Sager NP9873-S, LOTS OF PROBLEMS.....(with video proof)

So a few months back I ordered a NP9873-s with single GTX1080, 2 - 256 950pro nvme ssd's in raid 0, and 6700k Skylake. I received it approximately 2 weeks ago and since day 1 I have been having issues.

Let me preface by saying this is not a Sager bashing thread as I loved my last laptop from them. What I really want to know is if im alone out there and this is an isolated case. Here are my issues;

1: 1440p display is washed out in contrast. Trying to adjust this in the Nvidia control panel helps but there is always a bit of a grey fog look to the screen.

2: Fan noise. If I dont overclock the gpu the fan noise is very tolerable however my gpu sits around 90C constantly while gaming. I tried using the onboard GPU overclocking utility to UNDERCLOCK the card to get temps under control. However every time I do this it maxes out the fans no matter what I set the fan offset to. So basically i'm stuck with crazy loud server grade fan noise or quiter noise levels but insane heat buildup.

3: System throttling. For whatever reason the system will seemingly throttle at random times. I'm not talking about gaming but things like browsing chrome and doing email in outlook. It is almost as if the machine cant handle simple tasks at random times.

4. Graphics performance (MY BIGGEST PROBLEM). I primarily play doom at 1440p. For the 2 weeks I have had the laptop it it performed great and averaged around 200fps (although GPU on stock settings stayed around 90c). Well last night the frames started dipping down to around 50 for no reason. I restarted the game, the machine, clean re-installed Nvidia driverds as well as the game. I am an experienced users and feel like I have checked everything yet I still get garbage frame rates now.

Here is a quick vid I did showing the garbage frame rates at 1440p with only medium grphics settings in Doom.


I have emailed Frank at Sager but it was late last night so I'm waiting for some help. If any of these are common or explainable I would love to hear from you guys. This shouldn't be happening with a $3500 Laptop...

 

Can you take a screenshot of your clevo control centre settings? Also what power mode is your system in?

 

Attached

 

Here is another vid showing it going from 200 to 50 and back.

 

Here is a video from this evening showing the system bottle necking so hard that it freezes. You would think I was doing something system intensive however all it was doing was downloading Doom (for the 4th time from steam). These freeze ups/crashed happen daily even though all drivers/windows are up to date.



Lemons happen with all manufacturers and I believe that is exactly the problem here.....

 

Doom will now no longer even start up now even though I fresh installed (after multiple try's). Many other games/programs will not load as well.

 

Hey Cmykpro,

I'm sure you're experienced but would you mind if I asked you some questions that might seem silly? Did you use drivers from Nvidia, or from Sager? Also, did the system somehow get switched to "passive" cooling while on D/C power?

 

Can I be honest with you? Systems like this just don't work out of the box without some tweaks..

If you want something working out of the box, BGA systems will do that..

You need to get your hands dirty to get this working optimally..

First do a repaste with IC Diamond.. Sager's paste job is junk..

Next do a fresh install of Windows.. Then install a proper Clevo control centre version, @Phoneix can tell you which one..

The install NVIDIAs 373.06 driver.. Seems to be the only one that works fine for me..

Try that and see if that fixes it

Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk

 

Can you run msi afterburner in the background and post up the graph to show activity? (clocks, power, usage etc)

 

Control Center AP v5.0001.0.50

PS: everything @TomJGX said is spot on.

 

People should stop recommending IC diamond, why is it so popular? Because it makes up for the uneven heatsink?

The problem isn't with the paste, it's the heatsink.

Trash paste that scratches up everything it touches.

 

Hey Möbius,

What thermal compounds would you recommend he try?

 

Gelid GC Extreme / Grizzly Kryonaut.

 

Either GC Extreme, or Kryonaut as bloodhawk said


Personally I would settle for nothing less than Liquid Metal such as CCLU or Grizzly Conductonaut

 

Thanks guys.

I thought it might be a fun idea to do a TIM test on my 8153's 6700HQ and GTX 1070 to see if I could maybe drop my temps a bit. My 6700HQ runs around 85C and my GTX 1070 about the same but slightly less.

 

If your heatsink contact is ****, Gelid pumps out.. Not a problem with IC Diamond though, it stays for a while..

Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk

 

Did you happen to get any help with the system freezing and locking up after you tried to download DOOM? I've had this happen twice now with GOW4 and Witcher 3.

 

I returned the Sager. It was riddled with issues; the new 1440p screen looks washed out and the antiglare was worthless, temps were out of control unless you ramped up the fans which made the noise intolerable.

