P955ER throttling

may I ask clevo resellers what is this ????
920mhz average on Gtx 1070 max-q ? On AC ? With a maximum of 1050mhz ?

Clevo is redefining the term "throttling" entirely.you used the 80w version to keep temps down and you can't even hold the base clock ?

Lets hope its just the power supply(the system is drowing 148W at max load with a 150W power supply) or specific to the Q6

While the aero 15x is doing 1720mhz boosts the sager P955ER is stuck below base clocks at 923mhz .....



UPDATE : has been fixed in a CCC update. It was a bug.

 

This is nothing new. Clevo reseller will tell you otherwise without any kind of proof. XMG has demonstrated this perfectly in another thread.

 

I believe its the power adapter since the GPU is cool. What kind of imbecile gives a 1070MQ laptop a 150W powerbrick? Is it just because clevo can't design a slim 180w one ? Use the msi 180w brick .

The normal 1070 will experience power drain with a 180w adapter and needs 230w . Is max Q a reduction of 80w ?

The system despite heavy throttling is pulling 149W constant(cpu@32w and gpu@60w)


You can see the cpu reaching 98c while running below TDP(32w) how does this even happen ?

 

Only worth spending time to post a response to say what an immature and petty thing that is to say.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/the-eurocom-q6.815405/page-2

 

Well no. Pascal have a much more sensitive throttling point due to GPU Boost 3.0.

 

Have you just compared average clock to an instantaneous one? Ok. Are both tests proceeded the same way, I.e. average measurement?

 

Its form notebookcheck review of the Q6 with the 150W PSU. Notebookcheck is the most trustworthy notebook review site in my opinion.

The GPU never boosted above 1050mhz and averaged 920mhz in witcher 3. That's abysmal

Notebookcheck blamed the 150W PSU as insufficient for a 1070MQ

And the aero 15x average clock is 1480mhz stock and 1700mhz when OC (WD2). In the video review it fluctuated between 1690~1740 when overclocked, that's stock 1070 performance

 

You're absolutely ritght. Because MSI thin'n'lights don't throttle to 920 MHz. They throttle down to 780. Not to mention 100 MHz less on CPU.

https://www.notebookcheck.net/fileadmin/Notebooks/Eurocom/Q6/stressmax.png

https://www.notebookcheck.net/fileadmin/Notebooks/MSI/GS65_8RF-019DE_Stealth_Thin/stresstest.jpg

 

Still, NBC isn't one person nor their benchmarking standards are standarised.

 

I am not an msi fanboy

And no that's normal for the GS65. The catsrated 80w 1070MQ frequncy in furmark is ~780mhz , while the superior 90w(aero 15x) version is ~1180mhz and the normal card is 1440mhz.furmark is a power hog

My proplem is the witcher 3 performance. 920mhz clocks for a 1070MQ is not normal (castrated version or not). The proplem is that the GPU temp is 66c so I don't know why is the GPU downclocking this heavily.

 

Their benchmark are almost standardized.

If the 150w PSU causes than anyone with it will get the worst 1070 performance mankind has seen.the people getting normal results all had the old 180w PSU.

 

Normal 1070 does not hold 1440mhz furmark/kombustor at stock power, more like ~1200mhz.

Yes furmark is an artificially heavy power load but it cannot break the board power limits so shouldn't run any hotter or hungrier than anything else stressing the gpu to 100%. Drivers also interfere with furmark too. Firestrike stress tests are not restricted and I've found will find the crash/bsod where furmark doesn't.

That P955 limit looks to me like a firmware total system power limit which is what furmark+prime is designed to find. Even much beefier units than this, like a P870, have system limits (aka throttles) unless you have modded bios/vbios/firmware. If it's purely because of undersized power brick, especially in Witcher 3, blame the hordes of idiot users who whine to resellers about saving a couple hundred grams on the spec sheet without realising the compromises that entails, and blame resellers if they don't make it clear the smaller adapter means reduced performance under heavy load, if that is the clear reproducible result of their testing.

Thin and light, stable and reliable, powerful; you can only pick two.

