New Z model with Intel Core i5 CPU

Thanks for info. Sounds handy but not as handy as mute/volume buttons would be. Can't understand why they didn't add them. It's so irritating to be stressed when I'm at work or uni and I'm not sure, if I muted the computer yesterday's night, after I watched movie... Or button for quick turning off the screen, like NW series have. Also don't understand why there's no button on the Blu-ray mechanics anymore.

 

I agree, i'm annoyed on how most videos are mainly about how pretty and thin it is while short on details. I want to know which SSD is inside that way i know whether or not i should budget for a Vertex or Intel SSD in the near future

 

The new S series is advertised as having a multi-touch trackpad so I would have thought the Z would have that too.

 

I hope you're right, that'd be a welcome addition. Seems unlikely that Sony would have a feature such as that on the S and not the Z, considering the S is supposed to be a lower budget 13.3".

 

Even Thinkpads have multitouch trackpads these days so I can't imagine the Z would go without one.

 

Thanks for video.

Interesting first comment about preview:

I'm not an Apple fan but does this sound exactly like a MacBook Pro. Dedicated graphics card that switches depending on need. Solid aluminium that's been milled down. Around 7 hours battery life. 13 inch screen. The res is better than the Apple machine but it is a copycat product. Interested to see if they can beat the Apple price.

This is kind of reaction you get when you try to present vaio Z like you are talking about MacBook

 

"Copycat product". Technically wasn't the SZ the first of that class of products (full powered components in a 13" ultra portable frame with switchable graphics and optical drive).

 

I think you are right. I bought one when they first came out. You had to reboot, but it was the first.

 

Well there was also the Lenovo U330, which I think also required a reboot to switch the gpu. I think that came around the same time as the Vaio SZ.

 

The only thing I've worried about is that all the "neat features" like scaling the GPU and whatnot is going to be software dependent. For those of us who are Linux users, I just hope that we'll be able to at least use the dedicated gfx by itself without issue. Likewise, for being able to reprogram all the hotkeys etc...

 

Linux and Sony Vaio laptops have never gone well together. i can't think of a single model where everything works -- certainly not the Z. Sony keeps things proprietary, and won't disclose enough details to let others create drivers or access the hardware. So it's all going to be trial and error, I'm afraid. Mostly error.

 

That isn't true. When the first gen SZs were released with the switchable gpus, IBM still made their ThinkPad products, however, the U330 came afterwards when Lenovo took over and created the IdeaPad line.

 

Someone posted that Best Buys is receiving their first shipment on the new S this Thursday with these specs:

I wonder, if maybe, the new Z will come sooner than expected. I read that S, Y and Z are available for preorder now, but where?

 

I would also like to know where we can preorder the new series....

I want the new Z

 

So what's the word on the final specs?
This laptop looks fantastic

 

Sigh. Great. I'd love to give Sony a chance to take my money. I'll overlook how they'll probably stick a Blu-Ray burner and SSD in the "You'll get it before June Special Edition" configuration, jacking its price up a ton, if it came with the great materials, form factor, and components expected of it. All I ask is that they be standards compliant, have a BIOS that works properly, and hardware that seems like it should work in Linux, actually works in Linux and is not propped up by some dumb executable in Windows to say, tell the fans to turn on when needed so they damn thing doesn't melt.

I've really had enough of how companies cut corners even on high end products because they assume nobody will notice. HP had an Envy15 returned to them because of BIOS, and this is getting frustrating. Do they think the only people that pay $2000 are solely interested on how the thing looks on the outside? Thanks for the heads up.

 

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showpost.php?p=5718860&postcount=379

 

The only pre-order option we know of so far is slated to begin "early February" for the two Signature Collection models. Obviously you are paying a bunch of extra money for this privilege...

