Memory upgrade scam in FZ

I have purchased 2 x 2gb DDRAM2 to upgrade my FZ-160E to 4gb. I installed them and when I boot up, Vista indicates that total memory is 3g. I thought that one of the DDRAM2 might be faulty, rechecked, but in the end, the problem lies with the components Sony used to build the notebook and Microsoft's requirements to be able to address 4gb of memory in Vista. Please follow : http://support.microsoft.com/kb/929605
But, if you look at Sony's marketing specifications, it says that the FZ160E comes with 2x1gb and is upgradeable to 4gb. THERE IS NO MENTION THAT YOU HAVE TO BUY A NEW MOTHERBOARD TO DO IT !!!!
Does anyone have an explanation or comment on the issue ? We have been fooled by Sony (once more) !!!!

 

you dont have to buy a new mobo, it is just that vista 32bits only display 3gbs of memory, i think the 64bit or the ultimate version uses all 4gbs.

 

How much memory is shown in the bios? Press F2 during the vaio logo when you turn on the notebook.

 

The notebook itself can support 4 GB of RAM, but as mentioned, windows can only address 3 GB of the total amount installed. If you were using a 64-bit operating system, then the total 4 GB would be visable. Don't worry, sony hasn't fooled anyone, its just that 32-bit operating systems cannot see more than 3 GB.

 

Its not a scam, do some research before you start flinging out accusations, the same thing will happen on a machine that can support 8 GB of ram if your still using a 32 bit OS.

 

Using 64 bit vista should address all 4gb of ram. I think the real scam is how much they charge you to upgrade from 2gb to 4gb of ram... how much did it cost? I'm sure you would've been much better off buying and installing your own ram.

EDIT: oh i see you said you purchased 2 2gb sticks, i assume that means you did it yourself because upgrading from 2gb to 4gb via sony costs $890..

 

I dont see it so clearly. At the Sonystyle website, if you try to purchase a FZ notebook and upgrade it from 2gb to 4gb the difference is usd 890. Do you think that this is the price of vista 64 bit ? No, this is the price of the hardware you must change to be able to address the 4gb. It is not a question of operating system, it is a hardware question. Even more, in the marketing specs it says that the notebook can be upgraded up to 4gb, without any comment on any special requirement. Do you think that I am not doing my research or it is that you are a liitle naive ?

 

it has to do with 32 bit windows only being able to address around 3gb or ram so it'll tell you you only have 3gb or ram even if you have 4, 9, 100,whatever gb installed. you're not getting any different hardware or OS from sony when purchasing 4gb of ram. you have to buy 64-bit vista to see all 4gb of ram.

 

Sony doesn't even officially support Vista 64 bit, which is kind of a scam within itself. However, it's pretty common knowledge that 32 bit only supports up to 3gb, and technically, the laptop will come with 4gb, but whether the OS can support it is a different story.

It's the same principle as having a dual core processor (like those in the FZ), but not being able to fully utilize it with a 64 bit OS. Not much you can do about it at this point.

 

Ok, if you have done your research, tell us how much memory can a 32 bit operating system address? The answer to that question is the root of what you are calling a scam. It is not a scam. As others have pointed out, ANY 32 bit OS, be it Vista, XP, Linux, Unix or whatever can only address about 3 gig (2 to the 32nd power to be precise). There is no "hardware change" the price difference is the only the price difference Sony is charging for the memory. Nothing more... nothing less. The knowledgebase article you referenced spelled this out very clearly.

Gary

 

OK, I didn't realize that I had to do this kind of research BEFORE buying a notebook, so I shouldn't believe Sony when it says that the notebook can be upgraded up to 4gb, and I shouldn't believe Microsoft when it says :

Quote :

Memory specifications

All editions of Windows Vista 64-bit provide increased memory support beyond the standard 4 gigabytes (GB) available with 32-bit editions. Refer to the specific edition of Windows Vista 64-bit to determine maximum memory capacity.

Unquote
Do you still believe that this is not a scam ? Who are the buyers of notebooks ? Computer technicians ??? Come on .....

 

This "scam" isn't specific to sony -- all the major computer manufacturers offer a 4gb memory upgrade to their desktops/laptops while allowing you to install a 32 bit version of vista (or only offering a 32 bit version)

here is the official microsoft link:
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/929605

 

You can't simply call it a scam for that reason alone. There is a lot of technical jargon that goes into buying a new computer, and sure the average person will not be able to understand without the help of someone else. However, it's just like any other upgrade on a computer....you have to know that it'll be compatible before you choose to go with it.

 

Dude calm down, no one is being scammed. And this is NOT Sony's fault, its a matter of math in 32bit software limitations.

First of all, when you pay $890 for 4GB from sony, you are getting the exact same mobo if you were to buy 1GB, there is absolutely NO change other than having different RAM modules which everyone knows you can change out yourself for much less, which it seems you have done already.

Second, Sony doesn't even offer Windows Vista 64bit. To get Microsoft Windows Vista 64bit edition you'll have to order the disc on your own.
And if you actually want to run a 64bit OS, get ready to quadruple your headache because there isn't much software out there that supports it, being vista is already bad enough, installing 64bit is just asking for pain.

The ONLY limitation to 4GB is software, NOT hardware. If you have installed 4GB, then your BIOS will display that you have as such, I know mine does, which further proves the point that it's not hardware.

Dell offers 4GB on 32bit Vista, HP offers 4GB on 32bit Vista and none of those options will actually be able to use all 4GB, it's not just Sony, and it's not a scam, you can use the whole 4GB, it's up to you which operating system you want to use, you'll just have to install it yourself if you really want need that extra bit of RAM.

