Design fault with hinge on VPCZ1 ?

Yesterday the left hinge of my custom VPCZ1 (nearly £3000) started making a click when opening/closing the lid, the click would occur when the lid is at around 90 degree from the base.

Came here on notebookreview.com to check for similar experiences and indeed it seems quite a few people have experienced that and have resorted to opening their cases/lids to tighten up some screws.

In addition to the click I suffer as well:
- Fatigue on at least half of the width of the part that connects the lid to the hinge. I'm saying this because the black plastic is now white-ish and I suspect that over time it will just snap.
- More pronounced near the left hinge than the right, whenever I open/close the lid I see a large amount of flex on the display and it gets distorted because of it (like as if you're pressing a finger on the screen), this has been happening from day one and I believe since the click occurred there is more of it.

I'm going to call Sony later today to get them to repair this as this laptop is still under 2 years warranty and I wanted to purchase a warranty extension seeing how well this laptop performs.

What's concerning me is having owned the previous Vaio Z where it, too, had a design fault with the display which would touch the palmrest and get scratched and clouding happening on the display due to too much lid flex.
The new Vaio Z doesn't exhibit any of these features which means Sony has managed to fix these unrecognized design faults but I'm saddened that a super-premium laptop wouldn't be designed and built so that something as basic as the hinge doesn't fail after the first year.

In the meantime I'd like to do a quick survey to check the extent of the problem with VCZ1 users.
Questions are :
- How long have you owned your VPCZ1
- Is it custom built ?
- Does the screen exhibit distortions near the hinge when you open/close the lid
- Do you see any kind of fatigue on the two black bars connecting the display to the hinge ?
- Do you hear the click, if yes on which hinge (left/right)
- Have you fixed the problem, if yes how ? (by Sony or yourself)

Many thanks for the feedback!



At present, this is where I stand :
- 10 months old VPCZ1
- Yes, custom built
- Yes on both left and right hinge, much more pronounced on left hinge and seem to getting worse
- Yes on both plastic connectors, half of the width looking from the top is white-ish
- Yes on the left hinge, only a single click when opening the lid
- Called Sony which will collect the laptop by courier for repair (pending)


###UPDATE 1 (21-02)###
Called Sony UK and they will collect my laptop for repair.
I wasn't too pleased that Sony support first implied that the repair wouldn't be done under warranty as apparently a hinge that is failing within the first year is normal.


###UPDATE 2 (22-02)###
Second call to Sony UK again after they forgot to confirm a pickup date by courier. And it's all set up now.
I was told again that a lid that is failing will be considered as accidental damage by Sony.
I asked then the agent how would she know that not even having diagnosed the laptop and she said she was setting my expectations because it's Sony's policy to consider lids failing as accidental (read user induced) damage. I then mentioned my rights as a UK consumer and she understood where I was coming from and raised a complaint on my behalf to Sony's UK head office.
I will put a not containing a full list of the symptoms the laptop is having:
- Single click noise on left hinge when opening/closing
- More and more distortions on screen near left hinge when opening/closing
- Black tabs connecting display to hinge show some stress
- Lid feeling generally not as stiff as it used to be just a few weeks ago
- Laptop randomly no longer going to sleep after closing it when it used to work for the first 10 months


###UDPATE 3 (23-02)###
Courier didn't come to pickup the laptop even though they said they would (got email proof of that).
Called Sony and was told I would have to pay upfront £49+VAT because a failing lid is by default (not sure if it's for all models the case) considered an out-of-warranty repair by Sony (!!).
I was told a slightly different process where I'd have to pay £49+VAT only after a Sony technician had a look and if I was time wasting Sony support by refusing to pay for the repair Sony would have deemed as out-of-warranty.
I have now paid the fee and requested the laptop to be picked up on 25-02.
I have asked another note to be added to my case to complain about the fact that Sony would consider lids failing to operate correctly as out-of-warranty by default.


###UDPATE 4 (23-02)###
Courier delivered laptop today, only parts of the hinge got repaired, not lid didn't get replaced (the black connectors still show the signs of stress).
Repair notes :
- Replaced tape 5/18, 2 places (TCN V10E057 processed).



So it seems they only did the minimum which means I am left wondering when this will happen again and hopping the lid won't fall off.
Time to reflect on all this...

 

- Just under a year
- Yes
- Yes
- No - still black
- Yes - loud click on right hinge
- Did ask Sony to repair it when they were fixing something else, but they didn't fix it.

 

8 Month
No
No
No
It _did_ click
Sent it to sony, they replaced the whole display assembly (LCD included) since then it is OK.

