*** Official Sager NP8170/Clevo P170HM Owners Lounge ***

sorry if this has been asked before but by default, if you get 8gb of ram, where does sager install that? beneath the keyboard or the bottom of the laptop

 

Installed RAM goes beneath the keyboard first.

 

Beneath the keyboard.

 

that makes more sense cause its easier to upgrade that way, but the manual says otherwise tho, i quote

Two primary memory sockets are located under component bay cover (the bottom case cover), and two secondary memory sockets are located under the keyboard (not user upgradable). If you are installing only two RAM modules then they should be installed in the primary memory sockets under the component bay cover.

 

It was the other way until the resellers cracked the whip and told Sager to change it. True story.

 

=D
where do you live wingnut? im coming to ninja your heart of gold

 

Ehh, I live in... Egypt. Yeah, Egypt.

 

^^This is what you call a bad lie.

 

Mr mom here is a pilot so you'll find htwingnut in the sky. Its the only clue I have

 

Damn, you're good.

 

"Attention passengers, this is your resident goldfish speaking..."

 

Did you sell your old Sager already? I noticed that it isn't in your sig anymore.

 

No, she's being decommissioned though. Deciding whether to sell whole or as parts. She'll get one last run this weekend while my niece is here for the weekend because I don't want her touching my new baby yet until I've put a few miles on it.

Infinite Improbability Drive needs some time to reach normality.

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I have thought of a question concerning the default display. Is it good for normal users (I don't do much Photoshop, etc)? I currently have the Gateway 7811fx with the 19x12 display and have always been pleased with the screen. Does anyone know from experience or general well-informedness if the default display will better, worse, or on par with mine?

 

It's simple, really. Even the default 1080p LED will blow away the cheap screen in that Gateway.

 

The screen that came with the 7811FX was actually a pretty nice screen for the time. Best viewing angles and brightness I've seen on a (cheaper) laptop. But I am guessing it is LCD but not LED...LED is much better than LCD, no?

I hope you're right that it blows it away, but I'd still like to know something more than just an assumption based on Gateway sucking.

 

LED is still LCD...

It's the backlight technology that is different.

Your gateway probably used CCFL lighting to light up the LCD,

and the Sager uses LED backlighting to light up the LCD.

 

Go to Best Buy, and check out the Envy 17. It should give you a solid idea, of what to expect from a 1080p LED.

 

Very good idea. You'd definitely consider the default Sager one comparable to one on an Envy then?

Oops, yeah. Sorry

 

What type of gaming support for sound does this model have? I know it has 7.1 outputs, THX TruStudio Pro, and a SPDIF output, but does it support EAX or Dolby Headphone?


Maybe a better questions is what does THX TruStudio Pro actually do for you?

 

Yes.

Even if its screen is from a different manufacturer, it's at least the same technology.

 

THX TruStudio Pro, like EAX, is a way of digitally enhancing the audio output. While EAX is more about ambiance and environment sounds by adding stuff on top of the audio stream, TruStudio seems to be more about purification and clarity by removing unwanted things from the audio stream. It supports virtual surround sound (faking surround sound for non-surround audio sources), automatic equalization (they bill it as a sound "restoration"), subwoofer enhancement (tweaking of the lower frequencies), and automatic volume leveling.

 

Does it provide anything like Dolby headphone for downmixing 5.1 to 2 channels?
It sounds like THX TruStudio Pr Surround might accomplish that, but every time I google it, I get the same paragraph of marketing text.

 

That's all up to how they've wired up the headphone jack, and I haven't seen any documentation that spells it out.

Because the headphone jack is just a stereo jack, it can only support two channels of output. I would assume that you wouldn't simply lose the center/left-surround/left-rear/right-surround/right-rear/subwoofer output just because you plugged into a 2.0 jack. I would guess that they combine the left-surround and left-rear channels with the left-front channel and send that to the left earphone, combine the right-surround and right-rear channels with the right-front channel and send that to the right earphone, and split the center and subwoofer channels across both earphones.

