably not even that much, more like 2 hours websurfing. If it gets more on that tiny battery then great.

 

That's unlikely even with the greater efficiency. There still isn't really anything that I'd game on battery instead of AC power on.

 

TL R - To some it may be a gimmick but these cards work best when sipping on power.


So while I do not own a Sager, I have had the p640R which was lovely....

The Marketing buzzwords do have some truth.

I have tested those clock speeds with my 1070 and can confirm a SIGNIFICANT drop in temps and minimal loss in gameplay, play ability and I am on a first release 1070.

For example

Stock Boost Curve : I hit 82-86 on GPU and 85-91 CPU with no modifications to volt.

Anyone who has owned this laptop will tell you it is LOUD as a jet to maintain workable non-throttled performance.. I got a 5400 in TimeSPY

I did some tweaking and came across something quite interesting

I obviously applied the -.125 UV in XTU for the 6700 (no brainer) and also flashed a custom ME for OC so I run the FSB at 102. This helped my CPU temp drop 10 degrees flat. (I am ok with 80-83 stressed on CPU).

For the GPU (I was surprised how hot this was...) I tried OCing to UV at 1700 mhz at .875 V, and then at .900 volt and found better temps and TimeSPY performance didn't really change. Weird right?
I figured, I would go the other way base clock of 11xx with a boost of 1449 and scored a 5000 in TimeSpy and my average power use was .625 to .750 V.

These cards are extremely efficient and with a score like that and the fact that my laptop has a gentle whir instead of a jet turbine sound.... It is a good compromise.

World of Warcaft (sub 40 db, sub 70C on GPU sub 78C on CPU) on GL502VS I have all things turned up EXCEPT Shadows are one click down, SSAO is one click down, View Distance is 7. DSR in NVidia Control Panel is 4.00x and 55% smoothness. 45-60 Frames in Dal and 90-150 Frames in M+ and most raid scenes. (Raids can dip to 50s when **** hits the fan)

Doom 4 is written so damn well.... 120-150 on Ultra+ with the same DSR settings on OpenGL 4.5 and 130-160 on Ultra+ with Vulkan (GPU at 76C and CPU at 82C)

 

Thanks for the write-up! I'm going to be interested to see what happens when we start getting more user data from the new models and how they compare to this.

 

NBC's Zephyrus review is up:
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Asus-ROG-Zephyrus-GX501-Laptop-Review.230546.0.html

TL;DR, it's hot as hell, the battery sucks and they really should've used a 1070MQ instead.

 

Your conclusion of "minimal loss of gameplay" is not really supported by using a couple of games that get huge fps and don't really stress the gpu down into sub 60fps (wow raid = cpu limited)

 

Yup, and this will be typical of owner reports, if their goal was quiet then large FPS loss won't be an issue as long as G-sync picks up the slack to make it look good.

As long as noone looking for a "1080" experience out of these Max-Q 1080 laptops gets "burned" and disappointed with performance, the light and quiet crowd will get more performance than normal so it will make them happy.

And, vendors and Nvidia will make a killing for selling under-performing 1080 laptops for $1000 more than their performance delivers, it truly is magical

 

That sucks big time. Lolz

It's for people who doesn't do a tiny bit of research...but ignorance is a good thing right?

 

Thank you, I am always more than happy to share my experiences and opinion.

Really? That is unnecessary. I was offering my opinion, it is mine, not yours. My conclusion? (I believe you mean experience) is appropriate for my experience, I forgot you were the authority of my experiences. I did not state any conclusion.

I have had less than 15% decrease in performance across the board..... You want a list of games that is fine, just ask. I will list all games that I have tested over the first 4 months of ownership of the laptop... I simply stated those two because I play them all the time. My sessions average 3 hours because I do not play my laptop 24/7. But hey, if you wanted to know more about my life, again you could have just asked.

Resident Evil 7 (13%) - Rage (10%) - Witcher 3 (18%) - AoS (18%) - Tomb Raider (negligible < 3% loss) - GTA 5 (negligble < 2%) - League of Legends (negligible < 2%)

Same NVidia DSR and smoothness between 33% and 55%. I have bounced between over time.