 

7 months
yes, its a cto
yes, a little bit near the left hinge on the bottom edge of the screen
no fatigue on the plastic parts at all
no clicking at all (screws are covered by black thin foam sheets so they cannot unscrew)
I would recommend to fix on your own with a drop of loctite, its not a big deal and you get rid of the issue for all times.

 

pyr0 :
I would consider fixing it myself if it was out of warranty but this is within the first year for a laptop costing much more than everything else on the marketplace at the time.
I will see what Sony says...

 

I've fixed mine twice. It's really quite trivial. I tried calling Sony the first time and spoke to a few people. They told me they considered it "accidental" damage and not covered under warranty.

 

That's what I was told, too.
Interestingly the person on the phone asked me if the click was coming from the right side, which implies Sony has been having a fair amount of returns/queries because of it.
The thing that worry me the most is the fatigue shown on both lid to hinge connectors, to me that implies some kind of stress, and a lid that is going to break after only 10 months is not what I would consider accidental damage.
Let's see what Sony says, they haven't contacted me back as promised to set up a courier pickup.

I have quickly done some research on various resources highlighting UK consumers rights and I don't think Sony can reasonably claim that accidental damage would apply to one of the basic capabilities of a laptop (opening/closing lid). Consumer Direct has a section on quality and depending on price of the item (premium in this case), and average expected life expectancy of this kind of product (laptop, several years), then a consumer should be in its right to request that the manufacturer repairs a product if said product has never been misused in any way.

I had too a problem with a lid on an Asus a few years ago and they didn't quibble and repair it under warranty.
So why wouldn't Sony on a product that cost over twice the price !?

 

No extra quality is necessarily included in the price! You paid twice as you bought switchable graphics, light body, high resolution display, ssd, etc. etc. and not for extra strength in the hinges!

I'm not saying that this accident is right or that sony is reacting reasonably. Just that the premium price you paid was for everything else (even if you don't realize or need it), but not for extra service or extra quality.
Such a problem and reaction from sony is NOT ok to the same extend even for Vaios under 500 euros. Their owners are entitled to be just as dissatisfied as you are, no matter that they did not want to pay extra for a finger-print sensor as you did...

I have given this example a few times already: You can't expect Audi A8 to break less, just because it costs twice as much as A4...

Hope Sony will realize that the best they can do now is be friendly and solve your problem ASAP and apologize! Let us know!

 

If mine screen does break, then either AMEX will pay for it in the first 2 years or my insurance company will. My insurance company won't pay for normal failures but since it's "accidental", they'll cover it.

 

Based solely on my own experiences with a variety of Sony products, they generally give me the impression, when it comes to needing service (especially free repair/service as covered by the product warranty) from them, that they try very hard to shirk responsibility whenever possible. I've had a few instances of needing repair services from them. Those times I needed service from them when the product is still under warranty, they tried to shift blame to others saying things such as "this is broken by you thru abnormally rough usage" & so on. However, interestingly enough, when I send my out of warranty broken products to them, those money s***ers seem to be very happy to accept them. Maybe it is because they get to make "a killing" on the repair & service fees.

My own conclusion is that yes, Sony makes a lot of amazing products. However, after you've bought a Sony product, you can only pray & hope that it will not break down because you'll only get more grieve & frustration when you send the broken product to them for repair/service. The thing with Sony products is generally to enjoy them while they last.

 

No problems here, but I've used my Z1 very lightly and not frequently.

- How long have you owned your VPCZ1: 6~ months
- Is it custom built ? No, VPCZ122GX/B.
- Does the screen exhibit distortions near the hinge when you open/close the lid? Yes.
- Do you see any kind of fatigue on the two black bars connecting the display to the hinge ? No.
- Do you hear the click, if yes on which hinge (left/right)? No.
- Have you fixed the problem, if yes how ? (by Sony or yourself): N/A

 

Fair enough, but there are laws in the UK, and Europeans, protecting customers and there are things like :
- Fit for purpose : if a product doesn't function correctly for a day to day task it's meant to perform then it is reasonable to expect a repair free of charge (or nearly) from the manufacturer
- Satisfactory quality/Durability : a product should be expected to function roughly as long as other similar products on the marketplace. And one of the prime factors to this is price

Considering those simple two facts, I really don't think Sony have any ground in claiming that a lid failing within 10 months of a premium product as accidental damage! They just don't want to repair it for free because it cost them money.
If that's what they're trying to do I'd really want to hear about their definition of "accident"

 

Do you think your insurer will accept a basic function a product failing early as accidental ?
I'm not sure of the exact definition of accidental, for what I know it might vary by country and it might not even exist as such in others (in legal/insurance terms I mean).
To me accidental damage a single event that affects a product rendering it no longer fit for purpose.


