Series 9 Owners: Third party mSATA upgrades

I ended up ordering the PM841 from Israel (to the UK, where I'm going to be for the next two months -- we'll see how HM Revenue & Customs works). Now I'm wondering what the next step in my long story of missteps in the SSD ordering is going to be. The amusing thing is there's a 50/50 chance my X3E will arrive via my uni this or next week, so I may simply miss it at home. I guess this makes it a Xmas gift later?

 

Regarding the VAT, the shipping company will normally phone you when the item reaches UK so they can get the payment (20% VAT + whatever service charge they add on).

I hope it's sent via a system with good tracking so you can see when you can expect the phone call.

John

 

Mine came from the states and the VAT was added at the time of purchase and delivered straight to my door

 

Hi again. Just curious - did you have time to fit and test the PM851?

 

My order from the Israeli company from eBay just got refunded without a word. The saga continues.

 

And ebay shows 10 available / 5 sold.....

I would dig deeper into my pocket and either go to notebook.de (no VAT to add) or excaliber pc (VAT payable upon import).

Or you can try the Mushkin 480GB. It's cheaper but slightly fatter (it uses an extra board). However, someone reported a few months ago that it does fit into the Series 9. It might also use a little more power than the Samsung.

John

 

I'm definitely going for Samsung. Not sure if Mushkin even has FDE.
The difference between excaliber + VAT vs notebook.de seems to be marginal (~£20?). I'll probably just order from the latter tomorrow. I'm also considering the PM851 from Oz (ramcity), but doesn't seem to be that much different than the PM841.

PS Writing this on the X3E (and in your great home country already, John), it's perfect. Maybe expected a little more juice when not plugged in, but hey...

 

Trying to make an educated choice whether to buy PM841 or PM851 based on product IDs on pictures since reviews are not available for the 851:
PM841: MZMTD512HAGL
PM851: MZMTE512HMHP

Anyone who knows the coding? It seems PM851 may have the higher clock rate for the controller (E vs D as 5th character in product code). Also MHP is same last three char's as the PM840EVO. May it be so that the differences between 841 and 851 are similar as pro and evo for 840 series? -> different tradeoffs and minor differences in real life as i read the reviews?

At the end of the day it might not matter what to retrofit since both provide enough storage at approximately the same cost....

 

I doubt if there is much difference. The PM851 seems to be sold only in Australia. However, it is also listed here. It might be the same controller but different memory chips. The only way to find out if it performs better is to buy one.

John

 

I ended up ordering one directly from excaliberpc.com, where the PM841 is listed for $449, but you need to pay $20 extra for the wire transfer which is the only payment option + whatever you bank charges you for an international wire. Hopefully this one reaches Europe.

EDIT: just got my PM841 from excaliber -- had no idea it was so tiny! (probably one of the reasons it escaped someone's attention at the duties..) Now waiting for the mSATA adapter from memoryC.

 

I was not able to do a clean install of Windows 8 (something wrong with the partitions according to the installer, although I tried changing and deleting them for several times), so I cloned my old drive via Acronis True Image and an mSATA USB 3.0 adapter.
Here are the results of the CrystalDiskMark benchmark for both the built-in Lite-On 256GB and the Samsung PM841 512GB I got from excaliber (this is with the internal AES FDE encryption on Samsung).



EDIT: In case someone might be interested, this is how the Lite-On drive performs in the USB 3.0 adapter:

 

Congratulations.

The SSD results tend to be slightly faster than my Samsung 512GB mSATA, which could well be due to various firmware improvements. Mine was in a computer assembled in January 2013 so it will soon be a year old. The firmware is HAGL (last part of model number in Device Manager).

John

 

Mine says SAMSUNG_MZMTD512HAGL-000DXT4 in the identifier field in the Device Manager or just -00000 in BIOS (should we call it UEFI now?).

 

HWiNFO says :

Drive Model: SAMSUNG MZMTD512HAGL-000
Drive Revision: DXT41K0Q

John

 

SAMSUNG MZMTD512HAGL-00000
Drive Revision: DXT4200Q

It happens when they change something.

 

BTW, John, I thnk one of the reasons my PM841 can perform a little better is that I haven't filled up the space yet (and this helps a lot with the SSD, as you know).

