Defective Nvidia chipsets in your current Vaio?

no sorry my comments were intended for SZ, not FZ.

If it would be possible it would be good to downclock the Nvidia GPU on FZ though. Don't know if it's possible. Anything to keep the temperature as low as possible will reduce the likelyhood of failure.

 

i have been monitoring the gpu for the last while, using the laptop , the highest temp i have seen is 62 deg Celcius, even while watching video online...

is the chip in my laptop definately going to fail? like are all the chips doomed to failure? why are sony so slow in recognising the problem?

it looks like my chip at 62c isnt running too hot....

are there any signs to watch out for impending failure?

thanks folks for all the help and info!

 

Well, it really depends on what you do with your chip that determines if it will fail or not. My chip just failed a couple of days ago, and so far I think this forum has had about 3 reported cases (including mine). I posted some pictures back on page 24 of this forum if you want to have a look (if your computer starts looking like that, then you know you have a problem).

I'm out of my one year warranty with Sony so I have been reluctant to send in my laptop (FZ180) to get it serviced because it would cost me something like $700. Last I checked, the best deal anyone has gotten is a half price fix, which to me is still not quite worth it because, well, I don't want to pay for a defected piece of equipment. In any case, nobody knows for sure what Sony is doing, but I've heard they have some people trying to stress their laptops to see if they fail or something, but Sony has been very mum about the whole issue. Hopefully they'll get with the program quickly before more units fail.

I wouldn't exactly say your chip will fail for sure. After doing some research (mostly just reading everything on this forum), the chips fail because of drastic temperature changes. Basically, so long as you don't go from playing Crysis to sticking your computer in the freezer, you should be alright. In the last moments my computer was working, I had been playing a game with an episode of House playing in the background before my computer suddenly cut out on me, forcing me to shut it down (note, this is probably the whole temperature cycling thing nVidia is prone to). On the first reboot, it was still okay, but no more than five minutes later, it froze again. After that, the graphics card was simply dead. So yea, don't go from 0 to 60 (or vice versa) in 5 seconds.

And just as an update, I mentioned already that I am out of my warranty, but I was just informed that I still may be able to get the computer fixed for free because some credit cards have an extended warranty that adds a year onto an purchase you make solely with that credit card. Just a note if any of you are out of warranty and having trouble haggling with Sony, check with your credit card company and see if they offer an extended warranty thing.

 

i had exactly the same problem with my FE

i know no one has reported anything yet.. and im probably the only one who's saying this.. but i wish sony would be more caring about their customers

 

No. No.

By the way 62 does not seem to be bad.

 

i rang sony support today to see what their response was:

i was told this

advised there is no need for the statement as the issue is connected only to certain manufacturers as stated by Nvidia , and these are not working with Sony anyway

 

So why did 3 or 4 FZs fail?
Magic?

Somebody is trying to talk his way out of trouble...

I wonder if its NVidia or Sony...

 

has it been confirmed that these 3/4 FZ's have failed due to the nvidia faulty cards? im sure there are lots of FZ's out there, you would expect some failures,

 

Well its definitely their graphics cards that have failed.
Some people speculated that the heat management in Sony laptops is better, thus prolonging the time until this problem appears.

Also, it depends on you type of usage.

If most FZs run on the same GPU temperature for long periods of time they would last longer...

 

Hi Seridica,

Unfortunatelly I only can escalate issues of Europeans models.
I'm also keeping an eye in Mikper83 case.

 

i have this chip in my laptop im based in Ireland, how do i check the manufacture date of my laptop?

i rang sony and they say there is no problem!

where do i go from here... i have REV: A2 of the 8400GT card in my sony vaio.

what now?? any advice?

 

If your are not a "gamer" but just a casual user, don't bother.
Maybe leave your laptop running (idling) instead of switching it off
for 10 minutes.
Else, nothing to do but wait...

 

How do you know if you have a defective chipset?

Just to report, I have a Sony Vaio FZ with Nvidia 8600M GS installed and it's been functioning horribly since about a month ago. I purchased it in January. I've narrowed it down to some sort of hardware problem but I can't say for sure where the issue is.

Problems:

- Random BSODs even after deleting the partitions and reinstalling Vista.
- Sometimes the login screen and desktop would have weird green lines and pixellated dots scattered on the screen.
- When the desktop loads without a BSOD after a few seconds all services stop, programs crash and another BSOD will come up. Every time.
- It got very hot sometimes just from web browsing.