Metal Mosaic $2,349.99 (VPC-Z????)
http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs...552921644649998&N=4294954789#/Metal Mosaic Z/

Glossy Carbon $4,499.99 (VPC-Z11FHX)
http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs...44649998&N=4294954789#/Glossy Carbon Fiber Z/

At the moment there is no spec page for them. At that price, I'd assume the glossy carbon one is loaded with i7, 8GB RAM, BluRay and the 512GB SSD. You'd probably have to be a video editor to need 8GB RAM...

 

Thanks for the info!

Is there any chance that it will be released sooner in Japan?

 

According to this post:

It seems unlikely.

 

I've been editing and encoding full HD .h264 files even before buying my 2nd gen Z over a year ago, and mind you those new specs are extremely tempting for something the Z's size. Ok, they (the CPU, GPU, RAM, SSD) may be speculation, but for over US$4k, I wouldn't expect anything less (though I'm kinda expecting a 335m instead of the 330m for something that expensive).

Although I wouldn't mind going and getting one with those specs, I'm pretty concerned regarding the new Z's heat and CPU management. The older (current) Z - that thing gets hot with the 9300m, and by hot we're talking boiling-point-of-water-and-higher-hot for those who push the Z to its limits.

I remember seeing and reading the T9900 CPUs in the higher end, older Zs which used to only run at advertised clock speeds for 5 or so seconds at a time before being forced to down-clock due to heat issues. Unless Sony has done a radical overhaul in the mobo architecture, which I'm rather curious about, I will pass this Z and will probably do so until the next refresh in 2012 or something is out. I mean, we have an i5 (and i7 seems likely as well) coupled next to a 330m, which undoubtly should make things even hotter.

Me being mobile alot and keen on video work would definitely consider the new Z, but only AFTER the official reviews and opinions of every-day buyers (if there are any for the high-end one) are out.

 

Anybody knows if batterydrain is still there with the new models?

 

The new F-series (16.4") has the 330M GPU, so I would be extremely surprised if the much smaller new Z had it too...!!

 

Unit they presented on CES 2010 has 330M:

http://pc.watch.impress.co.jp/img/pcw/docs/340/889/html/04.jpg.html

However you can not find any info about it on the Sony site.

To me it seems like Sony is not yet sure whether to put it in vaio Z or they think keyboard part built from one pice of aluminum is more important thing to mention

 

I assume it will actually come with the Graphics Media Accelerator HD Graphics and not the 4500hd- since that is for the C2D models.

Out of curiosity, how would this new S model perform compared to the original Z series? According to benchmarks, the "HD" integrated graphics should be nearly as good as the 9300M on the Z, but with better battery life ( http://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel-Graphics-Media-Accelerator-HD.23065.0.html .) I also presume that the i5 performs comparably to the C2D in the old Z?

So would you be getting equivalent performance and better battery life in exchange for extra weight?

 

Vaio S also has 310M GPU, so you would be getting better performance with longer battery life for extra wight . I would also like to see performance difference between those two.

 

Looks pretty nice but those numbers are up there for that laptop.

 

Remember that these are fancy "signature collection" models, so the price shouldn't be taken as too close an indication of standard models. Think of them like that Bond 007 VAIO where they added $1,000 to the price for a little insignia on the keyboard.

 

Yes, the box she read the info from only said intel graphics. She supposed it would be the 4500hd, but remarked she wasn't sure.

The 310m is an option, you can also get one without it if you want. The 310m is close to being the lowest card you can get in the 3xx series anyway, so don't expect much from it.

 

Unless they give you switchable graphics (which I have not heard any indication of) then the 310m will give you about 90% better performance than the HD graphics (comparing benchmarks of 1800 vs 3400 3DMark06) in exchange for worse battery life.

 

The core i processors come with a built in GPU. I can't see how Sony could maintain their claim of being a premium brand if they simply don't use what is already in there. Then again, they also removed VT support, didn't they?

About the performance: Bad performance times two doesn't equal good performance.

It certainly is an improvement over the intel HD, but it remains a low end card, so don't expect too much from it. Think of it like the 9300m compared to the current IGP. It gives a boost, but still leaves the notebook pretty useless for graphical intensive tasks.

