Sager, please make the $799 NP5855 model use i5+IPS instead of i7+TN

Hey Sager,

I think a lot of your offerings are on-point, and are a perfect fit for their price brackets. However, I think the $799 Sager NP5855 model should include an IPS 1080p display and an i5-7300HQ instead of a TN 1080p display and an i7-7700HQ.

The majority of the TN 1080p displays that panel manufacturers are putting out today are very poor in quality, far worse so than the TN 1080p displays from the 2010-2013 era. There's a critical gap in the laptop market right now for the $800 price bracket, that was left by Dell's decision to use one of these poor quality displays in their new Inspiron 7000 Gaming series. A lot of people are skipping the model, and many of those who bought it are dissatisfied. I think the Sager NP5585 would fill that gap nicely if it were reconfigured to use an IPS display and an i5-7300HQ, and my understanding is that the cost differences between the parts would allow the model to retain its $799 base price. I feel that an i5-7300HQ would be more than fine for most people's use, but IMO the TN display kills it. At the very minimum, this change would net this model a lot of recommendations on the various forums I frequent, edit: assuming there didn't end up being any significant build/reliability issues with the laptop, of course.

I did notice that the NP6850 with the RGB keyboards uses an IPS display with a GTX 1050, but I also saw that model costs $150 more. I don't think it's fair to make customers pay more for that laptop's other features, just to be able to get a decent display, which could easily be fit into the price tag of this model.

Thanks! I hope you take this into consideration.

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Update: Sager NP5855 confirmed to use low quality display. See later post in this thread.

 

Gonna need Clevo to change that, not Sager's call I think.

 

Imo all the Clevo N85x laptops share the same motherboard and displays. So they can be configured from any reseller in their own choice, as they order from Clevo:

- IPS, non-IPS
- 940MX, 950m, 1050 2GB, 1050 4GB, 1050Ti 2GB, 1050Ti 4GB
- i3-7100H, i5-7300HQ, i7-7700HQ,

Basically it's up to the reseller which combination he orders from Clevo. From a customer perspective I can fully understand if you get annoyed because of combinations, which make not much sense, for example:

- why pair an expensive 7700HQ with a low quality display?
- why pair an expensive 7700HQ with a 1050 non-Ti GPU?

One of the most non-sensical things is, that they always seem to use the 7700HQ (which is approximately 200$ more than a 7300HQ), while the additional performance will hardly be noticed. The money wasted on this CPU could be spent on a better GPU or display (or even both together). When I look into the chinese forums at tieba.baidu, I can see combinations which make much more sense, for instance: 7300HQ+1050Ti 4GB+IPS for the same price.

 

they can change screens at their discretion, but honestly, they won't change to non-standard displays from Clevo. It doesn't matter if it can physically fit, they won't even test. I asked some resellers to run the 120Hz panels in the P775DMx models, and all of them said "no, Clevo say it won't work" and then later Clevo just started allowing the 120Hz panels in those models, and suddenly it works.

So even if they have a better screen, it'll almost certainly be an aftermarket decision.

 

Some of it might just be related to past sales history too. I know a lot of people want an i7 over an i5, whether they know they need that extra CPU power, or whether they just think they need it. The options might be based mostly on lower sales of i5 models in the past, and make it hard to keep inventory on hand if that is the case.

 

Well the CPU configuration is 100% Clevo's side of things, since the chips are all BGA now. Not like you can just offer a slot-in i5-4210M like before. Clevo would need to sell the motherboard with the i5 as a configuration.

 

Exactly. It no longer is an option of having one motherboard and a handful of different processors (that also work in a lot of different models). It requires keeping stock of each motherboard for each configuration of each model.

 

Thanks for the replies.

I just checked, and it looks like they do offer it with the i5-7300HQ, at least! http://clevo.com/clevo_prodetail.asp?id=1000&lang=en

The specs also don't state anything other than "1920x1080 or 3840x2160" which is the same as listed for the P650HP6-G (Sager NP8156) http://clevo.com/clevo_prodetail.asp?id=983&lang=en

I'd have to do some more digging to find the N855HJ (NP5855) or related models on other sites with IPS, but it looks to me to me that, based on this and what everyone else has said, Clevo resellers should be able to spec the N855HJ with i5+IPS if they choose. I think at this point it's just a matter of Clevo resellers choosing different options for the CPU and the display.

True. However, I think there would be value in choosing to sell the laptop in the configuration believed to make more sense for more users, and to perhaps include a highly visible section on the features page that explains why that makes it a better value, and why the compromises chosen to achieve the price tag are better than the compromises other sellers/resellers make. I've often thought that this would be an excellent way to resolve dilemmas like this, and I think sellers/resellers appealing to a more knowledgeable crowd are in a perfect position to take this approach. I think it would put forth an great image of honesty and straightforwardness, and if forum recommendations are a substantial portion of sales, selling configurations more likely to be recommended may very well result in more sales.

I do see the point about market demand and sales history, though. I just think there's a bigger picture to it.

 

Not all resellers won't try it out. Eurocom showed me that the new 120Hz panels physically will not fit in a P770ZM.

