Sager NP5160 vs NP8130

I'm buying one of these two laptops. Wondering what the difference was in the configs I'm looking at (upgraded NP5160 display, RAM to 8GB and upgraded to hybrid main HDD and Centrino Advanced Wireless in both latops).

Its $1,134 for the NP 5160 vs. $1,399 for NP8130.
The spec difference I noticed are:
1) NP8130 has matte screen at 1080p, NP5160 has superglossy
2) NP8130 has GTX 460M (1.5GB memory, GDDR5) vs NP5160 GT 540M (1GB memory, GDDR3, Optimus)
3) NP8130 has a fingerprint reader

I also had some questions about performance of various parts. First, how do the GTX 460M and GT 540M compare in terms of gaming ability, battery life when gaming, battery life when not gaming, and heat. Are they both future proof (i.e. Crysis 2). I intend to us this as my primary machine for 3 years.

Also, what is the difference between the Centrino Advanced and Ultimate configurations. I read somewhere the the Ultimate has 3 antennas to the Advanced's 2, which increases effective range by adding 50% to DL speeds at any given range. Is that true, or does each antenna work on a separate channel so its irrelevant unless you are simultaneous upstreaming to a TV and downloading from a WiFi connection or something.
Also, do these both have Intel WiDi?

Finally, what is the value in paying for a higher clocked CPU in terms of performance and battery life/heat tradeoff? Would you recommend always or never upgrading CPU, or is it situational? Seems that with Sandy Bridge/Huron River (would like to know the difference there btw - does the NP8130 Huron River include the WiMax bells and whistles in addition to the new 2nd gen i7 CPU while the NP5160 doesn't) the i7 quad-core CPU will not be the constraint (RAM is expanded, but GPU is still entry level) in performance regardless.

NP5160 $1,134.00
Display 15.6" Full HD LED-Backlit Display with Super Glossy Surface (1920 x 1080) [$65.00]
Video & Graphics Card 1GB GDDR3 Nvidia GeForce GT 540M GPU with Optimus Technology / Embedded Intel HD Graphics
CPU Processor 2nd Generation Intel® Core™ i7-2630QM Processor ( 6MB L3 Cache, 2.00GHz)
Thermal Compound Stock Standard Thermal Compound
Operating System Genuine MS Windows® 7 Home Premium 32/64-Bit Edition ( 64-Bit Preloaded )
Memory 8GB Dual Channel DDR3 SDRAM at 1333MHz - 2 X 4GB [$70.00]
Primary Hard Disk Drive 500GB 7200rpm SATA Hybrid Hard Drive with 4GB SSD [$95.00]
Optical Drive Bay — Optical Drive or Hard Disk Drive in Optical Drive Bay with Caddy case 8X DVD±R/RW/4X +DL Super-Multi Drive & Software
Wireless Network Card Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6230 - 802.11A/B/G/N Wireless LAN + Bluetooth Combo Module [$25.00]
Primary Battery Smart Li-ION Battery Pack
Microsoft Office New! Microsoft Office Starter 2010 - Included in Price
Warranty Sager 1 Year Limited Parts and Labor Warranty

NP8130 $1,399.00
Display 15.6" Full HD LED-Backlit Display with Matte Finished Surface (1920 x 1080)
Video & Graphics Card Nvidia GeForce GTX 460M GPU with 1.5GB GDDR5 Video Memory
CPU Processor 2nd Generation Intel® Core™ i7-2630QM Processor ( 6MB L3 Cache, 2.00GHz)
Thermal Compound Stock Standard Thermal Compound
Operating System Genuine MS Windows® 7 Home Premium 32/64-Bit Edition ( 64-Bit Preloaded )
Memory 8GB Dual Channel DDR3 SDRAM at 1333MHz - 2 X 4GB
Primary Hard Disk Drive 500GB 7200rpm SATA Hybrid Hard Drive with 4GB SSD [$75.00]
Optical Drive Bay — Optical Drive or Hard Disk Drive in Optical Drive Bay with Caddy case 8X DVD±R/RW/4X +DL Super-Multi Drive & Software
Wireless Network Card Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6230 - 802.11A/B/G/N Wireless LAN + Bluetooth Combo Module [$25.00]
Primary Battery Smart Li-ION Battery Pack
Integrated Security Device Fingerprint Reader
Microsoft Office New! Microsoft Office Starter 2010 - Included in Price
Warranty Sager 1 Year Limited Parts and Labor Warranty