But that's a big assumption.

 

That type of thing is usually handled in software. The hardware just sees 2ch, 2.1ch ... 7.1ch etc. and it's up to your apps to use them or not. Most DVD/BD software, for example, gives several options for a stereo down mix. It will decode the full 5.1/7.1 from the disk, but the end result will be a stereo down mix.

If you go into windows sound properties, and set 2ch or headphones, your app will only see 2ch, and will only output 2ch. In most games, this usually means you don't get any special surround content. Dolby headphone (and hopefully THX TruStudio Pro Surround) will actually let the game render in 5.1, the process the sound down to 2ch such that the rear channels sound like they are coming behind you etc.

You can also get external amps that will take a 5.1 optical signal, and spit out a Dolby Headphone downmix.

I was pretty skeptical at first, but this convinced me:
(This only works with headphones
YouTube - Headphone Surround Demo (Dolby Headphone)

 

Isn't that task taken up by the headphones at that point? The output from hardware may be mixed down to two channels, but any surround sound effect you might get after that is is probably just some best-effort "virtual surround" built into the headphones making it sound as though things are in the front or rear. I mean, if your headphones are seeing a two channel signal, all it knows is left and right. There's no way for the headphones to know what info buried in the audio stream is supposed to be directed to the "front" or "rear". Or am I way off on this?

Unless you have some headphones with a spdif connector, maybe.

 

Your brain decides front/rear + up/down based on the reflections, delays, and coloration your outer ear and head add the incoming sound. Headphones don't do that. They are direct sound firing straight into your ear (in theory). This is especially true with canal phones. What "headphone surround" technologies try to do is take the rear/surround channels and apply head/ear models to them to make the sound appear to the brain as though its coming from behind you. They add in those reflections etc to the surround channels before mixing it in the stereo output. A similar thing can be done with height etc.

Dolby Headphone, as an example, can be applied by the sound card drivers, dvd software, your receiver, or by an external device. It is essentially 5.1/7.1 in, and 2ch. It sounds like total junk, btw, on speakers.

There are "surround headphones" with multiple drivers, but these are regarded by most as junk.

Grab some headphones and listen to the youtube link I posted above if you don't think it can work well. It is a multi channel source that has been mixed down with Dolby headphone into a 2ch format. I can hear the sound in front, behind, above, and below my head, even with a pair of crappy $5 headphones (it does sound better on my $100 cans).


(sorry for this slight topic derail).

 

I just listened to the youtube link on my closed sennheisers and it freaked me out a bit. Felt like something was floating around me. But it sounded like it should have though.

 

I'm using the FiiO E7 DAC + AIAIAI TMA-1.

Freaking crazy.

 

Turns out that this is not Dolby Headphone, but it is still an impressive recording.

 

Whos getting the 90% glossy gamut screen? Im wondering if it would even be worth it. I looked at the photos, but even looking at photos and it being there right in front of you can look like two different things. Anyone going to get it? Anyone think its worth the extra $200?

 

I'll be getting it, from Mythlogic. Because, I want this machine to maximize the quality of Blu-rays and games. It only feels natural, to include the best possible screen in that equation; 60% vs 90% is a huge difference in possible color representation.

 

Xoticpc told me the stock screen for the NP8170-S1 is at 75% color gamut.

 

Mythlogic has the datasheets, and they say 60%. I dunno.

 

I'm getting it; in fact, I decided to stick with the base GTX 460m, and spend the money on the screen instead of a higher GPU.

I don't play the hot, fast FPS games (too old and slow to compete ). I do RPGs, and Strategy games, and when I do any work for hire it's graphics, photo manipulation, 3D rendering, illustration, that sort of thing. For me, the best quality image will always include the most realistic color gamut. I know a stand-alone monitor will always beat the native screen in a laptop, but it is worth not having to lug a separate display to show "in-progress" work to a client. Having them understand that it's 90% of the NTSC video gamut will help them know what the final product will be like without having to dump to actual video and burn a DVD.

