*** Official Clevo P870TM Owner's Lounge! ***

The older MXM graphics cards such as the GTX780M were made in the same size and fit into most of the different OEM's laptop models. Today's MXM graphics card comes in different sizes and shapes. Determined by the OEM itself and not Nvidia. See also pict.

MXM 3.1 was released in March 2012 and added PCIe 3.0 support. The question is... When will it be added PCIe 4.0 support? None know, but this will come before or later. See...
Intel Optane SSD 900p Makes a Secret Appearance - has PCI Express 4.0 interface

 

Mr Fox is probably one of the most knowledgable people when it comes to this, along with the famous modders @Prema and @Coolane and @Khenglish
Dryfus (?) seems to have vanished. And I fully see why Mr Fox is angry.

Did you see the GTX 1080? MSI has two of them. One form factor used in their GT73VR and another bizarre form factor used in God Knows What. That one has the GPU literally close to the top of the MXM module instead of by the teeth. the "GT73" version has the GPU by the teeth, but the GPU and VRM's moved over like someone tried to design the layout while high on shrooms, so it won't align with the GTX 1070 or GTX 980 heatsink/VRM, while the MSI 1070 uses a non cancer form factor.

So, how exactly are MSI 1070 owners (Gt73 6re, 7re) going to upgrade to Volta? Will MSI's volta use the 1070 form factor or the 1080 cancer 1 form factor Or the Ebola form factor 2? How are they going to get the heatsinks for it?

 

Er, while I certainly see your point, and you do make it quite humorously...this is the Clevo P870TM Owner's Lounge.

 

Wow, sounds like a great idea. I suppose their (OEMs/ODMs) being dumb enough to snub the idea back then might, at least partially, explain the sad predicament we are in now with BGA filth and NVIDIA no longer supporting MXM. If Intel and NVIDIA have to support so many lone rangers scrambling for the kiddos' money, they went ahead and did it on their own by withholding support for something more awesome for notebook owners. Shame they cannot do it like NVIDIA reference GPUs. The different GPU manufacturers are free to deviate and make things more robust, but there is a minimum standard that must be met or exceeded. Even with standardization the different brands could distinguish themselves in the same way HIDevolution does. By offering the extra touch, taking pride in the product and taking something ordinary and making it better, nobody would need to feel threatened by the loss leaders selling junk. So, instead, most of the competition sells nothing but crippled trashbooks with funky bling and gimmick features because that's what the kiddos like, LOL.

I could not have stated it any better. To borrow from the famous words of Forest Gump, technology is "like a box of chocolate. You never know what you're going to get." Some you like. Others, not so much. Some of them are downright nasty.

 

I didn't know about that, what a sad but predictable story. Old enemies always seem to be able to agree when it comes to burying any potential for new and innovative competition entering "their" market.

 

Forced obsolescence and disposability can be highly effective tools to drive product sales whenever quality, excellence and ingenuity leave something to be desired.

Speaking of forced obsolescence, their new secret weapon is none of those biological tragedies. They're going to use the top secret new GPU form factor next time, code-named "Project Diarrhea" because it runs using less power, it moves really fast, and it is not harmful to the environment... fully biodegradable.

 

The thing was it made all notebooks identical. A bit like how ATX. is the standard but is actually terrible for thermals.

Notebooks have to serve a wider range of needs and each manufacturer has their own ideas about how best to do it.

 

All this aside.....What does it have to do with the current conversation? Z370 is not high end for desktops. It's a budget setup.
Just like the 2600K/3770k/4770k/6700k/7700k and now the 8700k. All budget cpus. Back when people were crying about paying 1k+ for a high end cpus. (Are they better than yester year? Sure, but they are still budget cpus)

B to D has been a very well known fact, so nothing new there. Although I'm not really sure if A is true though.... I think that was more of an IBM thing than an Intel thing and then everyone else followed suit. Since it's exactly the same for AMD. What I'm referring to is the placement of the i/o shield components and the pci to pcie slots. Yet the boards come in all shapes and sizes and configurations.

 

Has this system been released?

Is the only difference it supports the Coffee Lake line up?

 

First question: No, not yet.
Second question: Yup, pretty much. It might have new broken stuff that needs to be fixed that we don't know about yet.

 

Z370 is the fastest gaming platform and fastest at any other lower thread count operation. Budget is the pentium and B/H chipsets.

 

Eye of the beholder's wallet.

Side note:
I take it you mean this:
H=Budget/Home/Consumer

B=Business

Z=High End/Gaming

But our conversation is about budget gaming.

 

Budget gaming is a core I3, GTX 1050 on an H chipset.

Gamers should not be considering the high end desktop platform, it's pointless. That's for those who need to do heavy productivity.

 

It must be different in the UK, because it sure isn't like that here.

