XoticPc vs. PcTorque vs. Sager

ProStar is awesome, and has earned my business.

 

Just a lil'...
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Anywho, I guess to add something a little more constructive. All websites have something for someone that others don't offer. In my opinion there is no one that's the best. From my shopping experience there are strong positives in each (I dont want to list them because that will just fuel the fire) Malibal's great in its own sense, XoticPC is great in its own, and so are all others (sorry for not listing the other 9786986897 sites). Your decision should be based on your needs and there is always a site that will suit them. Lets not argue here as to which is the better site because all of them have their strengths. And if your question is about what your needs are, then I highly doubt anyone can help you with that. May whatever you believe in bless you... StZu out.

 

I think the discussions made by Sager resellers and Clevo builders made some great points about pros/cons of each other.

Let me summarize the main points as I see them:

Sager Resellers
Pros
- You are buying from Sager which has been in business since 1987.
- You will have a warranty if the reseller goes out of business. However you will be dealing directly with Sager.
- Due to Sager's lack of customer service, do not buy directly from Sager.
- Choose the reseller that provides the best before and after sales support.

Cons
- You are limited to factory configurations offered by Sager.
- The warranty is from Sager and the reseller may only provide cursory support leaving you to deal with Sager directly.


Clevo Builders
Pros
- They actually touch your machine and can stress test the machine before it is shipped to you.
- They allow for greater choices of the components and configuration than Sager.
- The Clevo builder may perform the technical support and warranty repairs. You need to verify who performs the technical support and warranty repairs.

Cons
- If the Clevo builder goes out of business, your warranty will not be valid if the work was performed in-house.


To me, it boils down to if the Sager configuration and components (brands) that are used in their machines are to your liking, then purchase Sager. If you prefer certain configuration or brand of components be used in your machine, then choose a Clevo builder.

In either case, you have to research what assistance is provided for technical support and warranty repairs since not all resellers and builders are created equal.

 

Keep in mind not all Clevo Builders touch the machine. i.e. Malibal's systems are assembled by Sager.

 

Great overview websurfer. Yes, I had a feeling that my questions may lead to resellers defending their strategy and overall becoming a comparison of strategies.. There are reasons to each strategies with rationales for Clevo, Sager, reseller, and end user. It does boil down to buyers researching beforehand. (though it's a bit confusing)

The topic is touchy, especially with the resellers representing themselves (a bit of conflict of interest) so I feel the details are not suitable for a user based forum where clevo/sager support, technical questions are the norm.

That said, I believe it is in the best interest of the resellers to revert to a cooperation so the forum remains a stable, likable place for potential buyers to obtain information. So far the exchange has been a positive one for me, and I'm sure many people will find the differences between Sager reseller and clevo reseller educational. As one who contributed to the questions, I'm hoping it'll stay that way.

 

So Malibal is a rebranded Sager. Interesting!

Which leads to the obvious question, why is Malibal considered a Clevo builder instead of a rebrand Sager seller?

 

I just think it's a rebranded Clevo built by Sager. I dunno, confusing.

 

I don't get it either, but since essentially their the same, I went for Malibal because of their logo >_> and it was cheaper, but not by alot.

 

Im probably going to go with malibal because their rep literally lives here )) adding lots of support. But xotic has the upper hand on their overclocking, which I still need to find out more about. Also my build comes out to a few bucks cheaper with the s1 config. Im a bit of a newbie when it comes to OC

 

We're always here to help out! Feel free to PM us if you ever need anything!

 

Wait I don't understand how xotic would have a better oc rate then other companies. because I'm a hard overclocker I'm just wondering why their barebones or cooling or fan or whatever is more advantageous vs another?

Also I don't understand why everyone frowns upon companies taking a stance on their policies. If a company is willing to go out of their way to justify their products, take stances or whatever it shows that the company is actually taking action.

 

Just to clarify what we do.

We get empty Clevo shells (Barebones), we fill them with our own parts, sourced from our distributors, we install the parts ourselves, do all the burn in and testing ourselves at our retail shop here in Ann Arbor, MI. Same place we also repair desktops and laptops. After that we ship it from our store to you We always invite anyone who lives around here to stop on by and say hi.

Thanks guys!

 

I think you misunderstood me.
Xotic has an overclocking option which I like. hence why I said I'm not an expert and never did an overclock, that is why I would pay them to OC it for me as other companies do not offer this service.

Also I didnt frown upon anyone, perhaps I was not clear in my comments or you simply misread.

 

Perhaps he was referring to my posts?

It's a classic question of liberty. Everyone has a certain amount of liberty. But if your liberty steps on my liberty, then that's not good. So, if companies justifies their products, that is fine. But in doing so, if they attack another company's product or strategy, then their there's some liberty footsie going on. A direct jab at another company's strategy.. well, that's out of the question. That's just my take. And even with free speech, we're supposed to respect each other's liberty right.

On the other hand, I believe the consumers have all the right to compare strategies, criticize them, etc.. The problem with the resellers themselves doing it is it puts them in a conflict of interest. If a particular strategy is under discussion, then the reseller that uses the strategy is not in the position to defend the strategy, because in doing so, it is unclear whether he is defending the rationales of the strategy, or his company. (we cannot ever make sure) Since the reseller is financially biased to defend his strategy, then what will the consumers get out of a financially charged discussion? What happens to the strategies / companies who are not represented here?

