I wonder how much longer my Z11 will last.

It's 6 months old and I've noticed there are quirks. The WiFi goes out fairly frequently now. Turning it on and off doesn't help. I have to reboot to get it back. Every couple of days or so, the screen gets seriously messed up for a few seconds. It's like all the contrast goes away. The first time it happened, I freaked out. Now, I just wait about 10-15 seconds and it's back to normal. I don't have high hopes that it will last out the year before needing repair. I'm glad I have a backup in the closet.

 

When you lose the screen contrast have you checked to make sure the intel display power management junk is off?

 

...I'm glad I finally got around saving money for a custom desktop rig. I've just installed 8GB of RAM on my now 2 year old VGN-Z (been in service 3x times this year alone) and am wondering how long the machine will go for with iffy sounds coming from the fan, which service, typically-enough said is normal... Normal my backside... I was originally planning some heavy, wallet-intensive mods for my Z but I think I'll have to cancel them at the rate my Z seems to be going.

I too have a backup laptop in the wardrobe but it's a 6 year old Celeron M machine...

 

It is normal -- for cheaply built laptops.
The problem is that when, for a given price, consumers have a choice between quality, design and features, they pick design and features. Every time a buyer makes that choice, they contribute to the quality for future products going down, having voted with their wallet.

So yes, the Z is a p.o.s. quality-wise compared to what laptops were like a few years ago. Because we, the consumers, buy the cheaper of two similar looking and similar featured products without asking why it is cheaper.

 

^I couldn't disagree more with that statement. The Z is a pos quality-wise compared to what laptops were like a few years ago???? What is the Z made more "cheaply" than and how is it now different (more cheap) than a few years ago???

 

Open up a Z. Open up a much older laptop. Compare.
The Z has far more plastic parts, glue and breakable plastic latches where there formerly were screws, cheaper capacitors, thinner PCBs, zif connectors instead of plugs, cheaper capacitors, and now even a surface mounted CPU. Never mind that the assembly has been moved to cheaper countries, and service has been outsourced to the cheapest bidder.
All to save costs, to give the consumer more features for the buck.

 

I've opened up plenty of Z's, nothing cheap about them. I can't see I see too much glue in there. All your other parts listed are in effort to make the machine THIN - especially the surface mount cpu. And what plastic latches?? Z's assembly still does not happen in "cheap" countries and the service here in the US is handled by sony (except onsite, which everyone outsources).

 

All the feet are glued on. Looking at my old Sony Walkman R2, it has a screw through each rubber nub -- and I haven't lost one yet, where I have lost five so far on my Z.
The fingerprint sensor is glued on (and quite a few people have complained that it slides over time as a result, or isn't completely straight from the factory). The heat assembly has a big blob of glue holding the pipes in place. There are plenty more.
The display is latched on. Multiple other parts are too. In fact, taking a Z apart without a bamboo tool or other thin flat latch pusher is a feat, so kudos to you for having done so with plenty of them.
The Z motherboard and other PCBs are assembled in China, from non-Sony parts. The only thing done in the US and Mexico is what unskilled labour can do with the pre-assembled parts.
As for the CPU, the fact that earlier Zs don't have a socketless CPU puts a lie to the claim that it was done to make it thinner.
Local service isn't Sony, it's a company acting on behalf of Sony, and the call centre isn't here either. The only thing Sony does is ship replacements (unless they've outsourced that too).

That others do the same only reinforces my claim -- customers look at features and design, and not quality, so in order to stay competitive, all companies do this.
Quality has gone down over the years, for Sony as well as for others. Where you could fully expect 5-10 years life span of computers in the past, you can now expect 2-3 at best. Welcome to consumerism.

 

Do you have a vgn-z or a vpc-z? Vpc z is very easy to get into.

You obviously are very frustrated by sony's rubber feet. I'm not sure what you mean by the display being latched on? It uses stainless, screwed in hinges like most other highend notebooks.

The glue in heatpipes is to retain form. Do you suggest they run screws through oil filled heatpipes??

The soldered on CPU is no cost saver. The vpcz is also thinner than the vgnz. Every time intel releases new CPUs Sony must run more boards through to be soldered. They must stock multiple boards in service, one for each CPU. These are certainly not cost savers.

Service internally is not outsourced. Onsite is, like most other mfrs do.

 

I'm going to have to agree with arth1 here, but instead of using the Z as an example, I'll use printers.

Back in 1996 our family bought a HP Desktop Machine Suite, a HP Desktop Inkjet 400 Colour Printer being part of the deal. One of the best Inkjets at the time with colour printing speeds of 1PPM, and black and white at 3PPM. I had that till late last year when I was unable to buy inks for it anymore; apparently the model was too old and they stopped making refills and recycled cartridges for it. All in all, I used that thing for 13 years and it was still going strong. But since it wasn't usable, I was forced to trash it (it wouldn't sell despite a $1 reserve auction).