 

-Screen is preference.. I prefer matter because of the lights in the classrooms.
-460 is more powerful then the 540. 540 will be better for battery life/heat. Classic tradeoff of battery for performance
-fingerprint reader is an extra. Depends on if you'll use it
-difference beween the 6230 and 3000 wireless cards (beside te antena count is that the 6300 doesn't have integrated bluetooth. You might get better range with the 6300, but I doubt you'll see a difference in speeds unless you have wireless N router and you're hitting over 350mb/s connection speeds
-I'd recommend the 2720. Better performance/$. not so much with the 2820. 2920 is obscene but allows for OCing

 

Thanks. Didn't realize matte made a difference in lecture halls, thought it was just outside. Good to know.
6230 card seems like a much better deal, I don't have a super router. Realized core i7 meant no WiDi though, so looked into a Dell XPS 15 now that 1080p screen option is back (i5 sandy bridge bigger but non-hybrid HDD) in a similar price range. Any thoughts? Will not having a quad-core make a huge difference given benefit of 2nd gen chipsets?


XPS 15,
Genuine Windows® 7 Home Premium, 64bit, English Unit Price $1,328.99
Instant savings with Online purchase. Offer Expires 03/04 at 5 am EST.
Expires March 04, 2011 @ 5:00 am EST Details - $239.00
Expires March 3, 2011 Details

Catalog Number: 70702 NXPS15_F_2E
Module Description Show Details
XPS 15 XPS 15
Operating System Genuine Windows® 7 Home Premium, 64bit, English
Processor Intel® Core™ i5-480M (2.66GHz, 4Threads, turbo boost up to 2.93Ghz, 3M cache)
Memory 6GB Shared Dual Channel DDR3 Memory
Keyboard Standard Keyboard - English
Video Card NVIDIA® GeForce® GT 420M 1GB graphics with Optimus
Hard Drive 640GB 7200 RPM SATA Hard Drive
System Color and LCD Silver Anodized Aluminum 15.6" FHD (1080p) B+RGLED Display with Facial Recognition and 2.0 MP webcam
Network Adapter Integrated 10/100/1000 Network Card
Adobe Reader Adobe® Acrobat® Reader 9.0
CD ROM/DVD ROM 8X Tray Load CD/DVD Burner (Dual Layer DVD+/-R Drive)
Sound JBL 2.1 Speakers with Waves Maxx Audio 3
Wireless Intel® Centrino® Wireless-N 1000 with Wireless Display Support
Office Productivity Software (Pre-Installed) Microsoft® Office Starter: reduced-functionality Word & Excel w/ ads. No PowerPoint or Outlook
Anti-Virus/Security Suite (Pre-installed) McAfee SecurityCenter, 15-Months
Battery 92 WHr 9-cell Lithium Ion Primary Battery
Hardware Support Services 1 Year Limited Warranty w/1 Year Return To Depot Service
Misc 5 Please contact me regarding Dell’s exclusive internet offers
Mobile Broadband No Mobile Broadband Selected
Bluetooth Dell Bluetooth 3.0

TOTAL: $1,089.99

 

yeah, my current laptop has glossy and it sucks to use it in lecture halls. especially when you've got a light on the ceiling behind you. the glare gets annoying.

i'd definitely suggest the second generation i7's.. sandy bridge is a huge jump in performance with little price difference. the dell one shown in that config is a 1st gen.

