Samsung Series 7 Chronos 700Z5C (NP700Z5C-S03SE)

Drivers etc. first purged fully, as noted before, and now re-installed. First test with a more demanding game immediately brought back the BSOD...

 

Wow, that's pretty conclusive as far as WHERE to look. If you uninstall again, does Windows Update offer drivers Nvidia drivers for you? I realize they're probably not as optimized, but just to test whether the BSOD still occurs. If the BSOD does NOT happen with the Microsoft-provided drivers, you could try with other driver versions from Nvidia and see if that makes a difference.

I am already out of my zone here, since I don't game and don't have Nvidia in my Sammy.

 

Pretty conclusive indeed, glad to have that confirmed! Tried uninstalling again, Windows Update does not appear to offer any Nvidia drivers so I'm now simply trying earlier versions directly from Nvidia, starting with the previous one from July 29th and I will try once again to replicate the BSOD's.

 

Ok... so that didn't work. Tried a few older ones but no go... same BSOD every time, when not installed in between just fine...

I have pretty much decided to do ANOTHER clean install Oh well... But, could you guys possibly run me through what I absolutely need to do in order to do a successful install? Just the basics until I actually have the OS in place... nothing more.
Also, the disc I have is of an OEM Windows 7 Home Premium in English --- that's just what was installed originally (except for the language I think), I don't need to make sure of anything else re. what kind of version I'm installing, right? Will I need to activate the OS again or is there some way around it? Just want to make sure of everything so please pardon me for all the questions.

I have also stored all the drivers from the Samsung site on an ext. hard drive... so I can get to rebuilding the system asap.

 

Just to clarify, it's mainly the partitioning bit of the process I'm still not 100% on relative to my SSD.... Other than that I'll manage just fine I think, using advice and links given earlier... I just don't want to botch this one---

 

I forget if you did the last installation in UEFI or BIOS mode, but I recommend you use BIOS mode for best compatibility between WIn7 and Samsung laptops.

Follow the EXACT steps in the Win7 install guide, starting with the Win8-delivered model: UEFI mode with GPT disk section at the bottom. That will wipe your SSD and convert it to MBR. Make sure your BIOS is set as specified in those steps. And create a 60GB Windows partition, as suggested there -- or use the entire SSD for your Windows partition if you don't want to bother with a separate Data partition.

Of course install from DVD (not USB) if you want to avoid boot problems. You already knew that

 

If the BSOD is happening during a demanding game then I would check the temperatures. Intel CPUs will automatically start to throttle once their temperatures approaches 100C but I don't know if anything similar is built into the GPU. The Z5C is around 2 years old then the cooling system can be getting clogged up and the thermal paste deteriorating.

You can run HWiNFO > Sensors and set it to write a log file with the temperatures. Then, if you get the BSOD you can check the temperatures just before the BSOD happened.

John

 

John: Thanks for chiming in again! Even though I JUST had a BSOD trying to run the Intel Driver Update Utility I'll give that a go --- I have the program running now and logging is ON --- should I just attempt to "provoke" a BSOD?

Either way I will probably be re-installing right afterwards anyway --- hopefully the third time's a charm. And, great info as always, Dannemand!

 

Got a BSOD the usual way by attempting to start a game this time, this time I got a slightly different BSOD (I have had this one maybe once or twice before) though --- "shut down due to an unexpected critical hardware error" or something to that effect. This, once again, is while having the Nvidia Geforce video card installed --- removing/uninstalling it seems to leave me unable to replicate this problem.

Either way, the Hwinfo log does not seem to have any really noticeable spikes in temperature but I will upload the CSV file for you either way if you want to take a look... perhaps I'm misreading it ---

 

Hwinfo log file:

http://www.filedropper.com/hwinfolog

 

Since you stated that the BSOD happens immediately after you start a game (your emphasis) I thought it was more likely an issue triggered by the Nvidia kicking in, rather than a temp issue. But definitely do check that out before embarking on a new installation.

One other thing to check: Have you tried configuring this game to run on the Intel GPU (on my AMD I set this in Switchable Graphics, don't know on the Nvidia)? If the BSOD still happens, it is more likely a DirectX corruption or error than an Nvidia one.