You go buy a printer today and you'll be lucky to see it last 2 years, let alone 13. The inks start leaking like mad at about 6 months of age, and overall the thing just breaks down for no apparent reasons once the one year warranty is over. I even hear some printers today have a 'counter' in which the machine actually just stops running and tells you to take it into a service center, despite there being nothing wrong with it (tells you to fix an ink leak problem). I suffered that with a Canon Desktop printer at work and had to throw that thing out; repair was billed at US$100 and for all I care I can go buy a new printer for about US$40.

Basically, electronics today are made not with QUALITY in mind, only with design and performance capabilities (in the short-term). I personally do miss the good old days where everything just worked without too much break-downs and inconveniences. Today however, it's like electronics are designed to break down quickly and manufacturers make you go buy new machines once that happens.

And unfortunately, I don't see my VGN-Z being in the 'good-old-days' category. I haven't owned alot of laptops myself, but just by looking at it my Z has slight imperfections when it comes to build-quality, imperfections which definitely WILL affect how long this will run. And as arth1 says, we as end-users have doomed ourselves to the mercy of consumerism as customers demand lower-quallity (more prettier) devices.

Me personally, I think the world has gotten a wee bit more 'less-informed' when it comes to electronics. People just buy stuff cause of the hype (**cough iPad cough**) when they actually don't have a need for it. Don't get me wrong, the industry probably has a millions uses for it. But for the average-Joe customer, I struggle to see a purpose...

As an electrical engineering student, I know what to look for in electronics. With my VGN-Z, I actually didn't expect a US$2500 (at the time) machine to start showing such shoddy detail to build-quality after just a year worth of use. So the price you pay for today, unfortunately enough, doesn't necessarily give you years of use with electronics. I considered this machine cause of it's specs, size, and price (it was a helluva lot more expensive than HPs and Tohsibas, who didn't even have similar spec-ed machines at the time, heck, not even today). And having done my research here before purchase, I thought it would last a decent wee while (and users here were giving it a favourable rating)... Well, at the rate this is going, I'll be lucky to see this last through 2011 (though I hope like hell it will).

And @arth1, the HP Desktop Suite had the specs (our family paid a good US$3500 bac in 1996):
166MHz Pentium CPU
16MB RAM
2.4GB HDD
1MB Video Acceleration RAM
8x CDROM reader
Built-in photo-scanner (in a 5.25' bay)
15' Monitor with 1024x768 resolution, with built-in speakers, volume control, and microphone
Built-in modem
Built-in floppy
The Inkjet 400 being included in the package, as well as a game called Monster Truck Madness...
Windows 95
...and a suite of actually USEFUL, full-version software and games to introduce the then-developing Windows users market to the OS and the then-revoluntionary GUI.

And that machine was in perfect working order till 2007 (it was 11 years old by then) when I had to trash that as well cause I just couldn't sell it off (and I needed the space in the house)... THAT there is true build-quality. The only thing I needed to do with that machine was to open her up and clean out the dust once a year or so.

 

Actually I don't see anything cheap about VPCZ... it's a business grade machine but as I see it's slightly delicate and needs special care.

About life expectancy, actually it depends on the way you use your laptop. Using it delicately will avoid you many problems. Also you have to know that you are dealing with many complicated miniaturized pieces of hardware unlike yesterday.

Today is not like yesterday anyway but keep in mind, today's devices are much more smaller, thinner, capable and more complicated previous era.

In term of quality, take a look at new consumer grade DELLs and compare them to 10yrs old models, of course you will feel the old ones more rugged and probably more valuable than today's childish dells and that's because of the increased demand on computers so they have to seek methods to decrease the production value and making them affordable for the most of population. At the same time manufacturers still offer expensive laptops which are more durable for people who want business grade laptops as Think Pad T, Latitude and Vaio Z.

 

I have a Z12 and I would not say it is "cheaply built" overall, but neither it is it the absolute top quality fit and finish, relative to its price point. If I look at say my wife's Acer 1810TZ the materials are better on the Z, but I dont get the sense any extra is there in the fit and build.

And If I compare the Z12 to my Panasonic Y5 from a couple years ago it is absolutley no match. The Y5 was built to the standards of a fine Swiss watch.

But that's not the say the Z is bad. Just maybe not where it could be for the price.

 

I don't see anything cheap about the Z11 tho. Yeah ok, some things are plastic but the overall feel is way better than i get from most laptops/netbooks. Although it's a bit expensive for what you get price/quality wise. But i don't have any problems as of yet.

As for the start post(i thought it was?) Wifi problems are fixed with upgraded drivers from the intel site. I did get the weird constrast issue once tho, although i think that was because of the intel display savings thiny. Haven't had a ''big'' problem ever since.

 

The only thing that happens to me is the display driver stops working, and then recovers itself. That's usually when going from speed to stamina or vice-versa. Also, I've found Firefox to be taking longer to load lately.

Threads like these are making me nervous that I'm going to have to get a new laptop in a few months. I have a three-year warranty with accidental damage, but who knows what Sony will do if the thing craps out.

I love the machine tons and tons...but I am starting to worry.