P775TM1-G and I9 9900K high temperature problem!

Hi guys,
I write because I need some information for cooling my 9900K CPU in my Clevo P775TM1-G.
Given that in many games it reaches 85/90 C° up to 98C°, I would like to do this:

1) Delid with liquid pro;
2) Replace the original IHS with another all in copper;
3) Use the kryonaut thermal grizzly between IHS and cooling system.

Do you think this is worth doing? The liquid pro ruin IHS in copper?
Or am I not doing anything, but just using the kryonaut thermal grizzly?

I await your advice

Thanks

 

The stock IHS is nickel plated copper. It's also soldered on making it trickier to remove.

 

So there's no need to do the delid?

 

Some steps to try before going this route.

Are you playing with fans at max, fn+1?
Is your 9900k undervolted? Trying to push the undervolt further.
Undervolting your graphics card can help if your p775 has the unified heatsink.

Gamersnexus on 9900k delidding and liquid metal tests.

 

No, the fans are 20% more, but I think they go automatically at the most.
The cpu is currently at 4700Mhz with udervolt -100mV. The gpu has the standard settings.
The gpu of how much should I perform the undervolt?

 

Try having the fans at max, by pressing fn+1 keys, and log the temperatures for games.

At 4.7Ghz you could use a higher undervolt, if you have a decent chip, you will still be fine at -150mV or even more. You will want to test this to find where stability ends. Something like Cinebench R15 is a quick way to find the this.

I'd recommend using max fans when doing this, and having hwinfo64 running in the background to monitor temps and if any WHEA errors appear.

Undervolting the GPU depends on the card. MSI afterburner is a great tool for locking the voltage/frequency curve. @Mr. Fox has a great guide on how to do this for the 10 series cards. But the same principle goes for the 20 series.

You might want to log a gaming session to have both CPU temp/mhz and GPU temp/mhz to give you an idea how cooling holds up.

 

Ok. thanks for the informations.
Other information, I'm using IC diamond 24 carat, what do you suggest I change it with other thermal compound?

 

If the temperatures are still unreasonably high after doing a more aggressive undervolt for the CPU and undervolting the GPU, you could repaste with Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut. It has a thermal conductivity of 12.5W/mK compared to IC Diamond 24's 4.5W/mK.

Best scenario would be to have liquid metal between both die/ihs/heatsink, however there is more inherent risk with using liquid metal if you dont take precautions and prepare the system. And further problematic is that clevo heatsinks are not perfectly flat, thus having liquid metal would at times result in poor contact between components and worse thermal performance. Not to mention that LM will react with the copper heatsink and diffuse into it over time.

 

I saw your laptop in signature, what are your temperatures?

 

There are many factors that are at play, type of load, ambient temp, fan speed, cpu silicone quality etc.

And it's really not fair to compare the p870 and p775.
They are both very different machines and great in their own respectable ways.

 

Try this for OC settings:

180w for Power limit 1 and 2.
An AVX offset of 3.

For a stable OC, under processor features, disable SGX.

1023 for VR Current Limit (A).
1023 value in Core /IA VR Domain - See the VR Current Limit (A) settings. The Core /IA VR Domain is in another place in the Advanced menu.
Put the same VR Current Limit (1023) in System Agent VR Domain.

For processor clocks:

Base freq: 3.6GHz (unchanged, but can be downclocked via Flex Ratio Override. Leave it as is)
Ring Ratio that is 3x less than the single CPU target Ratio.
Set Ring Ratio to a max of 44 (or 47, but test for stability) and leave it as is.

1-Core Ratio Limit Override: 50
2-Core Ratio Limit Override: 50
3-Core Ratio Limit Override: 49
4-Core Ratio Limit Override: 48
5-Core Ratio Limit Override: 48
6-Core Ratio Limit Override: 47
7-Core Ratio Limit Override: 47
8-Core Ratio Limit Override: 47

CPU Voltage settings:

Mode: Adaptive (default)
Voltage offset (undervolt): 130mv for Voltage Offset.
Offset Prefix to (-) for undervolt.

Other settings:

On power: Enable power efficient P-state and power efficient Turbo boost.