 

My proplem isn't with max q. Its with gimping max q further and delivering pathetic performance

I can pick the 3 : aero 15x





See that the 1070MQ in the aero 15x is for all intents and purposes a 1070N. The only thing holding it back is thermals(fixable) and single channel

The sager performance is trash forever because its caused by the gimped TDP

Why ? Because the aero card has a target of 90w and a limit of 100w while the clevo card has a target of 80w and a limit of 80w(90w if your lucky with the bios)

Clevo can match that, their GPU cooling is beefier than the aero 15x. But why should they do that when their are guys like you defending them 24/7 ? .

How low can sager go with the 1070MQ until people like you start criticizing them ? 700mhz ?. 920mhz AVARGAE on a ****ing game(not a stress test)on a pascal card is disgraceful abomination, let alone on a 500$+ card. ITS A 180MHZ UNDERCLOCK BELOW THE BASE CLOCK OF THE GIMPED 1070MQ.........

 

I don't care either way, MaxQ thin n lights are all gimped ripoffs to some extent, but how gimped some are seems to be something you care about a lot. NBC review shows the throttling, so go vote with your wallet already and buy Aero 15x to prove Clevo+Sager+resellers how stupid they are.

 

Sorry but you do not understand @ahmad hendeh point nor mine. The MSI does throttle down to 780 on Prime 95 + Furmark, that is absolutely currect, fortunatly for MSI that test is a turturetest that stresses out the hardware in a very unrealistic matter, however we talk 920mhz clock on witcher 3 on the clevo, this is a game. This is a realistic scenario irl, this is a user potentially buying a notebook that cannot handle gaming, this is a literal disaster.


As you can see here, running firestrike the GPU (sadly not clockspeed here) went to 67c, the CPU (4ghz) 66c.


Linus also confirming the GS65 handles games in terms of cooling effortlessly, but not handling extreme loads.

Again, you're a clevo fanboy that takes things out of context, misleading people who would want a proper notebook.

@bennyg I think you're wrong with Furmark. Prema and other users specifically warned users about using furmark for that exact reason, Furmark killed a lot of GPU's because it did exacly that, go beyond any kind of stress the card could possibly handle.

 

I am not a blind customer, I know that the aero 15x is overpriced by at least 300$. I can't even afford it currently.

To make my point more clear lets look at these 5 laptops

Asus zephryus M (GTX1070N 115W)
Aero 15x (1070MQ 90-100W)
MSI GS65 (1070MQ 80-90W)
Eurocom Q6 (1070MQ 80-80W)

3D performance :

1070 FE = 102%
Asus Zephryus M = 100%
Aero 15x = 95%
GS65 = 89%
Eurocom Q6 = 81%

You're losing 14% performance by going with a bad 1070MQ. The difference between the 1070MQ in the aero 15x and the Q6 is astronomical.

Clevo can fix this with a simple bios update and match the aero 15x, but when they have fanboys defending them no matter how low they go why bother ?. The card is already gimped by 5% why not castrate it by an additional 14%?



Clevo gimped the GPU performance for noise. And Eurocom took it further. And the result is this 1070MQ abomination in the Q6 running @920mhz average

 

Show me one game test that's comparable then. Not a screenshots with instantaneous numbers instead of averages after given test times.

 

MSI GS65

Q6

 

Is there any other brand P955ER review on the internet? Or just the EUROCOM one?

 

There is someone on reddit who is getting a GS65 performance out of it. Buy that guy:

1 has the 180w PSU
2 he bought if form gentechpc and had a different TDP hard power limit



Lets hope XMG sends a review unit to notebookcheck

 

I mean this is not rocket science, I know u're a clevo fanboy and you like to just overlook a lot of things, but stop it.

MSI GS 65:

Gigabyte Aero 15x V8:

Eurocom Q6:

 

And they've pointed out, that this might be caused by powerbrick itself. This is not thermal problem, which Clevo could've been blamed for, but it's the reseller fault. This thread is titled P955ER, what implies that every laptop from this series has that issue. And this is precisely why I'm asking for another reseller P955ER review.

 

The "other" reviews all have the 180w PSU some of them perform like the GS65(~1300mhz), while other are slightly below(~1200mhz) depending on your hard TDP power limit.