I picked up the new Asus G70vi and couldn't be happier.

 

This is the video link of the new ASUS I replaced the sager with and why.

 

glad you're happy with your new machine.

I wouldn't generalize your opinion about Sager or Clevo for that matter though, it was just your system that you had unfortunately

here's my system at 4.6 GHz on all 4 cores with a stress test that's insane. When gaming, the temps wouldn't even go above 85C for CPU / 75C for GPU

6700K CPUs are a matter of luck unfortunately, I had 2 bad ones before that just like you, even at stock clocks would reach 93C and thermal throttle. That's why I bought a 6700K delidded Silicon Lottery CPU and the result:



BUT, even for people that I've helped here on the forums who got one of those not so great 6700K CPUs, a simple undervolt by -150mV brought their temps down from 90C to a max of 82C

At the end of the day, if you're happy, tha'ts what matters

Finally, judging an SSD speed by only looking atthe sequential read/write speed means nothing. That kind of workload is what SSD manufacturers use to brag to their customers that their SSDs are so fast. What really matters is the 4K Random Read/Write. That represents how snappy your OS / programs would feel since they are usually compriseed of small files like DLL files and whatnot.

I have a Samsung 950 Pro and it definitely doesn't feel like a 2.5GB/S SSD, but its random read / write is like 50MB Read / 185 MB write and that is snappy as heck.

If you were a video editor or someone dealing with humongous files or copying large chunks of data from one drive to the other, that's where the sequential read/write speeds come in but that's not usually how us gamers or even power users use or measure their systems.

Good luck man

 

Thanks for the input Phoenix. I had been waiting for months on the Sager and it was a total let down. I get it that it is like a lottery but for that kind of money I want something that works out of the box. Im sure to some its worth playing the lottery, dealing with returns, etc but to me having something that works out of the box is money well spent. I'm not dogging Sager as a company as my last laptop from them was great. I'm very happy with the Asus which in the end is what matters to me...

 

For what it's worth, I haven't had any issues with any of my Clevo laptops and I haven't ever had to play the lottery or anything. To each their own.

 

Yup Asus are really good in that sense.. It usually just works out of the box... Hope the temps etc are fine..

I am really going towards getting an Asus ROG laptop for my next laptop.. Sick of upgradeble laptops and they never seem to work out of the box.. My Asus G73JH got repasted by Gentech and checked out before being sent to me and worked perfectly for 3.5 years with minimal hassle before I sold it..

 

I think it's time you consider changing your Custom title I didn't expect this!!
1+1=2
After I have seen some posts, I can easily see a change

 

I think so too.. But hey, not converted yet... My reluctance would be Asus's crappy warranty so yeah probably not happening but entertaining the thought.. Its not like I'm going to run out and buy something now, this is 2-3 years down the road and my wallet isn't endless unlike many of the people here who seem to be ordering 5k USD laptops lol

Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk

 

A ASUS ROG BGA machine with 1080 isn't either cheap. And I think you could buy a socket machine cheaper than 5K USD 7700K, single 1080(Ti if this will be the name), 16Gb ram and a cheap boot drive shouldn't run the total price of a socket machine up to heaven You NEED To RECONSIDER Your SICK IDEA ABOUT BGA. If I was like you now... I would have nightmares only by the thought of touching a JokeBook I hope you are with good health bro

Edit I really hope I can see this custom title for a long long time. And NO BGA machine in your hardware sig!!


We need you on the barricades. And I hope we socket enthusiasts grow into something big and can make a difference...

 

Brother @Papusan, It would be a terrible shame to lose Brother @TomJGX and his soul to the BGA filth god. There's no way I will ever consider buying anything more than a cheap disposable $500 turdbook build if it is built with BGA. To even mention it is blasphemy. I'd just get out of computing as a hobby altogether before I would drink that sludge from the bottom of the cess pool. With the Tornado F5 available there is no excuse for any self-respecting person to settle for BGA trash even in a small chassis.

 

Replaceable CPU's are a crock folks. You seriously want to invest into something you can "upgrade" over the next couple years? By the time you do that the socket has progressed exponentially making your "up-gradable" socket worthless...... Convincing yourself that being able to upgrade an obsolete CPU to a higher clocked obsolete CPU is somehow worth it is nuts....

 

Even if the socket is the same, there's going to be some backwards compatibility block with the newer cards.

Take for example the 9xx series, it requires UEFI bios or the machine won't POST. This happened with the M17x R3 and M18x R1. Then we have pascal that blocks legacy display output (LVDS) and requires signal from the EC to even boot.