I also have a limited budget so I can only buy so many games.

TimeSPY
At UV of 1443 at .793 4732 (lowest of 10 consecutive runs)
At OC of 1674 at .850 5472 (lowest of 10 consecutive runs)

So no, there is no conclusion. The statement I made was "I have tested those clock speeds with my 1070 and can confirm a SIGNIFICANT drop in temps and minimal loss in gameplay, play ability and I am on a first release 1070."

My observations have been AT MOST 0.83% FPS for 1C of temperature. I did not claim whisper mode. I did not conclude that whisper mode would be good. I gave my observation that for certain people, the benefit is clearly there. You know, people like me.

You good?

 

Sorry, but I don't have Sig's turned on so I don't see your's.

So you already have a 1070 laptop? Which model, and how much was it in comparison to the new Max-Q 1080? Was the price difference around $1000, or?

You know there are tools to tune the fan speed in most laptops, knowing which 1070 you have we could recommend what would work.

And, detuning the 1070 laptop to accomplish these cool and quiet goals is more than possible.

Most of the time here we focus on increasing performance as that's the goal of most people - to get the most performance value for their investment.

But, if you are wanting detuning info, the same tools work for that goal too...

Tuning the laptop for cool and quiet running, by using CPU / GPU tuning tools with Intel XTU, MSI Afterburner, Windows power options and Nvidia control panel 3d settings (global and for each game), along with RTSS frame limiting and in-game settings can all accomplish the same cool and quiet operation as Max-Q laptops, for $1000 less.

It's something to consider, spending time learning how to tune your already very powerful laptop to run as you like it, instead of paying someone else $1000 to build a "pre-limited" detuned version of a powerful laptop

 

No need to get all triggered... the anecdotes you supplied (Doom and WOW) in my opinion didn't back that up your statement because they are potentially non-GPU-bound scenarios, or at framerates above panel refresh... reread my words, I didn't state whether I agreed or disagreed with you

 

Much appreciated, I have set my boost curve leveraging MSI Afterburner and wanted a portable "Wow gaming machine for around 1000$ at the time". It plays everything amazing and without issue.

I wanted to see if I could make it more quiet, (I got a steal GL502VS for $1,080 Amazon warehouse deal when new they were $1,700.)

Needless to say, it is whisper quiet when I play WOW/League which are my mainstays.

It has a light whir when playing the other games listed.

Triggered? Not at all, you just seem to disregard other's opinions as conclusions. It is disrespectful.

 

That's big jump from $1080 to $3000

Glad you are enjoying your new laptop, and thanks for sharing your feedback, and more I hope.

 

The laptop was Retail for $1,700 at the time and I purchased one for $1,080. I do not quite follow where you got $3,000 from. Would you elaborate?

 

Meaning one can get a laptop with the gtx 1070 and underclock/undervolt to generate less heat and noise than a much more expensive 1080M.
And if need be unleash the full power of the 1070...

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

Wasn't the new one $2700+tax + the new stuff we always get with a new laptop purchase - maybe in this case a new bag, slip case, wrist rest, mouse, etc.

If the new Max-Q laptop is $2700 vs $1700 for the "real" 1070, then the constant of $1000 difference between a "real 1070" vs a "Max-Q 1080 with 1070-like performance" is still holding accurate.

In this case you have the added bonus of having saved $650 off the top of the "real 1070". So for you the difference is $1650...

That's why it's so confusing that you would go out and spend $2700-$3000 on a laptop that has the same or less performance...instead of detuning the one you have to be cool and quiet.

You have what, 7-14 days acceptance time to return for a full refund?

Maybe you can take the time to make your "real 1070" perform as cool and quiet with good enough game play, then you can return the $2700-$3000 of stuff and have what you want plus a stack of cash?

 

Maybe next neneration GPUs will be better? If yoo mean next gen Max-Qrippled... NO!! Will still give same Crippled performance vs. *Normal* graphics!!

 

That doesn't even make sense, I think you meant it the other way around

I didn't disregard your opinion. I said what you raised in support of it was flawed for the reasons I already stated (and which you have not disputed), I disagreed with the VALIDITY of your conclusion SOLELY based on what you raised as evidence in that post, not the conclusion itself.

