New Z model with Intel Core i5 CPU

I wouldn't worry too much about Sony's listed boot times for the Z. They use the same numbers for all their models.

http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&productId=8198552921666075665#specifications

They also list 60 seconds for the CW using a 5400rpm HDD.

 

That's pretty significant. On the contrary, RAID0 should make booting faster, I just don't know by how much.

I would just hate to have C,D,E and F drives (and G for memory card, H for DVD and the rest for my external drives/pendrives)

Another possibility would be to merge the drives using Windows. In this case I could maybe save 5-10 sec boot time (if in JBOD the RAID controller is skipped), but I would neither have the speed gain of RAID0 nor failure security. Would TRIM work with such merged drives?

 

In point of fact, no one can afford to lose their data, no matter how many disks are involved.

While we can get into the whole statistical argument of the failure rate of N RAID disks versus 1 non-RAID disk, the truth of the matter is that real-world single disk systems fail often enough - i.e. when you least need it! This is especially true in the hands of the average user.

Disk wipeouts stem not just from mechanical failure, remember, but can also result from OS/app misadventures, inappropriate power loss, physical mishandling, dropping in water, etc.

For N disks where N > 0, anyone who doesn't protect their data is at risk. So from the recovery standpoint itself it really is sort of immaterial how many drives you've got linked.

The questions that people really need to be asking themselves with respect to SSD versus HDD and RAID versus non-RAID are:

1) How much speed do I need?
2) Can the Sony setup supply it?
3) Can I afford it?
4) Do I have a decent backup/restore process?
5) Does Sony provide suitable maintenance (e.g. degradation correction) tools?


The argument that a multi-drive RAID 0 setup is statistically more prone to failure versus a single-drive setup is certainly true in theory. But really, are we talking about a failure every week? Every month? That would be silly, now, wouldn't it.

But for argument's sake, let's posit that the quad-SSD RAID fails once a year versus an HDD failure once every two years. If you answered the above questions positively, would you give up the speed boost just to save yourself a few hours a year?

Well, I can imagine that some people would say yes.

I wouldn't.

 

I have one question about upgrading SSD in the future. Is it possible that Sony will upgrade SSD for me if I send it back in the future? my thought process is like this: in the future, the price of SSD will become significantly lower than it is now. So, if I order a low capacity one now, when the price becomes lower for the high capacity SSD(like 512GB), I'll have them upgrade my SSD. Will they do this service for you? Or the price will always the same on SonyStyle? Thanks for answering my question.

 

Based on their previous sales offering patterns of the VAIO Z (old) series, I'm very sure that the (1920x1080) Full HD screen will be made available as a CTO option in the next refresh (probably during Jun.-Aug.) for the U.S. market.

IMHO, the main question will be:

Can you wait that long?

 

I like your argument, I'm sticking with quad. The single disk people and even the RAID 5 can all lull themselves into a false sense of security before WHAM! (the inevitable happens)

Meanwhile we (raid 0 folks) will be prepared come hurricane, earthquake or drive failure

 

Funny. This thread is about the new Sony Z11 so no point dwelling on the past. Needless to say they have laptop build issue quality problems. Even my first laptop from over 5 years ago had its hard drive failed when I got it. Parts have broken down on most of the computers I've gotten from them, but it's their service that used to be good. I got an XPS Desktop in Feb/2009, have made several subsequent upgrades and it pulls a 7.3 solid in Windows experience.

I pulled the trigger on the XPS13 because it was leather, had a solid deal (it was 1k less than a Vaio) had a backlit keyboard and a ton of connectivity options. The laptop came with uneven rubber feet (so annoying) and after 24 hours of hard extended use, the connection to the screen fried and wouldn't work in excess of < 45 degrees.

The Vaio offers the newest processors in a fantastic, low profile and less flashy form factor. The XPS had like, 3 big LEDs and another 6 small ones (ridiculous) I've been hoping to buy a Vaio for many years to complement my desktop HTPC nicely, it's here, and Sony (mostly) got it right. So here we go!!!!!!! Lets get those orders in, Sony!

 

Is there a switch to kill the keyboard backlight when watching movies in the dark?

 

The keyboard backlight can be turned on/off using the VAIO Control software.

 

Good reads from everyone.