 

That's a valid point. My tests were taken a few weeks after I got the computer. There is another set of results for this SSD here.

John

 

Well i finally got round to installing my PM851, benchmark below, it means nothing to me so I'll let the experts comment on whether it is any good

 

It's looking a little slower (particularly the sequential and 512k writes) than the PM841 results (second graphic here).

Was your computer doing anything else during the test? Have you substantially filled the SSD?

John

 

Hi John, that was just after the re-install with nothing else running and 16% disc space used, I have the 256Gb not 512 so maybe there is a difference there, although in comparison to the awful U100 it is still a huge improvement

SAMSUNG MZMTD256HAGM-0000
Drive Revision: DXT4200Q

I seem to have lost the Hibernate option, not greyed out just nothing there. I installed IRST (rapid start) and easy settings, it has recreated the 8GB partition to match the RAM...I searched the problem and found a solution involving disabling hybrid sleep, but I don't have that option either so I am a bit stumped and would welcome any suggestions.

Other than that all is good and a full boot seems as fast waking from hibernate was previously

 

I agree: the 256GB might well have a lower write performance. Not that one would notice the difference without running a benchmark.

As for the Intel Rapid Start, our accrued wisdom is in this thread. The original IRST package had a few bugs and the latest, direct from Intel, is more likely to get things working.

John

 

There are 12 of the 480GB Crucial M500 mSATA in UK @£257.65 as I type this.

I should add that there were some reports ( in this thread, IIRC) that it runs quite hot but that was a month or two back and might have been fixed.

John

 

I installed a 256gb Crucial m4 mSATA in my Series 9 15" last year and all was well.... it worked beautifully. Suddenly, this past September, my computer wouldn't turn on. Turns out that it was the SSD. The computer would come on but was not able to go any further than the initial startup screen and kept restarting itself. I put in my old/original 128gb SSD that came with the computer and everything worked just fine.

I called Crucial since the drive was still under warranty and they replaced it but the replacement hard drive had the exact same issue. Crucial told me it's not their SSD but instead my laptop and that somehow it has been damaged to where maybe it can't handle the power requirements of a 256gb mSATA or that the power in that port may not stable enough.

Anyway, I've been busy so I just worked with the 128gb that I originally had while still not having restored the data from the online backup I had of my Crucial 256gb, so it has been frustrating.

I looked for another laptop in which I could install their replacement SSD in and couldn't find one. So I bought a mSATA enclosure and it doesn't work in the enclosure either. I told Crucial this and they are willing to exchange their replacement 256gb m4 mSATA for yet another one but say that I should try it in another laptop first because they think it's my laptop and not their drive. They feel that my laptop may be short-circuiting their hard drive.

Can this really be the case or is Crucial just making excuses? I'm so tired of not having a working laptop. I now have a 256gb mSATA SSD that I can't even use and have all my old data backed up somewhere which I can't even restore (I access just the files I need).

I would appreciate your thoughts on whether it could be the laptop (has anybody on here or have you heard of anybody have this issue with their Series 9 15")?

 

I've had an m4 in an NP900X4C since July 2012 and have not encountered any problems. I've upgraded the firmware as and when available. The problem you encountered resembles one addressed in the firmware update:

If you didn't update the original firmware then it's possible that you encountered this problem. I then wonder whether the BIOS / CMOS is remembering that this type of drive has a problem and then refuses to recognise the replacement thinking it is the original, defective, one. Perhaps a full CMOS reset might fix it. I would suggest the following steps to reset the CMOS: (i) Disconnect the main battery; disconnect the CMOS backup battery (it's a small disc-shaped battery); then hold down the power button for a minute. If you still have No. 2 SSD then you could try those steps. I would certainly try it before installing No. 3. another strategy is to see if Crucial would send you the newer M500. The computer should realise that it's a different SSD.

I don't think there is a basic hardware problem with the computer since the U100 works fine.

John

 

Thank you John. I'll try this with m4 No.2 as you suggest. Hopefully it'll work. And then I'll go ahead and update the original firmware as well.

I'll let you know soon.

 

Just followed your steps and it didn't work. I'm going to try and update the firmware now I suppose.

