Sony VAIO SB vs Lenovo Thinkpad X220

TLDR @ bottom
So I'm considering a ultraportable sub $1.5k. Initially I'd considered the Asus U36jc and the Samsung Series 9, as well as the Vaio SB and the Lenovo X220. After tons of reading, I've cut out the U36 (old processor lineup, not as solid build quality) and the Samsung (way too expensive, though gorgeous...).

The main intended use for the laptop is just everyday university stuff. The CATCH: I have a desktop for SC2, but it would be a benefit if I could play SC2 on laptop (feel free to talk some sense into me). Given this, I want to love the Vaio SB with its specs and gorgeous design, however there are a few issues I've noted from the posts I've seen including fan noise and heat (I know there's a firmware update but the screen still blocks part of the vent), and the average screen quality. I've been to the Sony store seen the display, it looks fairly average; honestly I was hoping for better. It didn't blow me away like I was hoping (maybe because it was pink).

At the moment I'm very on the fence between this and the X220 which has excellent reviews (especially for its IPS screen). I know the SA is coming... eventually but I think it will be too late and out of my price range (I need it preferably for May). My previous laptop was a T61 (the graphics card blew out playing SC2), which I was fairly impressed with especially for its performance and durability, but I feel I need something lighter now. I think there may be other people considering the same options that I am and with the lack of reviews on the SB at this point, it's very hard for me to make a decision. The threads on the SB are also ridiculously long and scattered (though I've scoured them pretty thoroughly). Please feel free to offer insights and even alternate options I haven't considered.

TLDR: SB or X220?

Sony Vaio SB
Pros:
1. AMD 6630 should be able to rip through SC2 (I would hope at least on high)
2. svelte design
3. solid build quality

Cons:
1. Screen quality (average viewing angles and average quality overall)
2. fan vent design/heat (could be non issue?)

Lenovo Thinkpad X220
Pros:
1. solid build quality
2. very high screen quality
3. ridiculous battery life

Cons:
1. no discrete graphics (probably can still run SC2 on low at least)
2. somewhat dated design

 

Personally, I'm leaning towards the x220. Unless the Vaio SA makes an appearance real quick. Really, the only thing the SA has over the x220 is a difference in design.

I have no need to play games with my machine, so the discreet graphics is a non-issue for me. Also, the x220 IPS display upgrade is supposedly awesome.

Finally, I think the x220 6 cell battery will last an extra hour or two, compared to the SB's built in battery. This is another reason why I'm going x220 for now. Another consideration is the thinkpad docking stations are also awesome.

Finally, just another thing to consider, the x220 does not have a built in optical drive. This may be a problem for some.

 

Build quality wise X220 is certainly much better.

 

Absolutely. Also, I can attest to the fact that it is MUCH easier to get replacement parts for thinkpad laptops. Even several years after systems go out of production, you will very often see replacement parts on ebay, and other websites.

It's much harder to get sony replacement parts, even from sony itself.

 

If the dedicated GPU is not needed, it's definitely th X220 for me. It's got quite a few good reviews, it's military-grade , the screen is IPS. I wish the X220 will get a higher resolution screen though...

 

The X220 has a screen size of 12.5" and the screen size of Sony SB is 13.3". I'm also considering the SB - Does is still have noise/heat issues?

 

If you do your gaming in one place, and have an external monitor, another solution is the X220 with a ViDock.

 

I agree entirely with this statement, but since i don't have a desktop with me... I needed the Z to do that. Otherwise it would've been the X201 (for me back then) but the X220 would be the laptop of choice if i were to today get a laptop (only drawback is screen res... there was some rumor about a 1600x900 panel... i'm pretty sure it's just a rumor... but it doesnt hurt to dream right???)

 

So so far, opinions are very one sided. I considered the Vidock solution but since I actually do have a desktop I don't think I'd shell out the money for that. I'd really only be using the notebook to game if say I'm going to a lan party at a friend's house, or if I'm going home for the weekend. Any idea where could I look at an X220 in person?

In any case the design of the SB is much more attractive than the X220 (I feel like a noob for factoring in looks especially knowing how solid the build is on a thinkpad), so much so that I'm on the fence despite knowing how good the X220 reviews are. Between the two, weight, size and battery life are close enough that honestly I don't think the small differences would be a deciding factor to me.

From your replies, so far I think I've identified 2 deciding factors:
1. If heat is really an issue with an SB
2. If the screen is really THAT much better on an X220

Anybody know how to put the X220's IPS panel in the SB?

Any idea where to get a replacement Quadro NVS140M so I could resurrect my dead T61?

 

Difficult decision. But I would lean towards the X220 with the IPS, as you already have a desktop for gaming. What the Sony has going for it is the dvd and the graphics. If looks is a factor maybe the Sony is the winner, but I guess it will look dated in three years, whereas the X220 will look like a Thinkpad.