If you buy it with a 150w PSU (which is the most likely outcome) you are going to enjoy that 1070MQ@920mhz that will probably lose to even a stock 1060MQ


Almost all retailers except HIDevoultion sell it with the 150w adapter so it's universal.

And the GPU might not have thermal issues but the CPU does reach 98c undervolted with stock thermal paste

 

Show me 1 review or benchmarks showcasing something different. As far as I'm concerned If the only thing I get is 1 review but nothing else then I go after that. As you pointed out, they said it MIGHT be the powerbrick. What if its not the powerbrick? Are you happy recommending this garbage to people??

 

There are a jayztwocents review out there with GS65 performance. He also has a 180w PSU.

Put perma said that the 1070MQ in clevo chassis was gimped "further" to pass testing. The first gimp was using the (80-90w) version instead of the (90-100w) version.so The second gimp is probably is probably lowering it to 80-80w in new bios versions (aka the card will never, ever boost to anything above 1250mhz)

Result :



Combine the newer bios + power throttling from PSU and you get this catastrophe in which clevo-somehow- managed to get their 1070MQ into 1060MQ levels of performance.

 

It's a review of Q6, not P955ER. You can see that Eurocome does not have the best reputation on this forum. Either when it comes to this model or others. So yeah, I wouldn't recommend Eurocome either, given the feedback here or there. But you keep ranting Clevo and not the specific resellers. I believe John from Obsidian explained it to you, but it seems like you've just ignored what he's said.

 

You do realize the Q6 is a P955ER right?
I gave you 1 simple task, prove me otherwise by simply giving me something. I'm open minded, but when people like you keep writing that I'm wrong, or that I can't take a valid source as face value, without giving me anything to prove me wrong or showcase that not all models are like that, then how am I, as an open minded person, supposed to take your statements serious?

Why am i supposed to believe a guy who likes clevo more than a professional review?

 

Some clevo resellers (obsidian + HIDevoultion + XMG in my opinion) are truly good and I would expect decent performance in their gtx1070MQ + 180w PSU

But when configured properly on these resellers the P950ER is 1900~2000$. At that price the P955ER IS ABSOLUTELY NOT WORTH IT . Especially when you can buy an Objectively superior laptop like the msi GS65 for 100$ more or a vastly superior one like aero 15x for 200$ more

 

Just tell any Bugatti owner he rides a Volkswagen. Q6 is P955ER, but not every P955ER is Q6. Just like squares and rectangles.

 

I already pointed out the huge flaw in XMG's statement. Without any screenshots or logs of any kind, he's basicially hitting a brick wall here. He's doing the same as you do, obviously it's bad for business your products are disfunctional, so you claim, "internal tests showcase something else". It doesn't work.

Just don't be that guy, give me something that shows otherwise, anything. No statement, no random user without any kind of proof, All I'm asking for is a benchmark or any kind of screenshot showcasing proper clockspeeds during gameplay.

 

The reason I posted this with P9RXER name is that if this unprecedented level of throttling is caused by the 150w PSU then the overwhelming majority of people out there with the p955er will get this abomination.

Eurocom lowered the TDP hard limit(different than target TDP) to 80w from 90w. But 80w or 90w wont matter when the gpu is only getting 50~60w from the 150w psu

 

The only proof you have is that Q6 sucks. But you seem to foolishly extend that statement to every other reseller's version of P955ER. If there's one person who should be proving anything, it's you.

 

You prove my point. You are literally unable to prove me wrong. The Q6 is a P955ER system, I have no reason to believe that other P955ER systems are better given the fact that nobody, including you cannot prove that this is a blunder only on the Q6.

I gave you 1 very simple task, you are unable to do it.

 

I am waiting for confirmation from a guy with a P955ER from gentechpc(might take a while).

Scepticism is good for consumers. Assuming the worse is always better than getting stuck with broken trash because you are naive.

And no it's the responsibility of good companies to get their laptop to reviewers. Until MULTIPLE REVIEWS pop up this review is law for the P955ER because it's the only one we have

 

Can you ask the guy to make a thread? I'd like to be updated on that one as well.

and as you pointed out flawlessly, given the fact that we only have 1 P955ER notebook review, we should assume all are garbage until proven otherwise. Better safe than sorry.