I just cant justify keeping four small drives in JBOD. One drive? Absolutely. But four? We are talking about keeping only 70% full on a drive. That means we should only fill about 45GB of each drive. Awkward. And Im not about to merge the drives together because then Ive got the same unreliability as Raid 0 but without the perks. (It is to my understanding that when merged, one drive failure also results in full data loss)

So, while I dont need the speed, Im still going to stick with a compromise of 3 in Raid 0 and one in JBOD for now. You can bet your *** im going to back up my data though

 

Do they offer CTO in Hong Kong?

 

Just a thought: I find it interesting that you'd blame Dell for a HDD failure issue.

as if Dell made the HDD. as if they don't buy from the same HDD manufacturers that Sony and everyone else buys from.

But don't worry...you'll soon find Sony's have build quality (more like design quality) issues. Sadly, I'm still waiting for my refund check on my 9 month old Vaio. Yes, they had to give me my money back after almost a year of ownership because of shoddy build-quality and repair service among the worst in the business.

at least with Dell, you'd get in-home repairs done that same week or parts shipped to you via next day air.

Sony's repair/tech support is about as good as HP. and by that, I mean not good at all.

No matter what brand you buy from, you may get a lemon. My 2005 Dell still runs like a champ. My Toshiba before it had a laundry list of issues. My Sony after it had a laundry list of issues long enough for sony to think they should just give me my $2,600+ back. you know there are problems when they'd rather give you your purchase price back 9 months later than to just fix it.

I do understand that the Sony's are sexy and well-featured. It's what drew me in too. So here's hoping your Sony experience was better than mine. But don't be shocked if it isn't.

 

I'm not saying it's Dell fault in particular. As I mentioned, I own multiple dell devices.. what I'm pointing out is that at one time or another, different components have crapped out. I had the power supply on a desktop a while back, I actually had to replace the HDD twice and completely dissassemble the LCD to replace the lid in the Inspiron 6000 (the screws on the hinge were stripped). The keyboard on another laptop has needed replacing several times. That argument, given its context, is what I'm saying.. OEMs are responsible for the components they ship with their devices. I don't have issues with that HDD. Even with my newer desktop they supplied a crappy Samsung 1TB which I quickly shuffled off to my Drobo so I could put in a caviar black and an ssd. So, Samsung and their Enterprise line are to blame. That still doesn't get us anywhere.

Although you really do make me worry with your experience with Sony.. I thought their repairs were top-notch.. I know after dealing with Dell's service how annoying it is to constantly have to call back, time and time again, waiting for something to get done. 9 months!! I would have filed a complaint with the better bureau business or taken it to litigation far before that point. Fight for your money, man! Don't take crap from companies. Then again, if you really don't care, I suppose it doesn't matter.

I can only imagine the quality of the workmanship in this Vaio device is astounding. It was such a feat for them to cram all this horsepower into this super-sleek package I'm sure every attention was taken into structural rigidity, etc. Nearly every reviewer who's held it has said it's definetely sturdy. +1 for clumsy laptop users!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! *smash*

 

Indeed. The firmware has to scan for markers on each disk to find out which arrays they belong to, and then determine whether the array is valid and up-to-date, or whether corrective actions are needed.
It's not uncommon for a server with a hardware RAID controller or two to take 5 minutes before it commences booting. Desktops with "soft raid" are faster, not only because they tend to support fewer possible combinations, but because they do a less thorough check before signing off on each array as healthy. But you can still expect it to take a few seconds, at least -- some of it for reading the markers on the drives, and some of it for waiting to see whether you press the magic combo that lets you reconfigure.

 

Just sold my 16, no more headaches

Waiting for my Z11

 

May be interesting to see some tests with the drives in RAID0 vs a striped volume with JBOD.

Bad part about a striped drive is that you can't run the OS from it, in Windows at least. I've tried moving stuff around with directory junctions in Vista and Win 7. It works, but it a pain and the hibernation file can't be relocated.

This may be a good option for the "JBOD OS, RAID0 for the rest" people. There would be some speed increase and no RAID initialization through the Intel Option ROM loader.

 

Not quite sure what you're saying here. Are you saying you can't run Windows from a RAID 0 array? Surely I misunderstand you as it works quite well.

 

1080p Vaio Z was in a box that smiles

 

Sorry, maybe I wasn't clear. You can't boot from a software stripe created within Windows. Some linux bootstraps allow this, not Windows.

