The Samsung NC20 (12.1" netbook) thread

As suggested here, it is time to give the NC20 it's own dedicated thread now that it has arrived (at least in Europe).

The NC20 has a few features that make it stand out from the crowd:

1. A 12.1" 1280 x 800 display, so it it overlapping with the 12.1" notebooks

2. The Via Nano U2250 CPU

3. The Via VX800 chipset and VIA Chrome9 HC3 GPU

The weight of 1.5kg makes it significantly lighter than the budget 12.1" notebooks (but there's no built-in optical drive). The cost is around £400 / €500 with 1GB RAM / 160GB HDD and Windows XP.

There is pre-arrival discussion of the NC20 here and some photos and initial comments here.

John

 

Can anyone confirm if 2GB is the max?

Also, bootup times/shutdown and hibernate times/resume will be nice.

 

I think the chipset supports 4GB maximum, but NC20 has only ONE memory slot. So we need a 4GB ram mobule to test.

 

Are you kidding?! 1 slot? Well i guess if you are buying this you wont need much RAM

 

You don't need 2 memory channels with a netbook so 1 slot is more than enough imo. I will try and post later on with my impressions if I get a chance.

 

yeah i know, thats why i just said that.

either way windows 7 will hardly use much ram so 1gb or more should be fine.

 

As posted in spites thread my initial impressions are as follows "Personally for what this netbook is offering for me it is excellent. It will handle normal video's without any problems, the screen res means I can browse, work and use most applications without any disadvantage or loss of real estate. I will install Elements and Nikon Capture 2.1 for my D90 and try and see how it handles photo organising and editing. The build quality is excellent as well as the keyboard, there is no fan noise and the battery lasts more than long enough especially when it is on recommended mode. I would recommend this netbook without hesitation, while it isn't as small or portable as a 8.9 or 10.1 Inch it brings far too much to make that a disadvantage for me."

I would like to add that I ran 3dmark 06 in default settings ie 1280*800 resolution, the results were 133, so running it in 1024*768 should add a few points to that as well. As a side point it was still extremely quiet even when pushed which is another plus point for me and the underside hardly becomes warm. I will do some more thorough testing over the next few days and let you know what I think.

 

German video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKa5q_0N5cg

 

Nice video. I wish I could tell what they were saying, though I can probably infer a lot of it. The NC20 also for some reason looks a lot bigger than it actually is.

 

NC20 vs 1000HA in Super Pi

 

For those who don't like sitting and watching paint dry on youtube, see the attached.

The result is close and the same applies with wPrime if the Atom is running one thread. However, enable two threads and the Atom's wPrime time drops from 175s to 125s.

If you want to see the U2250 run ahead of the opposition then see SiSoftware Sandra's cryptography benchmark.

John

 

NC20 Hands On, coming to US in March.

 

I feel like at the price ($500) or so the processor is way too weak. ..

 

Considering you can buy an AMD neo this month for $600(DV2) in thinking that may be the way to go.

 

But can it offer the 6 hour battery time?

John

 

Just what I was wondering.

 

That dv2 is a crappy notebook weighing 4 lbs, it'll probably produce thermonuclear levels of heat and crap out 2 days out of warranty.

Sorry, I just don't think some of those HP laptops are any good.

And I used to call myself an AMD fanboy.

 

What are your thoughts on this:

http://www.newgadgets.de/2009/02/25/samsung-nc20-3dmark-2001-gegen-eee-pc-1000h/

The Atom comes out on top over the Nano? (Or the GPU rather?)