 

Actually I think the firmware might already be updated. When I did the CMOS reset and then put my 128gb SSD back in (because the 256 m4 still didn't work), Windows was showing today's date as 4/13/2012. I didn't think much of it and just set it to the correct date.

Then when I looked for the latest firmware update, I saw that Samsung only has one listed and it is from the same date: 4/13/2012.

So I guess I already have the latest firmware and still the CMOS reset didn't work.

Could my SSD be damaged because of what the Series 9 did to it? Should I try another m4 SSD from Crucial now?

 

Are you confusing the computer's BIOS with the firmware (effectively the operating system) on the SSD? You can check if the computer's BIOS is up to date using the BIOS Update program (link in first post in this thread). The newest BIOS will be either P06AAC (Feb 2013) or P10ABK (Nov 2013).

My comment above was about the SSD firmware which you need to manually download and install. The latest firmware for the m4 is 07MH. The factory version firmware on the m4 may be indicated on the label (the new m4 should be this version which was dated 26 March 13 but maybe they found some old stock to send you). However, your original m4 would have an older firmware (unless you had manually updated it) and hence vulnerable to the hypothetical risk of the problem addressed by the newer firmware.

Another possible fix is to turn on the computer between removal of one SSD and replacement with another. You'll only get a message about no bootable drive but it might encourage the computer to check more carefully when it next starts with an SSD inside.

Another thought: If Crucial send you a further SSD then check it in the enclosure first. If it is accessible then I would clone the U100 to the SSD before putting it into the computer.

John

 

Any advice on which is the best SSD (~256 Gb) for upgrading my NP9003XC?

I have looked at the thread but can't quite make up my mind. At the moment I'm looking at the Crucial M500 and the Plextor M5M, but looking at different reviews I get to different conclusions... I also haven't found out if there's anything much better than those.

Thanks!

 

The reported temperature problems (indicative of power consumption of the M500 have me a little worried about it, but the older m4 has caused me no worries.

Another brand to consider is Toshiba. If their mSATA is the same basic hardware as their M.2 SSD (used in the Series 9 Plus) then that could be a very good choice. It would be near the top of my list.

BTW, the 512GB Samsung mSATA is now on Amazon UK.

John

 

Thanks. I can't find any Toshiba mSata drives, so that doesn't seem to be an option. And the 512GB Samsung doesn't seem to be available in the US (at least I couldn't find it). How about the Plextor M5M?

 

Her's the Samsung mSATA at a very attractive price. At that price it's my recommendation. It's not the top of the class in write performance but is a good balance between performance and power consumption with an excellent reliability record.

I'm a bit surprised that the Toshiba mSATA isn't easily available in north America but occasionally we Europeans get lucky.

John

 

Thanks, that looks like an interesting alternative. I'll probably end up getting that one.

 

I just picked up this one for $150 shipping included, now back at $165. Not quite as good as the Samsung and 16GB smaller, but I think real world usage will be about the same and that's the lowest price I've seen for 240GB. Will post benchmarks when I get it installed.

Amazon.com: MyDigitalSSD 50mm Bullet Proof 4 BP4 50mm mSATA Solid State Drive SSD SATA III 6G (240GB)(256GB): Computers & Accessories

 

After my experience with the BP3, which throws disc errors every few days, I have trouble with recommending that brand. I should point out, however, that I haven't installed the latest firmware because I failed to jump through all the hoops without falling over plus the firmware update is guaranteed to wipe the contents, unlike Crucial's firmware updates.

However, maybe the BP4 takes the failings of the BP3 into account and will run for a long time without any issues.

John

 

But the samsung mstat is not a retail version and purchasing it means giving up any support on firmware update or warranty, right?

 

I don't recall Samsung ever releasing a firmware update for an SSD. This might be because their controller is very mature and, while there are small improvements over time, there are no potentially catastrophic bugs to fix.

You may be right about the warranty. That would be a question to ask the seller. Crucial is probably a better choice in that respect.

John

 

I'm also in EU and would basically purchase from amazon.co.uk. Samsung PM851 256GB is sold on it but no mentioning of warranty, I guess no warranty then. I also looked at Plextor M5M 256GB, the benchmarks looks good and reviews on Amazon.co.uk are quite positive, although still no warranty is mentioned.

