CPU Whining sound from a C2D machine?

This issue has been on my VGN-Z2 for a wee while.
This VGN-Z26 has the Intel Centrino 2 Duo P8600 (2.4GHz / core).
I didn't think much of it till today; have some spare time to on hand so thought I'd ask, just in case.

The description:

- Everytime the fan is about to speed up automatically, the CPU / fan makes a really high-pitched sound. The duration of the sound varies, anywhere between a second to 10 seconds. The sound is not there when the fan speeds down automatically.

- 'Automatically' above is in bold for a reason... I have set my S1 button as the fan speed toggle. If I use that to forcibly speed up the fan, the sound does not occur. In addition, if I press the S1 button while the fan is making its high-pitched sound right before a automatic speed up, the high-pitched sound stops immediately and the fan speeds up as it should.

- I can confirm that forcing the speed-up stops the high-pitched sound. I can toggle it to high-speed, and immediately back down to low-speed, where the fan will make the sound again preparing to go into high-speed automatically.

Has anyone experienced this issue? If so, anything I should be worried about? Any idea what is causing the sound?

Ain't too worried about it for now; it just gets annoying as it does this every 15 minutes or so, and I usually work in a quiet environment...

Below is a recording made using an IC recorder. That should clarify what I'm trying to say.
The first few seconds you hear the Z, and my rather loud clock ticking away in the background... Then I quietly get the Z to open up WMP and you can then hear the HDD, followed by the high-pitched sound (occurs twice), which then follows with the fan speeding up automatically.

One should note that this was done while the graphics was on Intel. nVidia has the same issue, the only difference being the fans are a bit louder.

Thanks in advance for all those who are able to help.

 

...bump...
Anyone with a VGN-Z with the above symptoms..?

 

Could it be a capacitor issue with power supply to the fan? I've known several capacitors to squeal on some video cards I've had in the past. It sounds almost identical, though a little more consistent.

 

Cheers for your response.
If the problem is indeed capacitors, then why is there no sound when I force the fan to enter high-speed mode from say silent mode?

I mean, it's pretty much the same except I'm toggling the fan to speed up whereas the sound occurs when the fan is set to automatically speed up.

 

No problem It could be like one of my old notebooks, and steadily build up fan speed from a very slow speed, to normal... that's what the sound file sounds like anyway. In that case, with capacitors still in mind, it could be that it only squeals under certain voltages, and as the voltage increases with fan speed it goes away? Maybe when you manually activate the fan with the S button, it's instantly supplying enough voltage to skip the beeping phase?

 

Ok. Cheers.
Finally...

Do you think this is worth sending in my machine into service for? My 2 year warranty is due to expire in 3 months. I wouldn't want the caps on the power assembly to just die; heck, 3 months ain't a lot of time and for all I care the caps could just give way in 4, giving me a load of misery...

Did your machine with the caps issue actually die from this (similar) incident? I mean, I've hit the holidays here so if I want to send my Z into repair, now's the time...

And another note; there are SOME instances when this high-pitched sound is not made. Example, when I'm playing a 1080p movie with the BALANCED fan profile; that will enter a high-speed mode without making a sound. Though that rarely happens.

I'd like to hear from anyone who owns the VGN-Z as well... This is turning out to be... interesting...

 

Well, TBH I've never had this issue with a notebook. Both instances I referred to were with desktop boards. But yes, they did die. Very quick death's, mind you. I'm not even SURE that this is your issue, but squealing noises can't usually be ignored. Even if it's a fan bearing going out, or a HDD spindle issue, it will still cause trouble in the end. Those are the only other things I know of that could be a possibility, but the timing is too erratic for either of those. I'm sorry if I worry you, but squealing noises have always ended badly for me.

 

Thanks. Well, this sound started back in November last year, so I think my Z would already be dead if it is something like what your desktops experienced.

And yes, the sound is rather erratic, and that fact that the high-pitched sounds are not there when I'm forcing a speed-up is kinda causing me to think it's something else.

Ah well. I'll drop by the service centre and let them take a listen to the sound (third time taking in my Z for warranty this year; gotta squeeze them dry with free services, thank goodness for 2 year warranties~~).

 

Amen! 10char

 

Oh. I should have mentioned this from the start; my Z just made another sound but in a way that I did not state above.