Does this sound like a defective chipset or some other hardware issue like the motherboard connections breaking?

 

Weird green lines?
Sounds like a failed NVidia to me...
If you look at I think the previous page, one member relinked to pictures of a failed laptop.

 

Unfortunately those pictures only appear as red x's for me, when I get home to use my laptop I'll check again.

Another issue I remember is whenever I used something that used more processor power it would cause a BSOD to come up. Reinstalling Vista only works for a little bit but then the BSODs come back.

And one time my desktop loaded strangely, the display was sort of warped.

 

Have you tried a clean install? Just to exclude the possibility of a software/driver issue.

Otherwise you should go for a warranty replacement/repair.

 

Take some pictures and post them on the forum Blue_Wolf. The more data we get the better (the previous page has some relinked pictures that I took of my own laptop with I'm guessing similar green lines when booting).

 

Hello Blue_Wolf,

Contact VAIO-Link asap. Seems to be graphics card problem to me too.
Explain to them that you already restored to factory settings and the problem is keep coming up.
Don't forget to take some pictures of the laptop failing. It will help the VAIO support to find the problem faster.

 

They refuse. I'm opening an inquiry with my state attorney general about the issue since Sony won't. It has been terrible. One option you do have, at least in the US is purchasing an extended warranty after the fact, wait 30 days and then claim it. There is a 30 day waiting period so what happens is that people don't buy one after a failure and try to claim it (which you're doing).

My FZ-190 was returned this Friday but needless to say, Sony screwed it up. They must have forgotten to reconnect the DVD drive because it isn't recognized. What a surprise.

 

To posters who a worried that their chip might fail:

I don't know how hard others with the nVidia-problem have pushed their Vaios, but it took 9-10 months of playing Warcraft a solid 12h/day to make my chip fail. If you're just a casual gamer, you're probably safe.

(And no, I wasn't the one playing. My unemployed brother is to blame -_- )

 

i have a nvidia 9800gtx in my desktop but i have a ati card in my laptop. and i feel sorry for you guys having all these problems with your gpu's in the laptop's i would say contact the BBB and see what happends and if you got to file with the court's and see what you can get done. i just cant belive nvidia is not manning up to its problem and just secret about this in a way. so i hope you guys get it fixed and nvidia and all the other companies who used the 8600/8400GS/GT's man up and fix the problem. because if they dont then they will lose bussiness from its customer's because they just want to do nothing about a big problem.

in my eyes i would rather lose a little performace then deal with a bad gpu in my laptop thats for sure.

So i hope you all get your problems fixed just my 2 cents

 

Okay, so I mentioned earlier that some credit card companies have a benefit that extends your manufacturer's warranty for another year. I was about to get an extended warranty from Sony like itssweeney, but I first checked in with my credit card company and it turns out I have this nifty benefit. Of course, this is going to take a lot of paperwork and a lot of time...but already having an extended warranty is much better than having to pay $200 for Sony's. Will keep peoples posted.

 

This is why I've been putting off sending it back :/ Plus the actual transit could cause more hardware damage.

It might just come straight back if they decide to label the issue as me deliberately damaging the hardware. The warranty is so strict you have to have a really specific issue.

The pixellation and funny lines thing only happens occasionally when I boot so I don't know if I'll be able to get pictures. Or even if it is a GPU issue, but there's definetly a good chance it is. I'll still try and get some pictures though if it happens again.

Agreed.

I'm thinking of just taking mine to a laptop repair store instead of going through all the trouble of sending it back to Sony. You still have to pay for physical damage fixes from what I've heard.

 

Thanks for your support. I've already have a claim with my State Attorney General in motion and hope it will prove worthwhile. I'm not going to stop until all my options are exhausted. Has anyone talked to Consumer Advocacy groups or publications? I'm actually considering sending my story to The Consumerist Blog.

Two other things I learned through this experience with Sony:

1. They will not return the defective/replaced parts with the computer. I asked thinking it would be helpful with a later Nvidia claim, but no such luck.

2. For the 50% of $699 GPU/Motherboard replacement deal, Sony tech's will also clean your display and keyboard AT NO EXTRA COST! What a deal!

 

Do it. Anything to speed this **** up.

A bit tempting. My keyboard has crumbs all over it >_<

 

Hmm...
Just saw this in the online edition of the New York Times:
http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/09/18/nvidia-cuts-65-percent-of-its-workforce/?ref=technology

Should we be worried?
If the market continues as it does I wouldn't be surprised if NVidia defaulted on itself...