Moreover, I have seen reviews saying that M5M has performance consistency problem because it cleans the drive only when the driver is idle, which brings a significant drop in speed during cleaning.

On the other hand, Crucial M500 has mentioned warranty, but I heard people say that M500 has problems and the smaller the capacity, the worse the problem.

So basically, if I can get Samsung with warranty at about the same prize on Amazon, I would like to go for Samsung.
If the problem of Plextor M5M is not true or has been solved, I would like to go for Plextor.
If the rumor about Crucial M500 has been solved, I would also consider M500.
Any comments?

 

I wouldn't worry about the Plextor doing its housekeeping when idle. Sensibly, that's the way all the SSDs are programmed to work and it's a relatively small task.

The Crucial M500 actually has the same capacity but 16GB is set aside for over-provisioning. This helps with the wear levelling. I have to wonder whether Crucial have sorted out the M500 problems since the M500 thread is relatively quiet.

John

 

I think what I meant about Plextor is that it accumulates the cleaning job rather than do the cleaning from time to time like Intel or Samsung. So when it piles up the work to some extent and starts to do the cleaning while at the same time, you want to write or read data on SSD, then there's a considerable drop in speed. You can view the detailed review here.
AnandTech | Plextor M5M (256GB) mSATA Review

 

I wouldn't lose too much sleep about that. Anand likes pushing testing to the extreme.

This review of the Plextor is very positive but they probably didn't put it through the same extent of testing. Most of us only write, at most, a few GB per day.

John

 

1TB Samsung mSATA 840 EVO anyone?

Samsung Introduces Industry’s First 1 Terabyte mSATA SSD | global.samsungtomorrow.com
Samsung 1TB mSATA 840 EVO Coming | forum.notebookreview.com

 

And also in other sizes. Interesting that they are using mSATA when M.2 is considered the way forward. Perhaps they realise there's a lot of scope for upgrades.

Let's hope that Samsung release these officially to the retail chain and use the 2.5" SSD pricing (or even lower).

John

PS: A review of the 1TB mSATA.

 

I just fitted the samsung PM851 512Gb sourced in the UK from here. It's replacing the Crucial M4 256Gb in my 1st gen 900X and here are the CrystalDisk Mark comparisons:


Crucial M4


Samsung PM851

 

It's useful to know that there is now a UK source for these drives.

The PM841 (model No. MZMTD512HAGL) in my X4C is slightly faster in some categories (most notably the 4kQD32).



However, this might be a consequence of the newer platform and the difference wouldn't be noticeable in real life. Much of the performance benefit of SSDs comes from the near zero access times (although the Sandisk U100 demonstrates that it is possible to make what looks like a good SSD but is capable of seriously slowing down a computer.

John

PS: The Crucial M500 480GB mSATA is currently £238.27 on Amazon UK.

 

Good price. I must admit I was put off the Crucial by reports of it running hot and not being power efficient. One of the reasons that prompted this upgrade, other than the extra space, was that my M4 had apparently died but after researching I found that it was possible to revive it doing a power cycle . I upgraded the firmware and it had behaved fine. However, since the change over I have been using it an external enclosure and it did it again and was again successfully revived.

 

I wonder whether the very long time between listing of the 480GB M500 mSATA and its arrival was caused by unplanned work on the power consumption issue. However, we have to wait for some user feedback. I would have been tempted to get one but Samsung's announcement of the EVO mSATA SSD has got my attention.

John

 

Me too and I may well have a 512GB PM851 for sale when they become available in the UK as long as they aren't too expensive

 

As usual you're right as nails John. The BP4 imaged successfully but died as soon as I turned on rapid start. Back it went to amazon and I exchanged for a now lower priced ($150) 240GB M500. A little sorry I didn't go with the $300 480GB though. Haven't noticed any of the heat issues, knock on wood. Go up to 39C (comparedto 34C on the replaced Samsung) after running crystal, but that's not too bad. Here are the numbers in case anyone is interested.

 

Bad news about the BP4 but good news that Amazon were quick in helping.

There's negligible difference between the M500 results and those in my m4 review (which will soon be 18 months old) so I wonder what is changed.

John