 

Ok, this one baffles me. The LP173WF4-SPx1 panels (1080/60 IPS) are used in P770ZM. These also fit the B173ZAN01.0 (4K 60Hz) which was used in the P870DM. The P870DMx uses the B173ZAN01.0, and the B173QTN01.0 (1440p 120Hz) and the B173HAN01.2 (1080p 120Hz). They all use eDP and the dimensions need to be the same since the lid isn't changed depending on the panel chosen.

So how exactly did the P770ZM not house the 120Hz panels?

Edit: I'm a dummy and thought the P770ZM was the P770DM. The P770ZM sold with two kinds of panels/lids. The one I described above with the eDP version of the motherboard and lid, and the one with LVDS. The LVDS supported MUCH better screens at the time, but the eDP model should suit everything I just described.

 

The bezel of the panel cover for the P770ZM is shorter than what is required for the new 120Hz panels, so it is not even close to fitting even though I have a P770ZM with an eDP panel. It's like forced obsolescence. It would require a dremel and electric tape to make it work, and I'm not comfortable with that.

 

So odd. As far as I know the dimensions should be similar enough. Ah well. I did feel like the ZM line got a shorter end of the stick even before seeing this... but geez

Sent from my OnePlus 1 using the force

 

Ask someone if they want the i5 or the i7 and they want the i7.

 

Ask them if they want to pay +200$ for a performance difference they'll hardly notice, and they probably won't.

 

If they never bother calling you can't tell them anything.

 

If it even comes to conversation. When given the choices people see i7 and that's what they go for. If they ask me, I tell them the i5 is fine, but not nearly enough people ask me unless it's about desktops.

 

The dimensions of the panel itself yeah, but with the power cables, nope. The specs say it should work but I've seen it in real life and unfortunately it doesn't work unless you want to use a dremel and electrical tape. Quite disappointing.

 

Hi,

How much of a deal breaker the TN panel is? Because besides that it looks like a really nice laptop to buy.

 

In my opinion, a poor quality display can be one of the most noticeable flaws in a laptop. TN by itself isn't an issue, but the majority of today's TN laptop displays are a particular low-quality type of TN that produces a grayish gradient in what should be a solid black picture. The resulting poor contrast produces a "washed-out" look that can't be truly accounted for by calibration. The difference is, IMO, far more noticeable than the difference between an i5-7300HQ and i7-7700HQ in most cases, and to me can also somewhat defeat the purpose of buying a laptop with a better GPU: to run games on better-looking settings. The other specs might look nice, but you're making a big tradeoff on one of the most central components. A tradeoff that, in my opinion, you shouldn't have to make.

Note that it is actually not confirmed the specific panel model number that the NP5855 uses. However outside of 17.3" 1080p (and 1440p) and 15.6" 1080p 120Hz TN, I haven't seen a good quality 1080p TN panel being used in any of today's laptops. Unless/until it is confirmed otherwise, I think it is best to err on the side that the NP5855 display will be closer in quality to the ChiMei and AUO TN panels that other laptops have used, than to the rather-decent LP156WF1 and B156HW01 (non-V.5) panels that were used in the Dell Studio 1645, Dell Latitudes, Lenovo Thinkpads, Dell L501x/L502x, Lenovo Y580, Y510p, HP DV6t, Sager NP5160/5165/8130/etc, and others from the era.

There are also rumors that the GTX 1050 equipped De ll Inspiron 7567 is switching to IPS panels again.

Typical laptop TN panel, black value:


Black value for what TN panels used to be (in this pic: B156HW01 V.4)


Typical TN panel viewing angles:


What TN panel viewing angles used to be (in this pic: LP156WF1)

 

Wow, thanks for the detailed response!

So you would suggest to wait until there are some reviews of the clevo, the release of the yoga y520 and if dell changes the screens on the inspiron 7000 gaming series?

 

A chat of mine with a Dell rep the other day didn't give indication that they were switching to IPS panels, which seems to mean those rumors are less likely to be true

And a NP5855 review just came out. The panel shares an identical hardware ID to the not-good one that is used in the Dell Inspiron 7567 (at least some of the 7567 units), the AUO38ED = AUO B156HTN03.8.

Viewing angles and 'contrast stability' for the B156HTN03.8. Misses the LP156WF1 ballpark by a considerable margin.


I think it's best to look towards the Lenovo Y520, Acer Aspire VX 15 assuming the cheaper ones use IPS, and perhaps the HP Pavilion 15, unless Sager changes the panel in this.

 

Update: An IPS panel option has been added!

- http://www.xoticpc.com/sager-np5855-clevo-n855hj.html
- https://lpc-digital.com/product/sager-np5855-clevo-n855hj/
- http://www.sagernotebook.com/customize.php?productid=1218
- http://www.pro-star.com/INDEX.PHP?r=product/configure&model=N855HJ

It would appear that, since the Prostar configuration page has added this option as well, that @Galm was correct that this change was on Clevo's side rather than Sager's side. Either way, great to see this option. I've updated the sidebar on /r/SuggestALaptop/ and added a temporary message, and will be making more recommendations for this model.

If anyone has info on whether this is a 45% NTSC or 72% NTSC IPS panel, that would be useful too, as I'll be able to recommend it to people who need more color accuracy.

 

Good News! IPS panels should always be an option!

 

Yes and it's not too expensive to switch to