But of course, the reality is that the resellers don't get over biased, and are generally working in cooporation, which I think benefits the consumer and the resellers, and notebookreview. I just saw that the discussion (debate, finger pointing, etc) getting sort of flame-ish, so that's why I intervened.

This is rather a technical thing, but hey, it's real business taking place here, so why not use real good governance practices, ya know?

 

If one company is spreading false or true information about my company, I would be sure to step in and confirm or deny the statements and set the record straight. I find nothing wrong with defending one's company instead of letting false information floating around uncontested.

 

ya, that's the thing.. I don't think it'll be such a big deal if people stayed within the bounds of own liberty. (representing themselves only)

 

Paypal me $20 and I'll write you a 5 minute guide to safe overclocking.

 

I'll do it for $15...

you hammered with that blizzard yet?

 

I think if I spend 5 minutes on google ill find a free one.
Its just a matter of me not wanting to. I'm a difficult person to understand.

And speaking of the blizzard, we were supposed to get in in NYC, not even a drop of snow yet... 8.50pm EST. I hate weather.

 

We were kidding. If you want a guide to overclock, we can help.

 

i would love a dummies guide.

I can overclock - but i dont know about safe overclocking.... i guess i really have one question. OC'ing without voltage modding is ok right? just reset GPU/CPU is that correct? and for locked multipliers CPU is there a safe way to OC them and are the programs that help define how far we can push?

probably a topic for another thread since I just hijacked the thread.

mods, feel free to correct, delete, recreate.

 

I would just like to clarify something. Since we sold our first Clevo laptop in 2004, the parts and labor warranty on all of our models has been backed by us and also a major Clevo importer who has been in business for 20+ years.

The only part of the warranty that's not double backed is the 24/7 customer service and the extended labor warranties we now carry, but this is the same for all Sager resellers. Sager does not back the 24/7 customer service that some Sager resellers offer. Nor does Sager back the extended labor warranties offered through their resellers.

So any customer who purchases a MALIBAL-branded Clevo laptop from our company has the exact same amount of protection and security in their warranty coverage as they do if they purchase a Sager-branded Clevo laptop from a Sager Reseller.

 

CPU cannot be overclocked unless you have the NP8170 and the 2920XM. I don't know how to do that. I have not and will not own an XM CPU.

GPU is pretty simple actually. Download MSI Afterburner, nVidia System Tools, eVGA Precision, or any number of nVidia utilities and overclock GPU, shader, and memory in small increments and run furmark or other intense benchmark for 5-10 minutes and keep going until your system fails or artifacts. Then back off a good few percent and leave it be. That's it in a nutshell.

So Malibal is really just a Sager product rebranded as Malibal then?

 

This....

...sounds like it might be Pro-Star.

 

Re-read his post. It is pretty clear who builds his laptops, and it is not Pro-Star.

 

Also make sure it operates within a healthy temperature range when on load (furmark). Just google your gfx card and you'll find the appropriate max temp

 

pretty interesting.

Quick question though, If I do a "safe" overclock. Will I have to redo it every tie i restart my PC ??also if I update the drivers does that say good bye to the OC?



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Edit: sorry we took the thread a bit off topic.

to stay on topic -

can some of the companies please provide us with all of the discounts they offer? i.e Student, Millitary, Cash dis, and with the ammounts, also is the ability to use some of them in conjunction with the other. I.e student and cash...

 

The OC will stay.

 

Depends. Usually, you have to activate the OC with the software on every reboot unless you use a tool that sets it on bootup or set macros to activate that profile before you start a game. Probably best to do it manually because you won't always need the overclock.

 

If I purchase from a Sager reseller and choose the default 3 year warranty for labor and 1 year warranty for parts, and that reseller goes out of business after a year, would I be able to look to Sager for the remaining two years of my labor warranty?

Could any of the Sager resellers confirm? Thanks.

 

No, Sager would not stand behind the 2nd and 3rd year labor warranty.

 

What about if you upgrade the parts warranty to 3 years?..

Will Sager be behind the 3rd year labor warranty as well?

 

If it's a Sager 3yr Parts and Labor warranty, then obviously yes. I think some Sager resellers also offer their own additional warranties which include accidental protection, and those wouldn't be backed by Sager either. So make sure you know which warranty you are getting.

 

Ah, thanks for the clarification..

Accidental warranty option would have been awesome.

 

Just thought id throw it out there that many electronics products follow the "bathtub curve", where the failure rate is high at the beginning of the lifecycle, quickly settles low after a year, then picks back up as the product dies from wear. Its "u" shaped.

Of course, it doesnt drop to 0 ever, so youre better protecting yourself. Just statistically, most failures happen within the first year. This is speaking from electronics in general, so its not specific to laptops, and not specific to clevo, just to clarify. Anyway, just throwing it out there.

 

Yes, but as a barebones fan,

I tend to just replace components, and with Clevo, I think it is better because you can basically upgrade any part...

I've swapped LCD screens before, CPU, casing, GPU, RAM, HDD, etc..

I feel like a tech. OF course, I did not care at all about laptops before I joined this drill-a-hole-in-your-wallet forum..

 

The Ann Arbor part caught my eye, so this post may get you a sale. As nice as it is to save a few bucks, it's also important to support local businesses, too.

 

Great to hear, stop on by say hi, we like to put faces and voices to forum posters =)

 

It's safe to say this discussion has reached the end of its life so I am closing it.