 

Some tests from netnooknews.de by Artthurko

Sisoft Sandra 2009 SP2 (dextop version VIA VB8001-16 Mini-ITX mit VIA Nano -email- max. TPD 17W)

Processor Arithmetic:
Dhrystone ALU:
VIA Nano L2200 1.6GHz : 4653 MIPS
Intel Atom 240 (HT, 1.86GHz) : 4326 MIPS
Intel Atom N270 (HT, 1.6GHz) : 3707 MIPS
Intel Atom 240 (ohne HT, 1.86GHz) : 3600 MIPS
Intel Atom N270 (ohne HT, 1.6GHz) : 3085 MIPS

Processor Arithmetic:
Whetstone iSSE3:
VIA Nano L2200 1.6GHz : 4021 MIPS
Intel Atom 240 (HT, 1.86GHz) : 3763 MIPS
Intel Atom N270 (HT, 1.6GHz) : 3225 MIPS
Intel Atom 240 (ohne HT, 1.86GHz) : 2403 MIPS
Intel Atom N270 (ohne HT, 1.6GHz) : 2059 MIPS

Processor Multi-Media:
Multi-Media Int x8 iSSSE3:
VIA Nano L2200 1.6GHz : 8761 kPixels/s
Intel Atom 240 (HT, 1.86GHz) : 9503 kPixels/s
Intel Atom N270 (HT, 1.6GHz) : 8144 kPixels/s
ntel Atom 240 (ohne HT, 1.86GHz) : 6093 kPixels/s
Intel Atom N270 (ohne HT, 1.6GHz) : 5222 kPixels/s

Processor Multi-Media:
Multi-Media Float x4 iSSE2:
VIA Nano L2200 1.6GHz : 8393 kPixels/s
Intel Atom 240 (HT, 1.86GHz) : 7393 kPixels/s
Intel Atom N270 (HT, 1.6GHz) : 6336 kPixels/s
ntel Atom 240 (ohne HT, 1.86GHz) : ???? kPixels/s
Intel Atom N270 (ohne HT, 1.6GHz) : ???? kPixels/s


http://www.netbooknews.de/2274/benchmark-race-samsung-nc20-vs-eee-pc-1000h/#comment-6808


I personally think 3DMark scores reflects graphics performance more than the CPU performance. I remember Spit had some Crystal Mark tests for NC20, and the result is slightly better than the Atom with the same clock speed.

 

Laptop Mag just did a a nice full-scale review. You should check it out. they gave it 4/5.

 

LOL

I also don't like HP notebooks although I'm typing this on my dv4t!
It seems like HP just makes notebooks without really caring about heat and fan noise!!!!!!!!!!!

I wouldn't search for a netbook if they made my dv4t cool and quiet!
I can't type on this one for a long period of time.

 

Yes it actually seems like as of recent all HP models are having heat/noise problems i wonder what thats all about?

 

I'm not sure what happened to Newegg or Samsung.
Laptop Magazine reported that Samsung would release the nc20 on Newegg on March 16, which was yesterday. Disappointing...

 

i dont see why not with an extended battery option.

 

The Samsung NC20 is coming to the US via Newegg.com the first week in April. the price will be $549, and will only be availabel in black. It will have the 6 cell 5900 amp battery, which was not included in the European version.

If you have an NC20 have you upgraded to 2 GB of RAM yet. At least one owner who upgraded noticed a big difference because the Nano automatically upgraded the dedicated video memory. It would be great if someone would compare the NC10 and NC20 when both have been upgraded to 2 MG of RAM. My hunch is you will see bigger differences favoring the NC20.

Pugrider

 

Wow... how did you get the information? I tried to find information about the release date and the price, but I couldn't find anything except Laptop Magazine's report, which has been proven wrong...

The price is somewhat disappointing... I expected it would be over $500, but it is, I think, a little bit high. Currently, the NC10 is somewhere between $ 439 and 450. That means the NC20 is about $100 more expensive... Even if the NC20 has a bigger screen and a higher resolution and performs a little bit better, a $100 increase is a bit high..

 

I found the information on the Laptop magazine web site:

http://blog.laptopmag.com/samsung-n...d-to-early-april/comment-page-1#comment-18763

This is consistent with what I heard from Samsung when I did a web chat with one of their reps.