Any updates on the lawsuit or any statements by computer manufactureres?

 

My AR21S Sony Vaio has just failed , looking very similar to the pics shown here. The NVidia graphics card has failed out of warrenty !!

I'd post pictures on the vaio forums but i can't seem to reset my password ..

Can anyone help with this issue, or has had sony admit some responsibility?

Thanks

 

As far as I'm aware, nothing from Sony yet, else it would appear on this thread.

Contact Sony with it though.

Without people complainign they won't really aknoledge the problem if they can get away with it.

 

I had trouble resetting my password as well. Just send a mail to [email protected] with your serial number and they'll take care of it.

 

This is almost funny (if not for my FZ180E vid card dying!). I just posted below yesterday. I wouldn't have found out about this defect if I didn't start researching my problem.

Hello all. I was hoping to get some information for those of you who have experienced this, or know enough of the FZ180E system. Basically, my 8400 GT video card died. I can now only boot to windows with the standard VGA driver. If I use any Geforce drivers, the system just hangs. I get different kinds of graphic artifacts right at bootup, from the VAIO logo and into windows. One time, I got it to restore to a date that still had the Geforce drivers (system restore) but it froze as soon as I launched a 3D game.

My question is, will I be able to just replace the video card? Can it even be bought as a separate component? I'm pretty sure my warranty is expired since I bought the laptop more than a year ago (yes, disappointed that its already broken). Any options you guys might know about?

Thanks for your help.

Majleonj

 

Somebody mentioned this before - graphics cards are often/always soldered to the mainboard
-> replace mainboard.

Sony has as far as I know not yet aknoledged the defect.

You may contact them, they may repair it.

Also: Someone somewhere mentioned that some credit card companies add another year of warranty.
Then: Where do you live? (Country) Germany get 2 years, the UK only 1 year....

 

Yea, I mentioned that thing about credit cards. I'm in the United States, and I'm still getting through all the paperwork to see if it will actually get anywhere. As far as I know, the credit card companies here only add a year onto the warranty, which looks like it should be enough for most everybody anyways. Of course, going to the credit card companies will take time and paperwork and talking with the credit card companies, but it sure beats paying $700 for a new mobo.

Also, to majleonj, if you're in the United States, you can purchase an extended warranty from Sony if the credit card thing didn't work. You will have to wait an additional 3 days after the warranty purchase, but it's $200 again compared to the $700 you'd have to pay for a new mobo without warranty. I think someone mentioned that Sony fixed their laptop (another FZ, not sure which model) for half price, so you can bug Sony customer support like the rest of us and see what they say =D

Until this gets resolved though, I've already purchased an Acer (blasphemy!) and will wait this whole thing out.

 

Here are some pictures of my defective AR21S
on boot I get lines all over the screen. then seconds later a blue screen.. and reboot

 

Ah yes, the green lines of "oh no nVidia died and Sony won't fix it!"

 

Well, card on my FZ190E has begun failing

01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: nVidia Corporation G86M [GeForce 8400M GT] (rev a1) (prog-if 00 [VGA controller])
Subsystem: Sony Corporation Unknown device 9005
Control: I/O+ Mem+ BusMaster+ SpecCycle- MemWINV- VGASnoop- ParErr- Stepping- SERR+ FastB2B-
Status: Cap+ 66MHz- UDF- FastB2B- ParErr- DEVSEL=fast >TAbort- <TAbort- <MAbort- >SERR- <PERR-
Latency: 0
Interrupt: pin A routed to IRQ 16
Region 0: Memory at ce000000 (32-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=16M]
Region 1: Memory at d0000000 (64-bit, prefetchable) [size=256M]
Region 3: Memory at cc000000 (64-bit, non-prefetchable) [size=32M]
Region 5: I/O ports at 2000
Capabilities: [60] Power Management version 2
Flags: PMEClk- DSI- D1- D2- AuxCurrent=0mA PME(D0-,D1-,D2-,D3hot-,D3cold-)
Status: D0 PME-Enable- DSel=0 DScale=0 PME-
Capabilities: [68] Message Signalled Interrupts: Mask- 64bit+ Queue=0/0 Enable-
Address: 0000000000000000 Data: 0000
Capabilities: [78] Express Endpoint IRQ 0
Device: Supported: MaxPayload 128 bytes, PhantFunc 0, ExtTag+
Device: Latency L0s <512ns, L1 <4us
Device: AtnBtn- AtnInd- PwrInd-
Device: Errors: Correctable- Non-Fatal- Fatal- Unsupported-
Device: RlxdOrd+ ExtTag- PhantFunc- AuxPwr- NoSnoop+
Device: MaxPayload 128 bytes, MaxReadReq 512 bytes
Link: Supported Speed 2.5Gb/s, Width x16, ASPM L0s L1, Port 0
Link: Latency L0s <512ns, L1 <4us
Link: ASPM L0s L1 Enabled RCB 128 bytes CommClk+ ExtSynch-
Link: Speed 2.5Gb/s, Width x16