So, there is a 'fluctuation' of sorts in the high-pitched sound as if a fan is being slowed down somehow, as if its being forced to slow down. Then the actual fan (audibly) speeds up. This kind of sound, although high-pitched like before, is a wee bit more rare. So I guess that rules out capacitors for now.

 

Well, from that I'd say your fan motor bearing is going. That sound is really quite specific.

 

Ok. I've just tried playing a full hd movie from the BALANCED fan profile and the fan sped up without a sound. So I thought I'd stress the machine a bit from the slow fan speed and see if the fan would make a sound before speeding up.
Basically, the fan speeds up without a sound when I stress CPU or GPU; hmm...

Doing basic tasks like typing this post though, the fan makes a sound. That includes typing word documents, MSN etc etc. Doing anything intensive like watching a 1080p movie, the fan speeds up without a sound.

The problem with this issue is that I'll need to specify WHEN the problem is occuring. If Sony can't replicate the problem, I get charged an assesment fee (as in any other country I guess). That plus, the sound doesn't ALWAYS seem to occur as stated above, which does make this a rather difficult issue to explain to Sony, with the front desk personel not being the most tech-savvy of people.

(fan made the sound and sped-up 3x times while I was writing up this post, which took about 10 minutes)

 

Just a wee update, and a bump of sorts hoping for some other possible causes for this issue...

There are actually 5x fan speeds, with only 3x speeds being selectable under thermal management in VAIO CONTROL CENTRE. The speeds are:
- UBER-LOW (the near-silent one you get when idling on battery on STAMINA mode, with the POWER SAVER power plan, this speed is not selectable by user)
- LOW (the one you get while idling on AC with STAMINA, on BALANCED power plan)
- MID (while on AC, idling while on SPEED mode or light load on STAMINA mode)
- HIGH (heavy loading, any mode, any power plan, regardless of AC or battery)
- UBER-HIGH (extreme loading, like HIGH but more intensive, not selectable by user)

-------------------------------------

The fan speeds on the VGN-Z were manipulated with:
- A 13GB 1080p file being played back on WMP12
- Using the SPEED (nVidia card) mode while
- Using the BALANCED fan mode setting
- Using the HIGH PERFORMANCE power plan
- On AC power (battery detached)

UBER-LOW until reaching CPU temperatures of 40'C, where they kickup to LOW. If the CPU temperatures go below 36'C, the fans will slow down from LOW back down to UBER-LOW speeds.

Fan speeds enter MID stages when temperatures hit 55'C. Speeds decrease from MID to LOW from 55'C as well.

Fan speeds enter HIGH (a loud fan speed) if any one CPU hits 60'C. It decreases back down when it goes lower than 60'C.

Fan goes to UBER-HIGH speeds (loudest) if CPU hits and goes over 75'C. Decreases back down to HIGH at this temperature as well.

- Incase anyone's interested, the CPU temperatures peak at 73'C on the INTEL card playing the above 1080p file.
- Using the nVidia card, CPU peaked at 81'C and the nVidia core at 69'C, though there was a lot less video lag.
- PERFORMANCE and BALANCED fan speed settings don't really have a difference, except PERFORMANCE keeps the fan running at HIGH constantly and increases it to UBER-HIGH when required, whereas BALANCED depends on the temperature (of any piece of hardware on mobo), as the above test indicate.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

The thing is, my high-pitched issue exists only when the fan decides to go from UBER-LOW to LOW. It's not there when vice versa, and not there when going from any other speeds (and their relative vice versas). Sound occurs irrespective of being on AC power or battery power.

That plus, if I put my ear right next to the vents, I hear the exact yet constant high-pitched sound at any speed, just really really quiet and inaudible at typing distance.

And finally, for anyone not yet aware of this issue, the high-pitched sound occurs MOST of the time (not always), which does seem strange if I were to go with H.A.L.'s theory of capacitors starting to die. Well, its been making this sound for a good year or so, so I guess that's out of the question if it's supposed to be a quick death...

So yeah... Does anyone else have another possible explanation for the high-pitched sound (or does anyone else experience this issue as well)? Cheers in advance for anyone who's able to help~~

 

Hi 5ushiMonster,

I have a VGN-Z690, with a P9600 C2D.

I have yet to noticed the high pitch noice that you mentioned here.
from your description, my Z stays in uber-low to low settings majority of the time. Granted, I only use it for school work and some light 720p movie.