Thinking about it, I don't think the single event stands actually.
for instance the case of accidental injury at work such as RSI. So I'm not sure now

 

What if I get accidental damage protection with my Z, would they fix the hinge for me no questions asked, or would they keep delaying it? Do I send it in or do they do in-home? I'm coming from HP which has by far the worst customer support when it comes to repairs, so I'm sure even Sony will be an improvement for me.

 

Of course they do not have any ground! I find even the attempt offending!

But this is exactly why I find UK laws regarding that subject hilarious and useless - they state nothing specific and leave room for speculations! Who is to say and determine how long " similar products last" and who is to define what a " similar product" or " satisfactory quality" is? Absolutely useless - no laws to protect customers out there! The customer is on his own in a fight against corporate evil!

The rest of the EU countries have very clear laws, such as:

1. A product (no matter if bought from a store or online!) can be returned without ANY explanation within 14 days of purchase
2. Warranty support for laptops is minimum 2 years
3. If the trading company is unable to resolve a certain problem within 3 repair attempts, the customer is entitled a new machine or refund.

etc., etc. - clear, specific and strict.

 

I had a sony z and the hinges failed, this is a common problem with Sony.
Nobody wants to admit that they have a quality issue, and that you are just paying for the name.

 

That's not true! This is a common problem with Sony Z only, not generally! There have been single reports for other models the same way as for all brands, but it is only typical for Z.

And no, even with the Z you are definitely not just paying for the name Have had enough of brands, where you "don't pay for the name". Thanks, never again.

 

thanks, I looked up the tesa and it looks like it's only available in Germany. I guess I can just use a few layers of tape. Also, I read in other threads that the loose hinge can be fixed by tightening the screws on the bottom of the LCD (hard to see until you remove the keyboard) if that's the case, then It's not a big issue IMO, not worth trying to get Sony to repair it when it's a 10 min job.

 

I don't own Z, but yes - many people report to be doing this themselves. Nevertheless, this is not ok and should be considered a serious quality issue! Most people buy a laptop to use it, not to fix and adjust it every few weeks.

 

- How long have you owned your VPCZ1: About 11 months, I think.
- Is it custom built: Nope.
- Does the screen exhibit distortions near the hinge when you open/close the lid: Yes, it does.
- Do you see any kind of fatigue on the two black bars connecting the display to the hinge: Yes, the corner/base of the right hinge is almost comletely white. I thought it was just grime...
- Do you hear the click, if yes on which hinge (left/right): Yes, on the right one.
- Have you fixed the problem, if yes how ? (by Sony or yourself): I'm planning on calling Sony when I know I won't be needing the Z1 for a few days...

 

Here is a picture of the display to hinge black plastic connector which appears to show some fatigue where it connects to the display.

 

Could you please post a picture of the base of the right hinge ?
I'm interested to see if it shows the same kind of fatigue as mines.
Thanks

 

I can confirm that tightening the two screws near the hinges solves this problem.

 

Yes, this is exactly the same problem that I have had twice with my right hinge - and ONLY the right hinge. The left hinge has never had a problem. The problem is that constantly tightening - and re-tightening - the screws can lead to the problem I encountered: stripping the threads in the lid. Each time, tightening the screws only last 3 months or so before things loosened up again.

Oh, and that loud clicking is VERY disconcerting to say the least!

 

yes.. i had the same issue and just tightened the screws fixed it..

 

The connector is itself quite thick so am sure it'd take a long time. It's hard to tell for instance if the stress is applied through the whole of it but considering how the pressure is made against it one would thing that it's the whole thing will snap at once some day not too far in the future.

Could you clarify one thing though, what you mean by "tightening - and re-tightening - the screws can lead to the problem I encountered: stripping the threads in the lid" (English is not my first language).

Right now, I'm not sure I fully understand the full extent of the design fault or whether we might even have several faults...

 

Sure thing! I mean to say that:

1. on my Z11 at least, tightening the screws once wasn't enough.
2. 4 Months after receiving my Z11 the screws loosened the first time
3. 2 months later, they were loose again.
4. The second time the screws were tightened, the receiving threads in the lid were stripped by a tech. ​

 

As someone mentioned in the beginning of the thread: if it is a screw loosening issue, use some thread lock.

Amazon.com: Loctite - Threadlocker 222 Low Strength Purple, 6 ml. tube (38653): Automotive

When I took off the RAM cover to do a replacement, I noticed some red goo on the screw threads, indicating Sony used some thread lock originally.

I used this once when I was assembling a model 1/2 HP gas powered helicopter, and I can say that it works great; in that it took a lot of effort to take the screws out after the thread lock had set.