 

I've looked at the log and agree that the temperature is pleasantly cool and therefore the graphics switching appears to be the most likely culprit.

John

 

So:

Temperature issues seem to be out --- Bad Windows install seems to be out as well (just reinstalled, just the same --- all linked back to the Nvidia card).

Dannemand: DirectX corruption/error? How would I go about troubleshooting that?

Also, found this which seems to point to this being a Windows issue, caused by a specific service called "Timeout Detection and Recovery' (TDR)". Full quote:

As a starting note, this is not an nVidia issue. It is not an ATI issue either. These errors are triggered by a Windows service called 'Timeout Detection and Recovery' (TDR). You will only see this error on Windows Vista and Windows 7, as TDR is a feature of the new WDDM driver model (implemented first in Windows Vista). TDR is supposed to be there to help stop BSOD's by resetting the GPU and/or driver when there is an issue or long delay. If the problem happens multiple times in a row, a BSOD can occur.

link: https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/389688/geforce-drivers/nvidia-statement-on-tdr-errors-display-driver-nvlddmkm-stopped-/



Another quote from the provided link explaining the process in more detail:

"The following sequence briefly describes the TDR process:



1. Timeout detection

The GPU scheduler, which is part of the DirectX graphics kernel subsystem (Dxgkrnl.sys), detects that the GPU is taking more than the permitted amount of time to execute a particular task. The GPU scheduler then tries to preempt this particular task. The preempt operation has a "wait" timeout, which is the actual TDR timeout. This step is thus the timeout detection phase of the process. The default timeout period in Windows Vista and later operating systems is 2 seconds. If the GPU cannot complete or preempt the current task within the TDR timeout period, the operating system diagnoses that the GPU is frozen.



To prevent timeout detection from occurring, hardware vendors should ensure that graphics operations (that is, DMA buffer completion) take no more than 2 seconds in end-user scenarios such as productivity and game play.



2. Preparation for recovery:

The operating system's GPU scheduler calls the display miniport driver's DxgkDdiResetFromTimeout function to inform the driver that the operating system detected a timeout. The driver must then reinitialize itself and reset the GPU. In addition, the driver must stop accessing memory and should not access hardware. The operating system and the driver collect hardware and other state information that could be useful for post-mortem diagnosis.



3. Desktop recovery:

The operating system resets the appropriate state of the graphics stack. The video memory manager, which is also part of Dxgkrnl.sys, purges all allocations from video memory. The display miniport driver resets the GPU hardware state. The graphics stack takes the final actions and restores the desktop to the responsive state. As previously mentioned, some legacy DirectX applications might render just black at the end of this recovery, which requires the end user to restart these applications. Well-written DirectX 9Ex and DirectX 10 and later applications that handle Device Remove technology continue to work correctly. An application must release and then recreate its Direct3D device and all of the device's objects. For more information about how DirectX applications recover, see the Windows SDK."


So, from what I'm reading there this could be caused by this TDR service kicking in due to a perceived delay during the graphics switching process --- so, this would be why eliminating the Nvidia card also stops the BSOD issue. But, it can't be that I need to uninstall an integrated video card when, I imagine, these components are actually meant to work together (OS and hardware)... can it??

 

Hi slados1,

Thank you for taking the time to try another Windows re-install. I am sorry that didn't solve the problem. At least this should confirm that it is not a file corruption issue (such as I had suggested with DirectX). There is almost no way that such an issue would be repeated on exactly the same file on two different installations.

I am curious if this installation otherwise behaves better than the earlier one. Did you experience that WiFi issue again?

What doesn't square with this being a general software problem like the TDR issue you mention, is that you are installing Win7, for which this model was designed originally (before they updated it with UEFI and Win8). Thousands of other users of this model are/were running Win7 on it with no reports of such a problem that I can remember.

Check the NP700Z5C Owners Lounge, which was one of the most active threads here back in its days. In fact, you may want to post there with a link to this thread, which might notify other owners who still subscribe to the Owners Lounge thread.

Have you tried using the Samsung supplied Nvidia driver from SW Update? Or if that's what you're already doing, tried drivers straight from Nvidia instead?