vbios version: 60.86.3b.00.15
graphical glitches on most boots (occasionally it is fine for a little while) including bios so its definitely hardware

had it for a year and a couple months so its out of warranty. They would probably complain about me using linux anyway (although im using official nvidia linux drivers)


glitches are viisually similar to the glitches posted above. the 'vaio' logo on boot is almost fuzzy looking


any suggestions (other than putting back vista crapfest back on before i send it back, lol)

 

Here's an email exchange I had with Sony eSupport:


Original Message Follows:
------------------------
Email Address: majleonj
Privacy Flag : No
Name :
Street :
Zip :
Phone :
Product Group: Sony
O/S : Microsoft® Windows Vista® Home Premium
Model : VGN-FZ180E
Question : Follow up on my previous communication. I did receive info on your repair process. However, I now know that the 8400 GT GPU in my VAIO is part of the line of chips that NVIDIA declared defective. Please let me know how you will support us VAIO owners.



(Majleonj),

Thank you for contacting Sony Support.

I'm sorry that the previous response didn't directly resolve the issue. Your VAIO Notebook video display adapter and video RAM chipset, as with most Notebook or Laptop Systems, is integrated with the motherboard and cannot be upgraded internally. If you desire a hardware option to enhance these components, we recommend you check with your favorite computer retailer for available options. I suggest that you send the Computer to replace the Video card to our USA service center, as given in the previous response.

IMPORTANT: Sony does not address any comments published on, or quoted from a non-Sony website. We wish to assure you that Sony products do enjoy an excellent reputation for reliability. Sony has not released any official announcement acknowledging any failure issues about the Video cards. These products are not known by Sony to be defective in any way and we are not aware of any issue. Sony does not address any comments published on, or quoted from, a non-Sony website.

Thank you for choosing Sony.

The Sony Email Response Team
C6H6
David


Anyway, I contacted the Sony rep at the store I bought my VAIO from and he said we can go ahead and send it out for a diagnosis and estimate. His response to the Nvidia issue is pretty much the same as the above. Can't really blame him, I suppose their responses are heavily controlled from the top of the Sony management empire.

 

Party lines...

I suppose in a way it poses a large problem if they did aknoledge the problem... (costs)
But maybe they should rather than sit it out.

Anyway, I wish you good luck!

 

Just sent Sony this reply (see my previous post):

David/Sony,

Thanks for the reply. I know issues like this are huge and very sensitive. I understand that the people who will decide this rest atop Sony's management chain. I don't believe I have much of a choice right now but to cough up the money for the repair. I know for a fact that a high visibility issue such as this Nvidia "cover-up" and "defective bonding materials" would be at the top of Sony's (or any other organization utilizing Nvidia cards) concern right now and is being discussed at the highest levels of the company. Acknowledging it is another matter of course.

I just want to provide some feedback to you all (Sony) in the event that your upper level management asks for your input with regards to these matters. I have been a Sony brand faithful for more than 25 years, from our first TVs to our current computers, PS2, PSP, PS3, Digital Living System, cameras, etc. I've always believed that Sony always does right by its customers. I'm hoping it will be the case in this matter and that they don't leave their loyal customers hanging with a defective product. Maybe in time when you have confirmed the problems, we will get some type of reimbursement for this Nvidia defect. I became an even bigger Sony fan when Microsoft pulled its infamous denial that there was nothing wrong with their Xbox 360s even though their customers have gone through repairs after repairs. It made me feel proud that we chose the PS3 over the Xbox 360. I told myself and others that Sony would never pull something like that to its loyal customers. Its just too damaging to their reputation. I honestly hope Sony does not do the same thing in this matter. Its the biggest disappointment a faithful customer can ever experience when the people they've trusted all these years abandon them just to avoid losing money. I understand this could mean a whole lot of money lost once the defect is acknowledged, but I hope Sony will place themselves in our shoes and realize, we spent a significant amount of money on these products, too... $2000 in my case, and for it to just die after a little over a year is heartbreaking. I ask that you please forward this feedback to the right people, and maybe it will make a difference. Don't let them take Sony down to Microsoft's level!

