XMG [email protected]: a worthy replacement for AW15 R2?

Hi guys,

I am looking for an alternative to Alienware 15 w/6820HK and 980M which unfortunately arrived with 4GB instead of 8GB VRAM as ordered. Dell are absolutely pathetic at handling this situation (there is a "980M 8GB" thread in the Alienware forum, if Clevo people would like to have a good laugh), so I started looking for alternatives and found this:

http://mysn.co.uk/xmg-p506-gaminglaptop

The machine is very similar to AW15, however, there are a few differences:

+ Supports 64GB which is a big plus for me
+ Lighter
+ Aluminium case
+ Good 300 nits FHD LG panel, the same I miraculously won in the Dell lottery
+ Full keyboard looks better for work purposes (is it?)
+ Excellent configuration transparency (e.g. the FHD screen model is specified)

- Anecdotally Temp management slightly worse (my CPU temp is 45C with overclocking)
- 60 instead 92 Whr battery
- Anecdotally worse build quality (some issues with the bezel?)
- No GA (don't care that much)
- Just one NVMe SSD M.2 supported (that's fine)

http://www.panelook.com/LP156WF6-SPB1_LG Display_15.6_LCM_overview_24180.html

My main concern regards general build quality etc. The AW15 build is really quite solid, albeit plastic - can I expect matching quality from XMG? Any other issues to be aware of?

The reseller themselves look solid, I expect the customer support will wipe the floor with Dell's - not a huge challenge anyway

Any comments would be much appreciated.

 

hey there, i think ull find plenty of info on that machine in the respective owner's lounge in the clevo section of the forum the xmg p506 is based off the clevo P650R series, exactly same machine just rebranded.

edit: heres the link - http://forum.notebookreview.com/index.php?posts/10109551

oh and btw: welcome to the clevo side of life, im sure ull like it!

as to xmg themselves, i can warmly recommend them and their customer service! i myself bought my current config from them and the whole thing was a blast! total pleasure to communicate with them, machine and packaging was pretty much flawless, extended warranty up to four years is a bliss (unfortunately they only offer up to 3 years now) and also got some nice goodies and price reduction with my order so im sure ull be in good hands with them!

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

 

Many thanks. Will follow up there. At the moment I'm a bit concerned about build quality (especially the lid/bezel), and thermal management.

 

Hi @etern4l . The link to the owners thread courtesy of @jaybee83 has a wealth of information, but if we can answer any of your direct questions here we will do our best!

Which specific comments have you seen that would raise concerns about the build quality and thermal management?

 

another +1 for XMG from mySN.
i personally wont buy from anywhere else now.
the support is top notch and the lappys are awesome.
clevo laptops are built to last. quite plain unlike the christmas tree's from AW but that makes them more professional looking.

my first gaming rig was from alienware m15x and it lasted 19 days. after a repair the twats sent me someone elses laptop so i got a full refund. this great forum pointed me in the direction of clevo and mysn and the rest is history.
first clevo is 8 years old now and still used every day.
second is my currant one now and not one issue in 3+ years.

 

@XMG/ Clevo P651RG/XMG P506 users: Would appreciate if you could answer some specific questions about the machine:

1. Could you advise what sequential transfer rates I'm expected to achieve with the Samsung 950 Pro?

2. In your opinion, is the P506 sturdy enough to handle heavy commute (2h/day). Specifically concerned about alleged lid weakness, as per the comments under this review (but also kind of visible in the review itself at 03:00 - wouldn't get any flex or shaking with the AW15):



" marco knight 1 week ago
thanks for the fast reply The worst thing about this laptop is that flex in the screen. You'll have to be very careful when it's in a bag and stuff. My friend has one and has marks on his screen due to leaving the power pack on top of the laptop!"