Also, did you try running this same game on the integrated Intel GPU instead of the Nvidia (but with the Nvidia drivers installed) just to see if the same BSOD occurs?

Are you seeing the BSOD with several different games and 3D apps?

You could also try a different Win7 DVD, just in case there is file corruption error on the one you have now. Come to think of it, that would explain a lot! Just download another ISO from Digital River (they're completely legal) and burn a new DVD.

The only other explanation I can think of is a hardware issue with the Nvidia GPU -- as you already suggested. One way to test that is to pop the original HDD back in and run a factory restore from Recovery and see if the problem is still present.

If you created a bootable factory image backup before swapping in the SSD (only applicable if it came with Win8 originally) you could also use that to put the factory installation on the SSD. In that case make sure to switch back to UEFI mode first ( OS Mode Selection=UEFI OS).

I apologize if you already tried or answered some of these earlier in this thread and I just forgot

 

Thanks for the suggestions! Going to be as brief as possible because I had a freeze/ strange warping of the screen image earlier today while writing a lengthier post that I didn't get time to post. Had to shut the pc off using the power button...

First: Had problems with Setpoint software install yesterday, got a "side by side configuration" error preventing me from running the program. After some googling I figured it was due to missing or corrupted Visual C++ packages so I uninstalled and reinstalled them all. This sorted the Setpoint problem and around this time I also got an update for the Nvidia video card via Samsung Update --- installed that and it went through fine. I also got the idea to connect a D-Link USB dongle to my pc, just to see what would happen re. the wifi issue, after it was connected it seemed as if the Intel Centrino was suddenly recognized again and I also got another driver update alert from Samsung Update. After installing it I am now able to use wifi and the correct driver is installed for the first time in months... other attempts earlier have not worked --- running the Intel drivers downloaded directly from the Intel site never had any effect.
So, in a way there's some positives --- what do you think this says about the state of the Intel Centrino hardware (if anything at all)? DOes this meant that it's not a hardware defect after all or is the D-Link dongle totally separate from the Intel Centrino when connected?

Still seems like the BSOD problem related to Nvidia Geforce video card is the same though, as I noted earlier I had a few freezes earlier today where I simply had to shut down via the power button, one of those freezes with a kind of distorted image of the page I was on, the other one was not visual other than the frozen screen and me not being able to do anything...

The old HDD is dead, I believe... it got a beating...

The BSOD's are seemingly not entirely exclusive to games --- the freezes and such I had earlier was not during gaming/ nor was it while running a game or even Steam. Just me writing a post on here, no other programs running...

Thought about another Win7 DVD --- I might try that as a last resort before having someone look at the notebook, I'm starting to come at my wits end here..

I have tried drivers from both Nvidia directly and now currently from SW Update... no difference as far as I can tell --- they install but the BSOD problem still persists...

The notebook came installed with Win7, so no go as far as the last suggestion goes...

But, like I said, for some reason the Wifi card is once again recognized --- this after the Visual C++ package un - and reinstalls, SW Update driver install and connecting of the D-Link dongle.

 

Thank you. Well done getting your WiFi going. But none of this should be that hard, and I am increasingly thinking there is either (1) a motherboard defect, (2) a corrupt Windows disc, or (3) a corrupt BIOS or NVRAM/CMOS data.

If you haven't already updated to the latest BIOS, I highly recommend you do, since that should repair any issues with the BIOS or its NVRAM/CMOS data. Make sure you use the safe procedure described in John's BIOS Update thread (do NOT perform the update within SW Update).

If you already have the latest BIOS, you might consider re-flashing it, which requires rolling back to an earlier version (a tricky process described in our BIOS roll-back thread) then updating again. I would try another Windows disc first, though.

I am running out of suggestions here...

 

Ooops, sorry I missed this. Don't want to hijack the OP so I'll be brief! Your comment about an SSD is quite timely -- I haven't made the switch yet, but thought about it as a nice fill-in for another 12 months on a reasonably solid machine (slados1's issues notwithstanding). I have indeed heard the rumors of Samsung's demise and hope they are greatly exaggerated! But in the meantime, I've had my eye on the Yoga 2 Pro (strange leap from the Samsung, I know!). But $100 for a 256GB SSD vs. $1000+ for a new machine...not a hard decision from the financial side of the equation.