Socketed hardware is hit or miss, one time you can upgrade and the other time not. It really is lottery when you buy a machine that has a socketed component. A lucky example is the M15x, it accepted GPUs from the 260M to 980M (and anything AMD inbetween).

 

I would for a thin and light general work device, magnesium alloy chassis, IPS display, thin design and SLI m.2 are really nice for general work stuff. I'd avoid a GPU in such a machine though.

 

Exactly! That's my problem! I don't really care about an upgradable CPU as whichever way, I get the best one when I call nowadays.. The problem for me is the GPUs..

We used to be able to upgrade them relatively easily and that's what really brought me over but the latest screw job by Clevo really pissed me off.... I can't even get a 1070 into my laptop and even if one gets available its like 1200 CAD which is absurd.. I've basically been screwed over totally by Clevo.. My upgradable P771ZM is now no better then a BGA turdbook.. The only good thing is a 4790K at 4.5GHz but I'm pretty happy with something that does 4GHz..

Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk

 

I thought you had seen enough of hideous BGA junk after all you've seen / experienced on the whole web. This should be a BIG wakeup call for you... The whole concept of BGA aka soldered hardware in a so called 15-17,3 inches *high performance* laptop is beyond all reason and should be banned. Listen to your brother @Mr. Fox for once or me If everyone had the same idea about hardware... Even Clevo had pushed out only BGA now. You just put on more firewood on the fire with your nasty talk <I don't really care about an upgradable CPU>. And Intel, Nvidia + All ODM / OEM's rubbing their hands, and will throw out even more of the same tragic litter!!I get very sad when I see such talk as you put out here in the thread. Wish I could help you with a socket machine bro. I really would have done it gladly if I had a little more money. Maybe if I win some money on the lottery You will be on the list.

 

Lol, I'm not buying anything now.. I have the money but its hard to spend it knowing you'd get screwed over a year or 2 later...

If this continues 2-3 years down the road, yes I will go this way... Remember now my primary machine is a desktop, the laptop gets properly used for gaming about a month or 2 in the year... So priorities have changed.. I still think upgradable is the way to go if your primary machine is for gaming but if your like me now, the extra expense makes little sense, especially since its probably going to be like 1060-70ish range lol..

I'd love to have upgradable in both not saying that but the crap pulled with the Pascal GPUs is a massive nail in the coffin of upgradable laptops..

Sent from my LG-H850 using Tapatalk

 

You kids that think sockets and s!ots are a crock are full of crap. Look no further than the lame results with those trash CPUs and you prove the point. It's not about upgrades at all. It is about quality, performance and serviceable products. Stupidity en masse and low standards will ruin it for all of us and embracing BGA filth is accelerating the destruction of a once enjoyable niche. Enjoy your BGA turdbooks. BGA accepters validate the views of the laptop hating trolls we have fought for years, and I will join their ranks as a hate troop leader and notebook terrorist if and when the day comes that all we have left is BGA feces in laptops. We need to create a massive stigma surrounding BGA so that everyone will want to avoid the shame in owning filth.

 

You are 100% correct in your analysis Fox. More people buy BGA = More of it will be pushed out.
We don't only talk about upgrading our hardware. A lot of people need more power than you can get from soldered processors.

Dellienware offer 6300hq for gaming. Need I say more?

See here below. This is so called latest *high end* Intel processors in Jokebook's today. Be stuck with this low entry trash isn't acceptable for people who use their laptops to more than gaming. And the so called unlocked mobile i7 isn't much more useful than first named Trash!! People forget that you/other will use their laptops for more than gaming.

http://hwbot.org/hardware/processor/core_i5_6300hq/

http://hwbot.org/hardware/processor/core_i7_6700hq/

 

I'd rather see you (and me) abandon the performance notebook niche completely, use a super cheap ($300) notebook, tablet or Chromebook for mobility, and only place value in desktop PCs than embrace BGA filth. This is a battle for the hearts and minds of notebook enthusiasts (the real ones, not the namby-pamby ball [grid array] suckers that have already defected) and for me it will be to the death. I have a zero tolerance for BGA feces in "gaming" notebooks and I'd rather see this niche completely die and become totally extinct rather than compromise. It's all or nothing the way I see it. So, stay with us and help foster a culture of shame and rejection for those who embrace BGA filth. It's not going to be welcome in my house... ever.