3. How many recharge cycles can the 60Whr battery handle?
4. What are the differences between XMG P506 and Schenker H506? From what I can see the latter has a different logo, no G-SYNC and costs a bit more
5. Could I order no HDDs, just OS media? If so, would you supply HDD fixings?
6. What's the UK warranty response time? I can see some additional options around this on mysn.de (i.e. 48h warranty response, which is free of charge for the initial period of the warranty)

 

@etern4l no problem:

1/ Transfer rates for any drive will be the same as shown in the component reviews, so expect maximum 2150 MB/s sequential read from the 950 Pro!

2/ In my opinion yes, as long as it is in an adequate bag. We haven't had a single customer report a problem with their P506 lid, not the H506 (same chassis) or in fact their predecessors (P505). I don't know exactly how many we have sold but it will be in the mid thousands. We do see occasional issues with laptops which are shipped back under RMA ofor repair, they have arrives with damaged lids and sometimes you can see that the LCD panel has been forced into the touchpad area - 99% of the time this is because the PSU has been placed directly on the lid with no packing. Like any laptop, you should use a bag with a dedicated laptop pouch for protection from both the other contents of the bag or from external forces.

I am typing this on my work P303, which was superseeded by the P304 and then the A305 and A506 so we're talking about a 2 year old laptop with a plastic lid (not aluminium like the P506). I have carried it to and from work for almost 2 years and the only damage is when I knocked it on the side of one of my kitchen units!

The flex in the video at 3:00 isn't actually flex in the lid, it's the lid as a whole moving because the reviewer is purposefully chaking the laptop. Bit extreme but you'll notice that he doesn't say anything about it or that it's a problem

3/ Honestly, enough not to need to worry about it. As long as you regularly let the battery fully discharge and recharge to 100% it will last for years.

4/ The main differences are the ones you picked up on - P506 has G-Sync and starts with the 970M, H506 has no G-Sync but starts with 965 and then the 3GB (rather than 6GB) 970M. The P506 is proced lower than normal at the moment due to exchange rates jumping around when we bought the most recent chassis stock of each model - usually the P506 would be £80 more than the H506.

5/ As a system builder we only supply the "System Builder" (used to be OEM) version of Windows. By Microsoft licensing regulations, a system builder isn't allowed to sell Windows unless it's installed on a machine. We could only do this is we sold the full retail versions of Windows which cost a lot more. If you buy without HDDs though, you'll still receive all the drive bay fixings - if you already have the drives then you can do this if you wish, if you would rather buy drives separately because you can find them cheaper elsewhere then please email sales @ mysn.co.uk and our sales team can see if we can offer you a more competative price.

6/ Same as the .de response! All our RMAs go to the RMA center in Germany so it doesn't matter if a customer buys from Germany, UK, France, Sweden or anywhere else outside Europe, everyone gets the same service. The only real difference is that the .co.uk office is run from the UK office.

 

@XMG wow, thanks for the exhaustive weekend response - unbelievable.

Hmm, yes - that's what I thought I saw somewhere. I'm getting 20% higher read throughput on the AW15, even on the RAID driver (will reinstall in AHCI mode later).



I guess this suggests some sort of thermal/power throttling in the P506?

Just to be clear - is the weight of the PSU placed on top of the lid enough to flex it?

A few more questions then if I may:

7. Are there any manuals, including a service manual I could take a look at? Prof Google came up empty.

For comparison, for the AW15 you get:
* A detailed specification booklet which confirms that that battery offers unimpressive 300 cycles
* A detailed service manual

8. When do you expect 2400 MHz 16GB hyperx impact modules to be available?

9. Now, this is a long shot but hey - it would certainly be Dell-crushing flexibility: would it be possible to order 32GB 2400MHz memory now, then upgrade to 64GB 2400Mhz once that becomes available by paying the price difference plus some reasonable restocking/wear fee?

10. What's your policy regarding the handling of dead pixels and light bleed?

11. Any reasons (apart from the small cost delta) to consider the Intel NICs over Killer?

Many thanks and Happy New Year!