Finally, I should note that the two reasons I absolutely needed a GPU were (1) my son's gaming, and (2) NVIDIA's development of CUDA (access to the GPU for parallel computation). Both those needs have fallen by the wayside, and sadly, I don't think my 640m has been accessed in a year! So yeah that's very good advice and I may end up sitting on my hands another 6-12 months. My only regret is that I've started to hang out quite a bit at the Lenovo Y2P and Y3P sub-forums, and would hate to say farewell over there.

In the meantime I should be honest and say I'm amazed at how much great trouble-shooting advice you and John have provided on this particular issue. It does indeed seem like either a very subtle hardware problem or (hopefully) a case of some bad drivers. I'm impressed at how thorough and persistent @slados1 is -- my fingers are crossed that it ends up being something relatively easy to fix!

-Matt

 

I think we're nearing the point where we've tried just about everything... indeed Again, can't thank you guys enough for your constant willingness to offer advice and help!!

Final round:

My BIOS seems to be the latest one --- P05AAG (got this info using the BiosUpdater exe and looking in the startup BIOS menu)

I think I might try another Win7 install when I feel up for it --- not right now though Would this --- http://msft.digitalrivercontent.net/win/X17-58997.iso --- be the correct link/give me the right version? Got the link from here http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_7-windows_install/cannot-find-digital-river-download-site/66a8439b-0d16-4b70-92f7-1c8486a46ebf seeing as I couldn't locate the Digital River site...
Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit OA (OEM) was the originally installed OS

 

I don't recall if that is the latest, but BIOSUpdate.exe (from John's thread) should tell you. Again, it is still possible to have corruption, either in the BIOS itself or its data. You can try and reset BIOS settings to default, save settings, reboot. I would do that before the next re-install.

I am surprised I couldn't Google Digital River either, but yes, that should be the correct ISO.

Fingers crossed.

@gadgetrants: Matt, do you remember having any issues like these when you clean installed Win7? I seem to recall yours being a Win8 model, though, so your BIOS would be different.

And I am like you: Still using my old Sammy, haven't even done the SSD thing yet, but prolly will soon. My next purchase will be a replacement for my (even older) HP HDX18. Not much choice in the 18 inch category...

 

Wow you have a superb memory. Correct! I did indeed wipe Win8 after purchase and clean install Win7 -- and it was a very smooth experience. Looking back, I'm intrigued to see that I chose UEFI/GPT instead of BIOS/MBR. I recently upgraded to Win8, and since I made a full system image before the switch, left the disk formatted as is so that I could go back to Win7 in a pinch. Either way, both operating systems have behaved well for me. My instinct/gut feeling at this point is that slados1 is not experiencing hardware issues, but the three of you have gone well beyond whatever troubleshooting I might have suggested! Not sure what the next step should be.

-Matt

 

My memory is actually deteriorating at an alarming rate But I do remember your installation because we mostly recommend(ed) BIOS/MBR for Win7 installations, and you relayed some UEFI/GPT experience; I think it was about ExpressCache in UEFI mode.

@slados1: If your computer had been an original Win8 model (UEFI/GPT) AND if this were a Win8.x re-install, I might have speculated that the switch to BIOS/MBR could have introduced issues with drivers being unable to pull some firmware levers. But as yours was a Win7 model (BIOS/MBR) AND since you're doing a Win7 installation (for which Samsung's legacy BIOS is designed) I cannot imagine that would be the issue.

Are we certain that the failed original HDD was actually a disk problem and not an interface problem (which is now causing problems on the new SSD)? Did you ever test the HDD on another computer?

Anyways, we're at the end of the road if none of of these latest efforts bear fruit.

 

Dannemand:

The original HDD was physically damaged due to me "overreacting" a bit when I was having some HDMI to ext.monitor issues, so I have not tested or connected the old HDD to any other equipment. I'm thinking about one other possible fix though, something I've read on countless threads re. this same type of issue, and that is adjusting the RAM/Memory timings. Not sure yet, as of now I have uninstalled the Nvidia card and, as usual, the problem seems to be nonexistent in this state... so nice.