There is another review of the Sony here: Review Sony Vaio VPC-SB1Z9EB Subnotebook - Notebookcheck.net Reviews

 

A bit of a contrarian opinion: If I didn't need the durability of the Thinkpad, I would get the Sony, hands-down. For the same reason as I like the current Z better than a tricked out Thinkpad X201t, an excellent, very fast ultraportable (with a Tablet alter-ego that can be used or ignored) which has long come with screens every bit as good as the one used in the X220, but they were 12.1" at 1280 X 800 and made by renknown BOE Hydis AFFS+ (same effect as IPS - unlimited viewing angles) with brightness up to 400 nit, and the well equipped X201t sella for $1,200-$1,500. Oh, and they look just like the X220 (and the X200, and the T61...you get the picture. The only reason you'd have to go with the X-2XX tablet version until now with the X220 IPS (besides, in my experience, the excellent uses of a Windows-based tablet) is that I'm pretty sure only they got the IPS-type ultra bright screens since tablets need to be viewed from any angle.

I don't think I'm alone here; I just see that the Thinkpad x220 "Emperor" is wearing the same clothes he always had (rock solid, good, current technology (but weak on graphics),comparatively light weight, good battery endurance (last year's 6-7, this year's 7-8) and an excellent screen (in tablet form at least). True, the clothes are this year's materials (Sandy Bridge cpu, improved battery technology), but that's noting new, and the Sony's will improve to the same degree with the same newer technology. Unless most of you considered an X201 last year and got the Z instead, I don't see how the X220 belongs in your target group unless you: a) are looking to spend less money (laudable, even smart!), b) need more durability or, c) had a bad experience with Sony and want the "anti-Sony!"

Oh, and, I have definitely drunk the Kool Aid on the upscale Sonys; thin, light and powerful with luxury features that "feel" good and work well, as well as combining these with a piece of industrial design that I get a kick out or just looking down onto, much less having it on my desk, on an airplane or even in my home. If the time comes that I value durability over most else, that's when I'll get a Thinkpad. But I can get pretty much all the features that are being touted on the X220 on the SA and the latter (or maybe the new Z, once the rumors and facts are sorted and the actual computers are out!) and as a new indoctrinee I can assure you that I would rather sacrifice some dollars and some durability as of now to get the thinness, light weight, luxury of feature and feel and gorgeous design/materials and if I couldn't afford the Sony (ie, couldn't find a great deal on a refurb of a current model) I'd probably seek out an HP Envy or business class HP or Dell to get the look and feel I'm really hooked on now. But there's nothing like the "real thing," and as a guy who hates OSX and never felt the level of luxury or elegance of design of the MBPs - much less, until just now, their anemic performance, so that pretty much keeps me in the Sony Vaio camp indefinitely - and happy to be here!

Just saayin, is all.

 

You don't need the Thinkpad (which is more for the road warrior, has to be very dependable, has to last very long). You want the SB. So the decision's pretty much already made.

I don't think the X220 is out yet, though YouTube has reviews. I think it's released next week or something...

 

I just don't believe there is a comparison here. We are talking about a consumer notebook versus an enterprise machine.

I have yet to see a Vaio that will stand up to the vigors of everyday 'working' usage. If the main criteria here is a notebook that will stand the test of time and still be running long after the Vaio has given up the ghost, then it it has to be the ThinkPad X220.

We have them released on the 19th April.

http://www./thinkpad-x220-and-x220-tablet-review-the-new-benchmark-for-ultraportables.htm

Call me biased, but I just don't see a contest here

 

You can't predict such a thing.

 

I am not predicting Rachel, I am just comparing years of experience of using both brands in a work environment. Thats not called prediction, its called evidence!

 

You are right in the sense that in general, Thinkpads are more durable than Vaios. But Rachel is right in the sense that for a specific Vaio, for a specific user, it may be more durable than a specific Thinkpad. For instance, in my case, I'm happier with my Z than the Thinkpads I've owned.

 

It's a given that Thinkpads are more robust than Vaios. Any computer though can develop a mechanical fault and fail at any time. There are Vaios that are still in operation after 5 years of ownership. My SZ is still going strong after three years and has never had an issue and at times it has been used as a work laptop. With appropriate protection when travelling it's not an issue for me at all being able to use such a notebook in such a manner.

 

Thanks for everyone's opinions. I think Tofuturkey somewhat hit the spot:

BUT the screen on the X220 is very tempting. If the SB had a comparable screen it'd be a no brainer (we can all hope for the SA to do so).

Also, I am aware that these aren't necessarily your usual comparison, a business vs a consumer oriented notebook. But as per the OP, I've been doing the research and for my needs I've narrowed it down to these two, and I think it's fair to compare them as I'm considering them both as they're both ultraportables with similar weight and size and power (other than graphics) as well as price. I respect the quality of thinkpads... as mentioned before, I had one and it was a tank, but it broke (not from abuse mind you, the graphics card failed).