 

First, let me thank you for your efforts at explaining the limitations of 32 bit software. I do understand them but this is not the point I am trying to make. If Sony does not offer as an option 64 bit Vista, and if Sony knows what a normal consumer will make of a line which reads "Upgradeable up to 4gb" and if Sony knows that the 32 bit software it is selling pre-installed will only address 3gb of memory and if Sony is willing to sell you the notebook with 4gb (at an unbelievably outrageous price), what do you think is the resulting situation for a normal consumer ? You still don't think it is misleading and malicious ? If Dell or HP do the same, then the problem is an industry problem. I would love to see if your answers and explanations would be the same if this had been a car or a TV set. Would you be as conciliatory or lenient with the manufacturer as in this case ? Why do you think that computer manufacturer's should be treated differently from the rest of the world ?

Just for the record, I didn't purchase the notebook with the 4gb, so my anger and frustration is not money based.

By the way, as I wanted to use the extra memory to run several VM in my notebook, I called Microsoft to know what would happen to the "not displayed" memory and the answer was that "even though it is not displayed, it will be there, available to the VMs". Do you agree ? I don't think so, but, I might be wrong once more ......

 

They are not. And the very same issue exists in both of those industries. First take televisions, if I go to the store today I can buy a HD TV, take it home and not be able to view any HD programs because the other components in my system, VCR, DVR, cable, dish etc don't provide the support. Its the same hardware/software issue. A similar situation exists in automobiles. I can buy a car with a speedometer that reads 150 mph. (In fact I have.) The car is not capable of doing that speed.

As with ALL technology, cars, tv's or computers the user needs to be aware of what the capabilities are. I see nowhere that Sony is making any claims about the software being able to use more memory than the OS is capable of. All I see is Sony stating what the limitations are of the hardware, period. That is prudent, so folks know what the hardware is capable of in the future when the software catches up with it. I do see some fault with the marketing blurb that you posted from Microsoft. The reference to 4 gig is patently false. But that is not Sony's issue or fault.

As to VM seeing the other memory, I HIGHLY doubt it. I am not intimately familiar with the memory addressing scheme in VM, but my understanding is it uses the underlying OS. If that is correct, VM will see only 32 bits worth of memory like any other app.

Gary

 

God forbid you do some research before you buy a computer! Better to just buy and then start throwing a fit and slinging insults when the information has been out there for the taking for quite some time now.

 

Just because you can't utilize 4gb right now doesn't mean you can't in the future when 64bit OS's become more the norm. Simply do not upgrade to 4gb if you feel you are being scammed.

Sony has done much more scandalous things than this, I assure you.

 

Yep! Can you say rootkit DRM? Talk about evil!

Gary

 

I wish I could give you negative rep points for the total waste of space and time this thread has been.

 

yup every other thread on the forum talks about the 3 gig thing. Its hard to miss...

 

Perhaps "scam" is a bit much, but I do think Sony was not being very candid if it offered to upgrade the OP's memory from 2 to 4 GB without this disclaimer:

Note: You will not be able to actually utilize any more than about 3 GB with the loaded operating system and hardware, but you will have a warm fuzzy feeling inside knowing that it's in there anyway. Have a nice day.

So I guess a single 1 GB memory upgrade makes more sense then, right? [I'm a computer newb] Would you do this as two 512MB's or just a single 1 GB?

 

I'll give you this much; Sony (and all the other notebook manufacturers) should put asterisks beside "Upgradeable to 4GB" stating, "Requires software upgrade".

 

You have two slots for memory inside the FZ machines. If you already bought 2 gig from Sony, they installed 1 gig into each of those two slots. To upgrade to 3, you must uninstall one of these and replace it with a 2 gig stick.

Gary

 

Thanks, SC.

 

OK, I understand this better but I have a new question. I have a similar Vaio AR590E design with two slots pre-loaded with two 1 GB cards each and "upgradeable" to 4 GB. It came with 32bit Vista Home Premium and I don't plan on changing that any time soon. I thought of swapping only one of the 1 GB for a 2 GB but the guy at my Microcenter store said that although true that I wouldn't achieve a full 4 GB with two 2 GB, there still is an advantage that by doing so I'd still operate in "dual channel mode" (? ) where as with a 1 GB and a 2GB I wouldn't because they would have a different "latency" [this is all Greek to me]. Was he just trying to sell me an extra card or is there truth to wanting identical cards in each slot? Thanks.

 

mzil, dual channel offers practically nothing in terms of a performance increase, if you are using RAM that runs at the same frequency as the procesors FSB. That means, if your RAM is 667 MHz, as is your FSB frequency, dual channel will not yield any performance increase.

However, if you are using 533 MHz, using dual channel will increase performance in certain circumstances. In applications that are memory and processor intensive, where large amounts of data need to be transferred to and from the processor to the RAM, there may be a bottleneck using RAM which runs at a slower frequency than the FSB frequency. For example, if you run a processor and memory intensive application on a computer, which has a 667 MHz FSB and 533 MHz RAM, there could a performance loss. Using dual channel in this case would avoid this bottleneck.

 

Zero, my processor (2GHz Core 2 Duo) FSB is 800 MHz and the 2 pre-installed 1 GBs are 667 MHz ea. Does this mean that as long as I buy a single 2GB 667MHz and swap a single 1 GBs I'll still be in dual channel mode when applicable?

I'm not a gamer, nor do I currently do much multi-tasking but I do plan on getting heavily into HDTV video archiving with the supplied cablecard outboard tuner that comes with the AR590E. [The main reason I bought this thing.] I would imagine that function would gobble up memory rather quickly.