 

ok, this is Mr. Fox's new future taptop:
Acer Aspire ES 15, 15.6" HD, Intel Core i3-6100U, 4GB DDR3L, 1TB HDD, Windows 10 Home, ES1-572-31KW

 

Hey, that's definitely better than spending $1500+ on disposable "gamer" BGA filthbook feces built for bottom-feeders.

 

Noooooooo!!!!!!!! Don't ever say that! BGA will never be better than LGA! BGA is gross, why would you EVER want a soldered on CPU? That's such a terrible idea. I want more modularity, not less. I would MUCH rather have old LGA than new BGA. Your P771ZM is still a really good laptop.

 

Why must every thread end up in this argument? Give it up already. OP had a bad experience and doesn't know what to do but instead of being helpful, the conversation ends up in the same toxic nonsense.

 

Long live BGA! Here i come Razer Blade Pro 2016!













/s

 

Never. The beatings will continue until moral improves. There will never be acceptance or forgiveness for this filth and I will be critical of it for eternity. It's trash... end of discussion. It's not an argument. It's fact and not open for debate. The displays of hate and contempt for BGA are a wake-up call for those with the intelligence to pay attention. The only way to create a stigma and culture of contempt for this filth is to constantly ridicule and highlight the inferiority of it. Get used to it... I'm in it for the long haul and committed to causing as much damage as possible. Toxic by design and intent... good observation. It's fitting for something so inferior and flawed and undesirable. This is to let the OP know that entertaining the notion of going to a BGA turd as suggested is a super bad idea.

What an abomination. Better Get Another.

 

LOL. All I can think of is the Insanity Wolf meme.

 

I will fix a bit <What an abomination. Better Get Another> Why Pay High Price For BGA? You can get a BGA machine a lot cheaper than a RazerBook. Maybe as well buy similar http://zhuomao.en.alibaba.com/produ...ZM_R5860_motherboard_repairing_equipment.html

Very costly to repare BGA after the warranty has expired. This is the solution

 

Well, first off, history has proven you wrong over and over again. Many have upgraded CPUs in the past and maximized the longevity of their machines while outperforming newer ones. Now, some of that could be accurate in the future because of the way Intel has bastardized notebooks with their cookie-cutter approach to things, and no longer offer socketed mobile Extreme processors. That doesn't make the argument that BGA is acceptable a good one.

And, there are plenty of folks that consider that opinion a crock simply because it's short-sighted and totally ignores the fallacy of purchasing expensive BGA garbage. It's not about upgrades. Sometimes those can and do happen. We may be able to upgrade from 6700K to 7700K... maybe. But, it's really all about avoiding pathetic trash that has severe performance limitations, and cannot be reasonably repaired or serviced. Good luck being able to buy a replacement motherboard for a machine out of warranty when the GPU or motherboard components fail without having to take out a second mortgage to pay for it.

Bottom line: BGA is trash and "high performance" notebooks built with BGA CPU and/or GPU are junk. They might get the job done if your standards and expectations are not particularly high, but they're not "good" by any stretch of the imagination. They are compromised products built with selfish intentions by lame OEMs that care only about how much money they can milk from their customers. If you have a BGA GPU it's a double-whammy, since GPUs have much shorter lifespans than Intel CPUs. It's generally not a matter of if as much as when a GPU will expire, and many of those die out of warranty. And, if and when you can upgrade, what's not to love about that? Half the cost, or even less than half the cost, of a new machine with the new GPU(s) is hard to beat. Can't do that with BGA junk.

 

BGA is lower binned than LGA chips. Just look at what core voltage needed to create a slightly higher overclock than a wimpy 3.9 GHz from 6820hk. You can almost hit 4.9 GHz on LGA with same voltage needed for 4.2 GHz on BGA (If you are lucky with the BGA Hk chips and can clock over 4.0/4.1 GHz).

 

Good point. Just think of all the defective (poorly binned) CPUs Intel would have to recycle at a financial loss if not for all of the BGA turdbooks. They are the architects of their own good fortune. Instead of taking a loss on the defective silicon they put them in notebooks, cripple the wattage, lock them down, then people buy them under an impression that because it is a Core i7 that it must magically be something special.

 

Same as DELLIENWARE. They don't want to take the financial loss on the flawed 3 screw heatsink. Dell have accepted the ****y quality and already paid!! And people get screewed with trash!! Not only are buyers screewed with BGA trash, but also harware like heatsink is in the same level.


http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...-uneven-heatsink.797477/page-48#post-10394114

 

THIS...this was an entertaining read. I love these debates.

 

Hi brother. Im waiting your next video review of it. Good luck.