How much difference is there between intel HD and a 6630 in real world performance?

 

gaming? absurd levels
encoding, decoding? intel win will.

 

According to this chart:

Mobile Graphics Cards - Benchmark List - Notebookcheck.net Tech

the 6630m is ranked 74 and the HD 3000 ranked 156. Real world performance... I think you summarized it before, the 6630m could probably play SC2 on high and the HD 3000 on low (but keep in mind that SC2 is a more CPU intensive game than other games like BFBC2, etc.)

The 6630M is a mid range card, better than the 330m on my Z (rank 95... when i got my Z a year ago it was ranked 64), read SC2 performance on the thread on this forum:

http://forum.notebookreview.com/sony/506240-starcraft-ii-sony-vaio-z.html

the HD 3000 is about equal to the 310M which I consider probably the lowest card you can play a game with.

In any case, consider that the Z has a 1600x900 or a 1080p screen when reading through that thread i linked to you. The SB has a 720p screen so you games should play better even with a 330m (unless you plan on using an external display, which you probably won't do since you already have a desktop and said you'd only game on the go)

 

I'm sorry, but do you think your screen name might lead some to think you may have a preference, hahaha

(Just joking, but you have to admit, it was a perfect setup )

 

What he/she said

what she said

What he said

We say tomato, you say, uh, "I don't care what it looks like, I just want a computer I can stand on"

They're both great computers that anyone looking for a high performance ultraportable today should consider, though for many in the end, one would be very attractive and the other unacceptable; I can make the case for either.

 

Durability is more of a personal thing to be honest.

If you are a plumber, and you need something to work with on the go, than you need a laptop with a 16 hours battery life that will keep going even after a toilet exploded on it.

If you are like me, and you still wear white gloves a year after you bought it, then you probably don't need one with military standards (slight exageration, but you get the point).

Also, as you will play games, battery is not really an issue. No one play games on a laptop for extended periods of time on battery saver mode.


You mentionned that you want to play SC2. That means you want to play games on your laptop, and while the XT220 could run that, you will probably also want to play new games in a year, which the XT220 will probably lag too much behind without a dedicated card.

I don't know if the SB is your best option at the moment, but I think you should look for an option with a dedicated gpu from your description.

 

@fmboisvert: You raise a good point with future compatability, which I think has been at the back of my mind. Any other suggestions then?
@Mr MM: Can you by any chance confirm what level of graphics an sb with a 6630 can run on SC2?

Went to go check it out again at sonystore. Honestly not sure what it is about the screen I don't like. It's not horrible but something doesn't impress me very much about it. Also noticed another thing at applestore; everyone is complaining about how the hinge on the SB blocks the vent. I looked at the back of a Mac (can't remember air or macbook 13"), and the ENTIRE hinge is in front of the vent. Indeed I do remember friends' macbooks getting quite hot...

 

Plus +1 rep point, please.

Quadro NVS140M t61 | eBay

Granted it's the whole mainboard, but I think I did give you a fair answer.

EDIT: I looked briefly at the parts book for the t61, and the only way to get the replacement gpu is to get the whole motherboard. The CPU, however, does seem to be replaceable on its own. You will need the exact system type the XXXX-XXX code in order to get the exact replacement motherboard. The two I found on ebay might not be the right ones.

2nd EDIT: Cheater, you edited your original post!

 

Maybe it's that larger bezel? That's the one reservation i have with the SB/SA... it's a 13.3" screen with a bezel that large... makes it a 14" now... and for me that's not a VPC-Z all-in-one successor...

And you're right about the MBP approach towards it... I like my barrel hinge... and my removable battery... the one thing that'll cause batteries to degrade: heat. And in a chassis like that... I don't see the battery being anything more than a giant heatsink... at least when i game on my Z i remove my battery...

Now I'm not saying that the X220 has a smaller bezel, but I just dont feel... the Sony in the SB/SA series... (i absolutely love my barrel hinge... so i'm biased i guess)

 

I believe you can currently play SC2 on low settings with the onboard intel on the X220, but you'll be getting 10-15 fps if you try high settings, which is pretty much unplayable.

The SB can handle high settings for SC2 with decent fps if you get the 6630 gpu. It would be better if someone that plays SC2 on a SB would be willing to comment though.

One thing to consider as well, is that the dedicated gpu in the SB is a native directx 11 card, while the onboard on the x220 is a directx 10.1 card, which means it will suffer a lot more in future games. If you will be gaming on your laptop, I would definitely recommend getting one with dedicated gpu so you can at least keep it running for a couple of years.