 

No problem

1/ 950 Pro performance - I was probably quoting 256GB version from memory, according to Samsung the sequential read of the smaller drive is limited to a max of 2200MB/s whereas the 512GB (according to Samsung) can hit a max of 2500MB/s - so it purely depends on which size drive you have and also which benchmark you are using as CrystalDisk usually produces high figures. Also the drivers are maturing which can account for performance differences.

Honestly never tested this!

http://mysn.de/secure/userarea/down...GQQXMG_P506_und_P706QQUser_ManualQQManual.zip - everything you need is available through www. mysn .co.uk > Drivers & Downloads in the top menu bar ;-)

I don't have any information one way or another so can't comment at this point in time.

We can't take back used components unfortunately, though even if we did you would probably get more for the memory that you did buy from us by selling it privately on EBay or similar!

I can't link you directly to our website as it's against reseller rules on notebookreview forum, but if you go to our website and go to Support > Knowledgebase from the menu bar, then type in dead pixel it will take you to the KB article on this.

Thansk you too!

Some people get on better with the Intel cards, some better with the Killer card. What you do get with the Killer is their software package which gives you streaming control and preferences. Personally I have never had a problem with my Intel WiFi module, but some other people swear that Killer is better - it often comes down to the model router you are most often connected to but there's no comprehensive compatability list to go on.

 

There are the kinds of speeds you would expect from the 950 PRO:





Temps of the Samsusng 950 PRO 512GB Right after the SSD Benchmarks:

 

@Matrix Leader - thanks, I don't have access to our internal company benchmarks from by corrent location!

 

@Matrix Leader, how are you measuring the SSD temps? Were you able to do the same with SM951?

 

Let me know if you need any help brah, I have the 950 PRO Benchmarks, 3DMark with a Dual 980M SLI, 3DMark with a single 980M

Please send a huge thank you to your management for being the only company that provides downloadable links to the latest BIOS for all laptops, you're the only company that does this and it makes it very convenient for customers to download or update their BIOS should they need to. Look at CLEVO for example, they don't even provide any BIOS update. The BIOS update site they have requires a re-seller ID/Password, so please send my biggest gratitude to your management; this is not to be taken lightly.

 

I don't have an SM951 mate, I had trouble finding any program that will read the temps from NVMe SSDs, neither HWMonitor nor HWiNFO nor CrystalDiskInfo could read the temps.

What I did was, run the benchmark, then immediately open Samsung Magician and go to SMART details, there you will see all the info about the drive and temps Easy heh? Sometimes, j00 have to think outside teh b0x matey

 

Why not have it open at the same time? The temperature is going to change very quickly.

 

@Matrix Leader many thanks for this - was able to basically match your results by installing the Samsung NVMe driver and disabling write cache flushing:





Temps are reported lower (42C), however, not sure how reliable that is - re-opened the SMART window a few times and got 42C in each case, even after Magician restart...


I guess it's worth noting that your Eurocom Sky X9 machine is higher end...

 

@XMG: many thanks for the info - will dive into that stuff. Just to confirm, we don't have further info on the type of battery packs used in the P506, specifically concerning the number of recharge cycles? Couldn't immediately find this in the manual. The reason I ask is that apparently the AW15 uses high performance Samsung batteries which support rapid charging and 2000 cycles...

 

I would also vote for XMG (Schenker). I did an upgrade of my x7200 via them (new HDD, RAM, thermal paste) and they were a pleasure to work with. Communication was fast and precise, and processing time quite short. It seems like they even cleaned/undusted the whole chassis before sending it back to me.

I'll surely buy my next Clevo off their website.

 

I reviewed the manuals pointed out by @XMG - many thanks. Some questions popped:
* How does overclocking the 6820HK and RAM work. For comparison, AW15 offers overclocking BIOS options specific to this CPU (core mult overrides, power throttle and voltage), as well as a simple RAM overclocking function (clock, mult and voltage)
* Manual states that adding a hard drive might void the warranty. Could you confirm/clarify?
* Is there a service manual?