If you have better evidence that is more applicable from a bunch of other games? That came AFTER my original comment (and perhaps you should share some more detail about those such as actual frame rates so their relevance to the issue can also be assessed)

 

The difference in price between the 1080M and the GTX1070 seems to be very large to justify the performance, but it seems like the 1070M over the 1060 will be around $200 which is more reasonable....also it seems the performance increase from the 1060 to the 1070M is also a bit better than from the 1070 to 1080M.....so I think the market is going to settle on 1070M as the sweet spot for thin and light.

 

That is the point. that is your opinion. What credibility do you have to "assess".

And yes, I did provide you a gamut afterwards, you just assumed that my opinion was irrelevant initially. Had you not done that, I would have gladly shared more. Instead I did it to mock your arrogance.

 

but most average consumers doesn't know about this...they just believe what ads tells them or they just simply ignorant or doesn't care about performance or they just simply want a thin and light gaming laptop or they maybe tech savvy rich kids who already have a powerful rig/laptop but wants a thin and light laptop...watta mouthful but then again this type of people who buy this are tolerating this greedy corporation to keep marketing this what seems to be an experimental garbage (MQ).

 

Actually, this marketing push against the weakness of the consumer - lack of knowledge or foresight to solve the problem on their own - is a fleeting event, as now they know

Now they know that they can detune their own 1070's, even 1080's, to get the cool and quiet operation offered by Max-Q, for less money and with the ability to "switch on" full performance when they need it - which can't be done on a Max-Q model.

Now people have been given notice that it's possible, and now they can do it themselves without blowing more money to get something they already have

 

Question is...is an average consumer ever heard of a notebookreviewforum?

 

The average consumer is pretty darned smart, clever, resourceful... plenty of other independent realizations will occur on their own, without any prompting from us.

Word of mouth from all those source points will take time, maybe longer than this product cycle if Nvidia / vendors are lucky.

 

Yeah, A damn Hot SCAM!!
And Nvidia shows her true face. Release a so-called *NEW* graphics card, but in reality exactly the same as the old mobile design. Paying 3000 EUR for 1070 performance is crazy. But that said, there are some who will buy this When will this madness stop? But unfortunately, only wishful thinking. We will instead see more similar tragedies like this Trash.

 

Lets pray for these poor souls who will buy laptop with 1070/1080 MAX-Q...
Truth may be known, but still there will be people who will buy this and allow nvidia to make money on such outrages.

 

MSI GS63VR Stealth Pro w/ GTX 1070 MaxQ – Full Review + Benchmarks

New Aorus and GIGABYTE Gaming Laptops With Max-Q GTX 1080

 

Slightly higher performance than a full power 1070 for less power....

 

You mean something is off ?

 

I'm normally a glass half kind of guy but not on this one

 

And $400 more.

 

More like $1000 more for 1070 vs Max-Q 1080

 

Only for the new "premium" designs...the existing laptops with a 1070 (i.e alienware) is offering the upgrade to the 1080M for 400. I believe other vendors will be about the same.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

Correct, MAX-Q doesn't involve binning and Nvidia aren't marketing the MAX-Q envelope as inclucing binned chips.

 

I am hoping Vega is released as MXM so we can upgrade them without the need in buying a new machine. I would gladly sell my 1080 once vega comes out.

 

That would be awesome, might need to be a card+heatsink kit though.

 

I would pay for it and the kit and probably go crossfire if allowed to.

 

I am definitely interested on how you went about doing that. I have been waiting for a vbios to under-volt my 1080 for some time. Also, how stable is the GPU under load at those temps. My CPU is undervolted at 4.4GHz with Prema bios and running cool. Would love the GPU to do the same.

 

AMD graphics is mostly used in the Alienware line + Apple. Expect BGA.

 

Those BGA GPU's should worry their shelf life. Especially share the same board while being so close. Thin is just not my cup of tea.

 

ughhh

 

Clevos had AMD in the past. They're the best hope for an MXM solution IMO.