 

Been running windows 7 and win XP from my Z's RAID controller in RAID 0 for the past year or so.

BTW, Just placed an order for two 200GB OCZ Vertex LE...
Man this is going to be interesting...
I will try these two in my old and then in my new Z (in place of the optical drive if I can)
Shipping tomorrow, delivery monday (the SSDs, not the Z )

 

Sure you can boot from a software stripe, as long as it has firmware or BIOS boot support. The RAID 0 used in the new Z is a software stripe.

 

(Cancelled)

 

What about the voltage? Are you planning to bring it back to the US? Will it still be compatible?

 

What about voltage? If you order the English keyboard, will Sony automatically know that you need a US compatible power supply?

 

I doubt it. These are CTO, so it's not like they have a bunch of pre built machines waiting on the shelves. I don't know why Sony doesn't offer that option in the US, it's stupid if you ask me.

If they wait too long and Apple offers 1080p in their 13", then I'll buy a Mac. Though, I highly doubt that will happen. There's no way Dell is going to make a laptop with a screen like that.

 

Latest review: http://www.laptopmag.com/review/laptops/sony-vaio-z.aspx
A few interesting remarks:
"It’s the closest thing to a perfect ultraportable notebook that we’ve tested."

Performance:
"Thanks to the combination of a 2.4-GHz Intel Core i5 processor, dual solid state drives, and discrete Nvidia GeForce GT 330M graphics, the VAIO Z is the fastest 13-inch ultraportable we’ve tested. It notched a very impressive 9,936 in PCMark Vantage, which is more than triple the category average. "

Battery Life
"(continuous web surfing over Wi-Fi), the laptop ran for a pretty good 5 hours and 21 minutes in Stamina mode and 4 hours and 23 minutes in Speed mode.The good news is that Sony offers a large capacity battery, a $249 option that promises up to 11 hours of endurance. (We’re guessing it’s more like 7.5 hours.) "

Verdict
"Some day Apple or someone else may be able to match the VAIO Z in terms of speed or portability, but at the moment this ultraportable stands alone as the fastest 13-inch notebook on earth."

 

Nice review, but if they reviewed the laptop with the standard battery, why is there a bulge under where the battery should be? Isn't that the extended?

http://www.laptopmag.com/review/newgallery.aspx?id=40989&img=16

 

This is the extended battery.

 

Oh wow... was not expecting it to be that huge.

 

Standard

Large

 

Great picture!

Just so you know, the "new" battery has exactly the same dimensions and exactly the same interface as the old battery. The picture is, however, a great representation of how the battery lifts the rear of the laptop and tilts the keyboard forward. Really, the only difference is that it is black now instead of silver. If you search the old extended battery (which I have been using for about a year now) you will see that the new Z11xx series is compatible with it.

 

It looks like a good way to keep the bottom of the laptop cooled too.

 

Indeed it is. It is, in fact, one of the many reasons I originally opted for the extended battery. For me, the extended battery provides:

1. Better airflow
2. A way to tilt the keyboard forward (a comfort factor)
3. Makes the laptop easier to grip to pick up (though slightly more awkward to carry)
4. Allows me to utilize the Vaio Battery Care function to not fully charge the battery - thereby increasing its lifespan - while still extending the length of time the laptop can run on battery (from what the standard battery can do on a full charge).

 

Are you sure? I thought the old VAIO Z series are using different battery models to what the new VAIO Z series are using... No?

 

YES, I am. I have verbal confirmation from 2 SonyStyle representatives (which by itself has limited weight), and also this link: http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10151&catalogId=10551&langId=-1&productId=8198552921665453981#compatability. This link is provided under the accessories listed for my pre-ordered Vaio VPCZ11DGX/SJ. If you select the Compatibility tab after opening the link, you will see the Vaio Z11xx listed at the top and you can scroll down to the "Discontinued Models" list to see "our" Z's listed. Clearly, that means it's compatible with both machines.

Of course, all claims and links will either be proven right or wrong when my laptop arrives in a couple of weeks.

 

Are you sure those guys can be trusted?