I don't really have any other computer to suggest, as I don't think there is anything out right now except the VAIO SB that has sandy bridge AND a dedicated gpu in a 13" format. (correct me if I'm wrong). Too bad the screen is disappointing.

The HP Envy 14 will be a strong contender for your need, but the sandy bridge version is still not officially released (but imminent apparently).

 

Well, if you don't mind the older processor series, the Acer 3820TG is still a good option and great buy. With a ATI 6550 GPU, you won't really be that much slower in games since the bottleneck is still GPU right now rather than CPU. And it's overclockable with the great heatsink/fan setup they have.

And since you'll be importing it from Canada, assuming you're in the US, it'll be tax free.

 

fair enough... still mad expensive though.

 

Sorry for multiple posts.

I actually really liked the barrel hinge. Too bad the Z is still crazy expensive despite being outdated. I also know it's too ridiculous to expect screen quality rivaling a z, but from what I remember seeing it would be hard pressed to rival an asus. I don't think it's the bezel either, I actually don't mind how wide the bezel is on the screen, it actually looks kind of nice to me.

Hmm... will check out but switchable graphics + sandy bridge I think offers better battery life which while I don't need my laptop to run for 24 hours I do place some value on it. (I am in Canada btw )

 

Some of them were "best offer". Send them a low-ball bid... they know it aint worth that money.

 

Now that the Canadian CTO works again I am very tempted...
I was looking for a comparison of whether or not the 2540 was worth the $100... http://forum.notebookreview.com/har...i5-2410m-vs-2nd-gen-i5-2540m-worth-100-a.html
will probably help anyone looking for it.

 

CPU upgrades for i5 is mostly useless really. Unless you're going from the lowest (full-power) i5 to the highest clocked dual-core i7, you won't notice much performance boost. The price/performance for an upgrade for processors in the i5+ range is really bad (ie. 2500k vs 2600k for desktops). Now then again, the only reason i went with the i7... was for bragging rights. I figured i was going to spend so much anyways i could splurge the extra ~$85 on a nicer CPU , but I knew full well I would never see the extra power (although I am a CS student... so maybe it'll pay off one day )

 

How was your i7 upgrade only $85? Mine was $250 or so.

 

OK so I guess there's some closure to this thread... I CTO'd an SB:
i5-2410M
AMD hd 6630M
sheet battery
fresh start
500gb

I plan to replace with an SDD. Eventually...

Mainly picked SB cuz I need it fairly soon, and graphics card vs no graphics card really decided it in the end.

edit: thanks for all your input guys!

 

What is the return policy on Sony Tiger in case you ended up not liking it?

 

The Sony Tiger? Is this a new product?

 

hahahaha. She is "tinythetiger;" he was calling her "Tiger!"

What a great way to start a rumor/thread: "The new Sony Tiger - faster than rack of servers, each with a GTX 460, all in a 13" 2 lb notebook, FHD IPS display, $2,900. Surprise: it's the REAL new Z!!!

 

That's cuz i got the i7-620m which i think is replaced by the i5-580m which has the same clock & turbo speed (but 1mb less cache). So the upgrade for me was just $100 - 15% discount for VPCZ11 CTOs (early adopter discount i guess... although it cost me $200 to go from 128gb->192gb).

 

I don't like grammar as much as the next guy, but commas are needed in the English language.

 

LOL @ the above, I should talk to Sony about licensing my name... and I'm a dude, not a girl =.=
Sadly Canadian return policy on CTO is non existent. Maybe I will sell it or give to my gf if I don't like it, but I think I secretly wanted one the whole time anyways. Hopefully there'd be some way to put the SA screen onto it, then I'd have nothing to complain about

 

Really... returns on CTO is not accepted in Canada? That's quite harsh...

 

Yea, pretty harsh, maybe that's why we get the 6630 stock on cto and have pricing pretty much at par with US. Perhaps they're finally feeling bad for us?

 

Post deleted.

Started new thread on: Samsung Series 4 vs Sony SB/SA

 

no thanks lenovo. they still cling on to having the fn and ctrl keys swapped around which makes it a huge usability issue (at least for me). i understand you can remap the keys in the bios, but still annoying nonetheless.

 

I had a T61 for several years. Honestly, when you're using it every day, you'll get used to it in a week. For me, every other laptop has their fn and ctrl reversed I don't think that alone should be a reason not to choose a lenovo just because it's something that you will get used to quickly, no matter how annoying it is at first.

 

I actually got used to that and prefer it.

By the way, I guess no one has posted that the X220's are on sale right now. The i3 is $854 and the i5 one is $100 more.

 

They are always on sale if you can figure out how to order from their EPP site If anyone happens to be making this same decision b/w x220 and SB now I must say that even though my SB is shipping, I feel like I don't regret picking it over the X220.

Also, now that ASUS is finally launching its sandy bridge version of the u36 and other similar sized laptops, I guess one could consider those again.