 

I understand that the core i7 processors don't have on-chip graphics while the others do. Also, if I were to guess, for the chips that contain on-chip graphics (i5 etc), there will be a firmware that will automatically switch between the discrete and on-board graphics, depending on the graphics-load of the application. Either way, the 310 is in the lower-end of the spectrum when it comes to high end graphics capability.

Was not the VT support removal related to issues associated with the OS and is essentially historical, and no longer relevant ?

 

I don't expect Sony to include hybrid switching in their lower end models unless they are forced by other brands. Right now only ASUS does it. And I can see most brands not implementing switching in order to differentiate their high and low end models so they don't cannibalize their own sales. Intel has been doing the same with its line of processors for a long time. Remember how you could mod cheaper chips back in the celeron D days?

Look at how ASUS overclocks some of its CULV models 33%. Simple enough to do but no major brand has followed suit. Why? I think its for brand differentiation. If you make a cheap CULV machine perform close (within 20%) to how your higher end P8400 based models and get better battery life then you eat into your higher end sales.

 

I agree with you tktk.

roweraay: What you say about the i7 is new to me. Where did you get that information from? I can't see any mention of it at the official announcement by Intel.

Edit:
nvm, just found this topic, where the point is brough up: http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=450640&page=2
But like ota-con mentions, the core i7 arrandale is not the same as the older quad core i7.

 

The "built-in GPU" of the newer Intel CPUs isn't a discrete component, but the ability of the CPU to execute graphics instructions and map graphics memory. This means that whenever you run graphics instructions on a core, you block it from doing regular work at the same time. Even if it can hold up to a lower-end Intel graphics chip, it does so at the expense of reducing the available CPU power.

The idea is good, but it's good for other things than high performance laptops. Two uses spring to mind -- (1) small devices where reducing the physical footprint and power use is paramount, and (2) servers, which hardly ever run graphics, except, perhaps, during setup.

 

BestBuy usually carries only low-end models, so it's not surprising they don't have discrete graphics. 310m is not bad, should be 2x performance of 9300 at least. 305m is the very low end discrete card available, and that should still be faster then 9300.

 

A 310m will play most games at medium to high settings (I can provide a link if needed), so it is not horrible. Its similar in performance to the old 8600GT in my 2 current desktop. So would have been a midrange GPU 2 years ago- which is not horrible.

But in 1-2 years a 310m will be similar to what a 9300M GS is today.

 

I thought it was a separate chip mounted on the same board. But, hey, I'm probably wrong.

http://hothardware.com/Articles/Intel-Arrandale-Core-i5-and-Core-i3-Mobile-Unveiled/?page=1

 

You are correct according to CTO options for vaio S you can chose 310M or integrated graphics so battery life will be shorter if you decide on 310M.

I think switchable graphic will soon become standard for low and high models since it is now much easier to implement it.

Since integrated graphic is not taking space on the board any more you have more options when choosing dedicated graphics. So instead of using switchable graphics to differentiate low and high model they will simply use better GPU for higher model. In this case you have 310M as an option for vaio S and 330M for Z.

I think only reason they didn't use switchable graphic for vaio S is because then performance of it will be too close to old Z.

 

A video editor or an electrical engineer running higher end simulation software. Sometimes 8GB of RAM isn't nearly enough, but good enough for a mobile laptop: http://www.ansoft.com/products/hf/hfss/

 

More marketing than anything. Like I posted before, the integrated "Intel HD" graphics will already perform about as good as the discrete 9300M GS in the old Z (and about 2X better than the 4500MHD.)

The 310M benchmarks about 2X better than the 9300m GS or Intel HD; The 330M about 3.5X better.

Roughly:
3Dmark06:
4500MHD: 750
Intel HD integrated: 1800
9300m GS: 1850
310M: 3400
330M: 6600

I use a 8600GT in my 2 year old desktop at home for occasional gaming (seen as a midrange GPU at the time.) It's 3Dmark06 is about 3500.