so basically the sager models you were looking at were a better choice IMO.. if gaming isn't a huge thing for you, and you'll be using it in a classroom, id suggest the 5160:
Sager NP5160 / Clevo W150HN PRE ORDER
- 15.6" FHD 16:9 "Matte Type" Super Clear Ultra Bright LED Anti-Glare Screen w/ 95% NTSC Color Gamut (1920x1080) (Add's 4-7 business days to build time)
- Standard Dead Pixel Policy
- -2nd Generation Intel® Core™ i7-2720QM, 2.2-3.3GHz, (32nm, 6MB L3 cache)
- Stock Thermal Compound-
- nVidia GT 540M 1024MB PCI-Express GDDR3 DX11 with Optimus™ Technology
- No Video Adapter
- ~ 6,144MB DDR3 1333MHz Dual Channel Memory (2 SODIMMS)
- Standard Finish
- ~Combo 8x8x6x4x Dual Layer DVD +/-R/RW 5x DVD-RAM 24x CD-R/RW Drive w/Software
- ~ 500GB (w/ 4GB SSD Memory) Seagate XT 7200RPM NCQ Hybrid (Serial-ATA II 300 - 32MB Cache)
- No Additional Hard Drive in ODD Bay - When Selecting, Optical Drive is NOT Included
- No Back Up Hard Drive
- NO External USB Optical Drive
- No Back Up Software
- No Floppy Drive
- Internal 4-in-1 Card Reader (SD/MMC/MS/MS PRO)
- None Standard--
- Intel® Advanced-N 6230 - 802.11A/B/G/N Wireless LAN Module + Bluetooth
- No Network Accessory
- Built in 2.0 Megapixel Camera
- No TV Tuner
- Sound Blaster Compatible 3D Audio - Included
- No Carrying Case
- NO Spare Battery
- No Car Adapter
- None Standard*
- No Dock/Hub/Adapter
- Integrated Fingerprint Reader
- No External Keyboard or Mouse
- No Notebook Cooler
- ~Windows 7 Home Premium 64-Bit Installed (64&32-Bit CD Included) w/ Drivers & Utilities CD's + Microsoft Office Starter 2010 - Included with OS Purchase
- No Office Software
- No Software Bundle
- 3 Year Labor 1 Year Parts, Lifetime Sager Toll Free Tech Support
- No Xotic PC Gear

$1394.00

but at that price point, i'd go with the 8130 considering for $5 more you get the 460, and 8gb ram. with a bit less battery life though..

so basically you've gotta decide what you want more. around 2 extra hours of battery, or better gaming performance. (and the 8130 weighs around 1lb more which isn't much, but might be something to consider..)

 

Don't get the XPS 15. You're getting a crippled GPU. That 420m is ~50% slower than even the 540m (which is already low-mid range). You will notice a huge difference in the processor as well. That i5 is a last gen dual core. The 2630qm is a quadcore at 2ghz (sandy bridge), but it turbos to 2.8ghz. the 480m is less than half the performance of the 2630qm, even moreso for the 2720qm.

Core i7 isn't what limits you in WiDi. It's the 2630qm. If you get the np5160 with the 6230 or 6300 (no bluetooth on this one) and the 2720qm, you can theoretically do WiDi. Requirements are here

If the screen is a problem, check out mythlogic or XoticPC, I'm fairly sure they both offer matte upgrades on the np5160.

Basically, avoid that XPS 15. You're getting much worse performance than the np5160, which ends up being cheaper too.

EDIT: bah, Hizzaah beat me to it apparently

 

Um the XPS 15 has the 540m as of tonight and the sandy bridge refresh for the same price as the previous one. add in Dell coupons and haggling and it lift actually be cheaper. Also I saw them advertising 3d... Can that card handle it?


I have a feeling the xps might be lighter too.

 

dont believe the 3D is in the 15" though.. only 17". which has the 3gb 555m card

 

I'm just gonna throw this into the mix
http://forum.notebookreview.com/sager-clevo/551664-2630qm-widi.html

 

No, it really can't handle it on the 540m. While it's technically supported you'll be hugely disappointed. I have 3d vision enabled on my desktop on SLI'ed 470's. I can run most games at high settings with 3d, but framerates aren't great. PC Perspective did a review of the 3D capabilities of the Asus G series running the 460m (which is 2x better than the 540m in most cases) and they had to turn the settings way down to get acceptable frame rates. I don't think you'd be happy with it really. 3D vision basically takes your standard gaming framerates and cuts them in half, because it needs to render twice as much material (1 frame per second now becomes 2 frames per second rendered, 60hz to each eye).

You'd still be disappointed here. Games that can run in medium to high on that card would need to be turned to low medium to play it in 3D. The 555m is still not quite the 460m in performance and as the link above shows, the 460m just can't handle it that well. 3D vision requires LOTS of umph to play games at high res + high settings. My desktop class cards only hit 20-30fps in games like Just Cause 2.

I did a pretty complete benchmarking post on the digital storm forums, but I'll just add it here because I've never really seen complete benchmarking between no 3d/3d and sli

I really need to update that with the 485m when I get it, because it equals roughly the 460 desktop card. You'll see what I mean when I say it hurts performance a LOT.