OC menu:

OC feature: Enabled
WDT interface: Enabled
XTU interface: Disabled
IMON Scaling support: Disabled
Vboost enable: Disable
BLCK Aware Adaptive Voltage: Enabled

Boot settings:

Setup Prompt timeout: 1
Bootup NumLock state: On
Legacy Boot Logo: Enabled

Advanced:

ICC/DC Watchdog timer: Disabled
ICC Profile: 0
(Leave the rest untouched)

Advanced/Processor sub-menu: (In overclocking)

Core Max OC Ratio: 50
Core Voltage Mode: Adaptive
Core Extra Turbo Voltage: Untouched
Core Voltage Offset:130
Offset Prefix: -
Core PLL Voltage Offset: 0
Cache Ratio: 47
Ring Min OC Ratio: Untouched
AVX Offset:3

Apply and test.

 

It's normal for a 9900K to throttle under 100% all core load.

Whether the OP's thermal throttle is "normal" depends on the game and the load it puts on the CPU. Plus with the P775, is the gpu heat from a unified setup overloading the cooling.

Reducing all core multi is one way to cap heat & therefore temps. Lowering power limits is another way. E. G. 140W/16 sec turbo, 110W long power, whatever the cooling can handle to the OP's target "safe" temperature.

Test undervolt and power limits in windows with Throttlestop without auto-run on startup. Much easier to recover from an excess undervolt...

Find stable settings THEN replicate in BIOS.

 

Delidding a soldered 9900k only drops temps 4-6C. For the Clevo you have to undervolt or mod the heatsink as everyone explained above.

 

Thanks for your advice, but to make these settings I need an unlocked bios right?

 

A chunk of it is accessible through XTU.

 

Ah OK! Can I have XTU together with the clevo control center 2.0? I read that they can conflict.

 

Should be ok.

 

I tried to try the settings, but I don't have the bios unlocked, so I don't have all the features. I tried also with XTU, but it doesn't have all the functions.

 

sand down that bare die baby

 

You don't need unlocked bios with all the advanced settings to reduce Cpu temps. Delidding the Cpu, correct thermal pads thickness, use of liquid metal and proper undervolt should be enough.

A few tips how to reduce temp...

Lapping IHS
Test pressure and Liquid metal

 

And the edges of the IHS to bring it down.

 

Very well, that's what I was going to do! but I ask you some questions:
1) why did you cook the liquid metal? to avoid corrosion?
2) you put the liquid metal also between IHS and HS, but it is not recommended to do it?
Currently I have the cpu that also reaches 95C ° in anthem game, you now what temperatures do you have?

Thanks

 

I think to soak the copper fully so no more liquid metal gets sucked in and the amount does not change.

 

First application of liquid metal will diffuse into the copper over time and would eventually lead to worse thermal transfer.
This way you have better longevity and thermals over time.

 

How long do you bake the LM IHS in the oven for?

 

The others answered question 1).

2) If you are careful and the heatsink lying completely flat on IHS, no other thermal paste perform equal good as liquid metal between IHS and heatsink.

Have used liquid metal this way several years without problems.

A couple of hours. You can repeat it if you have the time.

 

Ok, to do everything, I'm waiting for the copper IHS to arrive. Two questions;
After cooking the liquid metal, do you remove it with abrasive cloth?
Between CPU and IHS did you use silicone to close or not?

 

I wipe it of with a lintfree clothes while it’s hot and wet. I use a painting brush and rub it in further first. Then put on new liquid metal.

I use tape. Whatever I have in hands (electrical/kapton tape). The most important is not using too much liquid metal.

If you mean seal the IHS to the PCB. Nope, I let it float because the mounting mechanism hold the IHS in place.

 

What does baked Conductanaut smell like?

 

Not something you should be sniffing or doing in your kitchen oven

 

Well someone's gotta produce the MGS metallic archaea

 

I'd be more afraid of the wife finding out what you have been "baking".

 

Haha, yes that's a thin red line to cross.

 

Better than a thin red line out your nose.

 

Здравствуйте у меня модель P775TM1-g 1080 + 8700k температура видеокарты поднимается до 90 градусов все пробывал понизить но никак. На Control Center 2.0 можно понизить видеокарту частату поможет кто знает?

 

Does the GPU hit 90 even at max fans? What are you running?