 

I asked him to open a thread here. Just don't trash the laptop hard if he opens it. The guy seems genuinely happy with his machine

 

If he's happy with it good for him.

 

-not the same guy-



Temps with LM on CPU + GPU

 

Ouch. Any way of getting the guy to do some benchmarks to see if it at least doesnt throttle the GPU like mad?

@aIex great product, please keep protecting this kind of practice.

 

Couldn't agree more.

If I happen to prove it's resellers fault, will you rant resellers, preferably by name, and not Clevo?

 

He returned it(this isnt the same guy with P955ER. But another with a P950ER).

You can't expect a sane man to keep a laptop that's throttling to 3.6ghz + 99c on cpu with LIQUID METAL

 

Yes I would.

I would be shocked if this happens in an obsidian machine as example.


The only reason I didn't name this Q6 throttling is because if this is caused by the 150W PSU this will happen in almost all p955ER out there.


However, the higher quality resellers cost more. So the closer it gets to 2100$ the more worthless this laptop becomes. Since it's only advantage over the objectively superior GS65/AERO 15X/RAZER 2018 is the price.

 

Same reddit thread:


https://www.reddit.com/r/laptops/comments/8p57at/just_got_my_sager_np8954_clevo_p955er/

Although he has castrated 150 W PSU.

 

Notebookcheck got 14600 in firestrike graphics but still had 920mhz clocks with the Q6. That's why I am waiting for the clocks.

His comment confirmed to me that gentechpc didn't lock the TDP hard limit to 80w instead of 90w(since he is overclocking). But with a gpu eating 90w and cpu eating 45w stock one of them will inevitably power throttle.my guess is the CPU which might actually explain how he is getting mediocre thermals on the CPU compared with other guy horrific ones.

 

Moreover, 3Dmark doesn't stress GPU and CPU at the same time. That's probably why the 1070MQ holds in it while cracking in the witcher 3.

 

I'm only hitting a brick wall with you, no one else. The only flaw in my statement is that you found a way to argue against it and spend a week quoting and refering to it again and again and again and again and again and again....and again. It doesn't bother me in the slightest that you don't accept my comment.

It's getting really really tiresome.

P.S. please have the decency to tag me when you talk about me or 'him', at least that way its easier to see every time you attack or misrepresent my words so i can correct you.

 

Nothing more has to be added.

also the guy had 85c in heaven, heaven with 85C!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm crying :'D

@XMG The flaw is that you provide no evidence to proof your point which is completely uselss against a skeptical minded person. I only care about facts, not what a reseller tries to tell me.

 

@XMG why is the P955ER usually offered with the 150w power supply ?

If we assume the CPU is consuming 45w and the gpu is consuming 90(the weaker 1070MQ is 80-90w). You have 15w left. The screen alone properly eats more than that.

There is absolutely no way the cpu and gpu can run maxed out at the same time.

 

That's with A LM on the cpu too.stock will properly be in the 90's

 

Hey everyone, I'm the same guy on reddit. Saw this thread and decided to post here. I reran the heavenbench after seeing the issues with the temps. I guess I read wrong or was doing something else. Temps for CPU stays at around 57C average during Heaven.

I can try running more stuff to get more info, there seems to be a lot of different results for these laptops from Clevo/Sager so the consistency might be the issue with these laptops.

Edit: I've also took readings after playing the witcher for almost half an hour while in Novigrad there to get more stressed readings (trying to get through other games first).

What's interesting from the results I just ran in the last hour or so is that Heaven seems to keep the GPU at the base clock. The Witcher if you look at the average that I've posted on reddit holds at above 1500MHz while I have the OC in afterburner. Temps are still good all the way around.

The CPU seems to throttle in speeds while I run Prime95 but basically stays at 80C. When I turned up the CPU boost wattage in Intel's tool, it brought up the temp so 80ishC is probably about how hot it'll get overall. I haven't seem much higher. From what I understand this is how most laptop CPU's work with their boost? I have used desktops up until now so I haven't really read up on how it works.

These results are from running through a chunk of a quest in The Witcher 3 ultra settings with stock CPU and GPU settings.