Pugrider

 

Also, keep in mind that the Samsung NC10 Special Edition was listed at $499 preorder on Amazon and dropped to $469 before it even shipped. The NC20 in the US will have the high capacity battery for the same price as it is in the UK without it, so the price isn't too bad. If it stays at $549 it will be the same price as the Dell 12". I am hoping for a price drop before the actual release!

pugrider

 

FYI, I am basing the 2 GB RAM idea on a post from an NC20 user in the UK:

"The NC20 is quicker than the NC10, but it is not a revolution in performance by any means, more of an evolution. I don't have any benchmark results to quantify my findings but having used the NC20 for just over a week now, I am confident it is a little quicker.

Generally, Firefox seems to run quite a bit faster on the NC20 and MS Office seems to run faster too. Windows XP in general is a little bit snappier. Also, I have noticed that the graphics chip assigns 256MB graphics RAM once it detects 2GB of system RAM. 128MB is assigned with the stock 1GB RAM. Once I upgraded to 2GB RAM, I did notice that Google Earth ran a bit smoother.

RE: battery life... I have managed to get between 4 to 5 hours out of the NC20 with normal use (web browsing, MS Office use) whereas the NC10 gets between 5 and 6 hours."

It may be that the NC10 does the same thing when the RAM is doubled, but I don't remember anyone reporting this.

Pugrider

 

A few comments based on my own tests of both the NC10 and the NC20.

1. The Via U2250 has similar performance to the Atom N270 in single-threaded tests but the Atom's hyperthreading can boost its performance in multi-threaded applications.

2. Increasing the NC20's RAM from 1GB to 2GB changed benchmark results as follows:

PCMark05: 1401 increased to 1455

3DMark05: 326 increased to 324

3DMark06: 132 stayed at 132

However, if a user is planning to have a significant number of applications open then more RAM is likely to make performance smoother.

John

 

Thanks, Pugrider. I should have checked the Laptop Magazine website

I hope to see some thorough reviews from users, especially about heat and fan noise. To me, those two things are as important as performance.
If some users complain about heat and fan noise or if there are some claims that the NC20 produces much more heat and fan noinse than the NC10, then I might go with the NC10...

John, instead of those benchmarks, how about just daily tasks? Is the NC20 much smoother than the NC10 for web browsing, Word processing, and so on? If you own one, could you give your opinion about heat and fan noise (and if possible, boot time) , compared to the NC10?

Thanks in advance!

 

The key strength of the NC20 is that it has the much larger screen. The performance difference relative to the NC10 is quite small and depends on what the user is doing.

The heat and fan noise are OK (it's rare for Samsung to include a noisy fan in one of their products) but the NC20 does consume more power under load than the NC10. The NC10 is smaller and more portable whereas the NC20 is an alternative to a normal 12.1" notebook for a user who doesn't need a powerful CPU or built-in optical drive. Whereas the NC10 (or other similar netbooks) are best used as a second computer, the NC20 could be the only computer.

John

 

I am also very interested about heat and - especially noise. I am working as instructor and therefore I need often read & learn different material, like PDF and e-Learning software.

My question is: Is NC20 so quiet (=silent!) that I could be using that as a PDF reader when my wife/kid is sleeping next to me?

While using PDF, CPU is consumed only like average 5-10%.

If I am using e-Learning software, they are quite often Flash based which means more CPU.

Most machines nowadays are suitable for home usage and they aren't distracting at all. But at night, when there aren't any other noises this might be a problem.

It would be great if somebody can get me info about this one. This isn't mentioned in any review...

 

Thank you! I'm not sure I really need the NC20 because I already have a laptop... This laptop gets really hot on the palmrest area, so I can't type for a long period of time. I just want a netbok that I can used to work with Word or just to browse the Internet. It seems... the NC10 is a better choice for me.

Thank you

 

My thoughts on the NC20 are now posted.

John

 

John, big thanks for a very thorough review. I appreciate your checking on the 1 vs 2 GB of RAM, especially the benchmark differences.

One question and one suggestion:

The question - you mention the possibility of upgrading to 4 GB of RAM, but I thought the slot provided maxed out at 2 GB. In other words, even if you added 4 GB of RAM it would only recognize 2.