 

as so often, prema to the rescue concerning service manuals in this case: https://www.techinferno.com/index.php?/forums/topic/2965-repair-clevo-service-manuals/

just be aware that ull need to register at TI and post a specific number of messages in order to be able to download stuff

 

You're more than welcome

To defend Clevo a little bit, they have no direct contact with the public or end users / people who buy laptops that use Clevo chassis. The Clevo portal is for Clevo customers to use and it allows access to more than just BIOs and EC hence it's password protected.

I see the point that I think you're making here though, which is why isn't there a single source that every Clevo chassis based laptop owner can go to. From a second hand point of view this would make sense, but for customers who buy a new laptop it really is the responsibility of the seller to provide all this type of support.

There's 2 main reasons why we have such a comprehensive BIOS/EC download availability 1/ because our customers need access (!) and 2/ because a lot of European companies buy laptops from us and then sell them on as their own - so the download page helps both our end user customers and business customers equally

I'm not aware of anything in the regular reporting that would show the maximum battery cycle - it's definitely nothing that has ever come up in meeting with Clevo in the past either. If you're desperate for this information then we can ask the source! Our batteries aren't classed as rapid charge so I would expect there's no loss in charge cycles which is why the figures aren't detailed anywhere. I have a 7 year old Clevo W150HN at home which I use pretty much every day (just use the CPU, not for gaming) and the battery in that still gives me 3 hours running time!

The reason we don't make the service manual available is because Clevo doesn't allow it to be released to the public. We often provide customers with illustrated guides which are taken from the service manual and we have a library of these guides which our support team can make available at any time, but we're not allowed to release the full service manual to customers.

Interesting, there is also a lot more content in the "Full English User Manual" than there is in the "Concise 5 Language User Manual"!

P.S. We're moving offices in the UK this week so I won't be around too much on nbr. If anyone has direct questions please feel free to ask our sales and support team via email; sales or support @mysn.co.uk . Our European office is running as normal and the guys there will be taking care of customers in the UK, ROI and rest of the world outside the EU until our move is complete!

 

@XMG:
* Manual states that adding a hard drive might void the warranty. Could you confirm/clarify?

 

* How does overclocking the 6820HK and RAM work. For comparison, AW15 offers overclocking BIOS options specific to this CPU (core mult overrides, power throttle and voltage), as well as a simple RAM overclocking function (clock, mult and voltage)

Many tx

 

Could someone advise whether I should be able to run the 6820HK at 3.9GHz on all cores (I understand I would need to use Intel XTU) and what idle CPU temps can I expect from Clevo P650RE with that overclock. Some benchmarks would be awesome. Many tx.

 

depends on each and every individual cpu, cant state anything relating to overclocks with 100% certainty. seeing as some users are managing 4ghz on all cores, 3.9 ghz shouldnt be outside the realm of possibility though. idle temps wont change much at higher clocks, its rather the load temps ud need to concern urself with.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

 

I was hoping some P650RE users could provide concrete data points. Trouble is, it seems that the power users here tend to use the socketed Clevos...

 

...as they should, being powerusers why dont u go ahead and check out the P650 owner's lounge? im sure ull be provided with better info when u post there

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

 

What about mobile powerusers?
Yes posting there as well, but the problem is the logical thread interleaving. I suggest the per model class subforum model would work better...

 

Ugh, just noticed - no USB-C/Thunderbolt 3

 

Unfortunately not a lot of models have that as of yet. You would be looking at the P750DM, P770DM, or P870DM models for that currently.

 

Should I get 2666MHz sodimms for @XMG P506, will it run it at that clock or will I need Prema BIOS. BTW does 2666MHZ CL 18 memory make sense? Currently running 2400MHz CL 15.