Have you applied undervolting to your Z yet? I find it concering that your processor would go as high as >75 C just by playing a 1080p movie. I used to use my Z as a desktop replacement, while hooking up to a 1900x1200 screen via DVI in SPEED mode, and I only hit around high 60s. A good undervolting can lower the max temperature of your processor by as much as 10 to 13 degrees.

Another possibility is that the whining sound also exsist for my Z, I just never notice it. I will try to find a quiet place/time to stress my machine tonight and report back later.

 

Hi, thanks for the help. Hopefully I'm not alone and this is just the sign of the Z aging (mine's nearing 2 years old now).

I should let you know that my hearing is on the good side (good enough to hear the difference between SACDs and CDs, or .mp3 and .flac files). I can even hear the circuitry in some phones when they are sending / transmitting signal... which does sound strange to most but hey~~

I haven't tried undervolting yet. I'm guessing you are getting your temperatures with an undervolted CPU. I use my Z as a desktop replacement as well (which explains why I'm saving up for some high-end mods, and why I'm a wee bit concerned at this issue).

The 1080p that I used for the test above is not very compressed. As such, it is extremely demanding on the hardware. I have another 1080p file which is compressed very nicely; you play that and my CPU temps peak at 54'C and my nVidia core at 60'C (the fan stays on MID when playing this file). So it pretty much comes down to what sort of 1080p you're playing back.

Anyways, hope to hear from you soon in regards to your laptop's sounds. You'll have to be in a quiet room; I write code at night in a near silent environment, and considering the sounds occur every 10 minutes or so, it does get annoying (and worrying) after a while.

 

Upon some more investigation...

I'm pretty sure there is just 1x fan in the VGN-Z? When on UBER-LOW, the fan is actually not spinning at all. I can confirm this by actually placing my ear right on the underside of the chassis. The fan is heard spinning on LOW, listening in the same manner. Another test would be get a small piece of paper and place it near the vents. The paper doesn't move on UBER-LOW, and blows away on everything else.

I'm guessing what I'm hearing (and hopefully other VGN-Z owners too) on the UBER-LOW stage is the HDD spinning. So I'm assuming that having an SSD will quite literally make a VGN-Z silent...

Anyways, upon placing my ear on the chassis while on UBER-LOW, and giving my Z a slight stress to get the high-pitched sound, I can confirm that the sound is being made just before the fan is actually TURNED ON. Right after the sound the fan starts spinning (on LOW).

So I'm back at H.A.L.'s theory. The capacitors don't make the high-pitched sound WHILE the fan is moving and switching speeds. But when the fan is stopped and the Z tried powering it up, while the capacitors are being loaded with voltage the sound occurs.
So yeah... Though I'm not seeing the 'quick' death that the issue is supposed to bring about (I too know that capacitors, once they start showing issues, die quickly).

 

I think you are hearing the c-state switching. Common phenomenon with modern processors. You could try disabling c stated but it will have a significant impact on battery life and low-load temps.

 

to disable the c-states, you can set your power manager not to enter idle mode. the instruction was pretty simple by adding sth in the registry.

 

I did assume that this may have something to do with the power plans (with the fan being turned off and all). But the worry I have is this 'sound' was not there before. Certainly not during the first 8 months or so I had my Z for at least.

Which is why I'm rather transfixed to this being a capacitor's dielectrics crapping out (and exploding in the laptop...) or the bearings on the fan getting more and more worn.

But yeah. If I prevent the Z from idling (ie, run a light encoder in the background for example), the fan never switches off and the high-pitched sound doesn't eventuate. The bad side to that is, as mentioned by beaups, is the battery life. Considering I use my Z on the move alot, that's out of the question.

By the way, I'm referring to the VGN-Z not the VPC-Z; you mentioned 'modern' processors though I'm aware of only the i series CPUs having the sound issue, minus my Centrino 2 Duo here...

 

I'm back, and I'm finally able to find some quality time to test out your theory in the library during my EMS shift tonight.

I should note that I've had my Z for about a year and half. To stress out my laptop, I ran Orthos in Blend mode for stressing both CPU & Ram.

No, I can confirm that it is not c-state switching, I can observe my processor go from 6.0x (idle) to 10.0x before hearing the high pitch whining sound. It is an excellent guess though. To be honest with you, that's my first guess before I ran some tests on my Z.