The suggestion - if you don't already you should post sammynetbook.com:

http://www.sammynetbook.com/news.php

It is a great site dedicated to Samsung netbooks. I already posted a link to your review in their forum, and I am sure the readers would like to thank you in person!

Pugrider

 

That's an interesting question about the 4GB option. We'll know the answer for sure when someone tries a 4GB module in the single slot.

However, VIA's data on the VX800 chipset states:

John

 

Wasn't the nc20 supposed to be released in the US on March 16'th? Can't find it anywhere, what's with the delay?

 

it's here!!!!

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834131031&Tpk=samsung nc20

 

Can anyone tell me if the network card is upgradeable to 802.11n?

 

I'm sure it can be done. People have done the upgrade on the NC10. However, I would first want to satisfy myself that the upgrade would give benefits. In my case, g is still much faster than the router's uplink to the internet and performs fine around my house.

John

 

Sure it can. It's a standard mini pci express slot with 2 antennae leads. I put an intel wifi link 5100 in there myself. You have to take it most of the way apart to do this however. I upgraded mainly because I get better signal strength with the new card.

 

So where is the wifi card located? Is it under the keyboard? I just happen to have an extra intel 5100.

 

It's not under the keyboard (I've looked) and it's not under the HDD / RAM cover. So I think you need to get the whole of the bottom off.

Any advice from someone who has been inside?

John

 

The wifi card is on the underside of the unit. You can see it through the vents, slightly left of the touchpad area. The bottom casing definitely has to be removed to get to it. I installed an Intel 5300 and third antenna in my NC20 and it works well.

 

Yep, you do have to remove the bottom casing alright and you'll see it there. Just pull off the two antenna connectors gently to start. The card has one small screw holding it down so just undo that, tilt the card up to about 30 degrees and slide it out.

The 5300 is a great card. I ordered one of them, put it into my q210 and then put the 5100 from the 210 into the NC20 If you are getting the 5300 make sure to get one of them that comes with an an extra antenna so you can get the most out of the card.

If you are happy with the 2 antennae then the 5100 will do fine. You could also grab the 5300 and just hook up the 2 antennae too if there wasn't much of a price difference, it would at least give you an upgrade path if you wanted to add in the third later on.

One thing to note though: When I installed the 3rd antenna in my q210 I routed it up through the back of the screen so it was a few hours of fiddly work. If you want a quick upgrade replacing the card alone will be much quicker and easier.

 

Just happen to be looking on ebay and noticed that there are 9 cell batteries listed for the NC20. Does anyone know if these are legit? If so, the run time would probably be insane.

 

It's the same battery as the NC10. This site indicates that they are 3rd party batteries which this retailer promises a 1 year warranty.

John

 

When replacing the WiFi card, note that for some reason the Intel 4965 doesn't work on the NC20. (Or the NC10, for that matter.) Because the stock Atheros wouldn't talk to the routers at work (fine at home), I ordered an Intel 5300, which hopefully will arrive tomorrow. I'm just going to use the two stock antennas for now, as I only have a G router, and at work I'll be using 802.11a.

On the mod end of things, I dropped in one of the expensive but wonderful Intel 80GB SSDs. My NC20 hibernates/resumes at a very quick pace now.

I also have one of the 9-cell batteries on order from HAOBattery. Probably will have it in just over a week.

 

Well, some weeks ago, after deciding to ditch my initial lust for a Q210 after reviewing my requirements I decided, with the help of the views and comments of members of this forum, to plump for a NC20.

Impossible to get hold of a black one at the time but out of the blue last Thursday received an unexpected call from a company I'd enquired with (they'd suprisingly kept my details) and told that that they would take receipt of a small delivery so bought there and then. It will come tomorrow just in time for my extended trip to Thailand next Sunday. Result!!!

It's my first laptop so can anyone give me a few basic pointers on how to configure it or any do's and dont's?

Thanks in advance.