You would have been closer with an I5 and a 1060

 

I think the definition of " high end" changes dramatically between desktop and laptop as well, and it is relative to the audience one is having a conversation with. It's funny how we have varying definitions for things, but no real standard or baseline to clearly understand what they mean.

Another funny favorite made-up expression people like to toss around is " hardcore gamer" LOL. Not sure if that means they like gaming a whole lot, or they are addicted to it to the point that they need psychiatric care, or maybe they just have a really bad attitude toward everything life has to offer except for playing PC or console games.

With laptops " high end" means settling for nothing less than the most powerful option available regardless of cost; which is a similar standard in desktops, but with a much higher performance threshold for the definition. So, " high end" for laptop specs (socketed K-series desktop CPU, Z-series chipset and 1080/1080 SLI) tend to fall into the upper end of the common mainstream level for desktops, not even remotely close to high end. The P870 certainly sets the bar for the industry and defines what " high end" means for notebooks. And, 8700K is certainly looking very good compared to some of the so-called " high end" CPUs at the bottom of the HEDT processor spectrum, like 7800X, (which really seems kind of lame,) but it's not high end for desktops.

Low budget is low budget on either platform... meaning a lot less expensive, adequate for doing some things, but nothing extraordinary to write home about. Most games do not require an extraordinary amount of hardware horsepower unless someone is trying to do something totally ludicrous, like 4K with all of the graphics settings maxed out with only one GPU and expecting more than a mediocre cinematic-level of framerate.

 

Why an I5 with that 1060? Sure an I5 is nice but it's in no way required to have a decent gaming experience.

Budget is spending the minimum to be able to enjoy the game. Maybe you do that at 720p or 900p or lower details 1080p but that's still fine for a lot of people.

Part of this is the fault of Nvidia and halo marketing as high end of course.

 

I was giving you an example. If you sell this stuff then you would totally understand. I do not sell I3/1050's. Not one person has asked me to build something like that. They started dropping to the 1060 from the 1070 when Nvidia shot the price up. I5 (Not to mention they where K processors) was the base because they don't just use a "gaming" machine for just for gaming. It does other things as well. And most were going for 7700K's because as they put it to me. That was the best budget K CPU they could afford with 4/8. (Second best being a I5 K).

To me it makes no difference. Whatever the customer wants that is exactly what I'll sell them. Unless they ask for advice on something better.

As to the rest, They still have old systems from 3 to 6 years ago and are perfectly happy with them. My Niece is still perfectly happy with her 780M/3940XM Alienware from 2011.

But I do understand where you are coming from with what you're saying...

Ps: There are more everyone else gamers than there are pc gamers. (Xbox/Playstation/Nvidia Shield/Wii/Tablets/Ipads/Phones)

 

Well yes, they tend to be more the big box store systems and the dell specials rather than having a custom built one.

 

Tell the truth. You know you be getting your Candy Crush on Mr big time high scorer.

 

@Phoenix

Bruh, is this going be your new toy?

 

He left the P870DM3 for the MSI GT73VR, so I doubt he's going back to the Clevo.

 

Clevo......never again! I'd rather buy a jokebook than get a Clevo.

A company that has no customer service, drivers, or respect for its enthusiasts and diehard fans....... and flaky heatsinks for that matter....

@Mr. Fox

 

Amen.

 

Hardcore whatever means just having more than a passing fancy. When I or my friends refer to ourselves as hardcore gamers it means we play more than the yearly iteration of COD and Madden. We’re well versed on the industry trends, have opinions on where we’d like to see gaming go in terms of direction.

Coming from a dude with extremely strong opinions on laptops I don’t think I’d sit around and toss judgement

 

No judgment passed about anything. Just observations and humor about the expressions people use that are not clearly defined. All of us do it. Many expressions require context or explanation to be understood or meaningful to others. Without definition and context an expression like 'hardcore gamer' can even be an oxymoron. Even when you know what the person saying it intends for it to mean, without context it can still be unclear. For example, on what platform do they regard themselves as being a professional badass or hardcore? Console, PC or smartphone? The more diverse the audience is, the more confusion and controversy there will be because not everyone is on the same page. Some use Imperial measure, some use Decimal, and some fly by the seat of the pants and guess at everything.

 

Hardware and performance trump everything else for me. I am not willing to accept a soldered piece of trash turdbook under any circumstances except for a web appliance under $500. When you factor in all of the defects and look at the big picture, 'turd' can be an accurate way to describe every single laptop available today in one or more ways. Compromise sucks. Clevo is the only manufacturer left with any potential for greatness, but the entire notebook industry is screwed up pretty bad. None of them are actually good at what they do from my perspective.

 

I'd like to say things can only get better since it's pretty much a rock bottom - but in all likelihood I expect things won't change.