Just make sure you don't use the heavy strength stuff...it'll take a blow torch to get it off

 

Would that solve the signs of wear on both plastic blocks that connect the lid and the hinge though ?
So would one theory being that because the screws are not tight that there is some extra stress applied to the hinge design which shows with signs of wear on the plastic blocks ?

 

Well, I've never opened my Z and was only trying to help regarding the loosening screws, I really have no idea about the hinge design wrt the plastic. I'm guessing that the problem appears to be bent plastic while it really is just a very loose hinge.

 

When the black piece starts to separate from the screen due to the loose screwes, the hinge COVERS will appear to crack. They aren't. They are simply opening up due to the loose screws. This also causes the creaking/cracking sound.

Tightening the screws fixes this. Note that the cover is NOT the hinge, it's just a cosmetic cover. The hinges are stainless steel and are underneath the covers. They are quite strong.

 

I'm not worried about the hinge covers, I realize they don't much function and if they crack it's not much of an issue.
The issue I really have is the black pieces separating from the lid, surely that has got to be of concern no ?

 

^Yes, that's why you need to retighten the screws and add locktite. It's crappy that we have to do this, but it's an easy enough fix.

 

Having the same problem here, VPCZ1 - owned for just over 1 year, Right hand metal hinge has become disconnected from the screen (the two screws worked themselves loose and have fallen out) - looks easy enough to fix ... but does anyone know how to actually get at the things? Do you need to disassemble, it looks like there is no way to actually get at the screws as the body of the laptop is in the way

Many thanks in advance for any help!

 

You need to remove the keybroad to have access to the screen hinge.

 

Sounds really dangerous and troublesome...

 

Oooo looks fun - I feared this might be the case - thank you

If anyone is interested I've found possibly the dullest ever video showing how to remove the keyboard ... although it basically just looks like you just unscrew everything you can find on the underside of the laptop

YouTube - Sony Z11 Disassembly

this may well end in tears ...

 

Oh...don't worry.
It's pretty straight forward.

 

Just be careful if you decide to take off the ribbon attaching the keyboard. (If you don't take off the ribbon, you can have someone hold the keyboard area to perform the repair). Because if you tear the ribbon, it may be hard to find/expensive to replace.

 

- How long have you owned your VPCZ1 4 months (almost 5
- Is it custom built ? No. Its pre-configured, made in Japan
- Does the screen exhibit distortions near the hinge when you open/close the lid. Not yet. Hinge still functional
- Do you see any kind of fatigue on the two black bars connecting the display to the hinge ? Nothing I can notice.
- Do you hear the click, if yes on which hinge (left/right) Neither.
- Have you fixed the problem, if yes how ? (by Sony or yourself) No.

Maybe this is just because I only owned the laptop for 5 months, not as long as you did. I baby it quite a bit and have treated it very well.

 

Yes, i second that the ribbon cable is annoying takes me like 10 mins to put it back on. Just yesterday i went in and tightened my hinges for the 2nd time in about 10 months... I'd complain except for the fact that it forces me to clean out the internals with a can of compressed air that i wouldn't otherwise do. But the opening and closing feels so good yet again! (I really should open it to dust it out more often... my environment is too dusty)

 

I just took apart my Z to tighten the hinge screws - no loc-tite on me right now so I'm probably going to have to take it apart again in the future!

There were way too many screws to take off, and I even took off some that were unnecessary, but it feels much better now that the hinge isn't creaking and clicking and feeling like it's going to break apart.

 

- 9 months
- Yes
- No
- No
- Eight Hinge, just started hearing it today
- No, but will attempt to try my manufacture limited warranty or try myself not sure yet


Just wondering, it seems to be an easy fix, but can someone run through step by step what i must do to repair it. I don't mind opening it up. I will be a bit nervous, but will make sure I know what I am doing first. And does anyone know how long the Manufacturer Limited Warranty is? and if this would be covered?

 

Just take out all the screws on the bottom (there's 3 sizes so, i'd either print out a pic of the bottom of your Z or just place your screws and go methodically).

Remove the keyboard tray (slowly mind you) then disconnect the ribbon cable between the keyboard and the motherboard.

Then get a screw driver and attack all 3 screws on either side of the laptop. (you might need to bend the chassis a little bit in order to get to the two black ones, or you can do it slowly and carefully).

The Manufacturer Limited Warranty is (at least in the USA) is 1 year from ship date. This should be covered, but the hassle is not worth it. Also depending where you are in the USA, they might require you to send it in for repairs, here in LA, they sent a technician to me when i asked to replace a palmrest (under warranty with 2 days left ). The tech was a contractor so he wasn't that informed, even asking me if i knew how to unhook my palmrest...