I am finally able to find some time off tonight in the library, so I decided to give it a try. I should say that I also consider myself with above average hearing. As you stated, I can also distinguish the differences between a MP3 and flac file. I wouldn't place myself into the elusive category of audiophiles, but I have spend my great deal of money (investment rather) on audio equipments. The high pitch whining sound is QUIET, like almost-not-there-but-oh-it's-so-there quiet. Thinking back, I've probably heard it before, but it has never caught my attention.

I agree 100% with you that the sound is coming from the HDD. I came up with this speculation after I ran Orthos 10+ times, while waiting for the fan to spin down to LOW between each tests. I can confirm that the high pitch whining sound lasts around 1 to 3 seconds for me, and it stops before the fan fully spins up to the next higher level, and after the CPU stepping has maxed at 10x (it may be 8x or 9x in your case due to max CPU frequency).

My reasoning for this speculation is that the high pitch whining sound coming from my Z is never constant. It is always consisted of continuous short intervals of whining sound if you know what I mean (it's like a sin wave with an extremely short period). That leads me to believe that the noise is coming from the HDD spinning up to buff the initial portions of the file. It is also reassuring to see that you've came to the same conclusion as me.

Of course, I may be totally wrong here, but I hope it'll go away when I upgrade to a SSD later...

On another note, you really should search the forum on undervolting, and read the science behind it. Just like you, I was also skeptic about doing it, and was afraid of the adverse performance and stability that may be associated with it. However, it has NO effect on performance whatsoever, and if done correctly, it does NOT effect your stability in any way. It is VERY easy to find the right settings for your machine, it took me an hour and half max, and an hour of that was spent on stressing the CPU with Orthos. As you can see, I get great temperature results from undervolting, even when I raised the voltage level by 2 intervals after finding the correct voltage level. As I said before, I used to use my Z as my desktop replacement while connecting to a 1900x1200 monitor, and I'm happy to report that I had zero stability or performance issues with it, other than seeing a marginal decrease in temperature, and a slight increase in battery life when removed from the docking station.

Sorry if the last paragraph on undervolting sounded like an scam.... but it really is as good as it sounds... Every processor is slightly different on the atomic level from each other, but they all have the same voltage to ensure stability for majority of the processors on a statistically significant level. You really own yourself not undervolting your processor. It kills me to think that you don't want to undervolt because of the fear of lower stability.

 

Just remember c states and p states are two different animals. Just because your CPU is running at 6x or 10x (different p states) doesn't meant c states aren't bouncing in and out rapidly. Of course you could be hearing the hard drive still, but don't rule out c states. Why not temporarily disable cstates to rule that out?

 

Let me re-write my current findings now to make sure there are no misunderstandings.

There is a stage on the Z is when the fan is not spinning at all. At this stage, you hear the HDD and nothing else; the sounds the HDD makes comes through the vents, making it 'sound' like the fan.

1. The high-pitched sound is NOT coming from the HDD for me. Like I said, I place my Z into the NO-FAN-STATE and quite literally place my ear on the chassis (holding it up) to confirm the fan motor is NOT spinning.

2. Then I open up, say, WMP, to give the CPU a load to get the fan to start running.

3. I can hear from the motherboard somewhere, close to where the CPU fan is, the high pitched sound just before the fan is turned on. The sound occurs and the fan starts running immediately after.

4. I can confirm that the high-pitched sound for me only occurs when the fan is moving from the NO-FAN-STATE to the LOW stage ONLY. That means the HDD is not making the high-pitched sound.

Due to point 4 above, I too am forced to assume that this may not be due to C and P state changes either. It doesn't make the sounds from say MID to HIGH fan speed transition. In addition, there is a rare occurance every now and then when the high-pitched sound just never eventuates.

Thanks Jparity for the help and in-depth explanation. I'll definitely consider undervolting now, though you had me at better battery life ^_^

Anyways, my apologies about my wording and paragraph structure, which could have caused some confusion. Darn English exam study from 3 years ago took a toll on my writing style...

EDIT
I just made another recording of the issue. See below.
Basically, this time I bring the Z out of sleep. The Z starts up with the fan NOT spinning. You hear the HDD seeking / the motor spinning as I log in via finger print. Keep listening and you hear the high-pitched sounds 2x times before the fan turns on.
Ignore my large wall clock ticking away there, and any sound from 32 seconds onwards; that's my neighbour pulling into his driveway...