 

[QUOTE = "electrosoft, post: 10995346, member: 180938"] Ударен ли графический процессор 90 даже при максимальных фанатах? Что ты бежишь? [/ QUOTE]
Как можно понизить частату gtx 1080????

 

This is a English forum. Follow the rules

 

Basically please post a translation of what you are posting below your main post, google translate is fine.

 

Hi,
My CPU is hitting peak core temperatures of 100 C and the GPU high 70s C during heavy work.loads with warmer room temperatures and it is going to get warmer and need to improve cooling as much as possible. I'll apply Liquid Metal Conductonaut to the RTX2080 (MXM) GPU and the i9-9900K CPU (and IHS) of my Clevo P775TM1-G "portable desktop" system (Eurocom x7c). I already undervolted the CPU (using XTU) and use a cooling pad (with 4 fans).The CPU will be delidded with the ROCKIT tool and the 9th Gen copper IHS.
To protect again accidental shorts I'll use conforming silicon and Super 33+ electrical tape with a foam or straw dam around the GPU and CPU chips.

Questions:
1) First, Is there still no direct die cooling attempting with the i9-9900K and the unified cooling of this chassis Clevo P775DM1-G?

2) Regarding the IHS, is the 9th Gen Roc copper IHS better than reusing the original one? I remember reading something about thickness variation that needs to be compensated...

3) It is recommended to back the IHS with liquid metal, what should be the oven temperature?

4) Since I will first be delidding the cpu and remove the unified cooler from the CPU and GPU before replacing the thermal pastes with liquid metal, I thought that I might as well plan to replace and upgrade the thermals pads. Is the Gelid GP-extreme the best thermal pads?

5) What is the thermal pad thickness that I should order ahead (e.g. 1.0, 1.5, 2.0mm ...) and what is the layout (to check thermal pads are everywhere needed).

Thank you for your help in clarifying to help me prepare the upgrades.
D

 

1. There is a direct die vapor chamber mod for P870 and the 56x56x3mm vapor chamber should fit P775TM1 heatsink as well.
http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/clevo-overclockers-lounge.788975/page-1886#post-10999525
http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/p870tm-2nd-cpu-fan-port.812706/page-10#post-10993736

2. @Papusan had a custom RockIT IHS made, 4.36mm which improves contact pressure.
https://imgur.com/a/2xHnNVn
And there is a great custom BartX 4.37mm IHS which is CNC made in Poland.
http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/clevo-overclockers-lounge.788975/page-1792#post-10968036

3. Couple hours at 100c or more. Then remove any remaining residue, tin and indium with rubbing alcohol or acetone and finish off with a light and quick pass with +2000 grit sandpaper.

5. Order 0.5 and 1mm, then stack them as needed.

 

This is great news for direct die cooling of i9-9900K with a P775TM1-G (See picture). Thanks for the links.
https://imgur.com/7ruX7DB
If I understand I'd need to order the 56x56x3mm vacuum champer, remove the c-clamp. How about a direct die plate as I'd seen from Rockit last year?
Also, is your "TM1 mod" dealing with a CPU heatsink module only? Wouldn't there be issues with height offset/warping with a unified heatsink as I have (Part label: 6-31-P77FN-401 AURAS 190418-1475) and would I also need to remove/desolder the base plate as you did?

Removing the base plate you said you punctured one heatsink pipe and needed to replace the full heatsink - costly. If I do not remove is it that risky to puncture one of the heatpipes and can it safely be done with a soldering iron thin tip or I'd a large flat tip or a different tool (heat gun, flame, ...)?

Side note: I just moved back to Europe from the US, and I have left most of my tools so wondering what special tools I'd need for a mode like this.

I have a Rockit 9th Gen copper IHS but the overall thickness is 3.62-3.66mm. I would need to order a new one then? Since I have now moved back to France is it easier to order the BartX IHS?

Lapping the IHS and/or CPU lapping is also on my list. Lapping CPU, wouldn't that change the die height hence affect the effective custom made IHS height then?

I don't have an oven but indiction stove and I was thinking of cooking them on low setting for a couple of hours per side - I'll have an oven where I move in a few weeks though.
I just ordered a bunch of sandpaper grits (up to 3000) for my lapping and polishing project.