Good catch! I thought it was odd that that CPU was missing from that list since everything else is covered. I figured it was just because it was an OEM CPU.

 

3D killing frame rates makes sense.. doesn't 3D mean rendering 2 frames at once equaling twice the work (or more) for the card which means half as many fps? or something like that..?

I dont think the OP was interested in 3D gaming though.. just gaming in general..

@ OP: it depends on what games you're interested in playing, and at what settings. here's a rough list of what laptop gpu's will play what games, at different settings. the 540 should be able to play a lot of games at med-high settings, but dont expect to play on ultra settings for most games. the 460 is much more powerful and will be able to max out many games

 

After a few years of mid-low, the 485 will be a breath of fresh air for me

 

Join the club lol years of lows for me.. Best gaming experience to-date is from my current laptop. Inspiron 1545 with a 2.0ghz dual core pentium, 3gb ram, and integrated intel GMA 4500MHD 256mb graphics

 

So to clarify, the Intel Centrino Advanced-N 6230 could handle WiDi with the stock processor on the Sager NP5160? If not how hard is it to replace a wireless card?

Also, I believe the Dell XPS 15 has been updated with Sandy Bridge. Have no idea about 3D, will likely never use it.

Also, I've realized matte screens are that great for my needs. And this freezing problem with NP8130 is worrying? What are the chances a similar issue comes up with the NP5160 at release, and what are potential remedies if it exists. Cause that might make me get the Dell.

If I do choose the Sager, is sager website or reseller better for the standard configuration I mentioned in OP? What are pros and cons of each?

 

Wireless cards: dead easy to replace. Just unscrew the bottom panel, unhook the two (or three) antennas depending on the model, pull out the card. Put in the new and do the steps in reverse. Takes maybe 5 minutes tops.


3D: A lot of Nvidia cards technically support 3D, but most laptop screens aren't 120hz to support it. (and the cards don't have the oomph to drive it)

Freezing: I think the issue is less than people make it out to be. Only a few have even had issues, most of that thread is people that don't have the laptop yet and are posting tons of "oh noes" type responses. Check the poll in the owner's forum, I think it's not that bad (or it wasn't anyway). Most of the consensus was that this was happening on sandy bridge systems in general, not just Sager. People with Asus and Dell models and even desktops were having similar issues.

Sager: go with a reseller. Shop around. I found that Xotic and Malibal had the best prices, but the latter didn't have the np5160 I think. Mythlogic is a bit more but offers much better customization options like the matte screen. Most resellers also offer better warranties than Sager does, something like 3 yr labor / 1 yr parts and free shipping, versus 1 yr /1 yr no free shipping. Sager builds machines but the consensus is that they don't know how to service them or do customer support well, you need a reseller for that. I think they have a BBB rating of F for the customer support.

Widi: Yes, stock CPU and either the 6230 or 6300 should do it. In either case you need to buy a WiDi receiver box as well. And from first hand experience, I was underwhelmed by it.

 

eastofthemississippi:

I can confirm your clarification request in your first paragraph.

NP5160 has no freezing issues.

Sager resellers have been known to give better customer support and warranty.

 

Believe so.. but the wireless card should be pretty easy to change out.

yes it has SB. 15" doesn't have 3D. only 17" xps had 3D

the freezes arent limited to sager/clevo. many manufacturers are experiencing it. switching to dell may or may not make a difference..

we'll know more about how big the freezing issue is as more people get their machines. not many have them yet to know.

resellers are WAY better then ordering directly from sager. better support, better customization, and better pricing. just to give a few reasons idk of any pros for ordering from sager lol.

there are a bunch of resellers/builders represented here on the forum (their user name) : Mythlogic (MYTHLOGIC), Xotic PC (__@XoticPC), Malibal (MALIBAL), Powernotebooks (Paladin44), LPC- Digital (babyhemi), etc..

my suggestions:
-visit their sites
-pm them (i'd suggest several/all of them to get a feel for each of them. this will also help you with getting the best deal after you collect some quotes)
-shoot other users pm's if you want to know about their experiences with one of the resellers

they'll all be more then happy to take care of you

 

how is the gt555m of the xps 17 3d compared with the gtx 460m ?gaming wise, and without using the 3d on dell ?