By the way, if you go by the photos, they don't look exactly the same shape, so I highly doubt the new VAIO Z series batteries will fit onto the old VAIO Z series. Furthermore, the battery latches for the old VAIO Z series are larger in size while the new ones are smaller in sizes. Based on this, I again doubt that they'll work. At the same time, knowing Sony, I doubt they'll allow previous accesories to be compatible on newer VAIO models since they are "known" to want to "milk the heck out" of customers.

However, I may be wrong about the batteries' compatibilities for use between different VAIO models but since you've placed an order for the new VAIO Z series, I guess we'll know the answer for sure once you've received your new VAIO Z. Congrats on the purchase.

 

Great news indeed! Especially for those of us who are already Z owners...


No wonder they're still calling it the Z.

 

I totally agree about the reps statements being pretty unreliable as a rule. It's regrettable, but true.

As for them being a different shape, the only thing that matters is that they have the same shape where they connect to the laptop. One could be shaped like a fish and the other a polar bear once they clear the laptop shell. The problem in trying to make a determination from the photos is that Sony (intentionally?) took the pictures from different angles, so you can't really do a direct comparison. The battery latching mechanism from the link I provided is clearly seen, but on the new (black) Extended battery, the latch is hidden from view. Are they the same? Who knows for sure? Does anyone have a clear picture of the bottom of the new Z with the battery latching mechanism visible? If so, that would solve it for me.

 

Batteries are NOT the same and will NOT fit.
Connectors, while of the same pinout are slightly shifted to one side on the new model.
Old Extended is BPL12 and the new one is BPL20
Old one is 8.100 mA/h and the new one is 7.800 mA/h

Proof positive that they are not the same and will not fit. (Would be nice though...)
Thinking about it and considering the extra 300 mA/h I think I can disassemble my old Standard Battery (which I am not using) to try and fit it to the new Z.
Pray I don't fry it!

EDIT: As you can see in this picture: http://www.laptopmag.com/review/newgallery.aspx?id=40989&img=16
The bulge on the underside serves a purpose as it allows the lid to open to it's full extent.

 

http://plusd.itmedia.co.jp/pcuser/articles/1002/17/news045.html

Scroll down to the picture of the underside of the new and old Z side-by-size. There's no way the old battery would fit in the new one.

 

Also, all the good remarks about the performance were done with the Core i5 540 and not the i7. In reality there isn't much difference in performance between the two, while the i5 uses significant less battery. This makes core i5 the smarter choice.

 

The discrepancy between performance gain and battery-life loss for going with the i7 isn't that great. From the benchmarks I would estimate that going from the i5 540M to the i7 620M on the Vaio Z results in an 8% performance gain, while going the reverse direction results in a 15% battery life gain. The i7 seems to be worse performance/watt, but it may be worth it depending on what your priorities are.

 

Here's a new review from Laptop Magazine.

http://www.laptopmag.com/review/laptops/sony-vaio-z.aspx

 

New internal pictures from Taiwan Engadget, they said the new Z LCD back cover is much more durable than the old one, the editor tried to push the back and it did not cause any ripples on the LCD screen.

It looks like only full HD comes with Adobe 96% coverage...

http://chinese.engadget.com/2010/03/04/vaio-z-explained-by-project-leader/

 

In the blog, they also said that the new SSD is customized made by sony, you will not be able to add/replace it in the future...Ahhh...

Now I want 512GB SSD...

 

The price in Taiwan is so attractive, it is about 2/3 of the US price! And they will have Z on sale tomorrow....

 

glad to see that everyone is so interested in the new z.. have to admit that the specs are amazing.. maybe is it only me BUT design-wise it seems like a step back from the old z.. esp the palmrest.. if it were me, i would prefer the old one.. i have tz myself which looks sweet..

 

It is online now...the new Z is on Taiwan's SonyStyle..The flagship is only US$2500!(with 256GB SSD)

http://www.sonystyle.com.tw/is-bin/...oryID=HMYKAQuxcTUAAAEbtVUMjHGi#productContain

With two years warranty.

Similar configuration with 2 years warranty in US is around $ 3,081 .58

 

Looks like from the Engadget photos, you will NOT be able to replace the Sony SSDs with regular SSDs, even if you take the case off - the Sony SSD board is longer, but significantly narrower.



(Sony left, general SSD right.)

 

$250? For that price, these should be flat, skinny Li-ion Polymer batteries:

http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=3580

This new Z is soo perfect, but there is still room for improvement. Sony, are you reading this forum?