 

Got it. I am familiar with the overreacting element

Of course we'd love an update if you make any progress on this, now or later.

 

I have decided that the problems I am having are too erratic in the current state (aggravating) --- I had it in for a diagnosis at a local shop and they were not able to fix anything either... all they could state was that there was OBVIOUSLY problems due to physical damage to the motherboard itself (the whole thing is bent, apparently).

So, absolutely last few questions here: does anyone know where I can get a replacement motherboard? Ebay is an option but I've had no luck so far as I figure I have to have the exact same motherboard with the same OEM OS... correct?

Hope someone can chime in with a link or some quick info as this is the last resort before m retiring this notebook

 

Here in the US, samsungparts.com has NP700Z5C motherboards in stock for $874 (see here). That is of course way too much. But you can take the part number from there and look for better deals closer to your location.

Do note that there are different motherboards (part numbers) for different NP700Z5C submodels, including different ones for Win7 and Win8 models, with different UEFI implementations in BIOS. You should be able to install both Windows versions on either motherboard, but you want to install both Win7 and Win8.x in legacy BIOS mode on the older boards, and Win8.x in UEFI mode on the newer boards.

Although I cannot guarantee it, I would think that both old and new NP700Z5C motherboards should fit your chassis. But there is the questions of whether both types are compatible with the connected sub-boards you have in your model.

 

Thank you! Searching using that parts/model number there's actually one on ebay Samsung Series 7 NP700Z5C i7 Intel Motherboard NVIDIA Video BA92 10325A Mint | eBay

Mine is an i5 Intel though and this says i7. Would this matter?

 

Again, I am pretty sure it would fit the chassis, but I honestly don't know if there could be incompatibilities with any of your sub-boards. The only way to be sure is do some detective work and find out which model that eBay board came in and which sub-boards it had.

The NP700Z5C Owners Lounge and the Series 7 Disassembly thread may have some revealing posts on this. They're linked in the Samsung Sticky list. While you dig through them, others may post more informed input here.

Of course you could decide to take the chance, then if some of the sub-boards don't fit you can buy those as well. They couldn't be that expensive. The BIG gotcha would be if the screen somehow isn't compatible across the different NP700Z5C motherboard models, though I doubt that.

Seriously, I am not an expert on this

Edit: One more thought: The NP700Z5C was incredibly popular, including among tweakers and tinkerers. Given it is now 2+ years old, I cannot imagine a shortage anytime soon of motherboards and other components from retired units. So don't overpay for this stuff.

 

Thank you once again for the info! I will give this some thought and do some more research --- I'd retire the notebook in a heartbeat if I didn't like it so much when it's actually working!

 

My laptop won't boot the hdd crashed and I installed a new one and my problem is the same as in an earlier thread.
http://forum.notebookreview.com/threads/chronos-7-np700z5c-suddenly-wont-boot-or-post.730445/
I followed all your steps and the message all boot options have been tried Press F4 key to recover with factory image, any other key for next boot loop iteration. When I press F4 the computer resets and sends me through the same thing. Any ideas.

 

F4 won't work with a new drive because the factory image it is looking for is stored on the drive (ie it's on the dead drive and the new one is empty). You will need to install Windows using either recovery media provided by Samsung or a Windows installation disk (in which case you will need to find your Windows key). Once Windows is loaded then download and run Samsung's SW Update to find the Samsung-specific drivers (sometimes old and Windows may offer newer ones) and software.

John

 

So I have some water damage on my laptop and the keyboard has completely stopped working, Any advice on how to fix this issue?

 

Replace the keyboard. The official part is a combined keyboard / palm rest which Samsung call " unit housing top". If you do't like the cost of a new part then you might find someone selling a used part taken from a Z5C which died from something other than a problem keyboard. You may also find someone in China selling the basic keyboard on ebay for a reasonable price. You will need some butchery skills to separate the old keyboard from the palmrest and then fix the new one into place, but a few people have done it.

Alternatively, make do with a USB external keyboard. You might have to disconnect the internal keyboard to prevent it sending confusing signals to the BIOS.

John