 

2400MHz Hyper-X is the fastest that will run with the stock BIOS. I can't comment on what the Prema BIOS will enable above this, but the benefits of 2666 vs 2400 are arguable especially if you're loosing even more CAS.

 

Thank you. A few more Qs:
1. Could you clarify the reason for this limitation?
2. What about say G.SKILL Ripjaws memory?
3. Why is the 2400MHz Hyper-X memory available for the U506 but not P506?
4. Have you seen issues with the keyboard repeat rate slowing down to like 1/s for either the U506 or P506?

Best

 

@etern4l - of course:

1/ simply because the Prema BIOS opens up manual settings that Clevo have in the BIOs before they lock it down. 2666MHz seems to require quite a bit of tuning, if you look at the P870DM official owners thread for example the guys have spent weeks getting it sorted out and I don't know if will even perform the same on the lower spec models.
2/ Same with all memory, it's not about the quality of overclockability of the memory, it's because of the reasons mentioned in my point above ;-)
3/ 2400MHs Hyper-X was added recently to the P506 on mysn.de, it hasn't been added yet to mysn.co.uk because we're moving offices at the moment and the web guys haven't had a chance to catch up with all the mysn.de website updates that need to be mirrored on .co.uk. Should be an option early next week!
4/ I haven't heard of any issues like this and definitely haven't experienced them either.

Hope that helps

 

@XMG Many thanks for your explanations and continuing patience with me: just to clarify - I wasn't meaning to ask about overclocking this time. Factory settings. Why would the 2400MHz hyper-x memory work with the stock BIOS but not say G.SKILL 2400MHz or G.SKILL 2666MHz (again: at the factory settings). Can the BIOS at least run any memory at the default settings, or does the BIOS have to explicitly support each particular module type.
To put it in perhaps lightly more technical term: is each DDR4 module able to tell the controller/BIOS what settings it operates on, or does the BIOS need to have explicit support for each memory type (so I couldn't use say G.SKILL Ripjaws memory if Clevo/XMG only hardcoded support for Samsung and Hyper-X modules, for example).
I would certainly hope it's the former (i.e. all/most modules can be expected to work at factory settings)?

 

There's nothing particular to say that the GSkill 2400MHz wouldn't work, but I don't personally know if it will work straight out the box. The Samsung 2400MHz seems to have better "out the box" compatability than the Hyper-X 2400MHz - could be down to the JDEC / SPD or whatever, that Clevo test Samsung in pre-production but not Hyper-X, I can't really go into details because it would reveal information that could cover Clevo operating procedures.

Bottom line is that you can't expect all modules to work at their stock speeds and timings. In very simplistic terms (I'm typing this on my phone as I'm off work at the momen so can't really go into more detailt!), anything over 2133MHz is classed (by Intel) as overclocking the memory in HM170 Express, same with previous generation Intel platforms at 1866MHz and prior too to that 1600MHz. This means it's not plug and play in any system from any manufacturer and they need to "enable" faster memory support - not in a specific case of one module at a time but many modules, speeds, timings and so on.

 

Thanks v. much for the exhaustive answer.

 

That ballpark is all you are going to get, too many variables exist to give you an exact answer or even a proper average.

 

One More Thing (TM):
@XMG advertise that their MXM models (Batman 2 etc) are compatible with Maxwell.

Edit: any news on Pascal compatibility?

 

im guessing ure mixing up maxwell and pascal? naturally, the current models are compatible with maxwell gpus (them being the 900M series...)

 

Slow morning

 

Correct... sorry.

 

What does stability of the XMG P506 look like? I'm reading about touchpad driver related P650SE crashes.

 

@XMG: Do you offer spare batteries?

 

P650SE is the P505, but anyway there have maybe been a couple of cases reported on nbr and I haven't seen a case through XMG.

Batteries - yup, just replied to your other post about this - if they aren't available on the website then just contact us direcctly and we can add one fo your order or sell one in the future