I'd like to think that I still see color pretty accurately. I used to do a lot of Pantone matching by eye, and was usually dead on, or within a shade or two of the color densitometer readings. If nothing else, I'll enjoy the color depth.

As for gloss versus matte; gloss is really using a trick involving ambient light to make you perceive a deeper contrast ratio than might otherwise be seen. I would put it down to personal preference, all other things being equal.

I'll always be willing to spend a bit more for better "realism" in my screens, be they laptop screens or stand-alone panels.

 

I had a thought about when the 6970 was going to be available. Previously (like a month ago), we heard that Clevo was going to be testing it and putting it through QC and we should hear pricing information about it right about now. Then the intel hit the fan. At that point, a lot of people were saying "Well, at least with this delay I may be able to get a 6970 in my laptop", but after thinking about it I think that may backfire. I'm sure before the chipset fiasco, Clevo and Sager had their QC guys testing that unit to prepare it for mass production and distribution. However, I HAVE to think that now that they have copies of the revised chipset, that they have pulled ALL of their QC guys and testers off of the 6970 and have them all testing the new chipset to get it out as soon as possible. If thats true, then the 6970 will not be released while we are all waiting for our laptops, and we will be in the same boat we were in before this whole recall started. What do you guys think?

 

I believe one of the resellers had mentioned that the 6970 in Sagers won't be available for at least another two months. Just can't find the post where they said that.

 

Yeah, I HAVE to believe that's true. There is no way that Clevo or Sager has anyone testing the 6970 right now, even though they undoubtedly have some on hand. I just know that there are people in this forum that were hoping that the recall would allow them to switch their order to the 6970 since they thought it would come out while all this was going on. I just don't see that happening.

 

It was Malibal in the 8150 thread that posted that on Page 138. I copied it here too since this was posted in both threads.

I'm quite happy sticking with my 485m

 

Thanks Epsilon!

Like most things, this is really just a risk a buyer has to take. They will have to take the plunge at some point, when they perceive a dealing to be the best for them. If they keep waiting and wishing in the hopes for an even better deal, then they also run the other risk of missing out on the best deal for them.

 

I agree completely.

 

It just depends on how far along they were on the process before they had to shelve it. Maybe they were far enough along where they could leave a skeleton crew dedicated to the 6970 just to keep some kind of momentum going. Let's face it - everyone involved has taken some kind of hit due to the chipset problem. Sales mostly. Anything they can do to stop other launches from being pushed back any more than they can stand only makes financial sense. But there's definitely resource constraints.

I wouldn't be surprised if they're still working on the 6970 to some extent, but I'll definitely agree it's not nearly full bore. Hopefully they were close to being done anyway when the Sandy Bridge bombshell dropped.

 

The engineering samples have been in the wild since early February. All that's holding it up is AMD going into mass production. This is true for Clevo, as well as Dell's M17x R3. QA is done, trust me.

The 6970M plan is still right on schedule. The 6970M being "a couple months away" still lines up with April availability, a time when the majority of us, even those on preorder queues, won't have machines yet.

 

Probably about to order this with the 485 or 6970 real soon when the resellers email me back.

 

Thanks for the pictures, Mike. The sleek black aluminum looks pretty sexy.

 

HTWingNut has a review thread for the 8170 here, which has a couple more pics.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/sager-clevo-reviews-owners-lounges/553932-sager-np8170-clevo-p170hm-review-htwingnut-resident-goldfish-blub.html

 

I'll be glad to take any more pics people want.

 

I would love that, htwingnut. That is if it's no problem.

 

I guess I'd like to know what types of pics people would like to see. So far there's been a pretty decent spread. My camera is a point and shoot and not in the best of shape, so any quality beauty shots are out of the question.

 

We can stick to descriptions then.
Is the palm rest area brushed aluminum as well? I heard it was rubberized. Or is that only the touch pad. I ask because I hate the rubber coating on machines like the G73.