Thanks.

 

Have a look at @ole!!! thread I linked, in his original mod he soldered the vapor chamber to the heatsink and used a direct die frame from RockIT. The direct die frame needs modifying, since there are SMDs near and around the socket that get in the way. A dremel tool can be used to modify the frame for clearance. My version of the mod uses liquid metal between heatsink/vapor chamber/die, no soldering. And CPU is held by mounting pressure from the heatsink. Kapton tape is used to keep the CPU from sticking to the vapor chamber when disassembling. https://imgur.com/a/gyMIBLI

Yes, so the P870TM1 uses a non-unified heatsink and I didn't have to worry about z-height difference for the GPU. Since the VC is 3mm tall, it's very close to that of a regular 9th gen Intel IHS. With a unified heatsink, you might want to grab some 0.3-1mm copper shimms from ebay, that way you can align the two should there be issues.

The first heatsink was trial and error, theory was to have as few thermal interfaces as possible and better contact. However, even with removed baseplate contact was still sub optimal. Which is why I opted to do as little modding to the heatsink as possible for the 2nd rendition. The P775 heatsink has a copper base that's quite thick and relatively level, unlike the 0.3mm one on the P870, so I wouldn't do anything to it besides polishing it a little with sandpaper to prepare it for liquid metal.

As for the IHS, it really depends on how the contact is with your current one, as you will have to deal with z-height using BartX 4.37mm.
- BartX is a pro Polish overclocker who makes custom cooling parts. Great guy to work with, https://www.bartxstore.com/

The 4.37mm BartX IHS is made for a lapped 9th gen chip, if you want to use it with a non lapped 9th gen die, you need to put a washer or two between the ILM loading screw to reduce some of the pressure. Otherwise you might crack the die. https://imgur.com/a/w3qYRzH

You can apply liquid metal on the copper and leave it out in the sun for a day or two, since the reaction happens even at room temperature. Putting it inside an oven only speeds it up

 

Getting the pads just right on the GPU is still going to be important for the best contact for tweaking.

 

Great link, I had a look already and so the picture about the area to Dremel out, thanks for the reminder. I just ordered the vapor chamber you suggested.
I like your approach/version with Liquid Metal (LM) between heatsink/VC/CPU Die. In hindsight would you now go with your version or with a direct die frame for mod simplicity and/or most efficient heat dissipation?
Also with your version from what you've learned, with the vapor chamber would you solder it or just use LM (which seems simpler and easier)?

Regarding the foam pad barrier, you put one around the CPU but how would you put one when a direct die frame is in place (you wouldn't?)? Would you also worry about the LM slippage between VC and heatsink and put a foam barrier there you?

Note that my Clevo is mostly kept horizontal at home but, on the rare occasion, it'd be in a backpack the times I travel with it by land or on a plane. It is for those times that I want to make sure no LM bids sip out.
I was planning to use conforming silicon varnish, which is handy, but I'll also get a roll of 30mm of Kapton tape you have use in your mods.

For a direct die frame, I will order Der8auer 9th Gen Direct Die Frame, which is cheaper than Rockit with shipping. It is aluminum but I think with Liquid Metal (LM) it should be fine isn't it since it is anodized?

It sounds like a good plan, I like to keep it simpler, more elegant but also better for a first mod to make as little changes as possible.
I just got a new caliper and thickness gauge to help not just eyeball-it but also measure parts and dimensions.
Glad to hear I can keep the base plate. Also, with your version(s) from what you've learned, would you now have kept the base plate or desolder it still? (Of course, you pointed it out uneven original solder joint with heat sink pipes, which might still be an issue with the thicker plate of my P775 heatsink).

Thanks for pointing that out. The copper IHS from BartX does look really well made, the one I have form Rockit has machine tool (CNC/router bits) marks that I would have sanded down too.

At this point, correct me if I am wrong, if I tackle deliding, lapping cpu die and base plate, I might as well go direct die fo the most temp drop and heat dissipation for CPU and also for GPU thanks to LM application there too. My only concern is proper mode without damaging my system, and a sturdy mod for the times when I transport my laptop. I was told against using LM for when parts are vertical, like PCI Graphics car in desktop, but it should be fun with foam or tape straw barriers, isn't it?