 

There is always a remote possibility things will improve. I certainly wouldn't hold my breath on it, but hope springs eternal. The bar is set low enough now in notebooks that nobody should have to try very hard to claim improvement. Excellence may be forever elusive as long as the bar is set so low. There also needs to be some accountability (not to mention retribution) for all of them selling broken garbage. As long as most consumers don't know any better, or don't care enough to stop spending money on crippled crap, there will be no accountability or retribution.

 

Never been one for mobile games to be fair, the closest I got is peggle and converted board games for long trips.

 

That, was a joke my friend.

 

To be fair, this has always been the case for Clevo.


The Alienware went bga retarded and enthusiasts use Clevo, the problems begin to be more apparent.

 

You claim to not be passing judgement but make offhanded comments.

You realize you’re in a “Clevo’s owners lounge” for the new model that you don’t intend to own.

I also will go ahead and correct you. You meant to say imperial measure vs metric, but I knew what you meant.

I’m starting to think that everyone on this forum is just in a giant circle jerk of negativity.

 

Indeed, Alienware wimped out and lowered the bar for the industry. Notebooks in general have accelerated toward the cess pool since then. Other than the P570WM with @Prema BIOS, Clevo was never a brand I took seriously before Alienware stopped selling good products.

To be fair, the P870 dramatically improved my opinion of Clevo. They really didn't have much worth looking at except for the P570WM before then, and even the P570WM had some pretty lousy aspects to it. Without @Prema BIOS is was a sucky piece of trash.

The P870 is not perfect, but it is by far their best effort and their most successful example of what they are capable of in terms of build quality, performance and potential for excellence. They need to take it a little further and try a little bit harder to take it from pretty decent to amazing as shipped from the factory.

LOL. OK, whatever makes you feel better, professor. If you saw my post it originally say metric and I thought decimal would be the better word choice. In case you didn't already know, I am a huge Clevo advocate as long as it doesn't involve BGA filth. In fact, Clevo P870 is the only laptop I would consider buying at this point. But, I don't want to put up with crap from any of them. All brands are subject to ridicule and mockery when they screw up. Clevo screws up frequently, as do the rest of them.

For the record: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metric_system

 

I had that impression which is why I pointed it out, but a page earlier in the thread you were saying Clevo, Clevo never again. But really we get laptops because for one reason or another we have to most likely for travel and mobility purposes. So we make compromises, right? That’s just the way it is. To have dramatic opinions otherwise might just put you in the hardcore minority. Or elitist minority, if you prefer.

Second I’m just saying for what’s supposed to be a big go to site you don’t have to dig far in this forum at all to find a circle jerk of negativity. Even about the user types of laptop consumers. It’s crazy.

I can’t go back in time and see different iterations of your post. Just what you have now.

 

Just because the metric system is a decimal system of measurement does not mean the imperial system isn’t. I won’t tease you anymore but you don’t know what you’re talking about.

 

I would like to know is there any difference between the P870 models, dm3 and km1 in terms of cooling and efficiency?

 

You referring to this post? http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...0tm-owners-lounge.809623/page-8#post-10625238 It's a response for me from @Phoenix

 

Ah I am my bad. Their avatars are very similar. Regardless, the point stands that it’s a ton of circular negativity about the same issues over and over on here. 9 pages and probably 6 is just whining and complaints. No one even has the laptops and benchmarks yet.

 

Well the thing is that most of the components are unchanged from the KM1 version, not excellent by any means but still a serviceable laptop.

@Phoenix is right though, the keyboard really bothers me. I don't like how cheap it feels and the right side shift key is too short for my tastes.

 

Keep in mind that several who posted in this thread are former and current P870 owners. They know what they are talking about. When they mention Cooling and what to expect. Anyway... P870TM is probably the only option if you want a laptop worth buying.

 

So what is an excellent laptop? For $3,600 I’d like excellence. A good cpu, a 1080, a high refresh screen, solid build, etc. what laptop would you recommend over the 870?

 

The 870 is the only laptop I would recommend but the keyboard is bad compared to competition, there's no better way to say it.


You would also need to do a lot of internal work to get the machine running properly.

Thermal pad work, IHS swap to bitspower skylake + lap, soldering of shim to HS, liquid metal application (can be tricky) needs a way to stop spills (like the way mr fox uses foam to prevent spills).

 

So basically all laptops suck?

 

Exactly. All and from all brands is broken. Period!!

 

Lol ok man. And see that’s what I’m referencing here in my previous posts. I think the culture on this forum is just negative negative negative, and it’s circular.

No wonder I just see the same handful of people having the same discussion. As I was busting that guys balls earlier I guess this is simply the “hardcore” mentality but again, wow, overwhelmingly negative.

I guess some people are extremely hard to please.

 

Not really. They only want something proper back for their hard earned spend money

LOOL
This Seems like a half baked solution Have seen similar before.

 

Dellienware-whatever

 

I'm only saying that because I own the P870KM1 and can give you opinions about the build quality and user experience.

 

Is there an ETA?