Very respectfully,
(majleonj)

 

Since experiencing this problem myself (see above post) I have been reading up on various sites, including Sony Vaio's own forums. It seems an alarming amount of people are now starting to experience problems with the GPU's between 1-2 years old (a lot don't know about the publicised Nvidia issue's)
If this is an inherant problem of the GPU, it would be Nvidia eventually footing the repair costs, so I can't see why Sony can not take responsiblity for this.

This obviously needs addressing and maybe the increasing number of people logging jobs may help. The problem being people accepting the warrenty has run out and purchasing new, and not following this through..

 

A very strong text.
Let's hope they'll help you.

Good luck, all teh best!

 

I thought nVidia was paying about $200million for expected repair costs for their defective products... Wasn't that what the lawsuit was all about a month or two ago?

 

In a way I think yes, but then:
Has the verdict been reached??
Also: That lawsuit was in the US, it may not necessarily be valid for all regions of the world.

 

I bought a Vaio FZ21M back in February 2008. Just discovered this problem...

Any advice going forward would be much appreciated.


Do you think it's worth getting Sony's 2-year warranty extension? I can get this for under £100, which would extend my warranty to February 2011. If my Vaio fails within that period and I can get it repaired/replaced at no cost, that would be great. If it fails outside that period, then I'm even worse off. It's a gamble, but how big a gamble?


Alternatively, I could just cut my losses and purchase another laptop (perhaps a Dell) when my Vaio fails. Obviously I'd rather not meet this additional expense, but it may make better sense?

 

Well, I think it may be definitely woth it to buy the additional warranty.

Most FZ have failed shortly after 1 year.

Also, after 2 years you will possibly be able to buy a replacement, simnilar specs at a much lower price.
(Although it shouldn't be like this, you shouldn't be forced to replace your laptop)

 

Yeah, its really not a good feeling having to spend more for something that cost this much and not live up to expectations. It should be Sony and Nividia that are eating costs on this issue. Personally, I don't think I would spend anymore on my FZ. I think pressure from their customers will break Sony sooner or later. Nvidia already admitted there's a problem and once the specific models (computers and video cards) affected are released neither of them will have a choice but to make reparations to their customers. There is a lawsuit afterall. Then again I wonder how long it will take. Wasn't there a class action suit against Microsoft because of the XBox 360 failures, too? I think that's still unresolved.

Majleonj

 

Well, I don't quite think Sony should cover the costst for the repair.
But NVidia should.

I think I once saw an article somewhere that when software is concerned a lot of products are faulty and you've got no real way to complain.
If the wheels on your car come off you go back to your manufacturer, want it repaired, or even compemnsation if their fault caused damage to you.
With software, you buy a product, it crashes, ceases to work and that's it - the manufacturer will acept no liability.

 

In an ideal world, yeah, Nvidia should have to cover all costs. I guess it would all depend on what the contract between them say. In the end, Sony suffers "costs" in the form of lost customers and other indirect effects. Afterall, the average VAIO owner would be blaming them first, not some GPU manufacturer whose product is actually to blame inside his/her VAIO. Half the people I know who owns laptops have no idea what a Geforce or a Radeon is. They just want to get that spreadsheet working, and if the laptops crashes... **** Sony! Some can also argue that Sony has some responsibility in the end product --testing, quality control, etc, right? If I were Sony and the other PC makers, I'd be suing Nvidia till they bleed dry especially if they don't face the music head on real soon. They're delaying tactics are hurting everyone: consumers, pc makers, suppliers-- since no one knows the extent of the problem and everyone's getting blamed while a lot of consumers are having to pay since they haven't disclosed exactly where these defective chips went (is my VAIO affected? etc).

 

I've been on the phone with sony all day. they are refusing to compromise one bit. The inside number for a national customer support higher level people is 1-800-430-4433. The guy I have been talking to is named Bob. He's also an idiot. He won't let me talk to his boss. If anyone knows inside phone #'s for anyone else at sony please let me know.

Im going to keep it up until he stops spouting bull**** and uses his brain

by the end of the conversation I think my comments were starting to get to him


If enough people do it sony or his boss might take notice and do the right thing

 

Really feel sorry for those of you who had problems with your graphics chip. Hopefully, you'll all get your issues resolved.

 

As I have investigated this topic, mostly FZ and AR VAIO series had nvidia issue?

What about SZ?