Now that I have a caliper I could track how much I am removing when lapping the die. What would be a good amount to remove up to polishing finiish?

Thanks for the tip, I was going to do this as a minimum, especially for the heatsink base plate treatment might not be a suitable piece to put in an oven.

Thank you @jc_denton and @Meaker@Sager for the expert and detailed help and pointers. I am very grateful for your insights.

 

I am planning for that and just ordered Gelid GP-Extreme 1.0mm, 1.5mm and 2.0mm. I wonder if I should have ordered 0.5mm too? Any other sizes?

On a related note, I find it hard to locate thicker thermal pads. In the link below, a 4mm pad is used (and it was not stacked-up with slimmer pads).
http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...2-g-sager-np9152-np9172.795911/#post-10338566

Is stacking two-piece fine or not ideal when you shoot for optimum contact and heat transfers?
Would you recommend I order thicker pads for the thermal pad upgrades I'm planning to do along with delidding and applying liquid metal to CPUY, and GPU?

Regarding the P775TM1G, for the m.2 drives in the manual, there is a mention of square thermal pads to place underneath the drive controller and the motherboard. When I receive my chassis from Eurocum end of July '19, there not in the parts, shouldn't have come with it?
They told me at the time to purchase it from them (hum )-: ).
It is quite thick 10mm (with 2mm than can be peeled off in some case it seems. I had high temp on the controller according to Samsung Magician and other sensor tracking apps, and on a pinch, I put a stack of 3 or 4 squares under my primary m.2 drive per User manual guidelines.

I am now back in Europe and we are having the first heatwave coming, so all of this project is good timing and I just remembered about the m.2 drive I only recently noticed getting hot with a slight performance speed issue... Putting on the controller (which normally runs hot) and the rest of the drives chips was not a good idea, temps went out of spac and I got alarms... Hece, I'll tackle just the controller as recommended in the manual.

Do you know where I can get a pair of those original ones for my two m.2 drives?


Thank you for your help and insights.

 

I'm quite satisfied with my mod, it's simple with a little prep work, been running it since March and it's been great so far. The fewer thermal interfaces (TIM) you have the better, and the few you do have will be the limiting factor, since the vapor chamber is x10-100 times the thermal transfer of copper and copper being around ~300-400W/mK. With solder, you will be stuck with ~22-24 W/mK. That is low temperature solder (~138c), as vapor chambers are fragile and will warp if exposed to higher temperatures than that, due to internal pressures. Which is why TG Conductonaut is a great substitute at 73W/mK, which allows for much faster heat transfer between the vapor chamber and the heatsink.

Another thing to keep in mind, if you lap your 9900k the direct die frame will be higher than the die and vapor chamber + die will not have proper contact. You have to remember, you do not need much LM, so there shouldn't be any slushing around. It's basically a thin coat of paint. But having the foam and kapton tape around the socket is a piece of mind.

P775TM1 and P870TM1 heatsinks are very different, P7 has a thick copper plate that has heatpipes soldered on top of it. While P8 has a very thin baseplate soldered to heatpipes which are then soldered onto the heatsink mounting bracket. So for the P7 doesn't have to deal with a warped baseplate.

As mentioned, it's a thin coat but I would still do the foam/kapton protection. Der8auer has a good video on how to properly lap the die. I wouldn't recommend going thinner than 8700K. Stock 9900K is 0.87mm and 8700K/8086k is 0.42mm. Going thinner than that might end up cracking the die and there is no long term study of how LM affects silicon after you sand down the diffusion barrier.

 

Your goal is to slim down 0.5mm where possible and the thin pads will help with that. Talk to your reseller or a local one if you want pad replacements for specific bits OEM style.

 

Thanks for the clarification.

For the m.2 thick thermal, I asked one Clevo reseller in France and the person I talked didn't think they had this part.
To clarify, this thermal pad comes with a P775TM1G Clevo chassis and usually provided to the customer, isn't it?

I just moved to France from the US so I am just starting getting my way around, I'll call around french and European resellers. Apart from Eurocom sites selling them (they started after I asked, for short while they were going to mail me the missing part), I haven't seen anyone else selling these as an OEM part.

 

Yes if the port is not used we provide the pad in the box.