So every 2 years:
old Midrange becomes equiv to new low range.
old Low range becomes equiv to new integrated

so expect today's 310M to be similar to integrated graphics in 2 years. And todays 330m will be like low end in 2 years.

 

I called Sony Style Store and they only have two of the new Vaios in. The New F (one for $1199) and the New Y (one for $1000). As for the Z, she said, to pre-order at Sony.com, and whatever ship date appears, is when Sony Style Store will receive the New Z.

I didn't get the specs for those two models, as she was in a rush.

 

Surprised that Best Buy gets the S before Sony.

 

They didn't do it because it would give people less of a reason to buy a Z. Buy a $2K Z with barely any noticable differences or buy an S and save money? The only big differences then would be the screen and weight.

 

Interesting thing is i5-520m used in vaio S has built in intel graphic card. So S version with 310M should have two GPUs.

Since there is no switch for vaio S my best guess would be that switching is done same like in auto mod for new Z though I wouldn't be surprised if intel GPU wasn't used at all for reason you mentioned.

Edit: This new architecture of intel CPUs with integrated GPU is another reason for me to think switchable graphics will become standard for middle and high range machines. If they continue to use it to differentiate lower and higher models then we will have lower range machines with appendix GPU

 

It is a discreet component in that it is a seperate core.

However, you do hit on a good point. The CPU is overclocked based on the TDP. It overclocks if it can without crossing the TDP limit. Naturally the core taking care of the graphics also consumes power. So, if that core is in use, it could limit the max overclock the CPU core can reach, thus indeed limiting the CPU power.

Still, I don't see how that would be a reason for Sony not to use the built in GPU.

If they don't use it, we'll always be stuck with the dedicated card, which consumes more power. If they do use it, we get the option of less power, both in terms of GPU and CPU, but longer battery life, or more performance, both in GPU and CPU, but less battery life. The inclusion of the choice does not prevent the 'option' available without choice.


About the performance of the 310m. Mostly I agree with tktk. I'd only add that nVidia hasn't actually changed much about their designs between the 8000-series and the 'new' 300-series. They are working on a complete overhaul of their design, so I expect the performance to increase more rapidly than in the last two years. Intel also has shown themselves to be much more active in developing graphics recently, so I would expect the performance of the 310m to be rated as integrated in about a year to perhaps a year and a half, instead of 2. A performance boost of 2X really isn't that much when you consider it took 4 product generations to get there.

 

Because Sony signed a contract with Best Buy Blue Label laptop. Sony can't sell it until 6 months after Best Buy starts selling it. That is why international sony sites already have it listed and we don't. We won't have CTO for probably 6 months unless Sony can find a loophole, if they are even looking for one that is.

 

This agreement is ridiculous. Is it for "all" Vaios, including the new Z? Or is it for certain models only? Because Sony Style USA is selling both the F and Y and it hasn't been 6 months from there release dates.

This then means, as you've stated, there will be a 6-month lag, unless the configured Z model, I expect only 1 (the one for $1899), that Best Buys stocks, will be good enough.

USA consumers, won't be able to purchase the New Z anywhere, until Sept. 2010, with the expectation that it will be released in March, under this agreement. How does the agreement benefit Sony?

Even Apple didn't give complete exclusivity to ATT when it sold the iPhone. Apple, themselves, were able to sell their own product along with ATT. Why would Sony agree for Best Buy to be the "only" retailer to sell Vaios for 6-months, and not include Sony, the maker, under this agreement. Doesn't make any sense.

Check out this back-lit keyboard on S. I'm sure it will look the same on Z.

 

It is only for the S model, nothing else. All other models will be at Sony and other sites. But in the US I believe the S model will only be at Bestbuy until this agreement is over. It has something to do with the intel wireless technology that is included in the S.

 

Where do you see the exclusive agreement lasts 6 months? I highly doubt Sony is going to let Best Buy enjoys 6 months of exclusive sale of S -- maybe the S model with Widi can be exclusive for 6 months, but I can't believe all S models will be that way while the old SR has to soldier on when all its competitors are armed with Core i5/i7.